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 Shandara wrote:
One of my opponents is cursed that way, rolling a 1 for his first shadowfield save a few times now.

Although I don't think that is a strategy for defeating them, I do think it is bad to have a list that relies on a single deathstar or unit because if it fails you are SOL.

 Shandara wrote:
Use something that ignores cover and is barrage, i.e. snipe from behind Vect.

Ergo my exhortation to use the colossus. Or Dark Reapers with the Tempest + Crack shot abilitry. That can work too.

Flamers dont allow cover saves...bwa hahahahahahahahahha

Umm. But we're in an SOB thread, so using SOB units would be the primary focus.

Also, Tempest and Crack Shot may ignore cover, but doesn't ignore closest model first since it is a blast and not guess/barrage, right?

wrong, its barrage

Hmm, good to know. Still not terribly useful from a SoB tactica standpoint (or even from a Eldar one, imo, since Dark Reapers are so bad).

Dark Reapers are great, except for the point where they cost 37 points each.

 Shandara wrote:
Dark Reapers are great, except for the point where they cost 37 points each.

Exactly! That and their competition with cheaper and better units.

Well you can all have an opinion on them. I for one don't share it. I use two units of them. They kill more than their fair share.

Sisters of Battle should rightly fear Dark Reapers.

Others should fear Quad TL Flamers from Sisters of Battle. Again: bwahahaahahahaha

I don't think I disagree that Dark Reapers kill stuff, just that they are horribly expensive points-wise.

I use a unit of them, sometimes 2, with my Eldar quite often too. Usually in a Bastion.

Yeah, there's a difference between good, great and way too expensive but good. Reapers are way too expensive and arguably good at a role.

I'm okay with people thinking that way, so long as they pick up their models when it's time, preferably by the handful 3 times a game. That's all I ask for.

I look at my own Sisters of Battle list and think: would this list which has done nothing BUT win like to see THAT across the table? If the answer is no, it's probably worth looking into and respecting deeply.

From the Sisters side of the table, Outflanking makes a lot of sense against a force that uses Dark Reapers. For that to work well, the enemy would have to have them on the flanks. If they aren't on the flanks, it leaves those valuable units awfully exposed to anti-Rhino fire and if the Rhino can't hold up... ouch. that barrage from Two Dark Reaper units and/or my D-Cannnons (if it became necessary) will ruin their whole day. So in the grand scheme, well deployed Dark Reapers are always going to top my list for some of the bnetter units in the game. I certainly do not want to get hit with it.

I'm planning a sisters army, and I'm very excited. The way I see it though, I really should get some allies. Looking at what's missing in my sisters, I feel like they would benefit most from a) more long range shooting or b) some rock hard infantry that can take objectives. Any suggestions? I've never taken allies, and the only other army I have is chaos. I hate buying lots of guys, so I'd hope to get this right (nearly) the first time. I'm all ears.

For the record my sisters will include

Celestine
7x Repentia
2x Battle Sisters squads
7x Seraphim
2x Exorcists
3x Penitent Engines

And why the heck are IG the only battle brothers!?

Any of the marine chapters can do very well if you are looking for objective takers and long range. Space Wolves do particularly well in this regard.

Something like:
- Rune Priest and/or Wolf Priest
- 1-2 Grey Hunter Squads in Vehicles (optional with Wolf Priest)
- 1 Long Fang Squad
- Something choppy if you have the points (Lone Wolf, TWC, Wolf Guard, etc)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Speaking of Guard and Sisters, I am going to defend my title at the Guardian Cup next month. Looking for a good army to bring. One of my top choices right now is Sisters and Guard.

1750 -
Saint Celestine
Uriah Jacobus
Battle Sister Squad (10) w/ Meltagun, Multimelta, Bolt Pistol / Chainsword - Rhino
Battle Sister Squad (10) w/ Meltagun, Multimelta, Bolt Pistol / Chainsword
Seraphim (5) w/ 2x Hand Flamer, Meltabombs
Exorcist
Exorcist
Retributors x 5, 4 HB
Bastion with Icarus
Primaris Psyker
PCS with 3 Flamers
3 x Infantry with Power Axe, Flamer, Autocannon
Vendetta
Manticore

Tournament has all set objective missions (4 rounds). Kind of up in the air whether to trade the three IS autocannons for 2 Seraphim, but other than that it is pretty solid.

If you don't plan on using the seraphim as a DSing unit I would highly recommend getting them as many ablative wounds as you can (from my experiences at least).

Celestine up front can soak a lot, but 6th has been around for a while now and people have gotten much better with managing their firing lanes to reduce the impact of differing armor saves. I tried to run a 5 girl squad and the unit just gets reduced to ineffectiveness too easily.

You're paying too much for hand flamers to just let the unit end up as Celestine and 1 flamer girl by the time it makes it across the table.

Very true. Is the two extra seraphim worth 3 autocannons though? I guess I could drop the 3 flamers on the IS for 1 girl.

Yeah, I think I would drop the flamers long before the ACs. The magic number for me has been 7 Seraphim.

I would almost drop the flamers and 1 axe for the 2 girls. Jacobus essentially gets you a "free" axe from the other 2 sarges, so you may not even really notice. Or, you could drop the meltagun from the foot sisters and the meltabombs from the seraphim to get the second gal.

Question: Why the primaris over a CCS? Who do you plan on sitting up top and firing the icarus gun?

Sisters on top, rets inside.

Primaris gives the blob a bit of psychic protection and some casting ability.

If I went with a CCS, I'd need to find something to do with the other Sister squad since they don't have a ride.

Mostly it is just balancing points at this low points level.

I can dig the flamers, drop those and get 1 seraphim. Now at 6.

Yeah, if you are planning on sitting the ladies on top of the Bastion, I would drop their meltagun for sure -- 12" from the top of the bastion does not go very far. Can use the points to slap a combi-weapon on the mobile squad, or a 4th flamer in the PCS and a dozer blade for the rhino... or a slew of other things -- but if all they will do is sit up top then try to objective grab later on, I think the melta-gun won't see much (if any) use.

True, true.


Automatically Appended Next Post:


Okay, just double checked models.

So other than simple repairs (Bastion took a hit from a stack of boxes and a couple simple weapon reglues)... I need to touch-up the 'PCS' to have the same squad markings and swap their weapons for flamers. Base one squad of Reds for Infantry Squad 1 and the 'power axe' guy (Using Zealots with Eviscerators for Sgts with Power Axes) for IS3. Paint the Manticore entirely. Finish touch ups and basing on the Ordo Hereticus Inquisitor (Primaris Counts As).

If I get fancy, I may swap/drop the bastion squad's melta for the 10 points on something else but I'm feeling much better now that I've seen it on a table.

Yeah, it is really solid and I can't wait to hear how things go.

For the Primaris, do you plan on swapping for any particular set of powers, or keeping the defaults. I am really starting to latch on to sticking a Primaris with a unit of foot-sisters (either on the ground or on top of a bastion) to provide Nightshroud.

Nightshroud is really unimpressive though. Unless you're playing against something with really low natural leadership and vehicles get an auto 10.

I'm thinking Bio or Telepathy. I need to check through again and see how they go.

I was debating taking a Primaris Psyker my self.

But the CCS Lascannon + Orders are 2 awesome for me to give up.

Vs anything relaying on a cover save "Fire On My Target!" is awesome. Its awesome vs Skimmers, Tanks in cover or Flyers. Finally get that hit? This will make sure it sticks.

Twin Link Weapons is awesome ...

Anything with that can cause an Auto rally can save your arse.

 pretre wrote:
Sisters are pretty good, but not a great starting army. This is due to both price and learning curve. That being said, the standouts or base list (similar to above) is generally:

Celestine
Jacobus with Conclave in Rhino
2-4 Sisters Squads in Rhinos
3 Dominions
2-3 Exorcists
0-1 Retributors

So far, this type of army has been found pretty effective up to about 2000 points. I haven't seen any play above 2k, but we are theorizing that Celestine would need to be swapped for a second conclave and Kyrinov.

There's not a lot of variety in tested builds yet and we really need a lot more data. The problem is the small play base that currently uses them doesn't give us a lot of data.

Or the ones who play a different build get told to shut it, in not so many words.

I played successfuly with one of everything in the codex. Twas quite fun. Didn't lose much except right at the beginning when I first tried it. But I'm no quitter. Got my 20 game in with it.

Anyone tried that? REMARKABLY flexible threat profile. Only two troops in the list is where it was weaker. But when I did lose, it wasn't really because of the lack of troops. I will say it got way too close for comfort in those games and I think three Sisters units is really the least I would advise unless you're just messing around like I was. Still.... Did pretty good...

If your doing a pure sisters army the price isnt 2 bad if you buy it 2nd hand.

I got a whole army for just around $500.

Back in 5ed It was more then enough for me and my friend to split for 2 whole armies with left overs. Something like 5 Immolators, 3 Exorcists, St. Celestine, at least 4~5 squads with special weapons, and a Celestine squad + Canoness.

We also had some Inquisitors and Assassins but that got taken out from under us .... :: boo ::

I got a deal on Ebay one time: over $1000 worth of Sisters stuff for $200. No joke. I have so much excess sisters stuff its not funny. Good times. Sometimes Ebay is just your friend in a big way

Jancoran, did you just reply to something I wrote more than a year ago?

Not consciously. But then...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Humblesteve wrote:
I'm planning a sisters army, and I'm very excited. The way I see it though, I really should get some allies. Looking at what's missing in my sisters, I feel like they would benefit most from a) more long range shooting or b) some rock hard infantry that can take objectives. Any suggestions? I've never taken allies, and the only other army I have is chaos. I hate buying lots of guys, so I'd hope to get this right (nearly) the first time. I'm all ears.

For the record my sisters will include

Celestine
7x Repentia
2x Battle Sisters squads
7x Seraphim
2x Exorcists
3x Penitent Engines

And why the heck are IG the only battle brothers!?

Penitent Engines are an interesting unit. With the rules changes it helped the Penitent Engines be better in a lot of ways. Open topped means you really need to take cover with them. As the only forward armor in the list you just gave me, i am thinking they are going to be expensive paperweights fairly early on that will take pressure off the other units on the approach.

Moving behind the Rhinos could work but blown rhinos serve to slow the Raging machines down so the enemy probably can pop the rhinos without giving the Engines much movement advantage, Then kill the Engines.

Terrain is going to be crucial, but I am unsure as to whether that will save them. AV 11, open topped, rushing forth with nothing scarier approaching? I suppose what you'd be counting on is the enemy firing on the exorcists if the Sisters Rhinos dont block. Trouble is, the exorcists can be dispatched later and typically dont score so the Sisters and Penitent Engines will occupy a lions share of the enemy attention even if they have to throw away a unit to blockade in order to accomplish it.

In the past I have personally used Penitent Engines as singular things. It increass dramatically the number of uniots the enemy must use to kill them all and usually allowed at least one to wreak havoc before the games end. That would mean losing the Exorcists (and aesthetic shame) but then probably gaining a Quad-Melta Dominion Squad.

In the end, if you REALLY like Penitent Engines, that's what I would do. Split the pentitnts, skip the Exoscists and gain the Dominion to replace a lot of the anti-tank firepower you lost.

Help a noob out sisters!

Other than terrible luck I guess with positioning, had some oblits come in by deep strike and they were almost impossible to budge.

St.celestine and her 8 gal seraphrim squad killed one and a half with all their flamers and bolt pistols then charge in and fail to do anything in assault vs T5 while getting smacked by power fists. This started on turn 2 essentially and continues till turn 5's end. Failure to get away on hit and run each time on a 6 also didn't help I suppose.

Had some GK terminators come in also but the hammer guy died eariler and so all the power weapons just kept bouncing off them while power fists are still punching my face in. Between 2+ armor, T5, and their daemon 5++, oblits were damn hard to kill.

What do you guys usually do to multiple squads of these guys?

Exorcists and melta. Retributors.

2+ armor is the thing I like to see most across the field when playing sisters.

sudojoe wrote:Help a noob out sisters!

Other than terrible luck I guess with positioning, had some oblits come in by deep strike and they were almost impossible to budge.

St.celestine and her 8 gal seraphrim squad killed one and a half with all their flamers and bolt pistols then charge in and fail to do anything in assault vs T5 while getting smacked by power fists. This started on turn 2 essentially and continues till turn 5's end. Failure to get away on hit and run each time on a 6 also didn't help I suppose.

Had some GK terminators come in also but the hammer guy died eariler and so all the power weapons just kept bouncing off them while power fists are still punching my face in. Between 2+ armor, T5, and their daemon 5++, oblits were damn hard to kill.

What do you guys usually do to multiple squads of these guys?

pretre wrote:Exorcists and melta. Retributors.

Pretty much this. I wouldn't have probably thrown St. Celestine and company at them unless truly necessary, but since you did, don't forget Hit & Run so that you can break off and shoot them again.

pretre wrote:2+ armor is the thing I like to see most across the field when playing sisters.

Indeed. SoB are usually well equipped to deal with 2+ armor saves. If a SoB player is struggling with handling 2+ armor save models/units, then that is probably a good sign that they need to bring more Melta/Exorcists/Rets to the table, IMO.