Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Assuming the ‘average game’ is 1850 points, how many flyers would you happily play against in a friendly environment with list tailoring allowed?

I’m asking this because most people may have one, or even two, but I want to become the only idiot to ever use the Skyboss Wingnutz’s Air Armada formation (3 Dakkajets - 1 is a flyboss, 1 Blitza-Bommer, 1 Burna-Bommer). Even while still having plenty of ground elements would you play against an army with five flyers? Even if they are only Ork ones – I still feel that people wouldn’t be too happy about it, thoughts?

I would be fine playing against one or two flyers in an 1850 game, and any more would depend on my opponent's attitude.

No problem at all, since you said tailoring's fine - I'd bring my Elysians, we could have an air war, it would be cool.

Meh go for it! If the other player is made aware of that. It may also lead to some crazy air battle with lots of flyers on both side.

Most codex now have 3+ Flyer formation within their faction Detachment. Dark Angels get 2 Nephilim and 1 Dark Talon, SM get 2 Storm Eagle and 1 Storm Raven,... So i guess everyone should be ready for that even if they don't know about your list.

I'm saddly the only guy fielding flyers in my group of friends So far, but I'm dying for some air battle between 3+ flyer while the Armies clash between each other bellow.

It depends on the size and power of the flyer

Like if it were the Storm Talon, I'd be fine facing 4-5

But if it's like a Night Scythe it'd have to be 2-3

Personally, I'm generally not thrilled to see more than a couple of flyers or FMC's in a game, unless it's something really well themed (e.g. Elysian Air Cav). Spamming Hive Tyrants is not a theme

That said, there are of course, exceptions, I'm not going to be particularly butthurt about a grip of Ork Fight Bommas or Dakkajets in most cases for instance. My bigger issue is more of a "meta" one, in that I simply don't think certain types of flying things really have any business being represented on a tabletop given the scale of the game and the way such craft typically operate.

 Vaktathi wrote:
Personally, I'm generally not thrilled to see more than a couple of flyers or FMC's in a game, unless it's something really well themed (e.g. Elysian Air Cav). Spamming Hive Tyrants is not a theme

That said, there are of course, exceptions, I'm not going to be particularly butthurt about a grip of Ork Fight Bommas or Dakkajets in most cases for instance. My bigger issue is more of a "meta" one, in that I simply don't think certain types of flying things really have any business being represented on a tabletop given the scale of the game and the way such craft typically operate.

Pretty much this. Real life jets would be a mile away by the time you finished your movement phase.

I'm usually cool with however many flyers, they are all such cool models, even the impossible Imperial ones that fly around the way bricks shouldn't. I intend to eventually try running the Ravenwing Silence Squadron myself (I have the models, I just need to put them together!).

The more flyers - the easier it is to win against them. Flyers suck in maelstorm.

One in a 1500-1850 game seems totally reasonable. More than one per thousand points seems like it'll handicap your list or make it nigh-unkillable depending on the army list you're fighting.

 koooaei wrote:
The more flyers - the easier it is to win against them. Flyers suck in maelstorm.

Not every game is Maelstrom, so that's a pretty bad argument.

Disclaimer: I am probably an outlier.

I would like to see zero flyers, as that's what I'll be fielding.
I'll also be bringing no anti flyer stuff.

I don't mind seeing guard do air drops from valks but I can't stand seeing wolfhead gunships or croissants prancing around the table, hanging just a story or two in the air and pissing all over my lovingly painted infantry.

Jets really have no business in a game which cares whether your sarge is armed with a halberd or a spear.

Ork fliers are cool and all but I'd rather they were objectives or special effects ( bombardment once a turn) than active participants. I recall a battle report where Black templars droppodded onto an Orkheld airstrip, and ork pilots were scrambling for fightabommas (FW) whilst the templars attempted to kill the warboss.

If a pilot reached a plane, next turn he could take off and the following turn he could perform an attack run.

Anyway, thats just me
/opinions

 =Angel= wrote:
hanging just a story or two in the air and pissing all over my lovingly painted infantry.

That seems like a pretty good description of why I take my gunships and bombers.

No issue with any amount. A flyer in itself doesn't really matter too much, however, I'd be a touch annoyed if I saw 3 Baledrakes, but not because they're good, but because I wouldn't be expecting very good units. If he's practicing for a tournament, I'd have no issue, but if it is a casual game I'd treat it as solid practice and a challenge.

Really depends on the flyer. Are we talking about some powerful flyers like Vultures and Fire Raptors or some of the more dinky flyers like Dakkajets or the Tau codex flyers? AV10 flyers in general aren't usually problematic as pointing any RoF focused shooting at them will tear them apart or force jinking. Its the AV12 beasts that need dedicated high strength skyfire weapons that can be problematic to take down.

I run x8 Flyers at 2k with my Elysians to be able to compete in the competitive enviroment of my FLGS. With how powerful the current top tier Codexs are it has allowed me to compete with them head to head quite well, especially against Eldar, Tau and the new Space Marines which there is an abundance of at my store.

As many as he wants. if he's taken 3 Stormravens and 3 Talons, plus the fomation to get another 1 and 2 respectively, that's nearly 1500pts of models there. Which means he's going to have next to no scoring and no foottroops. So I can camp happy on objectives and shoot flak missiles.

Or if tailoring is allowed, take a Space Marine Air Defense Formation. 3x Stalkers with Ignores Cover on their Cannons and 3x HJunters that can reroll their Savant Lock, as well as extra bonuses if they all shoot the same flyer.

I personally don't care how many flyers someone takes, and I wouldn't expect my opponent to have an issue the other way around. Then again I play Necrons, and my only real transport for things is, in fact, a Flyer.

I'd be happiest with no flyers in my games. They should be off board special attacks (kind of like scaled down orbital bombardment) or fast skimmers only assaultable by jump units in the case of gunships, not supersonic craft being able to manauvre easily in a space the size of a shopping centre.

 sing your life wrote:
I'd be happiest with no flyers in my games. They should be off board special attacks (kind of like scaled down orbital bombardment) or fast skimmers only assaultable by jump units in the case of gunships, not supersonic craft being able to manauvre easily in a space the size of a shopping centre.

You would think it's about that size, but the scaling on this game is not completely accurate, and Forge the Narrative says that it could realistically be a larger area.

Not that it helps the argument, though.

1-3 in a 1,850-2k game sound about right. But going very flyer heavy is not without drawbacks, so whatever is fine.

I’ll play vs. anything, but would prefer just a couple for flavor (if at all). Spamming anything is irritating, flyers or not.

 Nevelon wrote:
1-3 in a 1,850-2k game sound about right. But going very flyer heavy is not without drawbacks, so whatever is fine.

I’ll play vs. anything, but would prefer just a couple for flavor (if at all). Spamming anything is irritating, flyers or not.

This. Also, I'm happy to go up against an all Flyers list, just let me know ahead of time, I'll bring my Skyfire

I'm happy play against whatever my opponent brings, at least once anyways.

An all air list would be plenty fluffy and look cool. Spam is alright in my books because redundancy, symmetry and cohesion look cool on the table and function well.

Well, I'd bring my Night Scythes to town, it could be 2 to 4 and an interesting matchup.

If list tailoring is allowed - bringing a flier is almost pointless. Fliers are more of an ace up your sleeve. fliers require a non tailoring environment to be useful - they already have the extreme drawback of being forced to start the game in reserves losing their hard to hit rule makes them useless or at the very best over-costed.

 Blacksails wrote:
I'm happy play against whatever my opponent brings, at least once anyways.

An all air list would be plenty fluffy and look cool. Spam is alright in my books because redundancy, symmetry and cohesion look cool on the table and function well.

This.

Its worth mentioning that:

a) Orks have no way to spam fliers outside an expensive and ineffective formation.

b) Ork fliers tend to fall on the crappy side of the spectrum.

Any.... and no tailoring.

If it's fluffy, I'll take it on - no matter how hard the engagement; you might be very killy but you still have to play to the objectives.

Bring it on, as many as you like (within points of course), I'll knock you out if the sky and claim the precious objectives to myself.

I play Renegades. I barely even notice the accuracy difference between snap-fire and regular shooting. Bring all the fliers you want. I'll just drown them in bullets the same way I do everything else.

MIni MIehm wrote:
I play Renegades. I barely even notice the accuracy difference between snap-fire and regular shooting. Bring all the fliers you want. I'll just drown them in bullets the same way I do everything else.

With covenant of tzeentch it's literally the same thing, giving you snaps at BS2 when you already got just BS2.

Always a good laugh when you shoot the same against jets and in overwatch as you do in normal shooting.