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illuknisaa wrote:

DAaddict wrote:Freebooters gun. 20 pt base HTH nob with no HTH weapons then spend 5 to 20 points for a gun that might be amazing except for the fact you have ork BS of 2.

Oooh 10 freebooters pumping out 20 S6 AP d6-1 shots for a mere 400 points!!!

Snazzgun is pretty amazing and when you take small squads they tend to go unnoticed in a objective match and give them a chance kill something.

I too think the snazzgun is actually a pretty good gun. Never take the Blasta upgrade, thats what makes them stupid. Whenever I tested them out in games and took that upgrade, Id kill more gits then enemies. But taking squads of 10 with shootier and more dakka, well that can bring the pain fairly nice. And again, most times people ignore them because of what they are, FlashGits.

STR6 is pretty much 2+ to wound and if you roll a good AP then your just creaming whatever squad your shooting at. I still think they should take away blasta, and make the gitfinder give them BS3 for 5pts each. That and take them out of the heavy section and into the elites. That would make the Flashgits a seriously badass unit.

Augustus wrote:
Those are very hideous as well, but at least they are OPTIONS. Eldar are stuck with their junk, I remember when Shuriken Catapults were BETTER than bolters for AP, way back in the hardback Rogue Trader days they were -2 Armor Save and Bolters I think were -1. I guess they shoot what, Love? now.

Not only that, but in Rogue Trader, a single Shuriken Catapult could wipe out an entire squad (Follow Fire was stupid). In 2nd, it was a Bolter with better range modifiers, more shots, and a better save mod.

How in hell did 3rd edition even happen to the Shuriken Catapult? It's just shameful.

As for the guy who said Shoota. You're just wrong.

DarknessEternal wrote:

Augustus wrote:
Those are very hideous as well, but at least they are OPTIONS. Eldar are stuck with their junk, I remember when Shuriken Catapults were BETTER than bolters for AP, way back in the hardback Rogue Trader days they were -2 Armor Save and Bolters I think were -1. I guess they shoot what, Love? now.

Not only that, but in Rogue Trader, a single Shuriken Catapult could wipe out an entire squad (Follow Fire was stupid). In 2nd, it was a Bolter with better range modifiers, more shots, and a better save mod.

How in hell did 3rd edition even happen to the Shuriken Catapult? It's just shameful.

As for the guy who said Shoota. You're just wrong.

Somethings have got worse ... but thankfully somethings have got better could you imagine these guys in your army?

Tactical dreadnought armour has come along way.

Augustus wrote:
Those are very hideous as well, but at least they are OPTIONS. Eldar are stuck with their junk, I remember when Shuriken Catapults were BETTER than bolters for AP, way back in the hardback Rogue Trader days they were -2 Armor Save and Bolters I think were -1. I guess they shoot what, Love? now.

So true, many things mentioned in this threads are poor weapons, but they are poor in the face of "why the HELL do I want an upgrade that makes my unit worse than it was?"

Guardians suck on a full time basis. The gun is a total mismatch for its user, and that makes it a failure above and beyond the norm... Not to detract from the other shocking guns in 40k, they're horrible too

They are too fragile & shortranged to be a gunline, and they don't have nearly enough punch to be worth carting around in a transport.

Deleted, couldn't find the delete post button.

From personal experience as a Space Marine/Blood Angels player, I have to answer the Lascannon. Sure, with BS4, S9 and AP2 at 48" range, it should be an awesome gun, even with the heavy 1 profile, but it isn't.

You see, while we call it a Lascannon, this is not its True Name. No, the True Name of the Lascannon is The Gun Of Many Ones.

Xeroen wrote:From personal experience as a Space Marine/Blood Angels player, I have to answer the Lascannon. Sure, with BS4, S9 and AP2 at 48" range, it should be an awesome gun, even with the heavy 1 profile, but it isn't.

You see, while we call it a Lascannon, this is not its True Name. No, the True Name of the Lascannon is The Gun Of Many Ones.

Sounds like my SoB melta guns. Even with my list that has more melta and flamers than bolt guns, those meltas roll a bunch of 1s. 1 to hit, or 1 to wound, at least 1 one when trying against vehicles (so I get a glance instead of a pen, or fail altogether) Units that have 2 melta guns means I just miss on one of them, then roll a 1 to wound/pen with the one that hit. Well, that is the reason why I spam them...

You're right. Even the useless deathstrike missile might be better than random guardians on foot with shurikens... 12" range for space-elves that are bad in combat?

8 points for 12" BS3, S3 T3 5+ save.

Even a mediocre termagaunt forms a better gunline. Give them devourers.

18" S4 Assault 3? AND morale check on enemy?

Devourers can actually shoot something with guns while not standing in punch-my-suicidal-elf-face-in range.

Xeroen wrote:From personal experience as a Space Marine/Blood Angels player, I have to answer the Lascannon. Sure, with BS4, S9 and AP2 at 48" range, it should be an awesome gun, even with the heavy 1 profile, but it isn't.

You see, while we call it a Lascannon, this is not its True Name. No, the True Name of the Lascannon is The Gun Of Many Ones.

Yeah, I agree. The sad thing is, there's really nothing you do to make it any better.

Making it more than heavy 1 makes no sense. It's only one shot.

Making it blast makes no sense.

Making it rending is dumb.


It's hopeless,really.

Lascannons don't need changing the slightest. My dice do.

I roll to hit, and usually get a 1. By some fluke I get a 3 or higher and my roll to wound roll will be a 1, or in the case of vehicle penetration, not high enough to even glance, the exception being av 10. In that rare circumstance, the damage result roll will end up Shaken.

Sisters repentia have the worst gun in the game. Their gun is so bad...that it simply doesn't exist.

Imagine:
"The US is driving in with tanks. To compensate, we are sending in our women without armor or guns to stop them."

The result is pretty much reflected in 40k too.

Scrazza wrote:

illuknisaa wrote:Once my termies were shot by about 100+ lasgun shots and only one died. I consider 15 bolters more scary.

that realy depends, I also hit 6 termies with around 100 shots one time. All of them died.

With imperial guard, it doesn't matter what the power or their rifles is. Numbers do mater.

Exactly. This game is about luck. My 3-man devestator got shot at by a Leman Russ Punisher. Nobody died.

Anyway, aren't laspistols even worse then lasguns?

^
they have the same strength and AP, they just have shorter range, like all pistols have.

Tomb Spyder's Particle Projector.

BS 2. Range 12". Reduces CC attacks by 1

Worst gun in practice: Guardian Shuriken Catapult.
Crap range on a model which needs range to survive. I'd take Pulse Rifles or Lasguns any day on my Guardians.

Worst gun option: Strangleweb.
Suffers about the same problems as Guardians. Cost twice as much as their performance merit. It's actual concept and stat line isn't that bad considering the huge number of hits you can get at no BS rolls, but it's as expensive as a melta-weapon.

I have to say it's pretty even with lasgun and shuriken catapult.

I would still say that lasgun is the worst because catapult is str 4 ap 5 assault 2 weapon and if I could I would arm my csm with catapults than with bolters.

Worst gun for space marines I would say is the:

Heavy Bolter.

Not as devastating as an assault cannon. Not as high strength as a plasma gun. Useless against vehicles.
And when you can take a missile launcher for free it's simply defunct.

Only good thing about a heavy bolter is how it looks.

Corennus wrote:Worst gun for space marines I would say is the:

Heavy Bolter.

Not as devastating as an assault cannon. Not as high strength as a plasma gun. Useless against vehicles.
And when you can take a missile launcher for free it's simply defunct.

Only good thing about a heavy bolter is how it looks.

They aren't bad when they are free. Like when they are on land raiders, land speeder typhoons, HB landspeeders (6 shots for 6 points isn't terrible), and bare bones razorbacks.

notabot187 wrote:

Corennus wrote:Worst gun for space marines I would say is the:

Heavy Bolter.

Not as devastating as an assault cannon. Not as high strength as a plasma gun. Useless against vehicles.
And when you can take a missile launcher for free it's simply defunct.

Only good thing about a heavy bolter is how it looks.

They aren't bad when they are free. Like when they are on land raiders, land speeder typhoons, HB landspeeders (6 shots for 6 points isn't terrible), and bare bones razorbacks.

Not to mention it depends on what your playing against. I played my brother once, where he had 4 HB in a heavy support squad, and they just MURDERED my Orks. Seriously that was some serious ouch. But against a MEQ or where the rockets are a free upgrade, yea Id pick the rocket launcher

Worse gun that I've faced or used? Las-pistol. hands down.

It would be more horrible if there weren't so many, and if it costed something!

the kroot gun on the krootox is pretty awful, 48" S7 AP4 - like an autocannon, except that it is rapid fire and is mounted on an assault unit
so either sit in the corner firing one shot a turn and waste the whole reason you took them in the first place
or: charge right up into CC range and fire two shots but waste your assault phase

MinionOfDaCube wrote: the kroot gun on the krootox is pretty awful, 48" S7 AP4 - like an autocannon, except that it is rapid fire and is mounted on an assault unit
so either sit in the corner firing one shot a turn and waste the whole reason you took them in the first place

Kroot are not an assault unit. So that pretty much throws off your whole summation.

Tau don't have cheap, long-ranged, str 7 guns out of the Troops slot otherwise. Those things are pretty vital to any anti-mech strategy.

That they don't fall apart completely when they get assaulted doesn't mean they are an assault unit.

mulkers wrote:Tomb Spyder's Particle Projector.

BS 2. Range 12". Reduces CC attacks by 1

But the PP is a str 5 AP 3 gun, one of very very very few AP 3 guns that aren't ordnance in the entire necron army. Sucks that it's held by a unit with such a horrible BS.

I hafta say that tau pulse carbines aren't really the bestest gun there is either.