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d-usa wrote:Even if I would think that doubling the police is a valid option, if the public in the US were given the choice to either:

A) Pay more taxes to pay for a doubling of the police.

or

B) Let us shoot the bad guys ourselves.

I think I know what the answer would be

Will people please note the wink?

And I was thinking people use all the money they would have used on guns and ammo to pay for more police (but I know Americans don't seem to like paying tax for anything that might benefit someone who is not themselves )

Knifes can be thrown.

thenoobbomb wrote:Actually, guns do create moar violence.
You may not believe it, but its true.
Im not against guns for sport, but guns in houses, no. Big, big no. Maybe its the culture. Most Americans seem to think that guns are the only thing to protect themselves. If you are scared, do the same as a female person of my family...
... just put a knife under your bed. *chop*

That must be why the UK is the most violent country in Europe and not Finland or Switzerland.

thenoobbomb wrote:Knifes can be thrown.

The ignorance of knife physics and effectiveness of throwing knives in this statement is baffling.

Someone has to train all their lives to be able to effectively and regularly kill a person with a throwing knife. Someone can pick up a gun and do the same thing except easier and deadlier and more frequently (once you throw the knife it's gone; shoot one bullet and you usually have at least five more).

thenoobbomb wrote:Actually, guns do create moar violence.
You may not believe it, but its true.
Im not against guns for sport, but guns in houses, no. Big, big no. Maybe its the culture. Most Americans seem to think that guns are the only thing to protect themselves. If you are scared, do the same as a female person of my family...
... just put a knife under your bed. *chop*

A knife would be a good option if not for the probability of:

1) The person breaking into your house could be armed. And I'm not all about bringing a knife to a gun fight.
2) You are counting on only one person breaking into your house, good luck trying to stab multiple intruders.
3) A stab with a knife is not going to neutralize the intruder.
4) You can shoot a guy from far away, meaning it is a smaller risk that the bad guy is going to disarm you and take your weapon and use it against yourself. You have to get pretty close to use a knife.
5) You need a lot more training taking down an intruder in hand-to-hand than shooting them from 5 feet away.

Of course, nothing we can say will change the mind of the "guns are evil" crowd, and nothing you guys say will make a difference to "guns are not evil" crowd.

Criminals in the USA must be heavily armed....
In the Netherlands our Dutch criminals that do break ins arent armed. Maximum some tools or... a knife!
And our East-European criminals are... well. Not armed.

thenoobbomb wrote:Criminals in the USA must be heavily armed....
In the Netherlands our Dutch criminals that do break ins arent armed. Maximum some tools or... a knife!

Gun > knife, therefor if they have a knife and I have a gun, I have the advantage. I have no reason to give that up in al life or death situation.

The biggest reason so many criminals over there have so many guns because they are allowed too.
If your not feeling safe, get better locks on your door and window.

If you take away everyone's guns then people simply start carrying knives, people will always find clever ways to kill eachother.

thenoobbomb wrote:The biggest reason so many criminals over there have so many guns because they are allowed too.
If your not feeling safe, get better locks on your door and window.

Why would not being allowed to have guns stop a criminal from obtaining guns?

THEY'RE CRIMINALS.

And by the way, I already proved that greater gun control doesn't strongly correlate with a safer nation, showing that of the top ten nations when ranked in deaths by guns per capita, the overwhelming majority of them had heavier gun regulation than the US (and some even heavier than the UK)..

thenoobbomb wrote:The biggest reason so many criminals over there have so many guns because they are allowed too.
If your not feeling safe, get better locks on your door and window.

This statement right there proves that you have no real knowledge of gun law in the US. Without a basic knowledge of gun laws in the US, and then the individual states and cities, you cannot make any informed statements.

AustonT wrote:That must be why the UK is the most violent country in Europe and not Finland or Switzerland.

There is a lot more to it than that. The UK is one of the most highly populated countries in the world (53rd apparently) - the mostly densely populated country in Europe by quite some way (Italy being the next most densely populated at 62nd). The Swiss are at 68th, Finland at 203rd. Our large concentration of urban populations leads to a relatively high crime rate, for example...

Often overused statement that is still true:

If you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns...

That's why the murder rate in the UK is over three times that of the USA.

Kilkrazy wrote:That's why the murder rate in the UK is over three times that of the USA.

But they are murdering each other like civilized people, without guns, so it's okay

thenoobbomb wrote:The biggest reason so many criminals over there have so many guns because they are allowed too.
If your not feeling safe, get better locks on your door and window.

/discard reason
/emphasize idealogical point.

Kilkrazy wrote:That's why the murder rate in the UK is over three times that of the USA.

Couldn't find a source for that, but I DO know that the average homocide rate per capita in north america is about 15% less than the average homocide rate in Europe given 2010 statistics from unodc.org.

Amusingly enough, the place in the US where we have the highest homocide rate (and death by guns rate) is Washington DC, which also has (at the time the statistics were gathered) some of the strictest gun control laws, having just shy of five times the rate of Texas.

There needs to be way way way more stricter gun laws. Out were I live the damn locals at like the Orks, they just go out into the woods with some cases of beer and shoot rifles because,

"FOR DA DAKKA!".

I hate going out to put the chickens in at night and it sounding like I got teleported to Armageddon.

While I can totally understand the situation of Mellissa (Women defence /Equalizing).

In fact it works the other way round. Its not the women who buy the weapons, but the men.

The problem is thats not only you, that has a weapon but anybody, because we are democratic. And face it, there are some mad and many stupid people out there.

Everybody. Everybody can loose its temper. When you family is hurt or destroyed, people cant handle this. People should not have weapon around when this happens.

You might say USA has the same death by guns ratio than Argentina, but dont forget that USA has a simliar society than the UK not Argentia considering crime rates.

So the situation in Switzerland. Every male has a assualt rifle there. Death by gun ratio is much higher than in other european nations (Swiss 6.4, Germany 1.4), espaccally if you consider the very low crimerate in Switzerland.
In Switzerland the problem is often, that the weapon is used to threaten the wife, even if only by its presence.

Short answer cos i on my phone.

I like guns, guns are cool, shooting is fun, and if i live over here ill buy a couple.

But Britain is a nicer place to live and i feel safer when im there simply due to the fact every tom dick and harry aren't packing, having guns everywhere is stupid and only escalates the crime problem.

The only other argument, the Americans that say "it's so we can fight the government!" is laughably ridiculous.

mattyrm wrote: But Britain is a nicer place to live and i feel safer when im there simply due to the fact every tom dick and harry aren't packing, having guns everywhere is stupid and only escalates the crime problem.

I repeat myself:

Melissia wrote:[...] the place in the US where we have the highest homocide rate (and death by guns rate) is Washington DC, which also has (at the time the statistics were gathered*) some of the strictest gun control laws, having just shy of five times the rate of Texas.

DC, despite having some of the strictest if not THE strictest laws in the country regarding gun control, became known as the murder capital of the US.


*I believe the laws were struck down as unconstitutional in the last few years

Melissia wrote:

mattyrm wrote: But Britain is a nicer place to live and i feel safer when im there simply due to the fact every tom dick and harry aren't packing, having guns everywhere is stupid and only escalates the crime problem.

I repeat myself:

Melissia wrote:[...] the place in the US where we have the highest homocide rate (and death by guns rate) is Washington DC, which also has (at the time the statistics were gathered*) some of the strictest gun control laws, having just shy of five times the rate of Texas.

DC, despite having some of the strictest if not THE strictest laws in the country regarding gun control, became known as the murder capital of the US.


*I believe the laws were struck down as unconstitutional in the last few years

Matty may have a point, just not one you agree with. He says he FEELS safer, that doesn't mean he is. For Matty too the possibility of fighting another person in melded is right up his alley, he has the advantage.

Also in support of that position, I take a lot of classes taught by ex patriate Israelis. The mothers have all told me they felt safer about thier children in Israel, during the violent periods than on American streets, perception affects a great deal.

Melissia wrote:Also, "wombs being penetrated"? Methinks someone needs to take sex ed classes...

Sigh.
Again applying biological thinking to Fruedian analysis.
The womb is a protective, smothering environment. It's why people like to kill themselves in small enclosed places (lol hitler).
It's why people enjoy being in bed, it's why we enjoy warm baths. People enjoy being regressed to the catatonic womb state.

Melded = melee. Iphone hates me.

Joey wrote:Again applying biological thinking to Fruedian analysis.

You're might be doing Fruedian analysis, but you're certainly not doing Freudian analysis.

Melissia wrote:DC, despite having some of the strictest if not THE strictest laws in the country regarding gun control, became known as the murder capital of the US.

Probably because there are more people you would want to shoot there

Melissia wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:That's why the murder rate in the UK is over three times that of the USA.

Couldn't find a source for that, but I DO know that the average homocide rate per capita in north america is about 15% less than the average homocide rate in Europe given 2010 statistics from unodc.org.

Amusingly enough, the place in the US where we have the highest homocide rate (and death by guns rate) is Washington DC, which also has (at the time the statistics were gathered) some of the strictest gun control laws, having just shy of five times the rate of Texas.

When I read the Data. The US has a incredible higher homicid rate than any european country:

USA 7.07
Nother Ireland (higest) 5.24
Italy 1.66
Denmark 0.23
Germany 0.22
England 0.07

Interesting:

While in the USA only 50% of all homicides are due to guns, in the Top3 Death Nations (South Africa, Columbia, Guatemala) ALL homicides are by guns.

SilverMK2 wrote:

Melissia wrote:DC, despite having some of the strictest if not THE strictest laws in the country regarding gun control, became known as the murder capital of the US.

Probably because there are more people you would want to shoot there

Or the USA has piss-poor law enforcement. Introduce and enforce a manditory minimum sentance for gun use and you'll see gun crime plumet a few years after.
But that would be expensive so, yeah.

Melissia wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:That's why the murder rate in the UK is over three times that of the USA.

Couldn't find a source for that, ...

I lied about that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States#Homicide

Yeah AT gets it. It's easy to point and shoot is all I mean. I've never seen a civvie with a gun in the UK, I've seen several here.

Even the bums here worry me because im far too proud to give my stuff up to a mugger, I know that's childish but hey ho. If a British mugger asks for my wallet and pulls a bat out Id stick the loaf on him. If he pulled a knife id point over his shoulder and say "Is he with you?" and then be off on my toes the second his gaze shifts.

Im confident and im fit so i feel safe.

If a bum tried to mug me here I wouldnt even feel safe fleeing, because being fit enough to run a mile in 6 minutes counts for gak if you get 6 rounds in the back as soon as you turn around!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And having a gun in my pocket doesn't help, because the guy who pulls on you first has a huge advantage, and also your way more likely to die win or lose.

In a nutshell, taking care of yourself and being fit and strong counts for more when people don't have guns. Guns even the odds for the fatter slower guys.. so i prefer nobody having one!