Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Buzzsaw wrote:

 scarletsquig wrote:
Some much better pics of number 88 and Wilcard from the Open Day:

http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/334663_370890089654262_1515453706_o.jpg
http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/334525_370890049654266_53652691_o.jpg

They look great! Just needed some better pictures.

88 looks great for certain! Wildcard, ehhhhhhh... the technicals of the sculpt are good, but that pose, yikes! Also, seriously, who decided that she plays in go-go boot heels?

Dance party!

And yeah, the stripper shoes are a bit of a moment. I'd have hoped some more of the producers would have moved past that level of derp.

88=ok
Wildcard=terrible

I need some new greens for other random stuff to re-assure me!

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Wildcard is absolutely terrible. The pose is pretty bad, but the shortened torso and unaligned spine are the real horrors.

"For the record, Mr. Stark, the pilot survived."

Think of her in the process of throwing a discus, I think thats the intent, and it works well (my opinion though)

Then wouldn't her left arm be up more instead of in a comedy "pushing away the midget" pose? Also, there are all kinds of things wrong with the torso that prevent it from looking like she's doing anything more coherent than twitching feebly. And I hadn't even noticed the F-me Frankenstein boots until now.

Great hair, though.

88 needs his left knee pushed slightly more upright, I think. II agree the glove looks too bulky. Apart from that I really like him. Crisp, dynamic.

Wildcard. The face is good.

The pose just doesn't look right. I know sometimes real-life body positions don't look realistic or even possible but occasionally they don't work well as a static model. And, unfortunately, I just don't find the model works. Yes, she could be fending somebody off while throwing but her legs are running...skipping...not sure...It just feels as if the sculptor is trying to pull off too many things at once. Her original pose oozed strength and character.

Maybe she does look good from one angle but that isn't acceptable - a figure should look good from many angles. Sure, there might be one or two that aren't so great but that's acceptable.

Aside from the face I dont' think the sculpting quality is up to that of the Ogres in the other thread or No 88. I'm guessing because it isn't finished (i.e. still WiP )

No it should not, what you say is all models should be static to look good from all angles in pics, why? dynamic poses don't work that way.

Anyway because it has been ignored, this is wildcards pose from the front and it shows why the body looks twisted, because it IS twisting probably pushing aside somebody in order to strike the ball, I really do not know why everybody took her side since this is the oddest angle for this model to take.
Spoiler because the pic is huge....


I assume because her artwork has boots and the other boot is been trimmed down and because this is a WIP, her multi platform will be shortened to a more reasonable length.

I said *occasionally* they don't work well on a static model. Further, I said that a model should look good from *many* angles not all of them.

I don't have an issue with her fending somebody away...just that the very low angle looks odd on that model. If we could see the attacking 'model' making, say, a diving tackle it would look slightly less out of place. That would also tie in with the way she is leaning back.

I've seen that happen often in rugby but in those cases the defender usually has the ball tucked in tight or cocked straight back.

My bad then, apologies.

 scipio.au wrote:

 Black Nexus wrote:

thank god you were there to pass it or it might never had made it pass their initial goal! Thanks Scipio

Heh, I'm sure they'd make their money if they start another KS tomorrow. Doesn't mean it's a classy thing to do though

Seriously though, the more times any of these companies go to the well for money before finishing making good on their previous commitments, the more it'll erode the goodwill that people have for them. Does that point of view make sense?

I can see where you're coming from,

but to me as long as they are at least begining to fulfill their orders AND the figures they are produccing are up to the standards the backers expected I'm OK with it (Icertainly need to see the greens as they are finalised too)

(now if a company involved had rumours of cash flow problems or anything that meant I thought money was at risk thing would be different)

I guess a separated but related issue is would I back a second KS by a company before I'd got the goods from the first...... If I'd got some of their mini's before and liked them, probably yes, If the KS was a from a 'new to me' company probably not (I'd want to see & paint some of their stuff first)

Psychotic Storm, why didn't you pose the angle that looks good instead of another "dud"?

Personally from this angle, I do not think she looks like a dud, the body is properly twisted she is running pushing somebody aside or balancing wile aiming to release the dreadball.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Psychotic Storm, why didn't you pose the angle that looks good instead of another "dud"?

Heh, it seems she's like a magic eye painting: if you squint just right she looks good...

Her lower body is just misaligned for her upper body, and her upper body, while it makes a certain kind of sense, doesn't seem to make sense given the description of the game. She looks like she's throwing side-arm (like a discus), but... why? Are there any other minis in that position? That doesn't seem to jibe with the poses of the other figures.

It's a very strange miss, considering how nice the other minis are (including 88).

EDIT: By the by, anyone know if there is any feedback thread on the official Mantic forums? Maybe I'm just a newb at their structure, but I can't seem to find anywhere that people are discussing the kickstarter stuff that references the WIP photos.

I am under the impression they throw the ball with a special "glove" like a disk.

I do not think form up front the body is misaligned.

 Buzzsaw wrote:

EDIT: By the by, anyone know if there is any feedback thread on the official Mantic forums? Maybe I'm just a newb at their structure, but I can't seem to find anywhere that people are discussing the kickstarter stuff that references the WIP photos.

All the Dreadball stuff is in general discussion at the moment, and there's probably some discussion about the pictures in the Open Day thread.

Wildcard looks great from the front angle as far as I can tell, and the face is very well-sculpted which is the important thing for me, as often sculptors don't get female faces right.

That is one thing I liked about the sculpt, her face was really well done!

 scarletsquig wrote:

 Buzzsaw wrote:

EDIT: By the by, anyone know if there is any feedback thread on the official Mantic forums? Maybe I'm just a newb at their structure, but I can't seem to find anywhere that people are discussing the kickstarter stuff that references the WIP photos.

All the Dreadball stuff is in general discussion at the moment, and there's probably some discussion about the pictures in the Open Day thread.

Wildcard looks great from the front angle as far as I can tell, and the face is very well-sculpted which is the important thing for me, as often sculptors don't get female faces right.

Hmm, do you mean this thread?

Before commenting further, when you say "looks great from the front angle", do you mean this picture?

I will agree freely with others, her face and hair are very well done, my complaints are all about her body/pose (she's a butter body! ).

^ Yes and no! I mean the angle from the front. The one where she has all that frontiness going on.

There aren't any complaints about the WIP sculpts on the Mantic forums, but then the place is far more focused when it comes to complaints.

E.g. You won't catch me giving a toss about whether or not Wildcard's boots should be 1mm shorter, but you will see me writing essay-long feedback posts about other stuff.

If any other "big" company tried to sell a model for $10 that only looked "good" from one very specific angle, you would all go full Warseer on them, so don't pretend it's okay when Mantic does it.

Look, the head and face are great, but just about everything else is wrong.

The left arm is angled too low, and the raised shoulder isn't lined up properly for a stiff arm, while the bent back wrist only makes sense if it is going to impact something. Unless, of course, Wildcard is doing the Christie Brinkley dance from Uptown Girl. Even so, a good sculptor will know something about dynamic posing, or at least have read How to Draw Comics the Marvel Way, and will realize that the downward angle is really unappealing. It's about as dynamic as a triangle lying on it's widest leg.

The torso is just too short. Her rib cage is touching her pelvis.

Her trunk muscles are not flexing/extant/human. She looks like an 80's GI Joe, connected by a rubber band. And it looks like her waist is off-center.

She must have learned how to run from the Khorne Berserker School of Imitating Phoebe Bouffet. Seriously, sculptor, do what He Man did and trace a photo of someone running.

The boots are hungry for love and it's feeding time.

Etc.

EDIT: The model would be 100% better if you put her head on 88's body. Still a bit akward, though.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
If any other "big" company tried to sell a model for $10 that only looked "good" from one very specific angle, you would all go full Warseer on them, so don't pretend it's okay when Mantic does it.

Agree Agree Agree.

My fear is Mantic now has to produce more models in a short period of time than they have competent sculptors, so a portion of the sculpts will be unacceptable done by unqualified sculptors. Who is the sculptor of Wildcard and can we see their other work to see if there is any hope?

Let's see some other models to make us feel better.

I have to agree, Wildcard's body just looks...awkward. The face and hair are excellent, which is the tricky bit, but that just makes the body all that more confusing; you do well on the hard part and then honk the basics? It's like they went for a pose that would work well with another model for reference (stiff-arming a Jack while lining up a strike seems to be the goal of the pose), but on a single model just comes across badly. If they squared up the torso with the legs, or changed the legs to convey more of a leap than a run, it could work a bit better.

Now, WIP is exactly that and I wouldn't rule out the bosses grabbing what they had to show it even if the sculptor wasn't done. The wide-angle shot shows just those two greens, which could indicate they just grabbed what was recognizable and perhaps not what the sculptors were happy with.

While every model range has models that only appeal to a certain segment, Wildcard was one of my "looking forward to" models. Not going to massively diminish my enjoyment of the purchase (over 200 models by the time all is said and done ) but still disappointing.

I'm really looking forward to getting this in the next few months. I finally sat down and read the core rules and its pretty easy to pick up, though they need to grammercheck the hell out of it for the final book. I'm interested in seeing how the various teams play and how league-play works. Pre-genned MVP's are cool, but I love seeing my own players rise through the ranks and into their own stardom.

Update today saying if you missed the KS you can e-mail them if you want to buy.

I saw the wildcard at the open day, it looked ok. I think this may be one to look at in person before making a final judgement, photographs can often be a little misleading.

I wanted to share some correspondence I had with Mantic over the WIPs;

Hi Buzzsaw

Thanks for getting in touch, and thanks for your kind comments about our Kickstarter!

It's a shame that you're not happy with the Wildcard sculpt. With regard to the pose, it does look a lot more natural when you hold it in your hand, it's just a bad angle for the photograph unfortunately. As for the high heels, we are aware of people's opinions on this and we've deliberately not gone this way for the female team and other MVPs. However, Wildcard's design incorporates a pop culture reference that pays homage to a character with similar imagery to DreadBall, and we wanted to stay true to that.

Thanks for the feedback, and we'll definitely take it into account with the continuing development of the game :-).

Thanks

Stewart

So, for those hoping that the sculpt is not finished, I fear your hopes have been in vain.

In that vein (pun!), allow me to restate the following without comment;
Of the 20 MVP miniatures representing named individuals, there are 3 (three) identifiable females. Said females may be further characterized as,
-Wildcard, in skinsuit and gogoboots,
-Helder, comically zaftig, and
-Mellisandra, an appropriately built and attired member of a non-human race.

Hmmmmmm.....

I think, the Wildcard sculpt looks odd because of the angle of the photo: Her upper body is a bit twisted and bent backward, making it look too short in this specific angle while in reality it isn't, as people who have actually seen the sculpt seem to confirm.

She is supposed to be an homage to the character from Tron 2 that didn't pay off, right? Or am I missing something?

I know a few guys in real life who will probably be happy to take her off my hands, so no biggie.

Oh yeah I guess she does look like her! A homage character to a movie I have seen? What madness is this?

Kroothawk wrote:I think, the Wildcard sculpt looks odd because of the angle of the photo: Her upper body is a bit twisted and bent backward, making it look too short in this specific angle while in reality it isn't, as people who have actually seen the sculpt seem to confirm.

I'm always nervous about being reassured by claims that "it's great, when you have it in-hand" when the people reporting this are a) paid employees, and b) fans sufficiently motivated to go to an exposition for the company.

I'm not saying people are lying, but the unconscious bias is not exactly difficult to imagine. Consider also that similar statements were made about the Kings of War elves, which remain very, very polarizing.

BobtheInquisitor wrote:She is supposed to be an homage to the character from Tron 2 that didn't pay off, right? Or am I missing something?

I know a few guys in real life who will probably be happy to take her off my hands, so no biggie.

My assumption is that she is a (vague) reference to Quorra from Tron Legacy. That said, the character in Tron is a bit less stripperiffic (well, at least in the footwear department).

In any case, it seems rather poorly thought out to be wedded so tightly to a movie homage, especially when you have so very few female "characters".

Swap in one of those Bombshell babe characters, Buzzsaw

 RiTides wrote:
Swap in one of those Bombshell babe characters, Buzzsaw

Hehe! So true... knew there was a reason I invested in that.

A good woman is hard to find it seems!

 RiTides wrote:
Swap in one of those Bombshell babe characters, Buzzsaw

I think I'm going with Libby.


Or maybe Roller Girl from Reaper.

They both look athletic without being waif-like or comically fat. (I almost said "without being madonnas or whores." Why would a cruel double standard about women pop into my head in a Dreadball thread?)
I must be a real fat nerd.

EDIT: I have an idea! to deal with the skin suit

I just need to cut up one of my extra players and place the armor all around her. Then place her opposite the not-Prof X character, and the rest is obvious.

[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fg_cwI1Xj4M] "So, I see Wildcard charging me, and she's going for a super Slam, and I think, 'Oh really?' And her armour falls off. Instantly. And she's scrambling around to put it back on, but it's too late. I've seen everything.
"I've seen it all."[/url]