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I really don't think a couple of pieces of the board having a few concrete/stone tiles moulded into them is going to give someone a 'pre-measuring advantage'.

Of all the nits to pick, really...

You'd be surprised. The tables I built for my old FLGS, I was able to make reaaaaaaaaaaaaaallly good mortar/Basilisk "guesses"

Kanluwen wrote:You'd be surprised. The tables I built for my old FLGS, I was able to make reaaaaaaaaaaaaaallly good mortar/Basilisk "guesses"

Well duh! You built it

If you had just posted and talked about the Ex Illis board and how nice it was, and the things you could do with it, you would have gotten a nice little discussion going.

By badmouthing the GW board, all you've done is make this thread about whining, and I'm sad to see that even mods are getting in on it.

I tried to get an Ex Illis board when they sent my store a single fig and a pamphlet about the game. I emailed them twice about securing a demo kit, and never got a response. It's a shame their customer service was so poor, it looked (and still looks) like a cool concept.

Is the GW board expensive? Yes. Are most things GW makes expensive? Yes, so it's not a huge jump to pay $300 for a board to play on when 5 tac squads cost you $185.

And to suggest someone spend $200+ on a different board that will use more tiles to make a board that's not even 4' x 6' just seems like hating on GW for the sake of hating on them.

As for having money left over for terrain, I'd say if you only have $300 to spend, you probably shouldn't be wasting it on some plastic ground for toys anyway. Making it yourself is always the option for poor/smart/talented people.

Several years back, GW did a plain, green painted MDF board which was around (if memory serves) 5-6mm. Was alright for a bit, but soon warped out of shape (might have been how my brother stored his though!).

MDF simply isn't as tough as plastic.

If you handle it right, it is!

You probably applied paint only on one side and left the other side uncovered? By its nature MDF warps if it gets wet only on one side, so one should apply paint on both sides.
Second it depends where you store it. Humid places and leaning upright storage are a sure way to warp a board.

H.B.M.C. wrote:I really don't think a couple of pieces of the board having a few concrete/stone tiles moulded into them is going to give someone a 'pre-measuring advantage'.

Of all the nits to pick, really...

kind of like you harping on the skull pit every chance you get over the past few years...

it's a nice board but certainly nothing that makes GW's "eat your heart out" as your subject says. each has its own advantages and disadvantages and are comparable in price when you're comparing the same size (you'd need to buy MORE than two ex illis sets to make a legal 40k table). in the end, it comes down to the preference of the buyer as there isn't a no-brainer choice.

The fact that the sections are small and don't clip together really does kill it for me. If I need to have a 6x4 board to put these pieces on then what's the point?

The Ex Illis board looks good but I have a ROB and I like it. I feel my cash was well spent on it, and I had a lot of fun painting it up and all that stuff. I like that it came with it's own bag to store it in and I can just slide it under the bed when I don't need it. It would have been cheaper to make my own, I could have got 6 2x2 squares of plywood at home depot and painted and flocked that and saved a ton of cash. But, I like the way the ROB looks.

If I ever get any other kind of board, I will probably go with a zuzzy map and paint it in deserty colors.

So, the options for a good gaming board are:

Realm of Battle
Pros: Easy to snap together, good construction, good portability. Cons: Expensive, immovable hills, expensive, skull pits beloved by few.

Zuzzy battlemats
Pros: Good looks, good portability, relative good price. Cons: Slow shipping, they smell bad, possibly will flake if you paint it incorrectly (though not their fault, it still is an issue).

Sabol Mats
Pros: Look good, decent price. Cons: Out of Print, so can be hard to find. Advertising on one side.

Roll Your Own
Pros: good bang for the buck, potentially a fun project, will look exactly as skilled as you can make it. Cons: Will look exactly as skilled as you can make it.

Ex Illis gameboard:
Pros: somewhat less expensive then the RoBB. No molded terrain. Cons: Nonstandard size, many small tiles, a little plain.


In other words, there still is no compelling winner in the gaming board arena, and all of the choices are fairly lackluster.

warboss wrote:kind of like you harping on the skull pit every chance you get over the past few years...

Actually I don't harp on about the skull pit. The skulls are really a non-issue. It's the hills I have a problem with (as I've made abundantly clear in this thread - again, am I talking to myself here? Am I not being clear with my 'Moulded static immovable hills are bad mkay!' rants?). Are you people just seeing Commissar Calgar spinning away to the left there and just assuming you know what my post says? 'Cause that's a bad way to have a discussion people. A really bad way.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ouze wrote:So, the options for a good gaming board are:

...

In other words, there still is no compelling winner in the gaming board arena, and all of the choices are fairly lackluster.

You forgot one. A 6x4 piece of MDF with one of these on it. I've got one of them. Worth every penny.

Mr Mystery wrote:3mm MDF? Strong as a RoBB? I shouldn't think so skip. Seriously wouldn't think so.

I agree with Mr. Mystery -- it's not even close - you can stand on a realm of battle board, whereas I'd be loath to lean on my elbow on 3mm MDF ... that's about 1/8".

I'd keep that size for small buildings or coasters and go with at least 6mm (1/4").

@BloddQuest
Depends on how you construct it. The RoBB is only so strong because of its matrix. The same matrix under a mdf-board and you can go with 3mm without a problem.

And why do you need to stand on your RoB in the first place?

My MDF board is about 3/4ths of an inch thick. It is as strong (and as heavy) as the day I got it and it didn't cost me AUD$400.

Duncan_Idaho wrote: Depends on how you construct it. The RoBB is only so strong because of its matrix. The same matrix under a mdf-board and you can go with 3mm without a problem.

I agree completely, but it doesn't sound like this is the way the other board was made.

H.B.M.C. wrote:And why do you need to stand on your RoB in the first place?

Because I like to cover myself in cardboard box armor festooned with aquillas drawn on in crayons, and roleplay as an imperator titan.

Honestly HBMC, I sometimes wonder if you even are playing the same game as the rest of us.

I think we overlapped with our posts there...

H.B.M.C. wrote:And why do you need to stand on your RoB in the first place?

I wouldn't, my point was that 3mm MDF sounds a little too lightweight.

On the other hand, I have actually thrown my RoB boards in the back seat of my car and taken them in to work to play there after hours. I wouldn't trust 3mm MDF to last too long being transported and yours would be so heavy I wouldn't want to have to carry it.

Of course, there is a happy medium somewhere around the 6mm mark, but I bet it would still weigh a lot more than my RoB board.

In all fairness, I have to say that RoB isn't perfect - mine is definitely NOT 100% true in terms of how flat it lies on the table, but the clips pull it into line.

Why does every single thread announcing a new game board have to descend into a bunch of willy waving over the merits and disadvantages of every single method.

1. We know the ROB board is expensive. It's GW. I don't suppose anyone knowingly buys an ROB thinking they are getting a cheap deal - as with everything GW, you are paying for the convenience and the quality. Can we please accept that for those of us who choose to buy an ROB, we do so for these reasons, not because we are blind GW automata.

2. We know that a cheap board can be built from scratch and will always be the cheapest option. Its not necessarily the best option given the modelling skills of some. Personally speaking, I have had my fill of playing on green painted MDF boards with terrain hacked out of polystyrene and looking like it was crafted by the local special needs community outreach group. Some people who have the skill and the time can create absolute wonders - I would suggest this is the minority however.

3. There are plenty of other alternatives out there - whether it be mats or other pre made boards. They all have advantages and disadvantages. Arguing over which is better than the other is like arguing who has the best car. Most of the time, it boils down to personal preference.

H.B.M.C , your antipathy towards GW is well known and well documented but decrying the ROB board as 'anti-imagination' is a bit strong. We get that you don't like the hills - but some of us do. In fact, I would suggest most of the people who have bought an ROB do.

Can we not just agree to disagree here? Posting alternatives is fine but presenting personal opinion as fact is a bit much.

Ouze wrote:In other words, there still is no compelling winner in the gaming board arena, and all of the choices are fairly lackluster.

You forgot one option, the Hotz felt mats (e.g. Western Town, European Fields and Moonscape with craters): http://www.hotzmats.com/felt_purchase_mat.html , and option I use regularly and am quite happy with.

@ HBMC - Well actually at least 2 people (AlexHolker and Ouze) have stated that they don't like this 'Skull Layer' and many others have too in this and similar threads, so in fact you are wrong when repremanding me for explaining that it isn't in fact a 'skull layer'. Maybe you should follow your own advice and actually read what others have posted before being quick to slam others for their comments.

I was wrong in stating that people had complained that the hills of ROB wouldn't take any scenery, I misread some previous posts and I apologise if I caused you or anyone any undue stress. Will the Dakka community ever forgive me?

I am wondering however if you are a 'spurned' ex-GW employee or something similar. Did a GW employee once accidently spill your drink or steal your girlfriend? Because the way you like to bash GW makes me think you are either on commision from GW's competitors or you once had a very bad experience with a paticulaly tricky Leman Russ.

The Decapitator wrote:I am wondering however if you are a 'spurned' ex-GW employee or something similar. Did a GW employee once accidently spill your drink or steal your girlfriend? Because the way you like to bash GW makes me think you are either on commision from GW's competitors or you once had a very bad experience with a paticulaly tricky Leman Russ.

in his defense, you don't have to be an ex-gw employee to be bitter with the things GW does; the only requirement is that you were/are a customer who even once paid full retail price (or in his case, the even more ridiculous oz pricing scheme).

filbert wrote:Why does every single thread announcing a new game board have to descend into a bunch of willy waving over the merits and disadvantages of every single method.

I don't think that's either unexpected nor unreasonable. When a product comes out I think it's natural to compare it to what's already on the market, and obviously we're going to talk about both the pros and the cons.

filbert wrote:1. We know the ROB board is expensive. It's GW. I don't suppose anyone knowingly buys an ROB thinking they are getting a cheap deal - as with everything GW, you are paying for the convenience and the quality. Can we please accept that for those of us who choose to buy an ROB, we do so for these reasons, not because we are blind GW automata.

I hope I didn't imply that when I mentioned it was very expensive in my comparison post. I was just laying out good and ill. To be honest, I've long since considered getting a RoB board... but I never seem to have enough to afford it. The skull layer is dumb but the construction looks good, I like that it's quick and easy to deploy, and I said it was expensive... not overpriced. It looks like a good piece of kit, and i don't mind the hills.

That being said I feel this is a somewhat underserved niche. I don't think any of these solutions are truly optimal.

Filbert wrote:
Why does every single thread announcing a new game board have to descend into a bunch of willy waving over the merits and disadvantages of every single method.

This is the Internet!. If you're not waving your willy at everything, you're doing it wrong!

Ouze wrote:That being said I feel this is a somewhat underserved niche. I don't think any of these solutions are truly optimal.

But can any solution truly be optimal? I mean, a game board with terrain is kind of a hard thing to make portable.

At least until we start having shrink rays and expandobeams.

Ouze wrote:

filbert wrote:Why does every single thread announcing a new game board have to descend into a bunch of willy waving over the merits and disadvantages of every single method.

I don't think that's either unexpected nor unreasonable. When a product comes out I think it's natural to compare it to what's already on the market, and obviously we're going to talk about both the pros and the cons.

filbert wrote:1. We know the ROB board is expensive. It's GW. I don't suppose anyone knowingly buys an ROB thinking they are getting a cheap deal - as with everything GW, you are paying for the convenience and the quality. Can we please accept that for those of us who choose to buy an ROB, we do so for these reasons, not because we are blind GW automata.

I hope I didn't imply that when I mentioned it was very expensive in my comparison post. I was just laying out good and ill. To be honest, I've long since considered getting a RoB board... but I never seem to have enough to afford it. The skull layer is dumb but the construction looks good, I like that it's quick and easy to deploy, and I said it was expensive... not overpriced. It looks like a good piece of kit, and i don't mind the hills.

That being said I feel this is a somewhat underserved niche. I don't think any of these solutions are truly optimal.

Discussion is fine and I am certainly not decrying that, nor am I decrying anyone's right to debate the various pros and cons of different solutions. What I am annoyed about is how every new thread about a new board or whatever immediately descends into a slanging match. The anti-GW camp attack people for buying a ROB board, the people who bought an ROB board then feel compelled to justify their purchase, then someone else jumps in to denigrate people for not making their own board etc, etc, ad infinitum.

I totally agree; there is no one universal, one size fits all solution, which is why these threads are useful and which is why it is all the more annoying that they have to be derailed by pointless arguments. I am suggesting we ought to have a truce and agree that whatever we have chosen for a game board, that our own choice remains exactly that; personal and based on personal merit and opinion. Arguing over personal choice and opinion is a fairly fruitless exercise.

The skull pits on the ROB really don't bother me at all. In fact the only thing that bothered me about them was that I had to go in and paint each skull. I eventually gave up and drybrushed them all white real quick. If it bothers you that much, spend an extra $5 and go to home depot. Buy a cheapy little tub of spackle and a cheapy plastic spackle knife. Fill in the skull pits, then just paint and flock your board the same. Problem solved

warboss wrote:

The Decapitator wrote:I am wondering however if you are a 'spurned' ex-GW employee or something similar. Did a GW employee once accidently spill your drink or steal your girlfriend? Because the way you like to bash GW makes me think you are either on commision from GW's competitors or you once had a very bad experience with a paticulaly tricky Leman Russ.

in his defense, you don't have to be an ex-gw employee to be bitter with the things GW does; the only requirement is that you were/are a customer who even once paid full retail price (or in his case, the even more ridiculous oz pricing scheme).

Didnt you know that you cant be critical about anything GW makes without having a obscure agenda? Even more... if you dont like the skull layer "your in the wrong Hobby".
Man sometimes you guys exagerate to really ridiculous levels!

For me the perfect solution is a smelless Zuzzy or a clean & cheap RoB... so I will buy nothing.

@ Painting the Zuzzy =
I got the Zuzzy battlemat - me and my friend painted it on a single night. used spray paint and house brushes. Then finished off the fine details with regular brushes. after a spray sealant, its still the best thing i have ever added to my table.

and believe me, have a table that is textured that you can roll away and super easy transport and that looks great and rolls well, is tre sweet!

H.B.M.C. wrote:And why do you need to stand on your RoB in the first place?

My MDF board is about 3/4ths of an inch thick. It is as strong (and as heavy) as the day I got it and it didn't cost me AUD$400.

Sometimes it's nice to know your product is overly resilient. Plus who knows what the next knobjockey is going to drop on your table, and from what height.

you know ROBB has lines too, you know if we're arguing the pre measuring angle.

Also Skulls suck so add me to the list.

________________________________________

There is no Layer of skulls in the creation of a planet.
1. Fire4effekt

warboss wrote:

The Decapitator wrote:I am wondering however if you are a 'spurned' ex-GW employee or something similar. Did a GW employee once accidently spill your drink or steal your girlfriend? Because the way you like to bash GW makes me think you are either on commision from GW's competitors or you once had a very bad experience with a paticulaly tricky Leman Russ.

in his defense, you don't have to be an ex-gw employee to be bitter with the things GW does; the only requirement is that you were/are a customer who even once paid full retail price (or in his case, the even more ridiculous oz pricing scheme).

But that's what I find amazing about the whole 'whining about anything GW does thing' because ultimately it's your choice. Nobody is forcing you to pay for something which you feel is overpriced! If people have such issues with GW then why do they continue to buy from them? I have been paying full retail price for years and quite frankly I don't have a problem with it as I understand that if I wish to be able to take part in a hobby which is massivly supported by fantastic models and stories, the ability to find a local store near enough wherever I am and to be able to utilise all that is and has been part of the Warhammer Universes etc, then I am not going to get it for free!

If I am unhappy with a product because of the price etc, then I will try and find a substitute at a more reasonable cost or I will just stop using it altogether. I wouldn't continue to use said product and constantly moan about it being overpriced. As the old saying goes, nothing in life is free, so if some people believe they can do a better job cheaper then GW then go for it! Then you can become one of the 'other options' which people can turn to and then GW might address the situation of they did begin to lose customers. However if you are not going to do anything about it, and wish to continue spending money on this hobby, then stop moaning about all things GW because what you are actually asking for is all the stuff GW offers for as llittle as possible. Which is just stupid as if GW didn't charge the money they do then the hobby wouldn't be as appealing as it is.

I suppose to sum it up I would say this, I would REALLY like to go on 5 or 6 holidays a year, for a few weeks at a time and not worry about what I spend when I''m there. I can't afford to do that, so I don't. What I do not do is go on said holidays and do all those things, and then moan about the cost of flights and hotels and food etc on forums and make out that I am hard done by because I want to do all those things but don't want to spend the money doing it.

Sorry for the rant but I'm getting fed up with reading about peoples attitude to GW and it's prices etc. Nobody is forcing you to participate, we are all aware that it isn't a cheap hobby either, unfortunately life is life and we don't get everything we want. GW is a buisness (which provides more it's customers than most I have to add) and not a charity.

Decapitator wins the thread.

I, personally, would rather pay 25-30% more for a ROBB that has 6 tiles than 25-30% less for a board with 40 tiles that I need to set ON TOP of a board and it's not even the right size even after buying 2 of them. ROBB I can set up on saw legs or a smaller than 6x4 table without too much worry (although balancing it on a 1x1 is obviously out of the question) wheres I need to build or have a table big enough lay the EX-Illis boards on and if I'm going to build a table to lay a table on it I might as well just flock the first table, add hills and not even buy the Ex-illis board at all.