Black Library News & Rumours Thread II, aka Rise of the Bibliophile

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**Grarg**

No, i think those are Gorefiend and Gorechild.

One of them is currently wielded by Kharn

**BrookM**

Begel Dverl wrote:
BrookM wrote:
Begel Dverl wrote:
Alpharius wrote:I suppose Butcher's Nails will do that...
No, silly, that is about Angron and his angriness!
The Butcher's Nails are the implants every World Eater receives.
I thought that the Butcher's Nails were the twin axes that Angron wielded as a gladiator.

Nope, thems the implants they all get driven into their brains.

**KamikazeCanuck**

I thought only Angron got them. Did he make them mandatory or something?

**BrookM**

While the Emperor opposed it, yes, they were mandatory.

**Theophony**

Just left the store with my copy of deliverence lost, have a couple of days of vacation left, hope to get some reading and painting done.

Hoping to see some world eater love, although iron warriors need some love too.

**nels1031**

Finished Legion of the Damned today...

I liked it, although the title characters make their appearance(somewhat) throughout the novel, its not until the closing chapter that the ghostly marines start to kick ass and take names. Other than that its a pretty straight forward Space Marine Battles novel, with some decent action and a somewhat unique threat. It did pretty much confirm who the Legion is or were, but it did little to explain how/why they got to what they are now, which was my primary drive to get this book. Sadly like the Lost Legions, we'll probably never know.

Also introduced something like a Rogal Dorn version of Sanguinius's genetic curse that afflicts this particular Chapter, which I thought was pretty neat and is central to the main characters predicament.

With that said, the Space Marine Battles format is getting tired. Its time to add some Chaos to the Space Marine Battles series. Or an actual battle where the Marines (gasp!) lose.

**Flachzange**

NELS1031 wrote:
With that said, the Space Marine Battles format is getting tired. Its time to add some Chaos to the Space Marine Battles series. Or an actual battle where the Marines (gasp!) lose.

While I sort of agree, the Fall of Damnos wasnt really what I would call a Space Marine victory. Grumpy smurf got kicked in the 'nads pretty well there!
Just now started reading the Gildar Rift...

**Hulksmash**

Just finished Deliverance Lost. I enjoyed it. Not as good as the original 3 or First Heretic but enjoyable. Especially like the look at Alpha Legion and Corax who is now one of my favorite Primarchs.

**Alpharius**

Agreed!

It was certainly... OK!

I'll be interested to see where they take Corax and the RG from here.

And this was certainly a 'game changer' in terms of Raven Guard background as the old Index Astartes article no longer seems to apply.

And as we know, neither does the one for the Alpha Legion.

**1hadhq**

Alpharius wrote:Agreed!

It was certainly... OK!

I'll be interested to see where they take Corax and the RG from here.

And this was certainly a 'game changer' in terms of Raven Guard background as the old Index Astartes article no longer seems to apply.

And as we know, neither does the one for the Alpha Legion.

This 'change' is an improvement or just different?
Thumbs up or down?

( Still waiting for DL )

**reds8n**

Friday, 18;00 GMT...

Happy New Year!

And what a 2012 we have planned for you lovely folks…

• over 30 new novels
• Six new titles in the Horus Heresy series (including novels from the founding authors of the series: Dan Abnett, James Swallow and Graham McNeill)
• More audio dramas than ever before (including Space Marine action from the Raven Guard, Ultramarines and Dark Angels)
• Black Library Live! 2012
• Seven Games Days across three continents
• The biggest Black Library event ever this November

And that’s only the tip of the iceberg. 2012 promises to be awesome and you needn’t wait long: the first big release of the year is only three days away.

**Alpharius**

1hadhq wrote:
Alpharius wrote:Agreed!

It was certainly... OK!

I'll be interested to see where they take Corax and the RG from here.

And this was certainly a 'game changer' in terms of Raven Guard background as the old Index Astartes article no longer seems to apply.

And as we know, neither does the one for the Alpha Legion.

This 'change' is an improvement or just different?
Thumbs up or down?

( Still waiting for DL )

For me, all the changes have been an improvement - for both the Raven Guard AND the Alpha Legion!

**Theophony**

I finished deliverence lost yesterday as well. I really enjoyed it, I was never a big fan of the rg, but I was really feeling what they went through and liked the back story. I know some people did not like it, I was just glad that it was more my style.

The alpha legion stuff was well played as well.

**Hulksmash**

@Alpharius

I'll agree that the Alpha Legion fluff was significantly diverged from the IA article but I wouldn't say the Raven Guards did much. It really just seemed to expand on it. I'm pretty sure that the lock them up and execute them thing happened post heresy so the whole article could really still apply.

**Alpharius**

Not really though - as there wasn't really any of that tone and/or foreshadowing - certainly not enough to drive Corax to madness and off on his solo looney odyssey into the Eye....

**sonofruss**

Lol Russ went too maybe they hooked up on the rim and dove in together and are kicking butt there still.

**d-usa**

Just a little over halfway through "Delivernace Lost", but I think it might be one of my favorite HH books so far, although I probably only read about half of them.

Comparing to the past books I have read, this one seems to have more actual conversations with the Emperor than I am used to seeing, so that was neat. And even though so far it doesn't actually answer any of the "what happened?" questions, it also seems to have some interesting focus on the lost legions. I wonder if there will be any explanation by the time the series is done.

It also seems that compared to the books I have read in the past, Corax seems to be the most humanized of the Primarchs so far. It seems to have less of the "people are in awe, can't look at him, trembling in his presence" type of language and seems more at ease when it comes to interacting with his legion. And the Space Marines seem comfortable interacting with him.

**Temujin**

That's because earlier books went out of their way to set up the astartes, and the primarchs in particular, as awe-inspiring beings removed from humanity, with gravitas suitable to the events being covered. Deliverance Lost has marines and primarchs alike chatting like Joe the imperial guardsman, clumsily undoing the careful work of the more skilled authors in the series. Previous glimpses of the primarchs and the Emperor have been few and far between for good reason. The dialogue with the Emperor incautiously splurged out in this book was cringe worthy, and the generic and wholly unnecessary dungeon quest it set up was goofy in the extreme. I can do without reading interventions by the Emperor that have all the gravitas of a senior employee meeting with his line manager.

I don't want every book to be written from the perspective of a human onlooker, but if that technique is not to be used then there still has to be some attempt to properly portray the distance between the astartes and humanity, and the majesty of the primarchs. If authors incapable of doing this must be allowed to contribute to the series then they should at least be given limits on their access to the primarchs, and nobody outside the core authors should be allowed anywhere near the Emperor.

To me, ADB has set the bar for handling dialogue with the primarchs. His marines feel beyond humanity, and his primarchs feel like the legends that they deserve to be. He also manages this without restricting their participation, as has (wisely) been the default in other books. Dan Abnett and Graham McNeill have also handled their primarchs very well.

**Hulksmash**

@Temujin

To be fair the only "Humans" who really interacted with the Primarchs in the story were suitably in awe/uncomfortable-ish in their pressence. The only human who wasn't completely in awe was one that literally grew up (albiet slower) with Corax. From the marine perspective I feel he did an even better job since I personally despise the whole marines go weak in the knees around their bosses thing.

I felt the meeting with the Emperor was fine. How do you expect the lord of mankind to speak with his sons in a private meeting?

On a side note regard ADB while I loved First Heretic Lorgar is my least favorite primarch in how he was written followed closely by Fulgrim. Lorgar didn't come off as a legendary figure in ADB's book. He came off as a petulant child. Granted the book was well written and I totally dug the actual main character but Lorgar definitely wasn't majestic.

**Grarg**

I've always thought that Lorgar was a petulant child who after being slapped by dad, had a hissy fit.

I really need to finish Path of the Seer so i can start on DL, but it's so dry....

**Kanluwen**

I LIKED the fact that Lorgar came off as a petulant child. That's kind of always been the whole thing with the Primarchs: they're not all majestic, legendary figures. They're still (somewhat) human.

Nothing says a Primarch can't be a jerk.

**Hulksmash**

I loved the book overall. First time I held out to the end that the main character would pull back from the dark and that's one of the only books written like a true novel instead of trashy sci-fi.

I just didn't care for Lorgar. It had nothing to do with ADB's writing. It just had to do with the character himself. Only Fulgrim and Ferrus Manus are even close to as bad. I'm actually not looking forward to any Iron Hands novel that might include Ferrus simply because he has to be the most boring Primarch ever!

**azrel9**

SPOILER ALERT!

**warboss**

azrel9 wrote:SPOILER ALERT!

Lol, your post (all two words of it) is decidely spoiler free!

**Alpharius**

I think he was commenting on the 'spoiler' that Ferrus is the most boring Primarch ever.

As always, it will depend upon who writes his story!

**automatonsleuth**

I haven't chipped in for a wee while, I was planning to finish Deliverance Lost before I said anything about it, but....

Have to say, very disappointed so far. I got my copy the day after it was released in my local GW (which was what, two, three weeks ago?). I am only on page 204. This does not happen for me. When I pick up a book, I read it. I read it to death. I read it, SO HARD, it can't sit back on the shelf for a week. I read the five books of A Song of Ice and Fire in 6 weeks. I read the Ravenor Trilogy over a single weekend. I even managed Battle For The Abyss in a single sitting ( verylong train journey) despite having other books with me I could have read.

I'm not saying Deliverence Lost is a bad book. I consider the plot interesting, it deals with characters and situations I want to know about, the characterisation and dialogue are, in my opinion, reasonable. My problem is that I can put the book down. I can go away, and just leave it for three days before coming back to read a chapter, then abandon it again. I'm not counting down the minutes before I can go back to it, I'm not relishing bus journeys as an excuse to read it to pass the journey. I just can't bring myself to care. I don't know what it is, but it's not gripping me, and it's unique among my last five years' reading material in this fact.

So, I'm afraid I shall be joining those in the "Please Gav, don't touch the Heresy again" camp. I don't trust him not to do whatever he'sdone to another novel I ought to care about and enjoy.

**jah-joshua**

well, Gav is killing me right now with Path of the Seer...
it is very dry indeed...

he better make up for it in the next book...
i do love me some Raven Guard...

cheers
jah

**reds8n**

We'll give this thread a few more pages before we lock it and start a new one.

First up, from Thursday BL blog...

The dark eldar are a vicious lot. When they’re not conducting brutal raids on Imperial worlds, killing and maiming innocents, they’re taking part in horrible bloodsports in Commorragh. Even their sporting events are deadly, as this extract from the soon-to-be-released Path of the Renegade shows.

The race was entering its final stages. The contra-rotating packs of Reavers had thinned to include only the luckiest and most skilful riders. The gleaming strip of the raceway began to ripple and twist to test their nerve and coordination even more, sending the speeding jetbikes even closer to the cliff-like walls. One Reaver was struck by splinter fire from behind and careened straight into the crowd, plung¬ing into the screaming mass like a fiery comet before exploding in a shower of white-hot fragments.

The vicious g-forces exerted by the twisting track were now flinging out both packs of riders so far that they passed through each other before plunging on their separate courses. Explosions of blood and vis-cera marked each pass. Some machines plunged straight into each other and fell locked together as a single flaming mass of tangled wreckage.

Soon only two Reavers were left, a jade-green cara¬paced jetbike with a bare-headed rider that threw itself against a glittering black one in a rolling dive. Bladevanes flashed as the two came together head-on, the jade-green vehicle jinking at the last second to sweep a sharpened wing above the other’s curv¬ing prow. The black-clad Reaver had anticipated the move and jerked below the onrushing jetbike, laying open the guts of his enemy with an upthrust dorsal blade. The jade-green cycle spiralled away spitting smoke and flames, disappearing out of sight. The vic¬tor roared around the track in triumph accepting the acclaim of the bloodthirsty crowd.

Now, wouldn’t Formula One be a lot more interesting with splinter rifles...? Path of the Renegade, the first volume in Andy Chambers’s dark eldar trilogy, will be released in March, and if you're keen to read the first Dark Eldar novel, set a reminder now and you’ll be the first to find out when it goes on sale. If you can’t wait for dark eldar action, you can buy the eBook of a short story by Andy, Midnight on the Street of Knives, that forms a prequel to the series.

and in Salamander related news..

Going back to the Sallies, I mentioned that the Tome of Fire trilogy wasn’t completely done with. That’s because there’s going to be a fourth volume that will come out between Nocturne and the next book in the new trilogy (tentatively titled Rebirth at the moment, which may change if the sales and marketing daemons don’t like it…). It’s actually going to be a collection of all the short stories (including the audio) that tie-in to the series and include some of the main characters (oh, The Burning will be in there too – I know a few people have contacted me on FB about how to get hold of that one).

Contents (but not running order) looks something like this, I believe:

Vulkan’s Shield
Hell Night
Fires of War
Fireborn
Prometheus Requiem
The Burning

I’ll also be writing an exclusive novella for the book. Hopefully, this will come as welcome news to fans of the series who want a complete collection for their bookshelves. It’ll have the same artwork style as previous volumes and fit in nicely with the three main books of the series.

from http://www.nickkyme.com/?p=1629

In other BL news Mr. William King has been nominated for David Gemmell award for his ( very good) Teclis/Tyrion novel, see if he can " pull a McNeill" and win one. Both the cover srtist for that book and ( my favourite of all the BL cover artists) Jon Sullivan have been nominated for the Ravenheart award for best cover.

... I guess -- confirmed by a quick glance at the GW financial figures -- this caps off a good year for BL.

**d-usa**

Hulksmash wrote:@Alpharius

I'll agree that the Alpha Legion fluff was significantly diverged from the IA article but I wouldn't say the Raven Guards did much. It really just seemed to expand on it. I'm pretty sure that the lock them up and execute them thing happened post heresy so the whole article could really still apply.

Alpharius wrote:Not really though - as there wasn't really any of that tone and/or foreshadowing - certainly not enough to drive Corax to madness and off on his solo looney odyssey into the Eye....

I have to agree with Alpharius here. The old fluff was very much "Crap, I created monsters, I'll just kill them. But instead of killing them I will just turn them towards the nearest enemy so they can slaughter and get killed at the same time".

The new fluff seems very much "We will not execute them, above all they are still Raven Guard" in tone, and it seems like the focus is on finding a cure.

**Kanluwen**

That seems more like the old fluff too.

Pragmatism only goes so far, I can't see the Raven Guard keeping bloodthirsty monsters(regardless of whether or not they were Raven Guard at one point) around if they didn't think they could cure them.