Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Try being in a fight and keep track at stuff. Thats really hard. Adrenaline pumping and everything.

Not being able to keep track of is not appearing to teleport. Regular humans can easily be lost track of. And it will probably be easier to keep track of a marine, considering their size.

Faster than regular humans, I'm sure. A top running speed of 45m/h would a very impressive feat (the fastest human was only 28 m/h, and that's a 100ft sprinter).
Now close combat is a different matter entirely. I took aikido for a while (the only reason I stopped is that I'm in college), and I can go from in front of someone to behind them in a second, maybe less. But much of that speed has to do with moving correctly, not how fast they can move.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Can you track Talos Valcoran running at 180 times the speed of sound?

You mean 222,480 km/h? Not even space marines could track that. The only possible way is if it were a vehicle of some sort a distance away.

And I think that can be put in the ridiculous pile. He'd probably burn up.

According to the Rogue Trader RPG a Space Marine could reach over 200 kmph in a sprint so think more Hayabusa and less human athlete.

If you start to use description by an author of Black Library, no matter how good they are, to calculate the speed of a dashing Space Marine with precision, you are clearly mistaken. With that kind of logic, you might as well become a Young Earth Creationist and calculate the speed of the Flood water ejection out of the ground, the raw strength of Samson or how much poo Noah had to shovle up the only window of the Ark per day. Black Library, unlike those of the Bible, are using literary language to make their stuff more engaging and spectacular.

If you want to take something more «reliable» yet not too reliable you can use the game mechanic of FF games or even 40K rules. Both tell the same story. Space Marine are fast, but not inhumanly fast. The fastest, quickest and sharpest human can be just has fast if not more than an average Space Marine, but the heroic Space Marine will always have a little edge on them yet they are all slow compared to eldars.

Game mechanics are far more fallible than fluff, because game mechanics are designed to be played as a game.

epronovost wrote:
@wyzilla

The number of stories describing ork nobz and warbosses smashing Space Marines asside like puppets even in their full gear seems to demonstrate that they don't need numbers to kill you. Shure they will use it, but it's not always necessary. Ghazkull was much slower than Belial, but it's Belial and it's entire command squad who got smashed asside like toys by the Warboss and they had terminator plates which are far better than ork mega-armor. This seems to demonstrate that the Space Marine superiority is paper thin when it comes to combat and can be explain by their tactical acumen and superior tech.

In fairness, the reason Ghazghkull can do that might be less to do with orks being the physical equivalent of SM (though, in the case of the larger ones, there's a debate to be had here) than with the fact that he's as big as a bloody building and even Belial can't reasonably expect to be able to stop all that mass charging at him.

Anything that has space marines running over 50 m/h, goes in my ludicrous pile. Even 50 is pushing it. 30 is about right, it's freakishly fast for a bi-ped. Especially since eldar are supposed to be even faster.


Oh, and the fastest airplane only goes to aprox. mach 20 (13,201 k/h).

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Anything that has space marines running over 50 m/h, goes in my ludicrous pile. Even 50 is pushing it. 30 is about right, it's freakishly fast for a bi-ped. Especially since eldar are supposed to be even faster.

Huehuehue

There's also the time that people dodge lasers....

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Anything that has space marines running over 50 m/h, goes in my ludicrous pile. Even 50 is pushing it. 30 is about right, it's freakishly fast for a bi-ped. Especially since eldar are supposed to be even faster.

Huehuehue

There's also the time that people dodge lasers....

Try dodging a bullet.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Anything that has space marines running over 50 m/h, goes in my ludicrous pile. Even 50 is pushing it. 30 is about right, it's freakishly fast for a bi-ped. Especially since eldar are supposed to be even faster.

Huehuehue

There's also the time that people dodge lasers....

Try dodging a bullet.

Well if they can most faster then light, bullets are easy.

The doging laser thing (IMO) is more reasonable. Keep moving so when they fire, you aren't there, same with bullets. A 5.56×45mm NATO round has a speed of upwards of 900m/s. You can't dodge that like you can dodge an arrow or a spear.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
The doging laser thing (IMO) is more reasonable. Keep moving so when they fire, you aren't there, same with bullets. A 5.56×45mm NATO round has a speed of upwards of 900m/s. You can't dodge that like you can dodge an arrow or a spear.

No. I mean that they moved after the laser was fired or deflected it.

Hence the joke of "FTL marines". I wonder how much heat would be generated from moving in the air that fast.

In terms of actual stats:
Able to keep up a running speed of 30mph. 40mph in short bursts.
According to Deathwatch a deadlift of 2500lbs without armor. So a bench of anywhere between 1500 and 1800.
Able to mulch people with punches. I don't know about turning them into mist. More like "Your torso is know in 3 pieces from one punch to the ribs.
Basically an Ork Nob that's way better with weapons, faster, and possibly even harder to injure.

Reminds me they did a test at Mythbursters with the Ring of the Phantom. Punching so hard you left a mark required the Strength of Space Marines and you would have another problem with just jaw being broken.

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
The doging laser thing (IMO) is more reasonable. Keep moving so when they fire, you aren't there, same with bullets. A 5.56×45mm NATO round has a speed of upwards of 900m/s. You can't dodge that like you can dodge an arrow or a spear.

No. I mean that they moved after the laser was fired or deflected it.

Hence the joke of "FTL marines". I wonder how much heat would be generated from moving in the air that fast.

https://what-if.xkcd.com/1/

It would be much like what happens to the poor baseball(and everyone nearby) in the above situation.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
The doging laser thing (IMO) is more reasonable. Keep moving so when they fire, you aren't there, same with bullets. A 5.56×45mm NATO round has a speed of upwards of 900m/s. You can't dodge that like you can dodge an arrow or a spear.

No. I mean that they moved after the laser was fired or deflected it.

Hence the joke of "FTL marines". I wonder how much heat would be generated from moving in the air that fast.

https://what-if.xkcd.com/1/

It would be much like what happens to the poor baseball(and everyone nearby) in the above situation.

Yeah, I was kinda expecting a nuclear fusion explosion.

And today we learned not to travel at or near the speed of light through any sort of matter.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
The doging laser thing (IMO) is more reasonable. Keep moving so when they fire, you aren't there, same with bullets. A 5.56×45mm NATO round has a speed of upwards of 900m/s. You can't dodge that like you can dodge an arrow or a spear.

No. I mean that they moved after the laser was fired or deflected it.

Hence the joke of "FTL marines". I wonder how much heat would be generated from moving in the air that fast.

https://what-if.xkcd.com/1/

It would be much like what happens to the poor baseball(and everyone nearby) in the above situation.

Holy gak, that's fething cool.

Custodes are one-man WMDs.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

epronovost wrote:
@Wyzilla


And then Warbosses get their heads lobbed off and taken as trophies by Comissars.

I know some Space Marine who also end up dead against the same comissars. Even great ones in armor and full gear.


Blinking is a reflex action. We are talking about the same thing. They can hit up to three times faster than your brain can prossess information. I have added some details in that post you might want to read it again for more information.

Yes. That's punching. I'm talking about moving over ten feet in around fifteen milliseconds so to the observer it looks like the dude is teleporting.

That's 45m/h. I can track a bike moving at 60, so I'm pretty sure I can see a giant man moving at 45.

Do you have any idea how fast that is? For an human being to move at forty miles an hour for ten feet, he would be almost teleporting. You can track a bike moving sixty, aye, but that's because you have the hundreds of meters to watch it go, not ten feet, aka 3.3 meters

 Wyzilla wrote:


No. I mean that they moved after the laser was fired or deflected it.

Hence the joke of "FTL marines". I wonder how much heat would be generated from moving in the air that fast.

Wha? How? How do you see a laser-beam coming? It's a frikkin' lightbeam, it moves at the speed of light. If you see it, it's already hit you, even if your nervous system processes information instantaneously.

 dusara217 wrote:

 Co'tor Shas wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

epronovost wrote:
@Wyzilla


And then Warbosses get their heads lobbed off and taken as trophies by Comissars.

I know some Space Marine who also end up dead against the same comissars. Even great ones in armor and full gear.


Blinking is a reflex action. We are talking about the same thing. They can hit up to three times faster than your brain can prossess information. I have added some details in that post you might want to read it again for more information.

Yes. That's punching. I'm talking about moving over ten feet in around fifteen milliseconds so to the observer it looks like the dude is teleporting.

That's 45m/h. I can track a bike moving at 60, so I'm pretty sure I can see a giant man moving at 45.

Do you have any idea how fast that is? For an human being to move at forty miles an hour for ten feet, he would be almost teleporting. You can track a bike moving sixty, aye, but that's because you have the hundreds of meters to watch it go, not ten feet, aka 3.3 meters

Yes, as a matter a fact I do. 45 is fast, but not so fast that it is impossible to track. React to, probably not. It would seem really fast, but it certainly wouldn't seem like teleportation.

Bran Dawri wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:


No. I mean that they moved after the laser was fired or deflected it.

Hence the joke of "FTL marines". I wonder how much heat would be generated from moving in the air that fast.

Wha? How? How do you see a laser-beam coming? It's a frikkin' lightbeam, it moves at the speed of light. If you see it, it's already hit you, even if your nervous system processes information instantaneously.

Easy. You can see where the guy is aiming the laser, and either move out of his aim or move your Power Sword in front of where the shot will hit before the shot is fired. Being Marines, they can move faster than humans, Orks, Necrons or Tau can react, so by the time the shooter realises the Astartes has moved, they are already pressing the trigger.

The difference to 45 or 450 is irrelevant in practice as you're not going to parry that blow either way.

 Ashiraya wrote:
The difference to 45 or 450 is irrelevant in practice as you're not going to parry that blow either way.

Yeah, unless you are an eldar, which are supposed to be even faster. You can see why I think them being that fast is iffy.

 Wyzilla wrote:


Considering their extremely potent stomach acids and saliva, I doubt they actually do so at all. I wouldn't be surprised if an Astartes GI tract resembled something more like a chemical fire where virtually everything is processed.

Also, we in the modern day have figured out how to safely extract and make water from dung, or food.

Extracting energy from tough, fibrous sources like grass and wood isn't about the potency of the acid but the cooking time, as it were. That's why herbivores often have multiple stomachs (such as cows) or partially digest it then eat it again once it has already passed through to get the remaining nutrients out (such as Rabbits), not to mention massive intestines. This all makes digestion a long time. It's like making a stew, you keep it simmering for a long time so it's all nice and tender.

Pure carnivores, on the other hand, typically have very strong stomach acid and a faster digestive system. To carry on the cooking analogy it's like frying a steak. Meat is much easier to break down than vegetation.

Omnivores like humans have stomach acids with strengths in between carnivores and herbivores and stomach/intestines smaller than a pure herbivore but larger than a pure carnivore.

 Ashiraya wrote:
The difference to 45 or 450 is irrelevant in practice as you're not going to parry that blow either way.

Are you responding to me?

Didn't Lysander punch his way out of the Iron Warrior's planet of Malodrax? He was naked and punched his way through a legion of Iron Warriors to get a shuttle and escape.

Wow, that means marine armour must be really weak!

Nah, mate, Lysander was just hitting the gym REALLY HARD while captured.
You should see his prison tattoos.

On Fenris, the wolf priest would go down into the villages to recruit. I don't think it says it explicitly, but it definitely gave the impression that they did so without their power armor (the fluff is presented from the perspective of the Fenrisian villagers, and they are described as huge warriors with no references to their technology).

Of course, they then out wrestle and out drink the villages strongest warriors, who they then recruit to become space wolves.

 odinsgrandson wrote:
On Fenris, the wolf priest would go down into the villages to recruit. I don't think it says it explicitly, but it definitely gave the impression that they did so without their power armor (the fluff is presented from the perspective of the Fenrisian villagers, and they are described as huge warriors with no references to their technology).

Of course, they then out wrestle and out drink the villages strongest warriors, who they then recruit to become space wolves.

Yes, but you'll notice they only ever pick adolescents, who have become adults by Fenrisian standards, but are probably only like twelve standard years old.