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Original concept or not: Red Gollums look funny, not menacing.

 Meade wrote:

gorgon wrote:


@Meade -- you realize that these ARE primarily fantasy kits, right?

It's a dual release for fantasy and 40k, and these are kits right? correct me if I'm wrong.

You don't understand. The aesthetics need to work in a fantasy setting first. That's why you have musicians and chariots and not an array of tanks and artillery. The Soul Grinder was their one nod to 40K, but they've since made that available in WFB, and it's very unlikely that we'll see any more sci-fi styling in the Daemons line.

This could make a good cannon chariot if the horses were replaced by juggernauts. What do you guys think?

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:

Concerning Khorne: When did Khorne daemons stop being brutal and frighening fighting machines? The bloodletters are just stupidly grinning skinnies with a too large sword, probably with a high pitched squeaky voice.

The Bloodletter look is a return to the original bloodletters from Realm of Chaos, I actually really like them with their long heads and gangly limbs. That's how they originally were.

The Bloodletter herald forgeworld do (with the daemon prince) is one of my favorite models.

Yeah, I'm okay with the current plastics. The metal bodybuilder 'letters looked ridiculous. The beastman-y metals looked good, but they were a fairly radical departure from the original art and models. Not sure if there's an IP angle there or not, but GW definitely decided to revisit the old concepts with the new plastics. And they did look too much like beastmen, IMO.

Based on these small pictures, this looks like a really piss poor release from GW. The flys and the Tzeentch chariot in particular are really bad. The fire in particular on the chariot just looks terrible. Looks like GW let thier B or even C team loose on this one.

gorgon wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:

Concerning Khorne: When did Khorne daemons stop being brutal and frighening fighting machines? The bloodletters are just stupidly grinning skinnies with a too large sword, probably with a high pitched squeaky voice.

The Bloodletter look is a return to the original bloodletters from Realm of Chaos, I actually really like them with their long heads and gangly limbs. That's how they originally were.

The Bloodletter herald forgeworld do (with the daemon prince) is one of my favorite models.

Yeah, I'm okay with the current plastics. The metal bodybuilder 'letters looked ridiculous. The beastman-y metals looked good, but they were a fairly radical departure from the original art and models. Not sure if there's an IP angle there or not, but GW definitely decided to revisit the old concepts with the new plastics. And they did look too much like beastmen, IMO.

I think the bloodletters did a great job of that. I think the plastic daemonettes were a miss though, some of the heads that Jes sculpted for them are great, the rest are fairly nasty, I'd have preferred they just ran with the new Diaz aesthetic as they failed to recapture the 1st edition aesthetic.

Juggernauts have never looked so good.

Horrors, well they can never seem to stop utterly changing aesthetic, but I love my originals with the giant hands.

I really was hoping to see them redo the Greater Daemons, but if this current batch of minis is anything to go by, perhaps they should leave them the hell alone (although even I am boggled as to how they could make the keeper of secrets worse).

I do think there's a strong IP driven initiative behind the designs recently, I've thought this since the minotaurs, since you can't take anyone else's minotaurs and incorporate them with the new GW hulk minotaurs with their hoof-feet and razorback and curious face design.

This is liable to continue I think with all the ranges. God only knows what they'll do with my orks... I hope they don't shift them from the current aesthetic too much.

What's frustrating is that we went through decades of model design being constrained by the medium. Then comes this new computer sculpting technology and we start to get some really dynamic kits - Screaming Bell, Arachnarok, Necrosphinx, Abomination etc

And then... some time around Ogre Kingdoms, the designs started to get really weak, with at least one rubbish kit in each release usually as a consequence of trying to combine two kits into one - scraplauncher/ironblaster, mortis engine/coven throne

Now this malaise is affecting entire releases. As Kroot pointed out, the last six releases have been highly underwhelming (with the possible exception of DA in my case). At best, I can find one miniature/kit I like the look of which is certainly no incentive to invest in the entire army range.

GW - Your minis are (were?) the sole remaining reason for staying in the game and this aspect is slipping fast.

Im at the point in the hobby when i just look forward to the new releases because they allow me to convert my own versions of the new units

The Khorne Cannon is a god sent (pun intended) as i can finally make a daemon tank that makes sense ruleswise.

Maybe this has been covered (i didn't have time to read the whole thread) but , wasn't there supposed to be a new greater daemons. Khorne and nurgle for this wave?

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

I think the bloodletters did a great job of that. I think the plastic daemonettes were a miss though, some of the heads that Jes sculpted for them are great, the rest are fairly nasty, I'd have preferred they just ran with the new Diaz aesthetic as they failed to recapture the 1st edition aesthetic.

GW had no choice but to retire the Diaz boobie-nettes.

Don't blame them for the sheer stupidity of your average over-protective b***** soccer moms here in North America...
Hell, my local GW store had to bookshelf their boxes of the Diaz 'nettes because so many of these jumped-up b***** would get screaming mad that their little 6 year-old had just been "psychologically scared" by seeing little miniature daemon boobies.

And some dumb@$$ moms still complain about the new ones that barely suggest anything.

I know they call it a beer and pretzels game but come on. They really need to not let these guys drink at work.

Being serious though maybe they lost some of their good sculptors at some point and their using 2nd and 3rd stringers.

Does anyone know if that is possible or who they might have lost around that time?

Let me preface my post by saying I like the Plastic Demonette's. I don't love them. But I think they're fine - they are perfectly fine looking models for gaming.

Having said that, let me state that IMO this wave of Demon models is bad, and GW should feel bad.

Only exceptions being the herald of Nurgle and Khorne - one of which is finecast so, LoL nope!

This could make a good cannon chariot if the horses were replaced by juggernauts. What do you guys think?

I still think the GW sculpts for the most part simply blow away anything made by PP, I've never liked much of their work. I like most of the kits GW has done for the past few months regardless of what the most vociferous forum users have been saying. Much of the Chaos stuff is a return to ideas that were around when I got hooked on GW designs more than 2 decades ago and that's just fine with me.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Horrors, well they can never seem to stop utterly changing aesthetic, but I love my originals with the giant hands.

Now, I like the original horrors too, but models never existed that were sillier, or looked more like something you would find in a happy meal. Why was that ok then and not now?

Now, I like the original horrors too, but models never existed that were sillier, or looked more like something you would find in a happy meal. Why was that ok then and not now?

Because irrational negativity is the engine that drives the forums and keeps friendly positive people from participating much. :(

I am fond of the original Realm Of Chaos sculpts by GW they are still some of my favorites of all time. The return to that aesthetic has been good for me and I like some of this crazy looking new Daemons stuff too.

As a request, can we please stop criticising others and their opinions, be they due to criticism or support of GW.

People go through the thread and post their opinions, and that's fair enough; it's what N&R threads are. But can we please stop criticising one another for doing so? Citing individuals or the forum as 'whiney' or 'white knighting' achieves nothing and instead just creates a cycle of further complaints.

Can we not just share and (constructively) discuss opinions, rather than simply criticise them, no matter their alignment?


Edit: Unlikely to happen, I know, but worth asking for.

 BrassScorpion wrote:
Irrational negativity is the engine that drives the forums

Sigging this.

So according to the latest posts up on Warseer...

Mat Ward has written at least one of the books
Check out post #814 here: http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?358267-Daemons-in-February-2013/page41

Why do I now have the sinking feeling in my gut that we're about to be 7th edition Orc&Gobbo'd?

Crap. Now I have to skip over a new rash of "Ward Hate Threads" for the next 2 months.

Hopefully he wrote the Fantasy book, so that will stay out of the 40k Discussion area...

Edit: Added smiley face to seem less dick-holish. Seem, anyway...

 kronk wrote:
Crap. Now I have to skip over a new rash of "Ward Hate Threads" for the next 2 months.

Well, there's what, that 1 in how many piss-poorly balanced books he did get right?! (so there's a small, almost insignificant glimmer of hope to be had!)

But considering how he ruined 7th with his first attempt at Daemons, and how universially hated Daemons have become in 40k, I'm now kinda expecting a hellishly severe over-nerfing to take place.

I think that Herald of Khorne model looks fantastic. Reminds me of the FW Angron for some reason.

Didn't be write the deamons book last time as well? Makes since they would have him do it again since he's familiar with it.

Can we leave the Ward garbage out? The guy on warseer didn't even support it as a rumor, it was just a passing comment.

 wowsmash wrote:
Didn't be write the deamons book last time as well? Makes since they would have him do it again since he's familiar with it.

Yes he did.

The herald of nurgle will look great with a bit of cleaning, some OTT details in there...It looks quite bigger in comparison with other plagues ( look how the base seems smaller) will get one eventually.

The flies are a big disappointment for me, I love nurgle and I'm nuts about bugs but the miniature designers involved in this have no idea of what they are doing its so wrong visually that ouch! they do need better designers.

 pretre wrote:
Can we leave the Ward garbage out? The guy on warseer didn't even support it as a rumor, it was just a passing comment.

Down boy, down. . I just asked question. Didn't even say anything bad about him.

 wowsmash wrote:

 pretre wrote:
Can we leave the Ward garbage out? The guy on warseer didn't even support it as a rumor, it was just a passing comment.

Down boy, down. . I just asked question. Didn't even say anything bad about him.

Guilty conscience? I was responding mostly to Exp626 and the potential for the thread to go downhill.

 NAVARRO wrote:
The herald of nurgle will look great with a bit of cleaning, some OTT details in there...It looks quite bigger in comparison with other plagues ( look how the base seems smaller) will get one eventually.

The flies are a big disappointment for me, I love nurgle and I'm nuts about bugs but the miniature designers involved in this have no idea of what they are doing its so wrong visually that ouch! they do need better designers.

If you, or anyone else, finds any suitable scale fly or similar insect toys, you be sure and share that info, ok? I really like the concept, but not the model, so will try and build my own.

Anyone else think of this when they saw the flies?


On the whole I actually like the models as Khorne has a unique flair and style and the heralds are all great.

If Ward wrote a Daemon codex, I imagine it would only be the 40k one. I believe authors try to stay away from authoring the same book twice.

I'd personally like it if Ward wrote the Daemon codex.

Hopefully, we start getting snapshots of rules soon.