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Ok I've reworked my Tau allied list, can you check it over for me, let me know any changes, I must/should make...

Allied Detachment
Shas'El 75 Fusion Blaster
Plasma Rifle
Multi Tracker
HW drone controller.
2 Marker Drone
2 x Sheild Drone
172

Fire Warriors x 5
Shas'ui x 1 with Markerlight 80

3 x Broadsides
4 x Sheild drones
1 x Blacksun Filter
273

525

Thanks

Eldercaveman wrote:
Ok I've reworked my Tau allied list, can you check it over for me, let me know any changes, I must/should make...

Allied Detachment
Shas'El 75 Fusion Blaster
Plasma Rifle
Multi Tracker
HW drone controller.
2 Marker Drone
2 x Sheild Drone
172

1: How 4 drones. A drone controller lets you take 0-2 drones total. I would drop the Marker Drones.
2: Shas'el is 50 not 75.
3: An incredibly tough Shas'el has Iridium Armour and 2 Shield Drones. Oh, and if you give him a Hard Wired MultiTracker and you can Twinlink one of your weapons.

Fire Warriors x 5
Shas'ui x 1 with Markerlight 80
You're better off running this as 8 fire warriors than with the 1 markerlight that has a 50/50 chance of hitting (if you don't move) that only the broadsides of shas'el can take advantage of.

3 x Broadsides
4 x Sheild drones
1 x Blacksun Filter
273

I'd take a Team Leader, give him a Hard Wired Black Sun Filter and Bonding Knife, and take 2 more shield drones.

525

Thanks

Eldercaveman wrote:
Ok I've reworked my Tau allied list, can you check it over for me, let me know any changes, I must/should make...

Here are my viewpoints of your approach...

Allied Detachment
Shas'El 75 Fusion Blaster
Plasma Rifle
Multi Tracker
HW drone controller.
2 Marker Drone
2 x Sheild Drone
172

A Drone Controller can only control up to two drones, not four. Highly recommend you drop the marker drones. I'll explain in a bit. Also recommend giving him a targeting array as well.

Fire Warriors x 5
Shas'ui x 1 with Markerlight 80

The markerlight here is unnessicary, again, I'll explain below.

3 x Broadsides
4 x Sheild drones
1 x Blacksun Filter
273

You can probably use the points you saved above on marker drones to add two more shield drones, if you're so inclined. Promote a member to be a team lead and give him a HW Blacksun for that effect.

But i would most recommend, with three broadsides, giving them all target locks instead. Three broadsides on a single target, especially vehicles, is probably the single strongest definition of "overkill" in the entire warhammer 40k game. Two shield drones on the team lead will hold the line enough to help out, but once someone wants your suits dead, they will be and no amount of shield drones will stop that.

As for the markerlights, here's the big problem with them. They only work on Tau units. Not whatever other faction you're using. Just Tau. It means that you're increasing the BS of your commander, who should have a Targeting array already or your broadsides, who are twin linked and almost don't need it. You could reduce cover saves, but that requires an insane amount of committment from 500pts of your army just to kill one unit with your broadsides or commander (your firewarriors rarely need markerlights). You can shave off a whole pile of points with my suggestions and still get admirable results.

Thanks for the help both, I have made a few adjustments,

Allied Detachment
Shas'El 50
Fusion Blaster
TL Plasma Rifle
HW drone controller.
HW Multi-tracker
Iridium armour
2 x Sheild Drone
202

Fire Warriors x 6 - 60

3 x Broadsides
4 x Sheild drones
1 x Blacksun Filter
273

510

I've dropped the fire warriors down to the minimum as they are only going to be a back field objective holder, my main purpose for this Tau allied detachment is to field 3 broadsides, and that is it really. It will be allied with my Blood Angels, and I don't really want to go much over 500 points.

I'd drop it to a Shas'el - the BS5 isn't worth 25pts. (the +1 WS is irrelavent, the +1 wound isn't that helpful on an already expensive T4 model that has 3 Wounds anyway, and +1 attack is as useful as +1 WS).

You make a pretty convincing argument for the drop and it does give me an extra 25 points to play with, does dropping down to 'El, mean I need to make any changes to wargear?

I'm debating on the Target locks on the broadsides, as my friend does like to field a multitude of vinidicators, so dropping them in turn one would be quite nice, however I have seen Broadsides, that struggle to hit the Broadside of a barn door.

Eldercaveman wrote:
I'm debating on the Target locks on the broadsides, as my friend does like to field a multitude of vinidicators, so dropping them in turn one would be quite nice, however I have seen Broadsides, that struggle to hit the Broadside of a barn door.

Yes, but that's just terrible dice rolling. A twin linked BS4 hits nearly 75% of the time and will easily just about any armor. Granted, it's tougher when you're going against AV14, but when you do pen you have a 50/50 chance of blowing whatever was unlucky enough to get hit all to bits.

If heavy vehicles are your problem, I would honestly consider a twin linked fusion instead of plasma on your commander and have it go all in on armor and 2+ armor units. It would be one hell of a haymaker and make your opponent focus on it instead of the rest of your army. However, it needs to be mobile if you did this and Iridium Armor takes away more mobility than I care to lose.

To be fair I could just strip the Commander down to basics. He is literally there as a means to an end, where does the BS 4 come from on the Broadsides? Maybe there would be an easier way to do this, you have 500 points to spend on Tau, your only restriction is it must be codex legal, and must include 3 Broadsides, what do you pick?

I would actually take a Railhead with DPod, Flechetts and MT. Just zip about popping things with a 3+ cover. Drop in a Shas'el w/ 2 Vre weaponised between them for anti-everything for the annoyance factor, and 12 FWs w/ 2 SDs to blob on an objective.

 IHateNids wrote:
I would actually take a Railhead with DPod, Flechetts and MT. Just zip about popping things with a 3+ cover. Drop in a Shas'el w/ 2 Vre weaponised between them for anti-everything for the annoyance factor, and 12 FWs w/ 2 SDs to blob on an objective.

I'm not too familiar with the Tau lingo, so could you give me it without please?

I am open to this idea though, how many points would it be roughly? or exactly?

~800 points for all that lot IIRC (I have a 30% of army total for allies, so forgive large points tag XD)

Translation: I would take a Railgun Hammerhead with DPod, Flechette Dischargers and a MT. Just zip about popping things with a 3+ cover. DS in a Shas'el HQ w/ 2 Shas'Vre bodyguards, weaponised between them for anti-everything. (for the annoyance factor) and 12 Fire Warriors w/ 2 Shield Drones to blob on an objective.

See 800 is to much for me, I have 1500 of BA to field and I want this as a 500 point add on. Well truthfully I have 7000 points of blood angels, but I just wanted the fun of fielding 3 broadsides.

hence my apology for the price tag. using tau as allies, you can quite easily field an insane number of points using each point of allied foc

Tau, being a 4th Edition Xeno codex, are expensive.

unfortunetely so.

Except the troops, who are rather cheap, but rather weak.

 Micky wrote:
Tau, being a 4th Edition Xeno codex, are expensive.

Bit of a historical question. I haven't been around long enough to know this - was overcosted options a real issue for 4th edition non-Imperium armies?

Eldercaveman wrote:
Ok I've reworked my Tau allied list, can you check it over for me, let me know any changes, I must/should make...

Allied Detachment
Shas'El 75 Fusion Blaster
Plasma Rifle
Multi Tracker
HW drone controller.
2 Marker Drone
2 x Sheild Drone
172

Fire Warriors x 5
Shas'ui x 1 with Markerlight 80

3 x Broadsides
4 x Sheild drones
1 x Blacksun Filter
273

525

Thanks

Just go here for your Tau template (and for all army building information):

http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2012/09/template-tau-empire/

Can we go back to talking about tactics? I'm enjoying this thread.

Interesting article today on Bell of Lost Souls that really highlights the reasoning behind all of the focus in this thread on ForgeWorld. We knew it would make the Tau better but evidently they were quite competitive in a ForgeWorld atmosphere.

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2012/09/get-yo-resin-on-forgeworld-and.html

I'd like to look more closely at the Comikaze results. Do we have anyone in the thread who was present and playing?

 Flavius Infernus wrote:


Just go here for your Tau template (and for all army building information):

http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2012/09/template-tau-empire/

Can we go back to talking about tactics? I'm enjoying this thread.

well I got some tactics questions anyway:

ve been debating on eldar allies vs GK allies for the Tau.

I'm kind of torn between them and how to best run it. The first page was very informative but I don't think this particular aspect was addressed.

Eldar = farseer buffs, runes of warding anti-psyker defense

GK = can use coteaz to camp corners to defend against outflanking and strike squads can save against deep striking units along with easier time of getting first turn with coteaz. Also can take a stormraven for some good anti-air, and of course air power.

or maybe vanilla marines somehow?

Any opinions on what you find more useful?

Also for eldar allies, do you guys think that jetbike farseer is better (having a higher T) and more able to run away or last minute contest (accompanied by some sort of jetbike guardian squad)

vs

Pathfinder camping squad with long range (36') snipers on top of aegis? ( I guess the farseer can still be jetbike I suppose but probably die from all those dangerous terrain checks) Can buff the gun line but won't be able to keep up with crisis suits for buffs (though the crisis suits probably gonna get markerlight support?)

I'm personally leaning more towards Eldar Farseer for buffs myself. I feel I only need Runes of Warding and a bunch of psychic powers. Probably a jetbike for mauverability and jink, so I would accompany it with a guardian squad for contesting sake (and essentially extra wounds for your farseer)

 sudojoe wrote:

 Flavius Infernus wrote:


Just go here for your Tau template (and for all army building information):

http://yesthetruthhurts.com/2012/09/template-tau-empire/

Can we go back to talking about tactics? I'm enjoying this thread.

well I got some tactics questions anyway:

ve been debating on eldar allies vs GK allies for the Tau.

I'm kind of torn between them and how to best run it. The first page was very informative but I don't think this particular aspect was addressed.

Eldar = farseer buffs, runes of warding anti-psyker defense

GK = can use coteaz to camp corners to defend against outflanking and strike squads can save against deep striking units along with easier time of getting first turn with coteaz. Also can take a stormraven for some good anti-air, and of course air power.

or maybe vanilla marines somehow?

Any opinions on what you find more useful?

Also for eldar allies, do you guys think that jetbike farseer is better (having a higher T) and more able to run away or last minute contest (accompanied by some sort of jetbike guardian squad)

vs

Pathfinder camping squad with long range (36') snipers on top of aegis? ( I guess the farseer can still be jetbike I suppose but probably die from all those dangerous terrain checks) Can buff the gun line but won't be able to keep up with crisis suits for buffs (though the crisis suits probably gonna get markerlight support?)

I played two games with a drop pod tac squad and librarian with terminators. THe tac squad comes in turn one, harassing about the back lines of the enemy, and gives the tau gunline allot of relief from advance/fire. With a teleport homer sergeant I have the option of being really dangerous in one side of the board and having a strong gunline at back, or dropping the termies somewhere else for an even spread of threat.

Next thing I'm gonna want to try is 60 ork boys and a warboss

I had an opponent take two drone controller things on his hq for 4 drones? Are you saying that doesn't work?

x_x

you cant take the same upgrade twice, by the same logic I would buy two railguns for my hammerhead and shoot 2 templates each turn.

I think thge problem was that they took a drone controller, and a hard wired drone controller.... Im not positive about the legality, but Im going to lean towards no.

Hard-wired systems are the same wargear, just not taking hardpoints.

The is no such wargear "Hard-wired dron controller", there is "drone controller" and "hard-wired system", a hard-wired one is still a drone controller.

You CAN take a Drone controller AND a Hard-Wired Drone Controller, but one will take a hard point, the other will not. But it's REALLY expensive and generally not that amazing a tactical option.

Sigh...

Well, you will have to take it to YMDC, or realise that as both the DC and the HWDC follow the same rules (as stated in the "hard wired" explanation in codex) and that the the drone controller rules are not "a drone controller allows you to take 1 or 2 drones" but "a character with a drone controller must take one or two..."

The main point of the sentence is that even by RAW it states that having A drone controller, not ANY drone controller, and as such even if you could take two, they would still be one or two drones.

Well he gives his guy iridium armor and 4 shield drones so now I have 4 more 2+ saves to go through...

Also if taking a drone controller lets you take one or two drones it stands to reason that taking and additional controller would let you take four drones...

tedbpb wrote:
Also if taking a drone controller lets you take one or two drones it stands to reason that taking and additional controller would let you take four drones...

Not really... If I say 'everyone with a nike shoe may have a piece of candy', do you automatically assume that because you have a pair of shoes that you get two pieces of candy?

The rule states, "A model with a drone controller must take one or two Gun, Marker, or Shield Drones, in any combinations". It doesn't say that you get one or two drones per controller, it says the model must have one or two drones because it has a controller. If your friend wants to waste points on an emergency backup controller, that's up to him, but it doesn't entitle him to more drones.