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Hello
During last game a question came up – do models behind forests and ruins get cover save or not?
The issue is mainly with terrain templates we use for forests:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-gVOdzjYmqKw/TevPnoU3CrI/AAAAAAAABCE/ULEmjx2fs2s/s1600/IMG_2337.JPG
They are nearly zero thickness and have some removable trees put on them for decoration. Trees are shifted around or removed to accommodate units entering forest.
So fill units behind such forest (and similarly made ruins) get cover save?
(I mean they would get cover save behind forest with trees glued on it)

If it blocks LOS then yes they will AFAIK. Or do you mean do they get the cover save from the forest?

I'm quite sure the keyword "Citadel Woods" was mentioned once in the BRB, but strangely it is missing in the terrain section.

edit: see page 190

We play it usually like this:
In ruins - 4+
through ruins - 25% cover rule, then 4+
forests - 5+
through forests - 5+

I think it was like that in 6th and we kept that. A forest usually consists of more than 1 or 2 trees

 Ratliker wrote:
Hello
During last game a question came up – do models behind forests and ruins get cover save or not?
The issue is mainly with terrain templates we use for forests:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-gVOdzjYmqKw/TevPnoU3CrI/AAAAAAAABCE/ULEmjx2fs2s/s1600/IMG_2337.JPG
They are nearly zero thickness and have some removable trees put on them for decoration. Trees are shifted around or removed to accommodate units entering forest.
So fill units behind such forest (and similarly made ruins) get cover save?
(I mean they would get cover save behind forest with trees glued on it)

RAW, you only get cover for:

1) being inside a wood area terrain feature,
2) or if standing behind the woods terrain feature, you only gain cover from it if the model is actually physically obscured by one of the trees, making it vitally important to never move any of the trees.


However, as that is an incredibly stupid rule for any of us who have woods terrain with moveable trees (which also covers most tournaments as well), I highly suggest you house rule the game to say that if LOS passes all the way through a forest terrain feature, that a model on the other side gets a 5+ cover save even if they aren't actually physically obscured by any of the trees.

I'm not sure that being inside the woods terrain feature would give you a cover automatically. You still need to be obscured. Ruins (and later rubble) specially say that you get it even if you are not obscured. The first paragraph on pg 108 BRB talks about the difference.

If you are using the Terrain Datasheets starting on pg 183, then you could either create your own for those woods to fix the issue, or use the Twisted Copse rules which WOULD give you the 5+ regardless.

 Thairne wrote:
We play it usually like this:
In ruins - 4+
through ruins - 25% cover rule, then 4+
forests - 5+
through forests - 5+

I think it was like that in 6th and we kept that. A forest usually consists of more than 1 or 2 trees

The underlined is incorrect, as per the 25% Cover rule, obscured models always get 5+ cover.

It is usually house ruled as the rules worked in 6th: the cover you get varies with what is in between you and your target.

 BlackTalos wrote:


The underlined is incorrect, as per the 25% Cover rule, obscured models always get 5+ cover.

It is usually house ruled as the rules worked in 6th: the cover you get varies with what is in between you and your target.

The example in the BRB states "3 Orks (circled in red) have a 4+ cover save as at least one firing model has his line of sight partially obscured by the ruin.".

What actually constitutes being "in" a ruin?

Ackoogin wrote:
The example in the BRB states "3 Orks (circled in red) have a 4+ cover save as at least one firing model has his line of sight partially obscured by the ruin.".

What actually constitutes being "in" a ruin?

See the attached rules snippet from the BRB below.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

curt1893 wrote:
I'm not sure that being inside the woods terrain feature would give you a cover automatically. You still need to be obscured. Ruins (and later rubble) specially say that you get it even if you are not obscured. The first paragraph on pg 108 BRB talks about the difference.

If you are using the Terrain Datasheets starting on pg 183, then you could either create your own for those woods to fix the issue, or use the Twisted Copse rules which WOULD give you the 5+ regardless.

Sorry, I should have specified: there are no actual rules for woods in the BRB now, but the Twisted Copse datasheet is GW's idea of woods, and that does give a cover save just for being in the area terrain feature, even if not obscured by the trees.

It is also relevant to point out, unless otherwise specified in the book all cover is assumed to be 5+.

I'm curious how others handle mixed situations with large units. Like 30 Shoota boyz firing at 30 slugga Choppa boyz.

Exactly half the shoota boyz have clear Los to half the slugga Choppa boyz. The other half of the shoota boyz have clear Los to the other half but are obscured from the first half.

So 60 shots become 20 hits becomes 10 wounds. The first would be casualty is obscured from half of the firing unit and not the other. What is his cover save?

 Rismonite wrote:
I'm curious how others handle mixed situations with large units. Like 30 Shoota boyz firing at 30 slugga Choppa boyz.

Exactly half the shoota boyz have clear Los to half the slugga Choppa boyz. The other half of the shoota boyz have clear Los to the other half but are obscured from the first half.

So 60 shots become 20 hits becomes 10 wounds. The first would be casualty is obscured from half of the firing unit and not the other. What is his cover save?

Easy peasy: Determining Cover Saves (Shooting phase section, using digi edition so no page number sorry)

If, when you come to allocate a Wound, the target model’s body (see General Principles) is at least 25% obscured from the point of view of at least one firer, Wounds allocated to that model receive a cover save.

If the model would get a cover save from any model firing, he gets a cover save against every model firing.