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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





If you put the emperor's shield and then also nightshield on this pile of 30 conscripts, you have the potential to (4+ and -1 to be hit) quickly throw the strategem "go to ground" to drop them to 3+. if they are in cover taking fire, they can be at 2+ and -1 to be hit, which means massed bolterfire will be slow to kill them. Even out of cover beside the objective, 3+ to save and -1 to be hit is a powerful combination and in some situations far more resilient than buffed crusaders, and 30 obsec.

Without those buffs, they are dead to the massed bolterfire that is ninth edition, in a heartbeat, and I would agree with blackocato. With them, maybe situationally useful.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/01/28 04:52:44


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Fresh-Faced New User




Dukeofstuff wrote:
If you put the emperor's shield and then also nightshield on this pile of 30 conscripts, you have the potential to (4+ and -1 to be hit) quickly throw the strategem "go to ground" to drop them to 3+. if they are in cover taking fire, they can be at 2+ and -1 to be hit, which means massed bolterfire will be slow to kill them. Even out of cover beside the objective, 3+ to save and -1 to be hit is a powerful combination and in some situations far more resilient than buffed crusaders, and 30 obsec.

Without those buffs, they are dead to the massed bolterfire that is ninth edition, in a heartbeat, and I would agree with blackocato. With them, maybe situationally useful.


You would be better using those buffs on Bullgryn or Death Riders. Plus they give up less VP when they die and can actually fight in CC.
   
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Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot






And for everyone considering deathriders for their rules but either not liking the models/the price ($)/working with resin: take a look at AoS Pistoleros (25€/5 guys) and the other AoS cavalry. They are really easy to convert (basically just stick a Cadian torso and head on top) and it is still 100% GW. Of course one might want to doublecheck if your gaming locality has a strict modelling policy, but as the whole model is bought from their lines they should be ok with it.

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Maxzero wrote:
Dukeofstuff wrote:
If you put the emperor's shield and then also nightshield on this pile of 30 conscripts, you have the potential to (4+ and -1 to be hit) quickly throw the strategem "go to ground" to drop them to 3+. if they are in cover taking fire, they can be at 2+ and -1 to be hit, which means massed bolterfire will be slow to kill them. Even out of cover beside the objective, 3+ to save and -1 to be hit is a powerful combination and in some situations far more resilient than buffed crusaders, and 30 obsec.

Without those buffs, they are dead to the massed bolterfire that is ninth edition, in a heartbeat, and I would agree with blackocato. With them, maybe situationally useful.


You would be better using those buffs on Bullgryn or Death Riders. Plus they give up less VP when they die and can actually fight in CC.


Well that's the thing, I don't have any at the moment and don't have the physical ability to build and paint any right now. Oh well I guess, I'll do the best I can with what I have.
   
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Guarded Grey Knight Terminator






What are some of the best synergies that yall e.ploy with conscripts?
I plan on having an astropath and a commisar with WLT master of command to buff and give orders.

What other ways do yall employ to boost conscripts? What regiments? What strategms? Orders? Gear? Auras? Etc?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/01/28 21:55:09


"Glory in our suffering, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope. And hope does not disappoint"
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I note youcan bring an inquisitortogrant them 5 invuln pretty east.. Then drop it to 4 with anygaurd psyker.

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Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant






Wilderness Survivors seems a good pick for a regiment trait to give them -1 to hit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or just park a couple of vehicles in front of them so they can't actually be seen

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/01/28 22:13:05


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Wilderness survivor is cover save when nit advancing. And only the plus 1.. Not a minus to be hit.

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Made in de
Lone Wolf Sentinel Pilot






I honestly lack practical experience, but whenever I look at conscripts my gutfeeling says buffing them (apart from wilderness survivors) is a trap. I (personally and as I said only based on intuition) would leave them barebones and use my buff characters/powers/stratagems elsewere. 100/150 points for 20-30 dudes is cheap enough to have some use on their own and with the new moral/attrition system it takes a bit to really completely remove them. If your army gives up "thin their ranks" anyway you can afford to loose them.

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Hurr! Ogryn Bone 'Ead!





Wilderness Survivors + Firing from the Hip seems the best combo for infantry heavy lists.

For buffing, maybe a single Astropath who gives them Psychic Barrier or Nightshroud.
   
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I just think in almost every list there are more sensible things the Astropath should cast nightshroud/psychic barrier on. Especially vehicles

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Sure. But as often on the thread someone asks not if something is ideal and perfect .. But how to make a cake with these substitute ingredients. An inquisitors buff power gives o e unit of onfantry 5++ shields... Rather a waste on a 10 mansquad and superfluous on bully or crysaders. If you take inquisition payker support it becomes a more reasonable option for the troop choice withith so so many individual saves to roll... While you wont see it winning at LVO anytime soon its not uselessby a long shot. Hold an onbsec claim vs a bunch of enemy with numbsrs and suddenly its not so bad. Especially if your foe spends disproportionate firepower to remove a trivial unit.

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I have a question: with the change to the secondary objective 'While we stand we fight' that states it now applies to units not models, can you pick a unit of 3 tanks? If you can it makes it an objective worth seriously considering.

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I note only that nine leman russes with nine plasma executioner turrets and nine heavy bolters is a cheap 1395 points, leaving 105 points for yarrick (that's a lot of reroll 1 plasmas!) and 50 for a psyker primaris, 35 for an astropath, 330 for basic infantry, and 35 for an engenseer.

Its not incredible anti-horde but its certainly not crappy at killing intercessers!

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Norn Queen






 PaddyMick wrote:
I have a question: with the change to the secondary objective 'While we stand we fight' that states it now applies to units not models, can you pick a unit of 3 tanks? If you can it makes it an objective worth seriously considering.
Assuming you mean something like Leman Russes that split into individual units after deployment:
If a unit splits into several smaller units during the battle, all of those separate units (excluding Drones units) must be destroyed for the original unit to count as being destroyed for the purposes of this secondary objective.’
   
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Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant






Thank you BaconCatBug. I wonder if they intended units of tanks to be included in that, as the clearly are.

It makes it a good pick then, and something to think about when list building.
Duke, that's a tasty list. You could make one russ from each squad a bare bones battlecannon and let it hang back. Also, may be worth having them in a vanguard detachment for the obsec.

Alternative would be a couple of squads of artillery tanks (sadly not manticore), 2 or 3 strong each, and maybe a big blob of bullgryn with all the buffs.

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Wing Commander





Bristol (UK)

The Munitorum Field Manual has recently been updated, looks like it's just fixed some obvious errors rather than other changes.
Only change I really noticed is Baneblades/chassis are now back to their older costs, as the 50pt for the twin heavy bolters has transferred to the lascannons (confirming that it was the sponson cost and they'd forgotten about the inbuilt guns).

So superheavies are back on the menu!
/s
   
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Noble Knight of the Realm






Infantry only Guard for now still is the wah to go with plenty of Bullgryn support.

"Don't Feed the Troll" 
   
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Noble Knight of the Realm






Maryland Open happening in a few months and I'm actually looking to go. Have not played a 2k army this Edition so what can I expect?

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Regular Dakkanaut






 BlackoCatto wrote:
Infantry only Guard for now still is the wah to go with plenty of Bullgryn support.


I am regretting buying 10 crusaders last year when I should have bought Bullgryns... no supply for months :(
   
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Is there any Value to the idea of the custodes Invuln flag with full bullgryn squads?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/02/14 04:00:59


 
   
Made in us
Noble Knight of the Realm






 RegularGuy wrote:
 BlackoCatto wrote:
Infantry only Guard for now still is the wah to go with plenty of Bullgryn support.


I am regretting buying 10 crusaders last year when I should have bought Bullgryns... no supply for months :(


Yeah I saw Crusader and thought those just weren't gonna cut it. :c

"Don't Feed the Troll" 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





I have the same reaction to the bullgrn though, in an age where so many marine elites are effectively ignore ap-1 and 3+ or 2+ saves, with 3 wounds, AND where the deathgaurd cut their damage down to 1 per hit.
Its not making it impossible to like bullygrns -- but its worrying me a bit as I think about marines also using their many options to force the bullygrns to swing last in the train of melees.

Side note, I think ratlings as midboard deployment screens may be useful right now, which isn't something I ever thougth I would ever say. Since a lot of marine armies seem to be using things that charge the whole length of a board on turn 1, or that setup in a 9 inch from your deployment zone window.

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Same tactics the IG has always used.


This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/02/14 13:29:01


"But the universe is a big place, and whatever happens, you will not be missed..." 
   
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Noble Knight of the Realm






If only that worked these days

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What faction you gonna take there? Catachans seem solid in this meta.

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Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut






So since I have 10... How would you best put Crusaders to work these days? Seems like embeded with Catachan and some missionaries is a start... I think I'd like to try and push them up on to an objective early and even charge forward to blunt the rush of whatever's coming at the guardsman who pull up afterwards. Thoughts on how you would use them these days, or how you've seen them used well?
   
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Honestly chaff. Bullgryns can do it as well and definitely better. If you do, buff, buff buff.

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[DCM]
Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant






Pyroalchi and Dukeofstuff, here's your theoryhammer homework for this week* :

Most efficient way to take a backfield objective from a squad of 10 inner circle deathwing terminators? Please show your working out.

*Cheeky I know. You guys are great.

Answer below

Spoiler:
get a new codex

I have a blog on the Warhammer Tournaments website:

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My first and current painting and modeling blog:

Planetary Defence Force with alternative models and converted vehicles 
   
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Sounds like an interesting challenge. I'm not up to date with the DA codex, could you give me the statline, unit size, cost and defense related special rules of the terminators?

Edit: so what I found was:
unit size 5-10
statline: T4,W3, 2+, BS3+, WS3+, A2
armament: Stormbolter + Powerfist (Sergeant has a Powersword)
cost: 38 per dude, 33 for the sergeant

alternativly: Thunderhammer + Stormshield instead of Stormbolter and Powerweapon => defence changes to 2+ (+1 from stromshield), 4++, 43 points/dude.
And they seem to get +1 on their attacks if they don't move from being dark angles?
Is this roughly correct?


So I would do a little math assuming 10 dudes each, so 370 Points for the variation without stormshield and 430 for the one with

The numbers in front of the slash are always the dudes without, behind with stormshields
1. 10 DKOK Combat Engineer with "Grenadiers" Stratagem using their Gas bombs: 35 "shots" result in 19.44/12.96 unsaved wounds for 6.48/4.32 dead Termies. As the Engineers only cost 70 Points that sounds quite efficient. Main problem would be to get them close enough
2. Hades Breaching drill with "crush them": 5 attacks transfer to 2.89/1.73 dead Termies. In the next turns (without crush them) 1.73/1.04 dead termies. But I'm not sure if it would go first in the first round. And if not it might not survive the termies CC punch before it can do anything. But if it does it might kill back its points at least.
3. other than that I can only think of Psykers... Maybe one could also bind the Termies in CC with Deathrider (they are not thaaat efficient in killing the horses) and smuggle in an infantry squad close enough to outscore them on that objective.
If I'm not off 10 Termies with their 30 attacks "just" kill about 4 Death Riders per fight phase so to clean of 20 death Riders (300 Points) they Need 5 fight phases/turns. As ong a during that time one infantry squad is Close enough to negate the Obsec, those Termies score nothing as all the Riders count.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/02/22 09:44:01


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