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Kill being a figure of speech, as in whats bothering us most, not that its dead. Im still playing aren't I? yup. Tau will be updated by 2013 im sure

Blind wrote:Kill being a figure of speech, as in whats bothering us most, not that its dead. Im still playing aren't I? yup. Tau will be updated by 2013 im sure

Quit being so optimistic and get with reality. 2525, if mankind is still alive.

MY fix for firewarriors?

no, not bs4.

rather, let them get rending (for shooting only) for one shooting phase if you expend 2 markerlights on them, to represent enemy weak points lighting up on their HUDS and being sniped at for massive damage.

oh, and make the carbine assault 2 18'' or something so people actually take it. make it cost a couple points or something to take.

rending? that's kind of overpowered...

and the carbine seems fine to me. It does pin afterall.

Fantastic in cities of death or if you're ultra rushing with tanks.

and the carbine seems fine to me. It does pin afterall.

And what is actually effected by pinning? No one ever takes the carbine for a reason.

Pinning can be effective against low LD armies like orks. Its a good way to slow Nobz down.

Pinning can be effective against low LD armies like orks.

Yes pinning is very effective againt fearless armies like Orks... Sorry what?!?!

Its a good way to slow Nobz down.

In my experience Nobz come in 3 flavours - in a transport in mega-armour (or both) or on a bike none of which are particularly worried about pulse carbines all of which are lead by a Warboos with Ld9.

Pinning is next to useless against Orks. It only really effects other Tau and IG neither of which are that worried about pinning.

Especially since Guard have orders which give you a second chance to Get Back in the Fight! Every now and again you can get Space Marines to take cover....

Every now and again you can get Space Marines to take cover....

Yeah until they choose to fail their break test and then auto-rally... Plus with Ld9 and 3+ save it will not exactly be a regular occurance.

Whilst pinning is not entirely useless it isn't much of an advantage and certainly doesn't make the Carbines even worth considering.

The next Tau codex will be out from one to two years before the 6th edition comes out and invalidates it.

@ Killkrazy,
Too true. It's GW's way of telling us to have more than one army.

pinning is useless as many armies are sm or fearless or have some funky special rule like the guard. The only army pinning is effective against is eldar in my opinion, or sisters of battle.

Well, look, here's my thing. Grots get BS3. GROTS! Do you really think Firewarriors should be equal in skill to GROTS?

That's all from me.

Solorg, BS4

You see, Solorg, you're now going to get a bunch of messages about how poor Tau vision is and how they can't react to movement...blah blah blah.

Solorg wrote:Well, look, here's my thing. Grots get BS3. GROTS! Do you really think Firewarriors should be equal in skill to GROTS?

That's all from me.

Solorg, BS4

Increase them to BS4 and people will be complaining they are as good as SMs.

agnosto wrote:You see, Solorg, you're now going to get a bunch of messages about how poor Tau vision is and how they can't react to movement...blah blah blah.

Or about how Guardsmen are also BS3, and Eldar Guardians (who's technology is superior to the Tau), and Space Marine Scouts, and.... the list goes on. Unfortunately, Grots are more likely the exception than the rule. And what would be the argument against Grots having BS3 when Boyz have BS2? It's more fluffy and fun that Grots are better shots! There was once a bit of fluff about how Grots are actually the superiors to Orks in all ways by physically, and were intended to be the leaders of Orks (and that Thraka actually had a "pet" Grot that he got all his good ideas from), but Orks were like "bah, liddle blabber mowf's dunt no wats gurt for dem. Weez da big 'uns, weez tell 'em wats ta du!"


Automatically Appended Next Post:

FlingitNow wrote:

Every now and again you can get Space Marines to take cover....

Yeah until they choose to fail their break test and then auto-rally... Plus with Ld9 and 3+ save it will not exactly be a regular occurance.
Whilst pinning is not entirely useless it isn't much of an advantage and certainly doesn't make the Carbines even worth considering.

Why such a jumpy negative Nancy, FlingitNow? I say "Every now and again..." I didn't mean, "Space Marines are constantly getting totally pwned by Pinning Checks, Tau are totally fine without anything in their next Codex!" Just dial it back a bit, man.

Solorg wrote:Well, look, here's my thing. Grots get BS3. GROTS! Do you really think Firewarriors should be equal in skill to GROTS?

That's all from me.

Solorg, BS4

I thought you were joking but other people seem to be taking you seriously - were you joking?

Because a grot can fire one round out to 12", a firewarrior can fire twice out to the range. So the firewarrior is twice as skilled, before you account for his ability to fire out to a full 30", 2.5 times as far as a grot.

Why such a jumpy negative Nancy, FlingitNow? I say "Every now and again..." I didn't mean, "Space Marines are constantly getting totally pwned by Pinning Checks, Tau are totally fine without anything in their next Codex!" Just dial it back a bit, man.

Fair enough I'd been responding to someone who thought pinning was good and made Carbines fine and that Tau don't need new stuff in their codex.

Didn't mean to jump down your throught

Kilkrazy wrote:

Solorg wrote:Well, look, here's my thing. Grots get BS3. GROTS! Do you really think Firewarriors should be equal in skill to GROTS?

That's all from me.

Solorg, BS4

Increase them to BS4 and people will be complaining they are as good as SMs.

Sounds to me like they should just make a sort of middle ground. BS3.5 (For eldar guardians, Tau, Baneblades (and other IG tanks that are BS3) scouts etc... this would show that while other things out there with BS 3 are better then Grots (because CLEARLY grots are just like, the worst shots ever) and this could be represented in rules that would say, when firing at Half Range, the squad is BS 4. Any more then half range, bs 3.... this would totally make more sense then dropping grotts to BS2...

Keep them BS3 and improve some other stuff within the existing framework of core rules.

For instance, allow any model with a drone controller to take any type of drone.

Make all drones count as jump infantry jetpack so they get Relentless. That let's any unit move and shoot markerlight drones. (Alternatively, make markerlights Assault.)

Invent a couple of new drones, such as a close defence drone which fires Flechettes and optical grenades at anyone assaulting the owning unit.

That way any Fire Warrior unit has the options to get better at shooting or better at resisting assaults or a bit of both.

unless I'm incredibly misinformed... aren't drones already jetpack and therefore relentless?

Mr 4 Strings wrote:unless I'm incredibly misinformed... aren't drones already jetpack and therefore relentless?

Drone are the same unit type as the unit their attached to (IIRC), so FW squads w/ Marker Drones cannot move and shoot them.

Black Antelope wrote:

Mr 4 Strings wrote:unless I'm incredibly misinformed... aren't drones already jetpack and therefore relentless?

Drone are the same unit type as the unit their attached to (IIRC), so FW squads w/ Marker Drones cannot move and shoot them.

Page 31 of Tau Codex

Drones:

[blah blah blah]

Unit Type:
As Owner

FlingitNow wrote:

Pinning can be effective against low LD armies like orks.

Yes pinning is very effective againt fearless armies like Orks... Sorry what?!?!

Its a good way to slow Nobz down.

In my experience Nobz come in 3 flavours - in a transport in mega-armour (or both) or on a bike none of which are particularly worried about pulse carbines all of which are lead by a Warboos with Ld9.

Pinning is next to useless against Orks. It only really effects other Tau and IG neither of which are that worried about pinning.

Not every ork unit is fearless. Its expensive to make nobz fearless, and a warboss easily can cost you 100pt. And five biker nobz can cost you twice what a squad of fire warriors will. I would argue that it is easier to make 9 nobz fail a LD check then to kill 9 Nobz before they get to you; especially bikers. I'm not saying that it makes fire warriors with carbines good, it makes pinning not useless.

18" is past my comfort zone though, so many units have ridiculous charge and assault options it seems, I just feel the risks out weigh the pros and I dont want to build a carbine armed squad

I would argue that it is easier to make 9 nobz fail a LD check then to kill 9 Nobz before they get to you

True but you get 1 turn of shooting with eth carbines befoer they get to you with the rulse rifle you could get 2-3 and one of those in double tap range mean 4-5 shots compared to 1. So you're morelikely to stop them with 4-5 shots than make them fail an LD test (which will only give you 1 extra shot to stop them so you're still 2-3 shots) with 1 shot...

Not saying pinning is entirely useless just not a huge benefit, Nobz are massive overkill against FWs anyway to be honest the large Boyz mobs that can multi-assault large chunks of my army are a more pressing concern.

I am a Tau player who started under 4th edition RB and it is unfortunate that 5th edtion RB and Codex's are causing difficulty to army lists and somethings are broken.

I believe the BS of 4 for all Tau Race is undoubtedly Over Powered.
I propose the Idea of giving veterns what they earned through Trial by Fire.

EX. If I have firewarriors or pathfinders and upgrade the Unit with a Shas'ui Team Leader I believe as some people have mentioned that he should gain +1 to BS. Gaining a +1 to Attacks does nothing when your already the worst assault unit in the game. Keep the Shas'la firewarriors at 3 BS because they are new recruits and not as seasoned as other warriors.

EX. If I have Battlesuits (XV8, XV88, XV23, XV15)the Shas'ui battlesuit should remain BS 3 because they are new to the path as battlesuit pilots and not as skilled in piloting, however Shas'vre are more veteran suits and should be at BS 4.

That makes the team leaders more accurate and makes markerlights more attractive to Tau players

Seems like to many people want tau to be IG.

But I would like their suits to get BS4 I mean surely a high technology suit can aim a little better with all that equipment then just the normal eye.

Solorg wrote:Well, look, here's my thing. Grots get BS3. GROTS! Do you really think Firewarriors should be equal in skill to GROTS?

That's all from me.

Solorg, BS4

Because Grots actually care to aim. Orks are BS2 because they don't try to aim. Tau are BS2 because they can't aim.

Old thread is old.