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But they will cause fear to a nearby squad of hamsters... crap! Time to break out Nevsky and run as a big squad...

Aren't squads that cause fear immune to fear?

Unless they are 'Elite' Unit type (Ex: Sand Guard), or have the 'Immune to Fear' USR (Ex: Chipmunk Weapon Teams) they are subject to Fear.

Thinking of big squad issues here: multi-charging several other squads is OK as long as 3" coherency is maintained, right?

Yes.

I'm going to request that this thread be moved to the Misc. Games section, just FYI!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Annnnnnnd now it's in the Misc. Games section

Ambushing/Flanking Order of Play clarification:

1) Roll for initiative
2) If the winner has anything to ambush/flank, they roll for their first model/squad
2a) If that model/squad succeeds, you then either Shoot OR Charge & Melee with it (Flankers get their full activation), ending it's activation.
3) Continue through each set of ambushers/flankers.
4) After all ambushing/flanking, make an actual activation from the rest of your army.
5) Hand play over to your opponent, who does the same stuff.

Hopefully that list will clear it up for you.

Cyporiean and misktonicalum, again, thank you so much for all your assistance! Tonight I played a warband match, me using Ribenguo vs. Zabar. I pulled this thread up to guide me through the ambush rules.

But as usual, we have a few questions... and again, I apologize if these are already answered and I just didn't see or find it!

The Hyenas have the Pestilence spell which states "infect a unit with poisonous spores..." We assumed this referred to the army specific trebuchet ammo. What parts of the wording apply when using poisonous spores as a spell as opposed to ammo? We assumed the tactical action roll replaced the deviation, but does the affected squad also leave a cloud behind when they die?

How can the Poisonous spores effect can be removed from a squad or model? We know about the Hyena, but is there any other way?

Warhog tusks only list damage in the description, no wield or handedness. Can the hogs use their javelins in combat as well as their tusks?

Axony question... The Heavy Brigadier has Claws at hLVL1 and Front Gauntlets at hLVL2. At hLVL2, what attacks and with what weapons does the Brigadier use? (It isn't clear if claws get replaced by the gauntlets)

Edit - forgot some stuff

Gymnogyps wrote: The Hyenas have the Pestilence spell which states "infect a unit with poisonous spores..." We assumed this referred to the army specific trebuchet ammo. What parts of the wording apply when using poisonous spores as a spell as opposed to ammo? We assumed the tactical action roll replaced the deviation, but does the affected squad also leave a cloud behind when they die?

Consider the target model to have suffered a direct hit of the spores, with all of its effects. They'll leave a spore cloud behind when they die.

Gymnogyps wrote: How can the Poisonous spores effect can be removed from a squad or model? We know about the Hyena, but is there any other way?

Only the Hyenas of Zabar know a method of curing the spores poison.

Gymnogyps wrote: Warhog tusks only list damage in the description, no wield or handedness. Can the hogs use their javelins in combat as well as their tusks?

Yes, Tusks + Javelin + Shield Bash

Gymnogyps wrote: Axony question... The Heavy Brigadier has Claws at hLVL1 and Front Gauntlets at hLVL2. At hLVL2, what attacks and with what weapons does the Brigadier use? (It isn't clear if claws get replaced by the gauntlets)

RAI, Gauntlets cover the Claws and take their place

RAI, Gauntlets cover the Claws and take their place

in other words, Two attacks at 2 DE, normal armor application, and 2 attacks at 1 DE that ignore armor. If you level higher and get Greaves, you do 4 Attacks at 2 DE, normal armor application.

(The upgraded attacks will be clarified in a later printing/errata update)

Wow, OK we will have to have a re-match and use the Warhogs correctly.

Thank you so much for answering these questions! I just have one more follow up...

Cyporiean wrote:

Gymnogyps wrote: Axony question... The Heavy Brigadier has Claws at hLVL1 and Front Gauntlets at hLVL2. At hLVL2, what attacks and with what weapons does the Brigadier use? (It isn't clear if claws get replaced by the gauntlets)

RAI, Gauntlets cover the Claws and take their place

OK, that makes sense, but I'm still not getting it completely... maybe I'm overthinking it (it happens occasionally).

Gauntlets are dual wield, 2 attacks, 2DE. Does he get 2 gauntlets, so 4 attacks at 2DE? Or just the 2 attacks at 2DE?

Gymnogyps wrote:Wow, OK we will have to have a re-match and use the Warhogs correctly.

Thank you so much for answering these questions! I just have one more follow up...

Cyporiean wrote:

Gymnogyps wrote: Axony question... The Heavy Brigadier has Claws at hLVL1 and Front Gauntlets at hLVL2. At hLVL2, what attacks and with what weapons does the Brigadier use? (It isn't clear if claws get replaced by the gauntlets)

RAI, Gauntlets cover the Claws and take their place

OK, that makes sense, but I'm still not getting it completely... maybe I'm overthinking it (it happens occasionally).

Gauntlets are dual wield, 2 attacks, 2DE. Does he get 2 gauntlets, so 4 attacks at 2DE? Or just the 2 attacks at 2DE?

The term Dual Wield is probably just confusing you, ignore it in this instance.

Front Gauntlets = 2 Attacks at 2 DE.

It should probably be Front Gauntlet x2, or even just Claw Gauntlet x2 (like the BAC)

miskatonicalum wrote:

RAI, Gauntlets cover the Claws and take their place

in other words, Two attacks at 2 DE, normal armor application, and 2 attacks at 1 DE that ignore armor. If you level higher and get Greaves, you do 4 Attacks at 2 DE, normal armor application.

(The upgraded attacks will be clarified in a later printing/errata update)

Cyporiean wrote:
Front Gauntlets = 2 Attacks at 2 DE.

It should probably be Front Gauntlet x2, or even just Claw Gauntlet x2 (like the BAC)

OK, thanks, both of ya's. I got it now.

The ambush/flank clarification is great, thanks!

Glad to help

Jason and I were sitting around last night after playing WEGS discussing the megabattle at Templecon. Specifically talking about the rules for trebuches.

The general consensice is that their far to inacuarate but thats not the point I'm going to make. Jason pointed out that it is possible for a Trebuche to fire something and have it drift back far enough to hit the Trebuche. Is there a rule we are missing or is this indeed possible?

Yes, all template weapons (that deviate) can possibly misfire so badly they wipe out the user.

This had hilarious results in Beta-Testing the Gopher Engineers... Originally they were Infantry (10 models squads) that ALWAYS threw a 5" template at whatever killed them... So it was very possible to chain explode a unit of them, and most of the countryside.

I actually like them

As to this thread, it is old and I learned soooooo much playing you guys in-person at TempleCon that are wrong in the early posts here. So I may start another soon.

That said, 2 questions:

1. Can a Lvl 5 hero take another level from the chart instead of a Boon with his 5th level? I reaaallllyyy want a hedge knight with 4 bodyguards (2 levels) and able to make a unit rush then charge (3 levels). Otherwise I'll only be able to take 2 bodyguards (1 level) and get a boon.
2. If a unit charges and kills some models, so they are not all in base contact, do they all count as in combat for shooting purposes? Do the unengaged models have the ability to charge into the combat they're already in, but not touching, next turn?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also is it written anywhere that artillery ignores body armor, but not shield armor, as stated at TempleCon?

 RiTides wrote:
1. Can a Lvl 5 hero take another level from the chart instead of a Boon with his 5th level? I reaaallllyyy want a hedge knight with 4 bodyguards (2 levels) and able to make a unit rush then charge (3 levels). Otherwise I'll only be able to take 2 bodyguards (1 level) and get a boon.

No, every 5th Hero Level spent on a single hero goes to a boon.

 RiTides wrote:
2. If a unit charges and kills some models, so they are not all in base contact, do they all count as in combat for shooting purposes? Do the unengaged models have the ability to charge into the combat they're already in, but not touching, next turn?

No, unengaged are not 'in melee'. They also don't have to be activated as part of a charge reaction if you like, and they can charge in.

 RiTides wrote:
I actually like them

As to this thread, it is old and I learned soooooo much playing you guys in-person at TempleCon that are wrong in the early posts here. So I may start another soon.

That said, 2 questions:

1. Can a Lvl 5 hero take another level from the chart instead of a Boon with his 5th level? I reaaallllyyy want a hedge knight with 4 bodyguards (2 levels) and able to make a unit rush then charge (3 levels). Otherwise I'll only be able to take 2 bodyguards (1 level) and get a boon.
2. If a unit charges and kills some models, so they are not all in base contact, do they all count as in combat for shooting purposes? Do the unengaged models have the ability to charge into the combat they're already in, but not touching, next turn?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also is it written anywhere that artillery ignores body armor, but not shield armor, as stated at TempleCon?

With your 5 hero levels, couldn't you just take two Hedge Knights? One with two ranks in Hedge Rider and another with three ranks in Boubonic Honor? It would give you the same buffs and an extra Hedge Knight.

The answer to your artillary question on page 67 "Artillery attacks ignore armor except shield AR."

Cyp- But if the unit is shot at, some are in melee and some not. Shots carry over onto the models in melee, but can shots hit the enemy?

I have 10 hamsters charge in, after killing stuff, 2 are now unengaged. Enemy unit activates to shoot at them. Can you do a step by step? Either they're a unit in melee or not, because missed shots could then roll over onto enemies.

Catyr, true

 RiTides wrote:
Cyp- But if the unit is shot at, some are in melee and some not. Shots carry over onto the models in melee, but can shots hit the enemy?

I have 10 hamsters charge in, after killing stuff, 2 are now unengaged. Enemy unit activates to shoot at them. Can you do a step by step? Either they're a unit in melee or not, because missed shots could then roll over onto enemies.

Catyr, true

If there are models engaged in Melee (B2B), and you shoot into Melee AND miss, those models take the hits.
If a Squad charges into melee, and all models that were engaged get wiped out leaving no models in B2B then missed shots go off into nothingness.

Okay, so if even one model in my "unit" is still in melee after a charge (i.e. everything does not get wiped out), and my "unit" gets shot at, the enemy models that are in B2B can take hits.

 RiTides wrote:
Okay, so if even one model in my "unit" is still in melee after a charge (i.e. everything does not get wiped out), and my "unit" gets shot at, the enemy models that are in B2B can take hits.

Yes, but just the ones in B2B with that guy.

Oooh, I didn't realise I could mix talent trees on the same hero! That could be fun.

 Casey's Law wrote:
Oooh, I didn't realise I could mix talent trees on the same hero! That could be fun.

Yup, just remember that you can't take a higher rank of an ability without taking the preceding ones.

On the 'more talents' front of your question RiTides, also note that there are alternative rules in the campaign section for allowing heroes to go up to level 10. If people preferred to play at that level, you could have a hero that goes up to level 10, gaining 8 talent ranks, and 2 boons. As Caty suggested though, you could resolve the issue with two hedge knights. The leveling system was designed to allow you to make one really powerful hero, but spreading your levels about is more effective (no upgrades to stats at all, no more equipment upgrades after 4, etc)

Just letting you know you could if there is a consensus amongst other players.

I looked at the talents again but I actually quite prefer my original 10hlvl choice.

I was putting my 200r list together and I have some questions now if you don't mind clarifying:
1. If an artillery piece is in base contact with a wall, can it be fired over/through it like infantry?
2. Bull Regulars have Pith Helms in their standard equipment yet a price is quoted at then end of the Axon section, should I be paying 2GD each or getting them free?
3. I have assumed not but can miniatures be in a trench, in base contact with a wall and fire artillery? It sounds ridiculous obviously but I haven't seen any rule that stops any combination like that from happening.

Those are the only things I can remember now.

1) Yes
2) Pith Helms got changed to Standard at some point between 1.0-1.2 and the cost just didn't get removed.
3) Yes.

 Casey's Law wrote:
I looked at the talents again but I actually quite prefer my original 10hlvl choice.

I was putting my 200r list together and I have some questions now if you don't mind clarifying:
1. If an artillery piece is in base contact with a wall, can it be fired over/through it like infantry?
2. Bull Regulars have Pith Helms in their standard equipment yet a price is quoted at then end of the Axon section, should I be paying 2GD each or getting them free?
3. I have assumed not but can miniatures be in a trench, in base contact with a wall and fire artillery? It sounds ridiculous obviously but I haven't seen any rule that stops any combination like that from happening.

Those are the only things I can remember now.

Just keep in mind that 200 resources is a large game... Most of the Brushfire players I know have a hard enough time fielding 100 resources let along double that.

On another note, I think you'd be severally hamerping yourself by playing one level 10 hero... With Aquitar at 100 resources and 5 hero levels I've been running a level 4 Trapper and a level 1 Tactician to great effect.

A question on determining the armor value of a horde unit. Do you use the armor rating that the majority of the models in the horde have or the higherst? An example would be I have a horde of 15 models, 10 of those models have armor 2 and 5 of those models have armor 3.