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Ghazzy has to make and accept challenges but at least he'll keep his 2++ save. To be honest I was going to be happy if he got back his 2 turn Waaaaagh so having it permanent from turn one gets me giddy. The tax for this is pretty heavy unless it's a big game but in a way it fits Ghazzy's fluff if he is on the field. Anything preventing him from switching out of a challenge on the second turn if facing an opponent too powerful?

 ProwlerPC wrote:
Ghazzy has to make and accept challenges but at least he'll keep his 2++ save. To be honest I was going to be happy if he got back his 2 turn Waaaaagh so having it permanent from turn one gets me giddy. The tax for this is pretty heavy unless it's a big game but in a way it fits Ghazzy's fluff if he is on the field. Anything preventing him from switching out of a challenge on the second turn if facing an opponent too powerful?

To be honest the challenge requirement for Ghazzy doesn't seem that bad. If he kills someone (which he likely will) he gets to re-roll to wound for the rest of the game and I can't think of too many character's that can stand against a WS8 (because of the Council of WAAAGH! weapon skill bonuses), 2+ invuln. 5+ FNP, Eternal Warrior protected HQ with 6 S10 AP2 attacks on the charge. He boost up to the upper tier levels so only guys like sanctuary'd Draigo, Abbadon, Smashfether and maybe the Swarmlord has a good chance against him. Everyone else will get promptly squished. Don't forget he gets to roll another 2 times on the Waaagh! Ghazghkull warlord table as part of the council so he could get master-crafted on his power-klaw and rage.

Also, it seems like the restriction only applies to the warlord having to issue and accept a challenge, nothing about preventing heroic interventions so its very possible to swap him out for one of the other warbosses in the unit. (With I4 we have a decent chance of getting in as well)

Are there any bonuses or restrictions on the Goff Killmob? Does the unit of Killakanz need 3?

Too bad they don't let you swap out a Morkanaut. If they go just go ahead and make it a Super Heavy Assault Transport, that would be great.

 oldzoggy wrote:

 TedNugent wrote:

XC18 wrote:

Spoiler:

You could use this formation with the standard Ork codex and the far superior vanilla codex warlord traits. Since there is a reroll, that even technically gives you about ~30% chance to get Prophet of the Waaagh with your vanilla warboss.

So the waaagh formation does noting at all if you include it in the Crapcurion :\

You can waaaagh 1 turn with orcurion.

Jup but the other way around. What is the bonus of that formation in the big picture. As in the Eldar core gives them nice bonusses what odes ours give :\

Blub wrote:
What I still don't really understand is the dread mob. Also in the old W!G it only stated "Ere we go" and described the special rule (which is a universal special rules for Orks). It doesn't say that the walkers have it.

For example Blitz Brigade just write "scout" , it doesn't add more details, and if you look in the BRB the definition is "model with scout blablabla", it doesn't say the BWagon have Scout but everybody understand it.

It is the same for dreadmob. They listed the Ere we go in the special rules, meaning that all the models of the formation have it.
The only difference is that they write down the definition of Ere we go. But as far as i am concerned, that's because it is not a BRB rule and it's from another book (the codex), so they need to write down the definition there.

Dreadmob does get 'ere we go, which is why the formation actually is pretty decent believe it or not. Armor saturation is always a strat and when you can already squeeze in a 4++ MFF without needing a CAD you can get some good coverage for most of them, while a Morkanaut covers the others.

Problem is its a list all in its own. Its something like 1400pts if you include a bike + MFF on the big mek. Thats one hell of a tax to get a rule they should have anyway.
I would love to run heavy deffdredd/kan lists, but i cant get 'ere we go so they can actually get combat without paying the 3man kan squadx3 and 2x naut tax, which makes it my only tactic (and i prefer multi-prong strats...pick your poison buddy you cant stop everything so what do you not want hitting you the most?)

A couple of things:
1, I'm excited for this
2, I'm glad that I didn't manage to get the old W!G book
3, I'm happy that I won't have to carry my Red Waaaagh!!! book anymore... that has been confirmed, right?

It seems that the Ork decurion will be more designed for horde style armies. I'd be more curious to see the rules for all the little formations and if they have been changed. Also, Totally possible to play double stompa! I've already e-mail FW about if the IA:8 characters can be used in exchange for the slots that say warboss, big mek, pain boy, etc. I think the air armoda is the only thing that is worth taking so far. the ability to reload one use missiles and bombs and restore the planes to full hull points is pretty awesome!

Yes. The Ghazkcurion doesn't fix anything for the orks, but it brings new toys we can try to play with, that's how I see it. (otherwise I'd be depressed)

In addition to the waaagh band + dread mob, I will probably try to play with the KillMob. Killmob seems to be less susceptible to moral issue ( min 20-boys mobs, walkers...), and when possible I will add stuff that don't mind moral ( Da Big boss pole, lone koptas, MSU tankbustas...)


Hey now I can give Da Fixa uppers to the Dread Mob's Big Mek (at least I can give him that when the Mega FF is too costly), yeah...

Actually you can give him both if you got the points now.

Gifts of Gork and Mork has the only one per model restriction, the Orkimedez stuff does not say that anywhere. The sheer cost of them makes you not want multiple items though lol

Also they never corrected the error in Da Council of Waagh formation.

The Waagh banner rule in that formation states that as long as the bearer is alive the entire unit is fearless BUT Grotsnik is already a part of that unit. They were fearless for this reason anyway.

This error was stupid to begin with but they didn't even take the time to correct this or add in anything different to make up for it.

I don't think the banner giving fearless is a mispringt. I think its just for if mad dok gets killed. I'm ok with redundancy in the unit myself. Plus the bigger benefit is the +1 WS it adds. The fearless is just potential gravy.

Ha i never even thought of that, theres 2 sources of fearless in that unit. Well that means its harder to remove it.

Bigger rule flop is the way they mentioned the WS bonus. RAW, the WAAGH! Banner in that formation gives you +2WS not +1 because it is literally the ONLY time GW has ever written a rule within a rule. Every time something confers other rules, it says it counts as or says doesnt stack with (ala lucky stikk). This formation's waagh banner doesnt say either.

Not that it matters though since beyond WS6 is pointless, and only the Nobz/Meks arent WS6 with the banner alone. Still Grotsnik, Ghaz, and 2 Warbosses sporting WS7+ PKs, which is more than enough to rip things apart.

Ya the WS 7 lets ghazzy hit on threes in most combats.

This IS just a redo of a supplement. If when the new CODEX comes out and some key units get updated or changed (like the gork or mork-anaut becoming superheavies, for example), or if the army gets some overall rule changes, this will all look different.

The thing that annoys me the most is the 6 Units of boyz requirements. Why exactly 6 units?! I could see doing between 3-9 units, because obviously its making you want to do more ork boyz than other armies troops. so at least 3. But then if you wanted to do more than 6 and really go horde, or trukk rush with lots of trukk boyz, it limits you.

Other than that im excited for WAAAGH every turn, even on turn 1.

 Voidwraith wrote:
This IS just a redo of a supplement. If when the new CODEX comes out and some key units get updated or changed (like the gork or mork-anaut becoming superheavies, for example), or if the army gets some overall rule changes, this will all look different.

LOL, the next change will likely be a nerf, and it won't keep up with the TAU upgrades when riptides become superheavies and TA’UNAR becomes a new class: "Ultraheavy."

Time will tell.

Removal of the Green Tide Formation was a harsh and unnecessary change I feel :(

 grendel083 wrote:
Removal of the Green Tide Formation was a harsh and unnecessary change I feel :(

It still exists however, you just have to use the one from the old book.

And if I'm not wrong, you can choose to use any of the formations in the Orkurion as seperate formations instead of using them in that detatchment, right? If so, you could just spam MSU Tankbustas in trukks (they probably didn't get much out of the normal Mob Rule anyway), slap a few oddboyz into the Green Tide, and there you go!

 big mek crazygit wrote:

 grendel083 wrote:
Removal of the Green Tide Formation was a harsh and unnecessary change I feel :(

It still exists however, you just have to use the one from the old book.

Since my "Old Book" just automatically updated itself into a "New Book" that's not really an option.
It's a bit like trying to use something out of a previous edition of a codex. Not many opponents or events allow that..

Can you not use the Apoc version in your meta, or get your usual opponents to allow you to use it?

Regardless, taking away one of the good formations and shoe horning people into 3 or 6 units of Boyz is pretty poor.

 Frozocrone wrote:
Can you not use the Apoc version in your meta, or get your usual opponents to allow you to use it?

Regardless, taking away one of the good formations and shoe horning people into 3 or 6 units of Boyz is pretty poor.

It does make me wonder though if the Green Tide formation will be re-released in a new Ork codex at some point, though even in this case I'd be pretty miffed since it'd be easier to just keep it in the Ghazghkull supplement.

I read somewhere on here that a GW employee stated that green tide was still a legal formation despite not being the updated book. I cant remember where I read it and it had no backing other than a guy saying thats what another guy said so make of it what you will.

Well, there aren't anything saying otherwise, except your opponent. But I'm pretty sure most will be alright with the formation, unless they hate waiting for 100+ models to be moved.

 big mek crazygit wrote:
Well, there aren't anything saying otherwise, except your opponent. But I'm pretty sure most will be alright with the formation, unless they hate waiting for 100+ models to be moved.

Its not that bad if you just move guys from the back to the front while not touching the characters during this process.

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
I read somewhere on here that a GW employee stated that green tide was still a legal formation despite not being the updated book. I cant remember where I read it and it had no backing other than a guy saying thats what another guy said so make of it what you will.

Well, Old zogwort was a HQ choice in the 4th ed ork codex. The 7th ed ork codex, which replaced the 4th ed one, did not have zogwort as a HQ choice. Can you still take Old zogwort with the 4th ed rules and points price in games today?

Because, the new W!G replaces the old W!G, just like the 7th ed ork codex replaced the 4th ed one. And similarly, if the green tide's not in here, I don't think it's allowable to take it.

And honestly...........though it was decent, the green tide was kind of a pain to use, and really abused some unit-buffing mechanics (FNP/DLS), in addition to things like having 5 out of 200 boyz in combat, all were locked and can't be shot at and only pile in 3". I mean, you could have boyz spread out for like 3 feet but all still in combat.

Part of me wants to believe that they axed the green tide because it kind of breaks some of their game mechanics when you're dealing with 100+ models in a unit, but it's more likely it was just an oversight.

Old Zoggy went away because imperials were crying their chaptermasters kept getting squigg'd. Even though thats basically all he could do since his melee power was pointless with low rate of attacks and no defenses.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Old Zoggy went away because imperials were crying their chaptermasters kept getting squigg'd. Even though thats basically all he could do since his melee power was pointless with low rate of attacks and no defenses.

Actually, IIRC, he got D6 extra attacks that wounded on a 2+, and if you combined that with whatever power that made him AP3, he could do some serious damage (if you got lucky).

But my point is that if codexes get direct replacements without previously listed units or datasheets, I think they're no longer legal - they're just gone :(

(I once squigg'd draigo in an apoc game - was pretty funny.)