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thanks John,

2)I toyed with the idea ofdoing a jetbike conversion out of a pirahna but then saw the tetra and figured that was the direction GW was going to take.

8)Like the aternative fire mode in concept but not sure with the limited ammo. Would add flexibility.
How about alternative fire, seekers have DP intercept capability, and drop the no cover save idea.(really liked that idea, wasted way to many points on kills that just fade away).

12) Currently pay 50 pts for a one shot a round gun and the overall army boost from one little squad would make it worthwhile.
But, honestly, I like your idea better( 3) donorian clawed fiend.) I just choose Bhargessi due to there proximity to Tau space and the tau's limited warp capability. Warp travel is easy to fix(they reverse engineer necron tech)

focusedfire wrote:Casper, dude' take the compliment. "I" spent to much time listening to GW talk about game balance. So much so that I didn't even think about basic BS increase in my dream wish list for the next codex.
We're not talking about a lot of pts increase on these ideas because 5th ed reduced individual unit effecticveness. Also, using the new SM codex as a template. Points for the same thing should drop, or stay the same with tweaks to make them more suitable to 5th ed.

Im really sorry man, I took your compliment for a complaint...was rather tired when I read that....so sorry. I continued to think of how to justify it even if it seems like a fat chance....If they redo markerlights and gave us the increase in BS then remove the ability to add to the BS....keep everthing else or mabe add more. However if they changed all the markerlights to networked, droped their points a bit (to make them more attrative to attach to the FW). Also makeing the drones relentless so they would be more useful would be nice. Therefore getting rid of the need in BS increase.

Once again focusedfire, sorry for misreading you.

No prob Casper. The drones I believe already are relentless due to their jetpacks.
Problem is they lose that ability when they join a different type of squad. Case in point, marker drones fire a "heavy" markerlight. If they are with crisis or stealth jumpsuits they can move and fire, but the second they join an infantry squad they lose that ability. I know it's silly.

I really think GW has a ton of potential here with extensive use of Xenos allies. Tau could bring back newly-allied Piscean Warriors, Fimir, Slaan, and Zoats from the Tau Empire and nobody would blink an eye.

JohnHwangDD wrote:I really think GW has a ton of potential here with extensive use of Xenos allies. Tau could bring back newly-allied Piscean Warriors, Fimir, Slaan, and Zoats from the Tau Empire and nobody would blink an eye.

Just think of the modeling possibilities Could make building Tau almost as much fun as Orks. Now if I could get a clear ruling on shield drones and wound allocation.(sorry if thats a little off-topic)

focusedfire wrote:

Just think of the modeling possibilities Could make building Tau almost as much fun as Orks. Now if I could get a clear ruling on shield drones and wound allocation.(sorry if thats a little off-topic)

I have wondered this myself...if anyone could let me know it would be great.

Not to continue with the jack...but can I third that?

What do yo guys think GW is going to push for the Tau. Personally, from looking at the recent packaging of sets, I see generic stealth commanders. Stealth commanders with plas or missles....hhhmmm that would be fun. Maybe improve the stealth ability to 2d6x2.

I personally think Tetras look really dumb, so I hope they wouldn't add those. In fact, I don't really like any of the Forge World models or conversion kits, including their weird battlesuits.

for the 10 points you pay for them, fire warriors need to be BS 4.... if not BS 4, then a drop in points would be nice...
if neither of those work.... then just make the fire warrior BS 4 and 12 points. you konw, what the etherial can get for a bodyguard (12 points is pushing it though)

the devilfish is crazy overpriced.

Distuption pods are underpriced.

for the love of Gork the SMS and Burst cannons need to be defensive guns.

and why cant fire warriors get a heavy weapon that can do some krumpin???
how about letting them get rail rifels at say + 10 points per... one out of every 6 fire warriors can carry one??
:EDIT mabey take away the pinning aspect of the gun?? for a few more points, you can buy special rounds for it that make it pinning... for a few more points you can buy it a target lock?????

i dont like the idea of tau getting a GOOD CC unit though... i mean come on, do you want them to be able to do everything just like the marines

I agree with you about the aliens...we dont really need more currently - fix the ones we have first....

Somehow still see pathfinders rail rifles returing much more than fire war's gettin them.

Otherwise i agree with everthing else...we probably are all dreaming about fw with bs 4...but i'de rather see that than a points drop. I just don't see the points drop as that benificial, Kroot are dirt cheep but dont last, fire warr's need to be around so we can hold objectives. And if CC is supposed to be our weakness then we should have some way of killing assulters before they get to us.

Casper wrote: we should have some way of killing assulters before they get to us.

i said it before, and ill say it again.

let the firewarriors get a heavy weapon or 2 that can do some krumpin.

Squad Leaders should remain at 1 attack and gain BS 4.

Imho, i doubt we will se fire warriors taking up a grenade launcher any time soon. I like the idea of having drones that carry the hvy wep - flamer, sniper, rail rifle (yes keep them both this fills a different role), mabe even other battle suit wepon systems. (As somebody previously mentioned)

Also another posibility would be to bring back the human auxileries (instead of new aliens) and allow them to take some better wepons - 1 or 2 per squad from a select list (Imp G or mabe Tau).

One problem with the human auxiliaries rules I saw was that these traitor guardsmen came in squads the same size as Fire Warrior squads, which is just too small for models with such wimpy stats.

Everyone agrees that disruption pods should cost more. Did anyone think this in the last edition? Because they were just as good then (only everyone took decoy launchers instead).

The way I saw the Human Auxilaries was similar to a small group of allies for recon.

Unlike Kroot, they get a markerlights. Fairly cheap markerlight. I'd say making Human Auxilaries into something like scouts who can out flank and light up targets from the rare would be cool.

How else would Tau use their allies in their tactica?

If human auxiliaries were available, where would they fit in the FOC, and should they be Scoring?

JohnHwangDD wrote:If human auxiliaries were available, where would they fit in the FOC, and should they be Scoring?

Probably troops. I don't see them being fast attack and definatly not eliets. I agree they would act like more hevily armed scouts (aren't kroot our scouts?) Squad size, points and gear im not so sure about (anyone have rules they could link?). Mabe put a cap like 0-1 on them or something bc no sane comander would have more allies than loyal fire warriors (who hopefully will be buffed).

As to scoring would you mean takeing objectives? If thats the case then yes, kroot can so why wouldn't they as troops?

I think they would be troops, but as Auxillia (a rule applying to all non-Tau) They do not use up actual troops slots. I think that may help.

what can humans naturally do better than tau?
CC

what else?
Well if they're space marines or assassins they can give the tau some superior tech, but guard/PDF? not a chance.

humans should have some kind of CC type of thing.

Actually, Casper, The kroot are our auxllary troops. Mostly, according to fluff, because we don't have endless hive wolrds. Our scouts are in need tweeking.

I liked the idea of another race because it fit the fluff. I would be perfectly happy with the simple mods I mentioned earlier to our existing allies. But if no new allies then how about a great Gnarlock?

As far as humans How about this WS3 BS3 S3 T3 A1 I3 Sv 4+ Weaponry; Pulse pistols, close combat weapons(to much to ask for chainswords OH!!! Honour blades), emp genades and maybe a flamer option. Inspired Defense Rule that allow them to bump their initiate by a point in certain conditions?

focusedfire wrote:Actually, Casper, The kroot are our auxllary troops. Mostly, according to fluff, because we don't have endless hive wolrds. Our scouts are in need tweeking.

I liked the idea of another race because it fit the fluff. I would be perfectly happy with the simple mods I mentioned earlier to our existing allies. But if no new allies then how about a great Gnarlock?

As far as humans How about this WS3 BS3 S3 T3 A1 I3 Sv 4+ Weaponry; Pulse pistols, close combat weapons(to much to ask for chainswords OH!!! Honour blades), emp genades and maybe a flamer option. Inspired Defense Rule that allow them to bump their initiate by a point in certain conditions?

Thanks, I don't know much of the fluff unless its in the dex. I like the humans as either another cheap cc unit that cant infiltrate (let kroot do that) or a unit that has the ability to get some templates or blast wepons. Something along that statline would be nice. But they should be less capable than FW. So guns mabe only st4? something like an imperial lasgun but with more punch?

Personally I think our lack of CC is what makes us different, and it takes better tatics when your army doesn't perform at all in 1/3 of the phases imho.

what do you mean the tau dont perform in the assault phase?? our suits jump around, a key part to tau tactics.

and the more i think about it the more i like the idea of heavy weapon drones in the fire warrior squad. 0-2 i think would be a good limmit per squad.

fw don't use heavy weapons, they go on battlesuits.
or drones I guess.

Not, yet, on the drones. Just speculating, was the first mod I thought of when I got my Tau army. Flamer drome is so simple that GW will plrobably never do it. Hope they do tho'.

Human Auxilia can function exactly like Imperial Guard platoons, heavy weapons and all. They aren't going to be assault troops. Kroot are superior and people don't use them for assault to start with. Let Human Auxilia be the squads that get heavy support weapons. They can act as the solid battle line that anchors the more mobile Tau units. Let them do as they do best, as the Tau fluff would have it. Maybe make Pulse Rifles an "x members of the squad can replace their lasguns with pulse rifles for y points" option, along with grenade launchers, missile launcers, heavy bolters and autocannons. Maybe add an option to either upgrade the squad with cameleoline and infiltrate/or carapace armor for 25 points per squad.

Problem is that the write up that I have for human auxilia is that they don't get to take the heavy weapons. (fluffwise)It's treated like part of proper integration in the Tau empire is that they give up the evil imperial tactica and adopt Fire caste doctrine. I do like your idea, its just that give a human carapace+few pulse rifles and they are superior to the basic tau statwise.

Maybe make use of the prefered enemy status. The auxilia will be engagement priority over tau units, make them distraction/speed bump.

The problem is that what makes Human troopers worth using is their heavy weapon upgrades. Human auxilia do not have these and thus have no niche to fill. The Tau fluff states that they still retain the industrial capacity to make standard pattern weaponry for themselves, hence the lasguns they wield. Just extend that to heavy weapons and they suddenly have their reason to exist back. Tau firewarriors retain their basic firepower and durability advantage, as well as their mobility advantage in Devilfish. The Guardsmen can form an actual battle line that that Devilfish, Crisis Suits and Hammerheads can maneuver around as they fight the enemy. They aren't particularly expected to follow fire caste doctrine, just what the empire orders them to do. Don't make them "fire magnets", as Tau do not acknowledge attrition tactics. Give them a real purpose to serve, or don't have them at all.

Not really disagreeing with you. At present they are pretty much just a cruriosity. Something cool to field because you took the time to convert them(I know, I said that like there is a problem with modeling for coolness. You guys can shoot me later). Its just, what role would they fill?

Also, as of this rule book, they would be able to use a transport as can the kroot as long as squad size is right. Can't start off loaded but you can load up after start of game.

I know, I ask for too much in their abilities, just throwing out various ideas to pick and choose from.

I think it would at least be an interesting option. You can get Witchhunter and Daemonhunter allies with some armies, so Tau armies with Kroot and Human Auxilia units could work in a similar manner. Purist Fire Caste? Sure, you can do it. Third Sphere Border Word force? Use a bunch of non-Tau auxillia. Or anything in between. It would be fun and characterful