Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

BrianDavion wrote:
my guess would be Indomatables. from whence we get the Indomadius crusade

Ooh...I like that!

 bound for glory wrote:
Female marines are even more Derp.

I don't understand this. Can you explain to me why?

Your all crazy if you think this isn't the first Nu-40k army release like 40k. They'll get books beyond count too. Regular marines being left in the dust.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Ok, ok, ok. Deep breath. Bigger marines, that's dumb. I think that's really dumb, and a tasteless move by gw.

Unless...

They can now be female, too.

In which case I will give them props. Because that would be a clever way to do it.

I don't really have an issue with the move anyway, but actually, I'd be pretty happy with that.

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 bound for glory wrote:
Female marines are even more Derp.

I don't understand this. Can you explain to me why?

It usually boils down to girls being icky and having cooties I doubt that GW will introduce female Marines with this release. But the NuMarines don't have the all male fluff inertia that existing Marines have so its not impossible.

The easier solution always was just to slowly reduce the size of the AM and other human. Marines IMO are appropriately scaled to Eldar (tall as them but not as built) and Orks. Tau should probably look a bit more squishy as well.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:
The easier solution always was just to slowly reduce the size of the AM and other human. Marines IMO are appropriately scaled to Eldar (tall as them but not as built) and Orks. Tau should probably look a bit more squishy as well.

Except this isn't changing the scale of the current Marines, they're a new type of Marine.

Ok, with these new marines I really cant see the existing space marine chapters being happy about this.

If another primarch returns, disagrees with this idea of super marines, could Guilliman end up leading these super marines against fellow primarch(s) and the current space marines?

With approx half the space marines in existence using Ultramarine geneseed, that could seriously tear the space marine forces apart, Half join with Guilliman, the other half resenting these new super marines. Especially if another Primarch (The Lion maybe?) turned up to lead these dissatisfied marine chapters.

Could Guilliman become the new Horus?

Will be interesting to see where these numarines rank compared to the Custodes and Thunder Warriors?

Also, what genetic material has been used - Just Guillimans, various, other? It would be interesting to know.

Another (or though less likely given everything else out there) thought was what if this is the continuation of the project that the raven guard were working on after Istvan? Would be cool if they had a faster way to create marines and have a larger genetically compatible base of humans to work from.

icn1982 wrote:
Ok, with these new marines I really cant see the existing space marine chapters being happy about this.

If another primarch returns, disagrees with this idea of super marines, could Guilliman end up leading these super marines against fellow primarch(s) and the current space marines?

With approx half the space marines in existence using Ultramarine geneseed, that could seriously tear the space marine forces apart, Half join with Guilliman, the other half resenting these new super marines. Especially if another Primarch (The Lion maybe?) turned up to lead these dissatisfied marine chapters.

Could Guilliman become the new Horus?

Will be interesting to see where these numarines rank compared to the Custodes and Thunder Warriors?

Also, what genetic material has been used - Just Guillimans, various, other? It would be interesting to know.

Another (or though less likely given everything else out there) thought was what if this is the continuation of the project that the raven guard were working on after Istvan? Would be cool if they had a faster way to create marines and have a larger genetically compatible base of humans to work from.

Going by what we've seen and he's said (we offer rebirth) my guess is that Guilliman's used the gene-seed of all chapters from the vaults of Mars. Basically he's using the last reserves in the galaxy in a desperate attempt.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Crimson Devil wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
The development is happening and no amount of 'the sky is falling!' will change that. I'm seeing a huge number of people not even trying to like it, then inventing all sorts of justifications for why, 100%, 40k will now suck and they will hate it. Which once again leaves me impressed at just how hard people will work to ruin their own enjoyment.

People will react according to their bias' and fears. Human nature.

Which I understand, but when it comes to creating an entire narrative to justify a viewpoint that is solely detrimental to it's holder I find things a bit silly.

Or maybe shock horror just because you like it doesn't mean others like it too. What a novel concept! But no. Obviously since you like others are jupt inventing justifications

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So, you like your Space Marine army. Numarines are released that you in no way have to use in your army at all. You now dislike the army you previously liked, despite it being the exact same army.

Lets be clear here, we're talking about (massively overpriced) hunks of plastic that we push around a table make pew pew sounds.

Basically the only thing that makes it "cool" or "fun" or "interesting" is the player's imagination, the story behind it, the narrative.

THAT is what's changing. They're the same hunks of plastic, but with a different narrative, and that narrative is what elevated it beyond a hunk of plastic.

If the narrative changes in a way the hobbyist doesn't like, the only real option is to block your ears and go "lalala I'm not listening!!!", which isn't good enough for some people.

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 bound for glory wrote:
Female marines are even more Derp.

I don't understand this. Can you explain to me why?

Female physique is weaker. Unless the NuMarines breed via natural means, what would be the point of manufacturing female Marines?

there not hunks of plastic , to me there hours of investment creating somthing that im proud of, ive never really followed the lore so my only concern is my model looking small on the battle field compared to the new marines, but things change and move on i much prefer the new rhinos. no narrative will please everyone and its even harder to please vets

ian wrote:
...no narrative will please everyone...

Of course not.... but largely the reason existing hobbyists picked 40k Space Marines is because they like that specific narrative, so it's best not to feth with core elements of that narrative.

You generally avoid trying to piss off existing customers before trying to please people who are currently your customers. If you want to attempt to capture new customers who might like a different narrative it's better to try and cater to them without pissing off the existing ones. That's why you invent new armies or new settings instead of messing with the ones you currently have.

As time goes on, the new audience that the game has been attracting thinks much differently regarding to fluff than a lot of us, the older players do.
I can totally understand why people are getting upset about it, but I also see that GW need to try new things to get more money flooding in and it is impossible to keep everyone happy !

All these recent story lines have been pretty poor in my opinion and devoid of imagination for the most part, but still a massive part of the player base is really enjoying it and getting pretty excited about the changes, good for them !

I think it will pay off for GW to focus on change and attracting newer players with a different views regarding the background ( or story lines as it seems to be more like now ) even if quite a few of the old guard are not happy.

I think that I am just going to have to keep my fingers in my ears for the next year or two, while sticking to SWA and the HH, and see how it goes.

I can cope with that as long as they keep bringing out funky new stuff like they have recently with the Mechanicus and the GSC.

Despite them being declared a seperate thing, I still believe they are meant to replace the current range eventually.

It's definitely better for everyones wallet to have them phased them out incrementally then just have them replaced all at once, so that's fine with me.

Right now they are portrayed as reinforcements, but further down the road they will inevitably become the mainstay of most marine forces, giving those a slight bump in power in order to make them even more attractive as a playable faction.

GW can round the whole thing out with a few novels in which they explore the oldmarines' perspective on what it is like to be replaced and to accept one's own inferiority (something Marines usually don't have to deal with – sweet irony).

Maybe there's even room for a final uprising and a Horus Heresy Light somewhere down the line, who knows. In any case, I'll be glad to finally shoot properly sized marines in the future.

Backfire wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 bound for glory wrote:
Female marines are even more Derp.

I don't understand this. Can you explain to me why?

Female physique is weaker. Unless the NuMarines breed via natural means, what would be the point of manufacturing female Marines?

Ohhhh no you didn't.

 Rayvon wrote:
As time goes on, the new audience that the game has been attracting thinks much differently regarding to fluff than a lot of us, the older players do.

I'd be interested to hear how many new players are liking the idea of their Space Marines becoming 2nd tier superhumans.

I can't imagine even new players being overly happy about the narrative basis changing under their recent investment of hundreds of dollars and hundreds of hours assembling/painting models.

I'm an old player and I mostly don't give a crap because as a Space Wolves player I've already watched my army turn in to a clown show and thus stopped caring about them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JohnnyHell wrote:

Backfire wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 bound for glory wrote:
Female marines are even more Derp.

I don't understand this. Can you explain to me why?

Female physique is weaker. Unless the NuMarines breed via natural means, what would be the point of manufacturing female Marines?

Ohhhh no you didn't.

Oh please god no, lets not turn this in to another female Space Marine thread. I don't want to wake up tomorrow and find 10 pages added to the thread, thinking it's a new rumour but finding it's just 10 pages of bitching about/against female Space Marines (likely from the same handful of people bitching about it every other female Space Marine thread).

Lord Kragan wrote:

icn1982 wrote:
Ok, with these new marines I really cant see the existing space marine chapters being happy about this.

If another primarch returns, disagrees with this idea of super marines, could Guilliman end up leading these super marines against fellow primarch(s) and the current space marines?

With approx half the space marines in existence using Ultramarine geneseed, that could seriously tear the space marine forces apart, Half join with Guilliman, the other half resenting these new super marines. Especially if another Primarch (The Lion maybe?) turned up to lead these dissatisfied marine chapters.

Could Guilliman become the new Horus?

Will be interesting to see where these numarines rank compared to the Custodes and Thunder Warriors?

Also, what genetic material has been used - Just Guillimans, various, other? It would be interesting to know.

Another (or though less likely given everything else out there) thought was what if this is the continuation of the project that the raven guard were working on after Istvan? Would be cool if they had a faster way to create marines and have a larger genetically compatible base of humans to work from.

Going by what we've seen and he's said (we offer rebirth) my guess is that Guilliman's used the gene-seed of all chapters from the vaults of Mars. Basically he's using the last reserves in the galaxy in a desperate attempt.

it's worth noting that if these new Marines represent mostly a new founding, this wouldn't be the first time geneseed has been tinkered with for a new founding.

I'll wait to see what the full fluff on the new marines is before making up my mind....

But all that trailer makes me think is that their super duper marines and that idea doesn't float my boat. Marines are already a group of "captain America" level super soldiers in power armour they don't need to be more super, leave that to the Custodes and Primarchs.

Interestingly it's making me think of the kurt Russel film "Soldier" (watch it if you haven't already)

Whichever way this goes, replacements, reinforcement or new faction, it will be interesting how chapter masters/characters will take it. As whichever way they will be affected ( not so much by a new faction, "oh here's another marine based Army that is better than us") how will they take having newbs that are potentially better than them, or if it is a gradual replacement, what happens to characters, slowly killed off?

People shouldnt worry- every time a primarch is found his chapters will reap the benefits of fresh access to his sweet sweet man juice gene seed.

Loyalists of traitor chapters (blood ravens, and a few other official chapters and ubtold scores of homebrew chapters) are stuffed, though. :(

I hope these space marines 2.0 bigger badder and better, don't have broken and overpowered rules so people don't buy them but that's just me being selfish. I really don't like this and hope they go away by popular demand via the democratic process of no one buying them.

I hope this means they'll be bringing back Corvus Corax. I'd love to see what he thinks about delving into the Emperor's original research in the Empire's darkest hour to develop a new breed of quick grown astartes using genetic data from all the primarchs.

Don't wanna read all 25 pages So, are these BigMarines supposed to just be like special new guys like the vanguard of vanguards? or replacing all of the current marines with more truer-scale models?

 Necros wrote:
Don't wanna read all 25 pages So, are these BigMarines supposed to just be like special new guys like the vanguard of vanguards? or replacing all of the current marines with more truer-scale models?

Yes, and eventually.

In that order.

The official fluff so far is that it's Gulliman's new marines, and rumors indicate that they will be true scale or larger marines, but a lot of people seem to think that it's a ploy so that in the fluff after all the other marines die except these new marines then the not quite new as these new marines will stop being supported and these new marines will be what you have to build future marine armies out of.

I hope they're not all Gullimarines and we still get the variety offered by the different primarchs.

Its the most unoriginal idea in the history of unoriginal ideas.

 JohnnyHell wrote:

Backfire wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 bound for glory wrote:
Female marines are even more Derp.

I don't understand this. Can you explain to me why?

Female physique is weaker. Unless the NuMarines breed via natural means, what would be the point of manufacturing female Marines?

Ohhhh no you didn't.

What possible lore justification there could be for female Astartes? Now, female Sigmarines do make sense as they are recruited from mortal heroes and it's perfectly plausible some of them would be female. But Space Marines are actually beyond whole male/female thing.