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@Osiris: Try WH. They need at least twice as many models due to the lower points costs, and they're all metal as well.

Everything is going up, and buying models is a luxury. So while no one likes to see their hobby get more expensive, at least I can still make the decision of buying a new box set or seeing a movie instead of eating this week or paying my bills.

LOL, I see its the same old same old with GW. Oh well I am mostly past caring nowadays.

grimshawl wrote:LOL, I see its the same old same old with GW. Oh well I am mostly past caring nowadays.

haha, and it's the same old same old with the naysayers right?

It's a price increase and as mentioned earlier, one can either choose to buy or choose not to buy the product. If you or anyone is in a situation where they are worried about putting food on the table, paying rent, or otherwise providing for themselves/family or buying product, then you should put the hobby away until it's not a burden to your survival.

Well, I've got loads of metal work, I suppose the only Orky metal bits I need at the moment are dreads? I'll have a look at the price when I come to buy some and decide if I'll scratch build or buy then?

I get paid on the 24th of september so I will go pig out on paints as that's what will be my next purchase for sure anyway. I'll probably buy the big box set if they're going to do a price hike?

The only other thing I'd be hogging in to is the AOBR set but that's plastic so no rush for that one hopefully!!

What is the point of metal models anyway? Why are they made in white metal not plastic? I actually find the plastic models much easier to work with than metal ones?

You know, this wouldn't be so galling (everything's getting more expensive these days) if it weren't for their pricing structure that makes characters cost much, much more than an equivalent weight in line troops. If line troops received the "adjustment" while leaving special characters etc. at their current level of ridiculous, it might seem a bit more consumer-friendly, rather than "screw you as usual, plus some."

There is a rumour that this price adjustment is going to pass Canada by. That would mean that after an increase of 17%, GW Canada would only be overpriced by 33% instead of 50%.

This is progress!

That's one way of looking at it.

Odd that the increase in metals/raw materials and transportation costs will suddenly pass over Canada...

I think the GW community has been dealing with price increases in the last 8 years like a person deals with death or loss:

Denial: "this is just a price adjustment. It's not a big deal, it's still the Mercedes of miniatures. It's no more expensive than any other hobby."

Anger: "I'm sick of GW, and I won't ever buy another miniature again!"

Bargaining: "well, I can buy from the Warstore, online, cut back on other hobbies."

Depression: "Who cares, the rules suck and the models aren't as good anymore anyway."

Acceptance: "I'll buy less, work more hours, and enjoy painting what I have."

I think we're safely between 4 & 5 right now. I don't know anybody personally that actually left over the price increases (as the actual cause, not the stated reason), and online bargains ain't what they used to be. The legions of fanboys that used to defend the increases seem to have faded away, and while some hobbyists are fading out of the scene or not starting new armies, we now simply accept price increases as a natural thing.

I hear that GWCan and GWUS will eventually merge into a single entity.

Alpharius wrote:That's one way of looking at it. Odd that the increase in metals/raw materials and transportation costs will suddenly pass over Canada...

Well... GW Canada's stuff is all shipped out of Memphis, same as GWUS. Shipping from GWUS to Canada does not cost 30-50% of your order, so make your own conclusions.

If it makes you feel any better, Canada got a price increase of $5 across the $20-$50 bands right after the adjustment that reduced your battleforces to $90, and got another increase after the Empire release. In the mean time, our dollar has been steadily gaining against yours, further increasing the divide. Canadian prices will never come down, but eventually, the US's prices will probably eventually catch up and then we'll be one happy family, paying the same high prices. Just be glad that your battleforces aren't $130 like they are over here.

Guys, you have to decide if you like (A) miniature tabletop wargames or (B) only GW games.

If you answer A, there is a whole world of less expensive tabletop options out there.

keezus wrote:I hear that GWCan and GWUS will eventually merge into a single entity.

Alpharius wrote:That's one way of looking at it. Odd that the increase in metals/raw materials and transportation costs will suddenly pass over Canada...

Well... GW Canada's stuff is all shipped out of Memphis, same as GWUS. Shipping from GWUS to Canada does not cost 30-50% of your order, so make your own conclusions.

If it makes you feel any better, Canada got a price increase of $5 across the $20-$50 bands right after the adjustment that reduced your battleforces to $90, and got another increase after the Empire release. In the mean time, our dollar has been steadily gaining against yours, further increasing the divide. Canadian prices will never come down, but eventually, the US's prices will probably eventually catch up and then we'll be one happy family, paying the same high prices. Just be glad that your battleforces aren't $130 like they are over here.

All it really means is that Canadian customers were really get screwed over. Which, of course, is not news to anyone living in Canada!

Still, it kind of casts GW's latest price increase message in a different light.

Not like they care though.

Polonius wrote:I don't know anybody personally that actually left over the price increases (as the actual cause, not the stated reason)

Probably - again, once you own your army, you can play it forever.

But a lot of people stopped buying. I didn't buy anything from GW for a few years, limiting my purchasing to trades of secondhand.

I think a lot of the moaning about GW prices is because a lot of players are still fairly young and only on pocket-money kind of incomes.

You can put together a decent size army for most factions, with some choices, for between £300 and £400 pounds.

I know that's more than you would spend on any other tabletop wargame -- but compared to golf, shooting, photography and so on it's pretty reasonable.

(All this has been said before of course.)

Kilkrazy wrote:I think a lot of the moaning about GW prices is because a lot of players are still fairly young and only on pocket-money kind of incomes.

I also think the reverse is true. Many of us are young professionals who started playing GW games in the early 90s. We've seen the constant march of the price increases and each new one is a reminder of just how high they've gotten.

Now don't get me wrong, there are still some excellent values to be had in the GW product lines. Black Reach is a perfect example. The metals on the other hand, have just gotten silly. I get my metals kick playing historicals and WM but still find working with GW's plastic very pleasing. I've been priced out of GW's metals and won't use them.

So... um... do they ever decrease the prices when things are looking up? If not I guess I should finish buying my VC stuff for a while pretty soon.

Since that GW is only increasing the paint and metals, not the plastics, why not boycott all metal purchases and only buy plastics, forcing GW to make more plastic models at the same price?
I personally hate seeing metal models, they are hard to work with and are sometimes just ugly in the cae of oblids.
Why are they still making matal models?

Squig_herder wrote:Since that GW is only increasing the paint and metals, not the plastics, why not boycott all metal purchases and only buy plastics, forcing GW to make more plastic models at the same price?
I personally hate seeing metal models, they are hard to work with and are sometimes just ugly in the cae of oblids.
Why are they still making matal models?

I've grown fond of my metal oblits and thank god they aren't hiking everything just the metals.

Do you know if metal/plastic hybrid stuff is getting a hike? Like the blisters of single black knights?

Kilkrazy wrote:Guys, you have to decide if you like (A) miniature tabletop wargames or (B) only GW games.

If you answer A, there is a whole world of less expensive tabletop options out there.

Quoted for truth. I realized my answer was (A) in 2004 and haven't looked back.

I'll probably still buy a GW mini from time to time (I like the way the new WHFB Chaos stuff is looking, for example) but there's a huge world of awesome miniatures out there, if you can rid yourself of the silly idea that you're in the Games Workshop Hobby, and not the miniature wargaming hobby.

Hordini wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:Guys, you have to decide if you like (A) miniature tabletop wargames or (B) only GW games.

If you answer A, there is a whole world of less expensive tabletop options out there.

Quoted for truth. I realized my answer was (A) in 2004 and haven't looked back.

I'll probably still buy a GW mini from time to time (I like the way the new WHFB Chaos stuff is looking, for example) but there's a huge world of awesome miniatures out there, if you can rid yourself of the silly idea that you're in the Games Workshop Hobby, and not the miniature wargaming hobby.

I have looked around but i keep finding myself uncontrolably drawn back to GW, i just find they are the best out there for me and i love them not matter what others say or try to convert me to.

Squig_herder wrote:
I have looked around but i keep finding myself uncontrolably drawn back to GW, i just find they are the best out there for me and i love them not matter what others say or try to convert me to.

I find this is true for their plastics. They really are pleasing to work with. I don't buy metal stuff from GW, so I'm largely unaffected by such price hikes.

That said, most of my gaming money no longer goes to GW. GW chooses not to receive it by not offering me the products I want. They still get some because they still offer the occasional good thing (Washes, Foundation Paints, Black Reach, LOTR Plastics) but generally speaking what they offer doesn't get my money at the current prices.

I tried A but my FLGS decided to lose the F and told me that I couldn´t play 40K with my proxy eldar army as the army was "very confusing" (sic) as I use Infinity and warzone minis (along with some heavily converted GW minis and tanks). They recomended me to try another army but if they can not stand my old and trusty Mishima units then I can stand not buying from them...

M.

Codex Space Marines is listed at $30.00 on advance order. Is this going to be the new codex prices?
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/armySubUnitCats.jsp?catId=cat1320003&rootCatGameStyle=wh40k

When I started looking at the prices for this hobby the general boxed sets were around 30-35 $AU. $34.95 actually. Citadel paints were $3.50

I think the boxed sets went up to 40.00, when GW brought in the price banding crap. Paints then went up momentarily as well, although I could usually find them marked down in toy stores for the old 3.50.

GW prices in Australia ATM you can work out from around the fact that the 10 Marine kit is $50. Independent retailers usually knock at least 10% of GW's prices, which is sweet. 20-25% off new stuff online. Anyone surprised that GW has been getting upset about online indpndnt retailers? I mean, seriously, if they want to look friendly, why don't they lower OUR prices and hike it for the retailers just a tiny bit?

I don't plan on boycotting metal models. This has been discussed in another thread, but I love metal minis and I know that my Skaven army in particular would not be the same if it wasn't packing so much white metal. Except for the metal plague monks - I waited for the plastics just because those models were dumb, 4th Ed warhammer style.

Squig_herder wrote:
Why are they still making matal models?

They hold far more detail than plastic, and there are molding techniques that work on metal but not on plastic for whatever reason. Thus, metal allows for more detailed models. Plastic is catching up however, and this can be seen in the Black reach captain etc.. Over time more stuff will become plastic, but until then they will continue using metal. They are however, trying to phase metal out.

Canute: ours have been $35 for some time.

The GW boxed deals are also a very good value here in Canada. For example the 1500 point boxed SM army is $340 (The $100 over the US MSRP is obviously to cover shipping from Memphis... 30-50% shipping costs is normal right?)

Thanks GW. You guys rock!

canute wrote:Codex Space Marines is listed at $30.00 on advance order. Is this going to be the new codex prices?
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/armySubUnitCats.jsp?catId=cat1320003&rootCatGameStyle=wh40k

According to another thread it is a thick book and has 50pp of fluff -- most other codexes are maximum 64pp including everything.

blinky wrote:

Squig_herder wrote:
Why are they still making matal models?

They hold far more detail than plastic, and there are molding techniques that work on metal but not on plastic for whatever reason. Thus, metal allows for more detailed models. Plastic is catching up however, and this can be seen in the Black reach captain etc.. Over time more stuff will become plastic, but until then they will continue using metal. They are however, trying to phase metal out.

It's also partly due to economies of scale. A typical 5ed. army needs something like 40-80 basic troops, and only one commander, so GW can't sell a lot of commanders. Plastic is only cheap for mass production, because of the cost of the moulds.

Kilkrazy wrote:

Squig_herder wrote:
Why are they still making matal models?

It's also partly due to economies of scale. A typical 5ed. army needs something like 40-80 basic troops, and only one commander, so GW can't sell a lot of commanders. Plastic is only cheap for mass production, because of the cost of the moulds.

They have made plastic commanders for a wide variety of armies now. Atleast the most popular ones. There's a plastic marines one. Chaos. On the fantasy side you'll find a couple as well. I also thought that the way to go would be to integrate them into existing sprues like they did with ripper swarms. A parter here and there where if you buy two troops choices worth of stuff, you'll be able to cobble together atleast a legal commander. For some armies, you can pretty much do this already.

>>They have made plastic commanders for a wide variety of armies now. Atleast the most popular ones. There's a plastic marines one. Chaos.

We know that SMs account for over 25% of GW sales by themselves, which obviously gives them economies of scale, so it proves my point.

I bet we'll never see a plastic Tau Ethereal.