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Is britain not pulling out in like 3 months or something?

i support 2nd and 1/2 amendment...




send some of those into NK and see what happens

That's seriously bonkers.

So what, you dont value the lives of our troops? your happy to see them being killed for a fight that isnt ours?
how about you sign up in the army, go out and see what its like for yourself?
why the feth should we lose our own troops to protect a country thats having problems? feth em, its thier problems, not ours.
if people didnt keep getting involved in everything then maybe we could cut back on wars.

its ok for you to blurt on about how things should be done, but at the end of the day the closest you have ever come to something like this is pushing a few model over a board, and following game rules.
and im guessing the worsed situation you have ever been in was possibly being bullied, not shot at.

maybe you should start thinking about it from a few different points of view before you open your mouth and sound like a fething ungreatfull bastard.
this is something that does annoy me, im risking my life for pricks like you who seem to think we are fething disposable, "they done thier job and thought, throw em away now"
that your kind of fething gakky attitude?
if so then how about you feth off to a different country or sign up and see how that goes.
fething prick.


sorry for the somewhat bad language used here, just making sure he gets my point loud and clear.
and im sure ill be hearing from a MOD soon ish.

JD21290 wrote:

That's seriously bonkers.

So what, you dont value the lives of our troops? your happy to see them being killed for a fight that isnt ours?
how about you sign up in the army, go out and see what its like for yourself?
why the feth should we lose our own troops to protect a country thats having problems? feth em, its thier problems, not ours.
if people didnt keep getting involved in everything then maybe we could cut back on wars.

its ok for you to blurt on about how things should be done, but at the end of the day the closest you have ever come to something like this is pushing a few model over a board, and following game rules.
and im guessing the worsed situation you have ever been in was possibly being bullied, not shot at.

maybe you should start thinking about it from a few different points of view before you open your mouth and sound like a fething ungreatfull bastard.
this is something that does annoy me, im risking my life for pricks like you who seem to think we are fething disposable, "they done thier job and thought, throw em away now"
that your kind of fething gakky attitude?
if so then how about you feth off to a different country or sign up and see how that goes.
fething prick.


sorry for the somewhat bad language used here, just making sure he gets my point loud and clear.
and im sure ill be hearing from a MOD soon ish.

So you don't think the lives of foreign civilians living in harsh conditions are valuble?
You think countries like NK and China can sort their own problems out?
They're been trying for a long time. It hasn't worked, has it? If you joined the military, you are expected to defend the world, not your country, which hasn't had a military attack for a very long time.
Who's to say the lives of soldiers aren't valuble? It's their choice to sign up, and they should understand the risks involved in military service.

Your argument is centered around yourself. What makes you so sure of the other soldier's mindsets? You aren't them, are you?

im risking my life

But only due to you choosing to take the job in the first place.

if people didnt keep getting involved in everything then maybe we could cut back on wars.

Yes. And if no one signed up to the armies then....

maybe you should start thinking about it from a few different points of view before you open your mouth

Quite.

I see the British army is now also seemingly responsible for protecting Australia as well. Good grief, we are a busy little nation. It's like the Empire never ended.

Your argument is centered around yourself. What makes you so sure of the other soldier's mindsets? You aren't them, are you?

Why should i fight to save another country?
i joined the BRITISH military to protect my OWN country.
not every fething country that has a problem.
Hence the idea of the military, to protect and serve.
im happy to risk my life for england, america and aus, simply because of the loyalty in return and you would all do the same.
to be honest, i would quite happily let you get taken and tourtured, why the feth should i risk my life and others in my unit to save someone who doesent really give a feth?

Yes, i know the risks of the job when i joined, i had no problems with that, i have problems with everyone deciding to get involved in everyone elses problems, causing more and more troops to die for a cause thats not thier own.

and im sure thats easy enough for you to say all that since your sat in a nice comfy chair, no problems atall, maybe you should actually think from the point of view of a soldier stuck out in the gak.


Another problem im starting to have is now usually caused by fat little bastards that seem to think they know how the world works, they seem to think they know everything.
if your so fething sure of your views then try life in the army, see how that changes for you.

after 6 months sat on here about the worsed you have is a few sores on your ass.
after 6 months in iraq you tend to get a good fething grasp on things, and also know what it fething feels like to lose good friends that lost thier lives trying to serve.
now, once you can try to work out how that would feel maybe your somewhat closer to knowing how it works.

and as for pricks that say "your in the army, its your job"
yea, its also my fething life aswell.
how about you learn to respect the people who put thier fething necks on the line to save some ungreatfull little dick like you.

So join the army today and broaden YOUR perspective on life..

I repeat; It's their choice to sign up, and they should understand the risks involved in military service. Including you.

I understand that you might have lost friends and comrades-in-arms in Iraq, but that doesn't mean that the top brass don't know what they're doing. All wars have casualties. Even in decisive victories, there are going to be casualties on your side. You could easily have not signed up and avoided the horrors of war.

Must have been a kick in the balls when you discovered it's not all fun and games over there.

after 6 months in iraq you tend to get a good fething grasp on things,

Clearly.

Still, literature's' loss is the armed forces gain.

So what cheese, i should reduce myself to a pale wreck sat on a computer chair all day pissing everyone off like you do?
i rather do something with my life.
and its people like you that do fething get to me.
you have nothing to do with any of this, your just a child thats hyped up on political ideas and seems to think the world if a perfect place.
if you seem to think that we signed up to die then maybe you dont quite get it atall.
i signed up to actually do something with my life, but now i can see that im actually protecting dickheads like you then that tends to make me think why bother with it.
whats the point in putting my life and others on the line just to be counted as a statistic by people like you?

and to end on a slightly better note, im taking a break from dakka for a while before i get myself banned due to dickheads like you.
i rather go for a few months and cool down than stay here arguing with someone that has no idea whats involved in a war.

Why the feth would i think its all fun and games?
hey, atleast i could get kicked in the balls, from what ive seen that seems to be something your actually missing.
maybe go out once in a while, see the world, do something with your life?


and now im off before i get banned.
i apologise for my language, but fear not, its all been directed at cheese, not anyone else (so yes, it is a personal attack, mods do what you want here)

and see you later (at some point i guess) to the people on dakka who are actually people, rather than a waste of fething good space.

And what gives you the right to insult my personal life when you know nothing whatsoever about it?

I don't think the world is a perfect place. I've read about the horrible wars, I've been to the German concentration camp museums, I know what kind of horrors occur in war. I've seen my own father bleed out and die on the floor, and you think I'm ignorant to what the world is like?

I'm not going to argue with you, because now you're going to rage some more about your twisted perception of the world. You could have avoided all of this, so don't blame me.

Did you know that until I became a Mod, I didn't even know the Off Topic forum existed?

True story!

More on point, PLEASE watch your language AND STOP the personal attacks, OK?

(Politics, religion, RAW, TLOS...)

How could you miss it? It was right there all the time. It's the most active forum on the damn board!

JD21290 wrote:

Your argument is centered around yourself. What makes you so sure of the other soldier's mindsets? You aren't them, are you?

Why should i fight to save another country?
i joined the BRITISH military to protect my OWN country.
not every fething country that has a problem.
Hence the idea of the military, to protect and serve.
im happy to risk my life for england, america and aus, simply because of the loyalty in return and you would all do the same.
to be honest, i would quite happily let you get taken and tourtured, why the feth should i risk my life and others in my unit to save someone who doesent really give a feth?

The reason why the USA and GB have the militaries that they do is so that we provide protection for our allies including South Korea. If an ally nation calls for aid then what the heck kind of an ally would deny it? The British military's allies are far more than just USA and AUS.

In the case of South Korea they routinely have deployed support forces to Iraq and the Republic of Korea Marines are some of the toughest SOB's around especially during Vietnam.

JD21290 wrote:So what, you dont value the lives of our troops? your happy to see them being killed for a fight that isnt ours?
how about you sign up in the army, go out and see what its like for yourself?
why the feth should we lose our own troops to protect a country thats having problems? feth em, its thier problems, not ours.
if people didnt keep getting involved in everything then maybe we could cut back on wars.

This has nothing to do with the quoted section I commented on. There you talked about either occupying a country entirely or letting it be. This flies in the face of basic bodycount maths (occupying foreign territory has gotten a lot more people killed in the last hundred years than peacekeeping has). It flies in the face of understanding the source of the wealth of nations comes from trade, and it is only with that wealth that countries can afford a modern military capable of defending the country.

its ok for you to blurt on about how things should be done, but at the end of the day the closest you have ever come to something like this is pushing a few model over a board, and following game rules.
and im guessing the worsed situation you have ever been in was possibly being bullied, not shot at.

Don't pull that rubbish 'I've served so I get to spout whatever I want and no-one gets to point that it makes no sense. No-one is doubting your courage or work ethic in serving. I'm doubting your understanding of how the world works. And yes, your idea that you either occupy a country or let it do whatever it wants is non-sensical. It fails to understand how interconnected the modern world is. It fails to understand how difficult military occupation is.

this is something that does annoy me, im risking my life for pricks like you who seem to think we are fething disposable, "they done thier job and thought, throw em away now"
that your kind of fething gakky attitude?
if so then how about you feth off to a different country or sign up and see how that goes.
fething prick.

You're not really talking to me anymore, are you? I haven't ever treated a soldier a disposable, and doubt I'll ever be in a position to do so. I've opposed most wars on the very explicit grounds that our soldiers are not disposable.

Meanwhile you've signed up to fight for your country, somehow thinking the only wars you'll fight will be ones to defend your own cities. It's a seriously naive view.

youngblood wrote:Simply put, it's far more complex than simply sticking up for human rights or trying to control oil, international affairs are obscenely complicated. This shouldn't be pinned solely on Mr. Bush, there are other countries in the UN after all. If people would stop looking to America to be the World Police, maybe we would stop acting like it.

But if we stop being world police we wouldn't be able to taser other contries into submission. And where's the fun in that?

Cheese Elemental wrote:Is this when you break out the photoshop retardation?

Damn, and I was sitting here thinking you were reasonable.

Frazzled wrote:

Golden Eyed Scout wrote:

Cheese Elemental wrote:If he really does push his nation into war, he doesn't deserve any mercy, because he's condemning thousands of innocent people without any sensible reason.

I'm not sure of Kim Yong-il's history though. Is he like Robert Mugabe, a hero who became a mad dictator?

Far as I know, Kim Jong hasn't had his military rape, mutilate, and kill innocent women and little girls to ensure his power. He's still fething nuts, and one of his generals is gonna see this and out one between those outrageous sunglasses of his.

Your lack of education is frightening in its depth. North Korea has the world's largest concentration camp. North Korean policy is that your family suffers for THREE generations for any perceived crimes. Thats right grandparents and children in the camps.

Next time before you type something it would be good if you actually did a little research before spewing forth nonsense.
http://indianchristians.in/news/content/view/680/45/

Kim Young-soon said North Korea was "a place that should disappear from the earth". She estimated that six or seven out of every 100 people died in Yodok Political Prison Camp Number 15 in one year. She herself spent eight years at the camp.



Kim Tae-jin suffered various tortures in the same prison, including being beaten with burning wood and being forced to sit on burning quicklime. "I realised pain can be more dreadful than death," he said. Kim said lack of food at the camp was a continual ordeal.



"One meal consists of a handful of corn kernels and they mix it with some edible tree leaves and they add some salt." He said he caught and ate rats, snakes and frogs to supplement his rations.

http://www.newser.com/story/45015/23-years-in-a-north-korean-prison-camp.html

Shin describes the daily horrors of life inside Kim Jong-Il's gulags, from fire torture to mutilation. He committed no crime—he was born in the camp—and is struggling to adjust to life in the South 3 years after his escape.

Guards cut off the tip of Shin's middle finger for accidentally dropping a sewing machine at the factory where he performed slave labor. Later, he was dangled over a fire and pierced with a steel hook to force him to confess to an escape plot he knew nothing of. He spent 7 months in an underground cell, to be released only to watch his mother hanged and brother shot to death

http://www.amnestyusa.org/all-countries/north-korea/page.do?id=1011213

I was refering to Mugabe, who started off cool an stuff, and is now a fething nutty bastard, but Kim Jong was pretty much always crazy. I say we insert a few green berets into NK and just let them wreck utter havoc till Il gets the idea we are serious, at which point we unleash some angry Army Rangers on him, and let the country desolve into anarchy and infighting afterwards. But that's just me.

**Point Taken**

In before lock! (I've started drinking after a six year hiatus that I really can't explain. Something about wasting monies on the little toy soldiers. Bah Humbug!) By the way JD21290, you also knew that merry old England was allied with the big, bad USA, didn't you? We had a squirrelly slow cowboy who was trying to outdo daddy as president, surely trouble was in the air?

@Cheese:

You know, I had something really witty to say to you... then I remembered that you are a 15 year old self admitted lier and decided it wasnt worth my time.

What could I possibly have to lie about on this issue? Come on, out with it.

So you don't think the lives of foreign civilians living in harsh conditions are valuble?
***If they are shooting at our troops or threatening our nation, not at all.

You think countries like NK and China can sort their own problems out?
***Yes indeedy. Its funny how history shows that, before the Great Satan that is the US, the rest of the world managed to sort itself out year after year.

They're been trying for a long time. It hasn't worked, has it? If you joined the military, you are expected to defend the world, not your country, which hasn't had a military attack for a very long time.
***No you sign up to defend your country. Your country, not the rest of the *&(&^ world.

Who's to say the lives of soldiers aren't valuble? It's their choice to sign up, and they should understand the risks involved in military service.
***Is a fireman less valuable because he chooses to go into burning buildings? Is a cop’s less valuable because he chooses to keep order and defend us from the wolves. A soldier does the same. He defends us from the wolves that are other countries.

Golden Eyed Scout wrote:I say we insert a few green berets into NK and just let them wreck utter havoc till Il gets the idea we are serious, at which point we unleash some angry Army Rangers on him, and let the country desolve into anarchy and infighting afterwards. But that's just me.

I like when someone says something like this.
Real World calling Golden! Real World calling Golden! Stop watching Hollywood movies. This kind of open move doesn´t work outside the movies because if you are successful you can bet that Russia and China will take note so next time they do the same they can hit the US with the fact that they were the firsts to drop the ball and if it misses you are in a worse situation because now NK have a bunch of US troops and no matter how many servicemen bills you have or how you want to dress it you are the one that started the war and that is not going to sit well with you allies.

M.

I find the lack of support for soldiers here upsetting. I know that in the US at least the oath you take when you enlist mentions protecting and defending the Constitution and the Country, not the entire world. I'm willing to bet that Great Britain's oath of enlistment, Canada's, and the French Foreign Legions oaths are all somewhat similar in that you take the oath to defend your country and it's territories not the entire world.


At this time I would like to thank JD21290 for his service, despite the fact that he is a Tommy not a Yank, as he has pointed out he has no problem defending Australia, GB or the US due to the loyalties between them. So thank you in a way you are responsible not only for country's security as well as mine. You know what, I'd like to thank all members of dakkadakka who have served in the Military, you keep us(your country's) safe and you shouldn't have to go out and fight in places that it not our business being. It is my hope that the I will be able one day to get back in the military and serve along side you all. Thank you once more.


I'll get off my soap box now.

JD21290 wrote:why the feth should we lose our own troops to protect a country thats having problems? feth em, its thier problems, not ours.

Where were you in 2003? I needed you then.

JD21290 wrote:Why should i fight to save another country?
i joined the BRITISH military to protect my OWN country.

The military exists to defend British interests, not just the rock that sticks up out of the sea above France. You seem to have joined the military for slightly naive reasons; you didn’t join the home guard.

As a public servants we’re happy to take the publics money in exchange for doing as those appointed by the public demand, if you’re unhappy with that I suggest you leave the armed forces.

< Injured US Marine who knows what its like to lose someone in Iraq

BrotherStynier wrote:I find the lack of support for soldiers here upsetting. I know that in the US at least the oath you take when you enlist mentions protecting and defending the Constitution and the Country, not the entire world. I'm willing to bet that Great Britain's oath of enlistment, Canada's, and the French Foreign Legions oaths are all somewhat similar in that you take the oath to defend your country and it's territories not the entire world.


At this time I would like to thank JD21290 for his service, despite the fact that he is a Tommy not a Yank, as he has pointed out he has no problem defending Australia, GB or the US due to the loyalties between them.

Wow, so the thousands of other allied nations that support and served with the USA and GB don't get a mention or aren't worth defending?

I really don't understand where this misconception stems from where the only nations that are worth defending or are loyal to eachother are USA, GB, and AUS (especially the latter) - but it makes more sense when one considers those are the most common flags seen on these boards than say South Korea.

And all those generalize and say things like: "Well country X isn't worth fighting for because their own citizens don't even want us there!" Well, thats a broad generalization and I'd like to know how you think an entire group of people is represented by a vocal minority. Especially since you'll find such vocal minorities in countries like the USA, GB, and AUS who go out of their way to demean and insult service men and women...by the former logic your own country isn't worth defending since a lot of its citizens rather you not exist.

Seriously, with some of the arguments here it'd be justified to let Hitler keep burning Jews and dominate Europe and just let the USA handle Japan especially since we weren't anywhere near as strong of an ally to European countries back then. After all its "their problem". Personally I believe we should spend our resources to help rid of tyrants and genocide like Hitler and say what you will about the Iraq War (however if you basically say Iraq was worthless and the like you're spitting on the sacrifices thousands of military men and women have and will make) it got rid of an oppressive regime which is something to be proud of.

EDIT: As for the JD guy I question if he's even in combat job or if he's even served because the way he talks about the US, GB, and AUS it doesn't seem like he's been exposed to real combat operations (ie Iraq) since there's a lot more countries whose brave men and women are serving alongside them.

Sue me for forgetting to mention Spain, Germany and the others. Not to mention I said thank you to any one. Get off you high horse mister, marine or not you should have known what I was implying.

If I recall correctly we entered the war against Hitler officially after he declared war on us, also the enemy back then posed an actual threat, where as if you are to believe most of what is said about Iraq there was no real threat.

My opinion has changed on whether or not we should bother with defending other countries because of the bad rep we get for it. Oh god the US is doing something in that country bitch bitch bitch bitch bitch.

Or there is its sister the US isn't doing anything about whats going on in that country, and the bitching starts once more.

So to hell with the other countries, the US in particular has things that need to be dealt with before it goes around trying to fix everyone's problems and they are pretty damn schizophrenic about whether they want us to do that anyway.

Most people, Im not saying me, do think the Iraq Conflict is a waste. Sure saving people can be used as an excuse, so can getting Oil, but oh god doing both people don't think thats possible. Iraq is an example of how people will react if we intervene in the Korean War again.

According to what you have been saying about defending everyone, we should already have removed Iran, Syria, N. Korea, Laos, Cambodia and Zimbabwe? I don't see you mentioning anything about riding in and saving them from their situations. Come to think of it, I don't see very many countries quick to jump in and save them. Hmm I wonder why that may be? Because humanity only cares about number one? Because the world doesn't care about much out side their country? Or is it because the politicians would rather get re-elected rather than send their troops to countries most people don't care about or have never herd about to save them from their plights?

Also before you go questioning the service of people you might wanna think the same can be applied to you. Combat job or not Mr. HighandMighty serving is serving, and from what I have herd from my dad and friend both of whom served, though I bet you'll questioning the truth of that, dad in the 3/116 Armored Cav and my friend in the 1st Cav, have seen non-combat jobs go past the wire because the military doesn't care.

Oh the list of Countries serving in Iraq at present are;

US
GB
Aus
Turkey
Iraqi Defense Forces
And of course the Contractors
Romania
Looks like the two of us forgot only a couple countries, not the "Lots more" you would have everyone else believe there are.


@ TheMods, if you don't like what I have to say ban my ass.

reds8n wrote:

At the heart of Icke's theories is the view that the world is ruled by a secret group called the "Global Elite" or "Illuminati," which he has linked to The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, an anti-Semitic hoax.[3][4] In 1999, he published The Biggest Secret, in which he wrote that the Illuminati are a race of reptilian humanoids known as the Babylonian Brotherhood, and that many prominent figures are reptilian, including George W. Bush, Queen Elizabeth II, Kris Kristofferson, and Boxcar Willie.[3][5]

When did Boxcar Willie become 'a prominent figure'? I mean, everyone knows the name, but how many people could pick him out of a lineup?

That's what they want you to think !


...I'd never heard of him until drunkenly stumbling on David Icke's "theories" one night.