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Made in ca
God-like Imperator Titan Commander





Halifax

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Nurglitch wrote:


I'm faintly annoyed with myself because they have Turbo Lasers out for Warlords now and all I can think is that they're not side-by-side like Imperius Dictatio's are.


Imperium Dictatio was a Lucius pattern. Mars carapace mounts seem to be vertical compared to the reaver or lucius versions.
I plan to get a set and add them to a titan with a volcano cannon and Gatling arm and name it Mechanicus Dictatio since it is mars pattern

With no plans to do Lucius pattern Titans I had way too much pinned on being able to build a Warlord with Turbo Laser Destructors, Volcano Cannon, and Gatling Blaster.
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

My facebook based kit supplier has been told the following by the GW rep about the Knight Battleforce for those trying to figre out whats actually included from the images


6x Questoris Knights, 4x Ceratus Knights and 2x Acastus Porphyrion Knights, and 2x Questoris Knight upgrade frames

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/25 12:18:31


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Cheers for that Orlando.


Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in gb
Rampaging Carnifex






 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
My facebook based kit supplier has been told the following by the GW rep about the Knight Battleforce for those trying to figre out whats actually included from the images


6x Questoris Knights, 4x Ceratus Knights and 2x Acastus Porphyrion Knights, and 2x Questoris Knight upgrade frames


Did they confirm what the GBP price is?
   
Made in gb
Impassive Inquisitorial Interrogator




U.K.

urgh, resin, that really puts me off

3 SPRUUUUUEESSSS!!!!
JWBS wrote:

I'm not going to re-read the lunacy that is the last few pages of this thread, but I'd be very surprised if anyone actually said that. Even that one guy banging on about how relatively difficult it might be for an Inquisitor to acquire power armour, I don't think even that guy said that.
 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

 xttz wrote:
 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
My facebook based kit supplier has been told the following by the GW rep about the Knight Battleforce for those trying to figre out whats actually included from the images


6x Questoris Knights, 4x Ceratus Knights and 2x Acastus Porphyrion Knights, and 2x Questoris Knight upgrade frames


Did they confirm what the GBP price is?


Yes, 400-30 Adeptus Titanicus Knight Battleforce £80 RRP

 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
urgh, resin, that really puts me off


Not worked with resin before, but the Forgeworld kits are said to be good quality. The price puts me off though.

Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in gb
Impassive Inquisitorial Interrogator




U.K.

SamusDrake wrote:
 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
urgh, resin, that really puts me off


Not worked with resin before, but the Forgeworld kits are said to be good quality. The price puts me off though.



Ive used a lot of resin kits, I tend t find that smaller kits with finer details seem to come out worst cast wise. The sculpts look great, but id much prefer to see them in plastic

3 SPRUUUUUEESSSS!!!!
JWBS wrote:

I'm not going to re-read the lunacy that is the last few pages of this thread, but I'd be very surprised if anyone actually said that. Even that one guy banging on about how relatively difficult it might be for an Inquisitor to acquire power armour, I don't think even that guy said that.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
SamusDrake wrote:
 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
urgh, resin, that really puts me off


Not worked with resin before, but the Forgeworld kits are said to be good quality. The price puts me off though.



Ive used a lot of resin kits, I tend t find that smaller kits with finer details seem to come out worst cast wise. The sculpts look great, but id much prefer to see them in plastic


We are still missing the lucius alpha head for the warlord. Would be nice for a third weapons sprue in plastic to cover that, the Gatling and quake arms, and maybe like the support missile racks.

Reaver has the arms covered now, maybe could fit like 3 carapace mounts on one of the little sprues and make an upgrade clampack.

Also want to see these all in 28mm. A full size reaver warp missile would be awesome.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:



Ive used a lot of resin kits, I tend t find that smaller kits with finer details seem to come out worst cast wise. The sculpts look great, but id much prefer to see them in plastic


Same here, if not just for the Reaver carapace weapons.

Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Is the knight battle force expected to come with terminals? Or are new knight players expected to buy this, and $50 of cardboard?

It’s still a great deal for those of us looking to add some models to our forces, just not a very good entry point for new players, if those terminals aren’t included...
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




RobertDD wrote:
Is the knight battle force expected to come with terminals? Or are new knight players expected to buy this, and $50 of cardboard?

It’s still a great deal for those of us looking to add some models to our forces, just not a very good entry point for new players, if those terminals aren’t included...


Questoris and Cerastus terminal are up to download for free by GW, only acastus remain, and you can find rule for them everywhere, from GW store, warcom and other blog. you don't need GW cardboard to play the game.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/26 04:10:24


 
   
Made in us
Novice Knight Errant Pilot




Oakland, CA

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
urgh, resin, that really puts me off

While it's always great to have plastic, I've really been impressed with FW's recent resin quality.

Agreed that it's tougher to work with.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




RobertDD wrote:
Is the knight battle force expected to come with terminals? Or are new knight players expected to buy this, and $50 of cardboard?

It’s still a great deal for those of us looking to add some models to our forces, just not a very good entry point for new players, if those terminals aren’t included...


The Knights themselves are surprisingly easy to represent terminal wise.

There is only one stat to track(structure/hit points) and that can be done with a D6 or two. After that its just the order dice and maybe a unit number count. If you look on the GW site for the terminals the images practically show all the relevent info, so you only need a single terminals-worth for each type.

For each banner just get a small item( a piece of card or post-it note? ) to put your three dice and counter on and just reference the rules when needed. If only Forgeworld gave it some thought, there is a great opportunity to make a slimmed down version of AT with just the Knights and would serve as a fantastic expansion for AT itself. But that is for another discussion altogether.


NOTE: Pringles lid! They are large enough to hold the dice and counter.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/26 09:14:13


Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Chopstick wrote:
RobertDD wrote:
Is the knight battle force expected to come with terminals? Or are new knight players expected to buy this, and $50 of cardboard?

It’s still a great deal for those of us looking to add some models to our forces, just not a very good entry point for new players, if those terminals aren’t included...


Questoris and Cerastus terminal are up to download for free by GW, only acastus remain, and you can find rule for them everywhere, from GW store, warcom and other blog. you don't need GW cardboard to play the game.


SamusDrake wrote:
RobertDD wrote:
Is the knight battle force expected to come with terminals? Or are new knight players expected to buy this, and $50 of cardboard?

It’s still a great deal for those of us looking to add some models to our forces, just not a very good entry point for new players, if those terminals aren’t included...


The Knights themselves are surprisingly easy to represent terminal wise.

There is only one stat to track(structure/hit points) and that can be done with a D6 or two. After that its just the order dice and maybe a unit number count. If you look on the GW site for the terminals the images practically show all the relevent info, so you only need a single terminals-worth for each type.

For each banner just get a small item( a piece of card or post-it note? ) to put your three dice and counter on and just reference the rules when needed. If only Forgeworld gave it some thought, there is a great opportunity to make a slimmed down version of AT with just the Knights and would serve as a fantastic expansion for AT itself. But that is for another discussion altogether.


NOTE: Pringles lid! They are large enough to hold the dice and counter.


The print & play route may be interesting to some, but I think most people will want the stuff that comes with the game. Keeping track of multiple titans/knight banners on a single terminal is clever. That may work! The dice thing is not a bad idea either. Unfortunately, Gw only sells the terminals in packs of 5. It’s certainly true that knights require less tracking than titans.

In addition to the terminals, one would also need the Doom of Moloch book to play with this. And the rules set, of course.

Last year’s Titan Battlegroup box for $170 seems like it was a much better entree point for first-timers. The knight battle group is a great value for someone looking to add knights to their existing forces.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Thats a good point you make about last years Titan battlegroup set because it is indeed a perfect match for the contents in the ruleset.

Sadly, while the terminals are well done they are the game's hidden cost along with the weapon cards. I'd treat myself to another pair of hounds but then its the additional cost of another set of terminals...

Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer



London

Well the rules set has considerably more stuff than the contents of the battleforce, but whatever.

You really shouldn’t need a terminal for each knight banner. It would make more sense just to have a damage track per banner and the weapon rules and stats separately.
   
Made in gb
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps





UK

Now live on GW NZ, upgrade sprue is a definite:

   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





That’s actually a pretty good saving. In Oz it’s $220, normally $350 if bought separately.

So a question from someone who has never played the game and doesn’t know the rules, is this pretty much a complete force of Knights? Or would you expect a to be expanding it down the track?

I’m tempted as it seems a good deal, but not so much if it’s only a small force compared to what people actually use in games.
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




AllSeeingSkink wrote:
That’s actually a pretty good saving. In Oz it’s $220, normally $350 if bought separately.

So a question from someone who has never played the game and doesn’t know the rules, is this pretty much a complete force of Knights? Or would you expect a to be expanding it down the track?

I’m tempted as it seems a good deal, but not so much if it’s only a small force compared to what people actually use in games.


It's a legal kniight household force. But all the household banner is at half strength. And you can't take all of them as a single household (nice rule), 1 type of knight will have to be freeblade.

And playing a knight household force atm isn't exactly a funn experience.

Still a great deal.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/30 02:43:41


 
   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





So if a new player bought this, what would you be expecting them to buy afterwards to make it a more complete and capable force?
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






AllSeeingSkink wrote:
So if a new player bought this, what would you be expecting them to buy afterwards to make it a more complete and capable force?


Couple boxes of Questoris and another box of Acastus would get you about 1500 points or so, so you might as well get 2 of these.

As for capable, Titans crush Knights and without any Titans of your own to draw fire you’re gonna be sweeping your models off pretty quickly.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/30 03:35:14


"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" 
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




AllSeeingSkink wrote:
So if a new player bought this, what would you be expecting them to buy afterwards to make it a more complete and capable force?


Probably buy that box now and wait in 2020 for more knight pattern. (and a revised knight household rule maybe). Right now they remain an important strategic choice for any Titan list, but aren't that great on their own. As a titan support unit, they are small, nimble and can move anywhere they want. However, as a Knight household, they're forced to lump together, which completely dismissed their advantage.

Unless you're spamming only acastus, which is pure shooting and doesn't care about being lumped together.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/11/30 06:37:02


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




AllSeeingSkink wrote:
That’s actually a pretty good saving. In Oz it’s $220, normally $350 if bought separately.

So a question from someone who has never played the game and doesn’t know the rules, is this pretty much a complete force of Knights? Or would you expect a to be expanding it down the track?

I’m tempted as it seems a good deal, but not so much if it’s only a small force compared to what people actually use in games.


Technically, yes. A minimum Knight household is but a single lance of three banners and so the two Acastus and a pair of Cerastus is all that is needed to meet that requirement. There is actually just enough to form two lances but thats stretching it too thin.

But as with any wargame, AT depends on the point budget of the game you are playing. The boxset provides about 900 points, depending on how you arm the Questoris. However, the Acastus are more powerful than their points cost suggests so they could be updated in the future, possibly bumping up that total to 1,000 points.

Don't forget that adding titan support is allowed(sigh, its on page 6 of Doom of Molech), so a pair of warhounds would be ideal at 480 points.

Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





So is 1500pts roughly what people like to play? For reference, can anyone share a ballpark points cost for the warlord and reaver?

I’m thinking I’ll pass, even though it saves $130 compared to buyin separately, I still need the rules and if I buy a box of warhounds on top of that, that brings the total to over $400AUD, a pretty big price tag for only having one half of a game.
   
Made in gb
Disgusting Nurgling




Bellshill

Roughly 500pts for the Warlord and 300pts for the Reaver. I would suggest between 800pts and 850pts for both, depending on build.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/12/02 20:16:36


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




AllSeeingSkink wrote:
So is 1500pts roughly what people like to play? For reference, can anyone share a ballpark points cost for the warlord and reaver?

I’m thinking I’ll pass, even though it saves $130 compared to buyin separately, I still need the rules and if I buy a box of warhounds on top of that, that brings the total to over $400AUD, a pretty big price tag for only having one half of a game.


Fully armed a Warlord is about 500 pts, a Reaver 330 pts and a Warhound is 240 pts. It depends on who you are playing but 1,000 to 1,500 points is ideal when starting out. Either side of that you have people who either cannot afford the game or very serious players. So the ruleset + titan battlegroup boxset is a perfect start(about 1,200 points), as the ruleset contains all you need for the 4 titans.

For your situation(Australian prices are too damn high!) I would do $318 for the rules + 4 Warhounds. Thats a medium luperical maniple(getting close to 1000 points) and I'm sure another player would be willing to either downsize their force or even let you use some of their models to balance things out.

Now, here is the thing about the Warhound sets - they have lots of left over pieces including Carapaces, heads and shin-plates, and you'll only be using 4 of the 8 weapons that are included. With basic plasticard skills I was able to DIY a third hound from my kit and with even greater skill with casting could have done a better job and even squeezed out a fourth hound! If you have a friend with a 3D printer...they could help you out here. This means that you could have as many as 8 warhounds for the price of 4. In 40K, there are many players who will make their own Titans from scratch instead of purchasing a Forgeworld kit, and so there is plenty of reference to go on...

Hope this helps!

Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in au
Osprey Reader




SamusDrake wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
So is 1500pts roughly what people like to play? For reference, can anyone share a ballpark points cost for the warlord and reaver?

I’m thinking I’ll pass, even though it saves $130 compared to buyin separately, I still need the rules and if I buy a box of warhounds on top of that, that brings the total to over $400AUD, a pretty big price tag for only having one half of a game.


Fully armed a Warlord is about 500 pts, a Reaver 330 pts and a Warhound is 240 pts. It depends on who you are playing but 1,000 to 1,500 points is ideal when starting out. Either side of that you have people who either cannot afford the game or very serious players. So the ruleset + titan battlegroup boxset is a perfect start(about 1,200 points), as the ruleset contains all you need for the 4 titans.

For your situation(Australian prices are too damn high!) I would do $318 for the rules + 4 Warhounds. Thats a medium luperical maniple(getting close to 1000 points) and I'm sure another player would be willing to either downsize their force or even let you use some of their models to balance things out.

Now, here is the thing about the Warhound sets - they have lots of left over pieces including Carapaces, heads and shin-plates, and you'll only be using 4 of the 8 weapons that are included. With basic plasticard skills I was able to DIY a third hound from my kit and with even greater skill with casting could have done a better job and even squeezed out a fourth hound! If you have a friend with a 3D printer...they could help you out here. This means that you could have as many as 8 warhounds for the price of 4. In 40K, there are many players who will make their own Titans from scratch instead of purchasing a Forgeworld kit, and so there is plenty of reference to go on...

Hope this helps!


All good advice. The 1000-1500 pts range is the game size I've mostly played too, although you can go smaller, down to 750pts or thereabouts.

AllSeeingSkink, bear in mind that AT was primarily intended as a game about Titans, with Knights as an interesting support choice (GW's obsession with Knight armies this year notwithstanding). Much like Battlefleet Gothic, you don't need as many models as you might think. You can have a decent game of AT with just three units per side, or even two. Titans can take a lot of punishment thanks to their shields--no wiping the opponent off the board in Turn 1 here. (Well, unless you spam Acastus. But let's not get into that again...)

I think of Reavers as cruisers / ships of the line. Warhounds are light cruisers. Warlords are battleships. Knights are piddly escort vessels. Acastus are Polly Pocket Death Stars.

As a fellow Aussie suffering from antipodean deployment expenses, I started out with the Rules Set and aimed to slowly collect the minimum needed for a Venator maniple. That's one Reaver Titan and a pair of Warhounds--slightly cheaper than the two pairs of Warhounds suggested by SamusDrake. It's not as many points, but it gives more variety, feels like you have a 'command' unit (the Reaver) with more staying power, and is easy to expand to a full Venator by adding another pair of Warhounds down the track. Also, the rules for the Venator are in the core rulebook, whereas the Lupercal is in the Titandeath supplement--it's full of cool stuff, but you may not yet want to invest in that. (Fair enough, all you'd need to see is the special rule for the maniple... but that's impossible without, um, some kind of futuristic information superhighway or something, I guess.)

Of course, a better option would be the Rules Set plus Titan Battlegroup if you can find it at a discount. I managed to effectively get a Warlord for free. The Titan Battlegroup box is the best value set in all Titanicus and a great way to get new players into the game. Naturally GW seems to have discontinued it.

The Rules Set contains enough accessories for two players... just. There will be a few annoyances, like having to refer to the book instead of the cards for Strategems and mission objectives.

You can also use the Rules Set with old Epic Titans if you like, to try out the rules. Some things may be a bit fiddly due to the smaller size of the Epic models, but the game should work in most respects.

Also keep in mind that the rules include handicap mechanisms to (theoretically) compensate for any imbalance in points between two opposing forces.

When I first assembled my models, I blu-tacked the Reaver's armour plates on, and did the same for the Warhounds' weapons. That way I could play a few games to see if it was fun (it was) before I bothered painting the models or collecting more.

At Aussie prices, I would avoid the big Warlord unless you can find it at a hefty discount. I got hold of one for the local price of a Reaver, and another in the Titan Battlegroup. Eventually I caved in and bought the Warlord weapon sprues direct from GW to equip the big boys with interchangeable loadouts. It hurt my wallet, but since I had assembled my Warlords by then, I knew I'd magnetise the weapons the moment they turned up in the mailbox and use them on the table ASAP. Which I did. I've bought plenty of more sensibly priced things that ended up collecting dust in a cupboard for years.

For terrain, at minimum, I'd suggest at least one feature big enough to completely block line of sight to and from a Warlord, and a few that can hide a Warhound (they'll come up to a Reaver's waist and give it some shelter too).

Getting back to future developments that may affect us in the future... where are our Chaos Titans? C'mon, it's just one new armour sprue per Titan. And why does Aeronautica get Orks but not AT? Kick off with mirrored factions to keep resources low, fine, sensible choice, but I'm not quite sure why FW seems intent on inventing new Titans for the Loyalists and Traitors when they could introduce Gargants and Phantom Titans and pull in a whole new host of players who wouldn't be caught dead driving humie robots.
   
Made in gb
Deadshot Weapon Moderati





Zenithfleet wrote:


Of course, a better option would be the Rules Set plus Titan Battlegroup if you can find it at a discount. I managed to effectively get a Warlord for free. The Titan Battlegroup box is the best value set in all Titanicus and a great way to get new players into the game. Naturally GW seems to have discontinued it.


Good news, the GM edition is very much still available due to a reprint. All of the online UK retailers that I peruse (3 of them) have multiple copies available, so I assume they're getting restocked on an ongoing basis.
Personally for value I prefer the AT xmas boxes. These, however, are all oop.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Oh, yes a Venator maniple is definitely recommended, but in hindsight would recommend the melta'n'chainfist variant as a starting point - simply because the meltagun is friggin nasty when up close, while the volcano cannon allows it to punch hard. The twin laser carapace weapon is quite good too, and will take the titan to 330 points(or was that with the Chainfist? Urgh! Canny remember!).

For what its worth, I too slowly built up to the minimum Venator and rule set. In the mean time my brother and I used some Questoris and Cerastus in games of Horizon Wars, until we got to that point.

One frustrating thing about AT is a lack of small-scale "skirmish" mode of play. Working together with my brother and through much play testing, we found that AT can be played in a Kill Team style fashion where a Titan or Scion leads a bunch of Knights in a group with a 400 point limit( we sadly don't own a Warlord to play test it ) and honestly it works really well. The only comprimise with the core game is having markers on the table instead of the terminals, as each Knight is no longer bound to banner formation - in other words they can go walkies, but still bound to their Scion or Titan for shake tests should a group member get destroyed. Such a mode of play would need its own set of strategems but would be fewer anyway. Under the fluff of "last survivors towards the end of the Heresy", it would make a good expansion book or for Titanicus 2.0 whenever that comes. Or even White Dwarf...

On the other hand, there is talk of a forthcoming scout titan- the "rapier" that is below the Warhound, and another battle titan inbetween the hound and reaver. So hopefully AT will become more accessable and lower-point games more common.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
JWBS wrote:
Zenithfleet wrote:


Of course, a better option would be the Rules Set plus Titan Battlegroup if you can find it at a discount. I managed to effectively get a Warlord for free. The Titan Battlegroup box is the best value set in all Titanicus and a great way to get new players into the game. Naturally GW seems to have discontinued it.


Good news, the GM edition is very much still available due to a reprint. All of the online UK retailers that I peruse (3 of them) have multiple copies available, so I assume they're getting restocked on an ongoing basis.
Personally for value I prefer the AT xmas boxes. These, however, are all oop.


Sadly, its not avaliable for Australia. That said, I think that would be getting on for about...$350 for Australia? The tragic thing about that set is that despite having two Warlords, it doesn't have enough for a minimum maniple.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/12/03 14:51:51


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