Movment in 8th edition:

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**nordsturmking**

Movment in 8th edition:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/04/27/new-warhammer-40000-movement/

I am not sure if i like this:

If you’re in combat at the start of your turn, you can Fall Back by moving away from the enemy. You’ll lose the ability to advance, shoot or charge that turn, and crucially, enemies will be able to shoot at you! This does, however, open up a vast range of tactical options for armies like the Astra Militarum, who will now be able to effectively deploy in firing lines, with each row falling back from any assaults in good order (if they survived) while the unit behind them fires at the attackers. It goes both ways though – if you have a dedicated assault unit that specializes in killing infantry (like Warp Talons) your opponent will find it much harder to pin them down in combat with heavily armoured units for the entire game.

Guess it makes the game more dynamic. But i think it will hurt my Tyranids. When i finally get my Hormagants or Reaveners into CC. And in the nest turn my opponent gets his guys out of the CC. He will just shoot rest off the board. But we have to wait for the rest of the rules to be released. And If it is still IGOYGO or not.

**Youn**

What that does is make it so Assault troops aren't safe by tarpitting an opponent.

Example:
Blood angels assault squad charges Imperial guard squad. They activate and kill all but 3 guardsman. At end turn guardsman get lucky and don't get eliminated.

Currently, Guardsman are tied up in combat and therefore the Blood angels are immune to shooting.

WIth the changed rule, the Imperial Guard player drops his guardsman back and opens up with his entire army on that assault marine squad.

**Audustum**

It also means good assault units can avoid being tarpitted themselves. If I have some Custodes trying to attack Renegades and Heretics, I can now try to maneuver around Plague Zombies (for example).

I like this change and I say this as a lover of assault armies.

**Vitali Advenil**

I agree. Yes, it does hurt my orks since most shooty armies will just fall back their turn, tarpitting is an annoying practice that wastes time and needs to die.

In the big picture, this means things like 2+ rerollable screamer stars, necron stars, etc. are severely crippled.

**Tautastic**

How does AoS handles "Run" mechanics? Mostly wondering if different type of units (Bikes vs Infantry) have the same run distance(D6 or 2D6)?

**Tiberius501**

Yeah this change is awesome in my mind. I always thought tarpitting was a little too static and cause for a lot of exploitation. The example they gave, of setting up guardsman lines and falling back each line for the ones behind to open up sounds so awesome.
Just to point out though, this also means that the assaulting army can then charge again, charging in 8th now giving a huge advantage, so I don't consider this a nerf to assault armies personally

**davou**

Yep, even though I'm playing orks I like this change.

The game should be about moving and ultimately dynamic, not a static game of two player craps.

**Tiberius501**

Tautastic wrote:
How does AoS handles "Run" mechanics? Mostly wondering if different type of units (Bikes vs Infantry) have the same run distance(D6 or 2D6)?

It's mostly a universal D6 extra, while some particularly fast units can roll multiple when specified

**Vitali Advenil**

Honestly what I'm most worried about in movement is my boyz getting like 4 inches of movement. I can deal with 5, but I really hope most standard infantry will just be 6.

Meganobz will almost definitely be 4, considering termies are 5.

Come to think of it, with this movement change, do you think they'll get rid the no running penalty for SnP? It seems redundant if movement is dynamic, now.

**oldzoggy**

Tiberius501 wrote:
Yeah this change is awesome in my mind. I always thought tarpitting was a little too static and cause for a lot of exploitation. The example they gave, of setting up guardsman lines and falling back each line for the ones behind to open up sounds so awesome.
Just to point out though, this also means that the assaulting army can then charge again, charging in 8th now giving a huge advantage, so I don't consider this a nerf to assault armies personally

I wonder why they didn't use tau or eldar in that example ; )

**Tiberius501**

Vitali Advenil wrote:
Honestly what I'm most worried about in movement is my boyz getting like 4 inches of movement. I can deal with 5, but I really hope most standard infantry will just be 6.

Meganobz will almost definitely be 4, considering termies are 5.

Come to think of it, with this movement change, do you think they'll get rid the no running penalty for SnP? It seems redundant if movement is dynamic, now.

It's possible that Orks will have a slower movement speed, as the Ironjawz faction of Orks in AoS have 4" movement. However, they have plenty of rules in stuff like battalions (formations) that help them move much quicker across the board for some sweet melee action. That said, they're meant to be heavily armoured, and the other faction of Orks, who play more like 40k Orks, have a move speed more akin to other armies. So it could go either way or perhaps we'll see multiple factions of Orks in the future like in AoS

**Tautastic**

Tiberius501 wrote:
Tautastic wrote:
How does AoS handles "Run" mechanics? Mostly wondering if different type of units (Bikes vs Infantry) have the same run distance(D6 or 2D6)?

It's mostly a universal D6 extra, while some particularly fast units can roll multiple when specified

Argh I hope not...I hope they at least do something like 1/2 of Movement value + D6. So to have some difference in movements.

**obsidianaura**

I wonder how terminator armies will get on, they'll be slower and their armour save will be changed by the new (old) AP deducting from saves system.

What will they do to mitigate that hit?

**G00fySmiley**

Vitali Advenil wrote:
Honestly what I'm most worried about in movement is my boyz getting like 4 inches of movement. I can deal with 5, but I really hope most standard infantry will just be 6.

Meganobz will almost definitely be 4, considering termies are 5.

Come to think of it, with this movement change, do you think they'll get rid the no running penalty for SnP? It seems redundant if movement is dynamic, now.

if matt ward had anything to say about it like 6th edition anything to screw over orks. they have to be the whipping boys for space mary sues err marines

**Tiberius501**

obsidianaura wrote:
I wonder how terminator armies will get on, they'll be slower and their armour save will be changed by the new (old) AP deducting from saves system.

What will they do to mitigate that hit?

The 2 wounds they've shown them having now seems pretty good. And -3 AP (which a lascannon has now) takes them to a 5+ save, which is like their old invulnerable save. So I'd say they're probably going to be tougher than before. Other weapons having AP values to modify their save is probably still going to take time to get through a unit of 2 wound models

**Zatsuku**

Tautastic wrote:
Tiberius501 wrote:
Tautastic wrote:
How does AoS handles "Run" mechanics? Mostly wondering if different type of units (Bikes vs Infantry) have the same run distance(D6 or 2D6)?

It's mostly a universal D6 extra, while some particularly fast units can roll multiple when specified

Argh I hope not...I hope they at least do something like 1/2 of Movement value + D6. So to have some difference in movements.

You do already have differences in movement. It's called the Movement value.

**obsidianaura**

Tiberius501 wrote:
obsidianaura wrote:
I wonder how terminator armies will get on, they'll be slower and their armour save will be changed by the new (old) AP deducting from saves system.

What will they do to mitigate that hit?

The 2 wounds they've shown them having now seems pretty good. And -3 AP (which a lascannon has now) takes them to a 5+ save, which is like their old invulnerable save. So I'd say they're probably going to be tougher than before. Other weapons having AP values to modify their save is probably still going to take time to get through a unit of 2 wound models

That seems fair. I've not seen that 2 wounds thing yet thanks

Wait! That makes me wonder how many wounds Paladins will have now!

**FEARtheMoose**

Tiberius501 wrote:
obsidianaura wrote:
I wonder how terminator armies will get on, they'll be slower and their armour save will be changed by the new (old) AP deducting from saves system.

What will they do to mitigate that hit?

The 2 wounds they've shown them having now seems pretty good. And -3 AP (which a lascannon has now) takes them to a 5+ save, which is like their old invulnerable save. So I'd say they're probably going to be tougher than before. Other weapons having AP values to modify their save is probably still going to take time to get through a unit of 2 wound models

True, but alot of the heavy hitting weapons like lascannons will do D6 wounds per hit now.

**Tiberius501**

obsidianaura wrote:
Tiberius501 wrote:
obsidianaura wrote:
I wonder how terminator armies will get on, they'll be slower and their armour save will be changed by the new (old) AP deducting from saves system.

What will they do to mitigate that hit?

The 2 wounds they've shown them having now seems pretty good. And -3 AP (which a lascannon has now) takes them to a 5+ save, which is like their old invulnerable save. So I'd say they're probably going to be tougher than before. Other weapons having AP values to modify their save is probably still going to take time to get through a unit of 2 wound models

That seems fair. I've not seen that 2 wounds thing yet thanks

Wait! That makes me wonder how many wounds Paladins will have now! :O

Yeah that'll be interesting. Or Wraithguard! I'm also quite interested in how Guardsman Sentinals and Roughriders will fair as well

**Vitali Advenil**

FEARtheMoose wrote:
Tiberius501 wrote:
obsidianaura wrote:
I wonder how terminator armies will get on, they'll be slower and their armour save will be changed by the new (old) AP deducting from saves system.

What will they do to mitigate that hit?

The 2 wounds they've shown them having now seems pretty good. And -3 AP (which a lascannon has now) takes them to a 5+ save, which is like their old invulnerable save. So I'd say they're probably going to be tougher than before. Other weapons having AP values to modify their save is probably still going to take time to get through a unit of 2 wound models

True, but alot of the heavy hitting weapons like lascannons will do D6 wounds per hit now.

Considering lascannons are anti-tank weapons I think this is fine. Honestly, single-shot weapons needed a buff for MCs and the like.

**Tiberius501**

FEARtheMoose wrote:
Tiberius501 wrote:
obsidianaura wrote:
I wonder how terminator armies will get on, they'll be slower and their armour save will be changed by the new (old) AP deducting from saves system.

What will they do to mitigate that hit?

The 2 wounds they've shown them having now seems pretty good. And -3 AP (which a lascannon has now) takes them to a 5+ save, which is like their old invulnerable save. So I'd say they're probably going to be tougher than before. Other weapons having AP values to modify their save is probably still going to take time to get through a unit of 2 wound models

True, but alot of the heavy hitting weapons like lascannons will do D6 wounds per hit now.

Though they suggested that the damage of each hit goes towards a single model. So we'll likely see anti-vehicle weapons being low amounts of hits but high dmg and anti-infantry weapons being high amounts of hits but low damage per hit

**UrsoerTheSquid**

Has anyone heard if overwatch will still be a thing in 8th? I'm wondering how this fall back will work if it is still a thing.

**davou**

Im holding out hope that overwatch will require you to set an action in your turn, but allow for full BS.

**Kap'n Krump**

Overall, I'm ok with the concept.

But I don't think it should happen automatically, or for free. There should be some kind of test to see if you get away (both sides roll a dice, add movement, highest value decides who leaves or stays), or maybe lose models based on a leadership test.

But the idea of just "I'm leaving now, bye" like in AoS, is a bit silly.

**Vitali Advenil**

Kap'n Krump wrote:
Overall, I'm ok with the concept.

But I don't think it should happen automatically, or for free. There should be some kind of test to see if you get away (both sides roll a dice, add movement, highest value decides who leaves or stays), or maybe lose models based on a leadership test.

But the idea of just "I'm leaving now, bye" like in AoS, is a bit silly.

Or sacrificing a few extra models as you run, that would be fine.

**davou**

It's not free. It comes at the cost of being effectively pinned for your turn; and is only worth doing if you didn't want to be in assault with that unit anyway.

There's already a cost/benefit element to it, and the reason you would evaluate that cost is probably because you were already loosing models. Adding more losses to it isn't really required, you can leave and then your pinned.

Whats REALLY interesting here is that it introduces a way for them to reintroduce consolidating into the next combat without it being massively broken

**Brutallica**

This is probably the change that i actually dont like.

I mean, if you dont have hard alphastrike units or you roll gak. The enemy is gonna run away and you basicly just advanced deeper into a gunline. I have a slight feeling the extra 1 wound on terminators arent gonna quite make them great again.

I hope im wrong.

**Kap'n Krump**

Vitali Advenil wrote:

Or sacrificing a few extra models as you run, that would be fine.

Yeah, I mean, something. I know that unit already takes a penalty for falling back, but they shouldn't be able to guaranteed escape a combat and take no additional losses. But, we don't know all the specifics yet. I think it's fine, generally, even as assault-heavy orks.

**Breng77**

Kap'n Krump wrote:
Overall, I'm ok with the concept.

But I don't think it should happen automatically, or for free. There should be some kind of test to see if you get away (both sides roll a dice, add movement, highest value decides who leaves or stays), or maybe lose models based on a leadership test.

But the idea of just "I'm leaving now, bye" like in AoS, is a bit silly.

It depends on the narrative you build in your mind. Because movement, shooting, and melee are all limited to specific times it can sometimes seem like "I'm leaving now bye" but it might be accurate to think of the last round of combat as a fighting withdrawal, with the movement not depicted until the proper phase. Similar to how units that move and then charge now aren't really moving, stopping, then moving again in "reality"

Also if "morale" works like AOS, it is very possible that units will die quicker in melee, so what this really stops is trying not to kill the opponent.

**obsidianaura**

Brutallica wrote:
This is probably the change that i actually dont like.

I mean, if you dont have hard alphastrike units or you roll gak. The enemy is gonna run away and you basicly just advanced deeper into a gunline. I have a slight feeling the extra 1 wound on terminators arent gonna quite make them great again.

I hope im wrong.

Maybe there'll be some kind of adjusted sweeping advance rule to help