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If you've seen Jame's Cameron's Avatar, you probably know about the final battle when the RDA attempted to bomb the Well of Souls with Scorpians, Samsons, a Valkyrie( that massive white shuttle) and a Dragon(that huge gunship which looks like a cross between a baneblade and Tau manta). How would a Warhammer 40k version go about? I know many people are going to say exterminatus; but come on; the Ultramarines would never allow that to happen if they were involved(look how they treat their verdant worlds in the Ultramar system) in addition the Imperium would probably would not to lose all that unobtanium and a bunch of radical inquisitors would probably want to know how Eywa works.

But Imperium politics aside, how would the battle commence about? What aircraft would be used in the place of the aircraft the RDA used? I was thinking that they'd use Valkyries in place of Samsons, Vulture gunships in the place of Scorpions, what about the Dragon and Valkyrie(Avatar version), maybe perhaps a thunderhawk with Space Marine Chapter serfs serving as the loadmasters preparing to drop the bomb. Sentinels in the place of Amp suits; some weird ad mech machine in those place of those big yellow mining vehicles

what do you guys think? how would the battle go about with what vehicles

Ultramarines would be the Na'vi because they are just the right shade of blue. Also

I don't know how it would start, but I know how it would end:
"Spare us your pity, xenos scum. You gush about your connection with nature, your primal wisdom, but what has it brought you?

"Where are your marvels of engineering? Your voyages of discovery? Your great insight into the nature of the universe? Even at our basest, when we dressed as you do, dwelt as you do, hunted as you do, lived as you do, we did more than merely survive. We built wonders. We made great journeys. We forged epics. You have not.

"You speak so proudly of the plugs dangling from your skulls, little realizing that they are but strings and you puppets. What little you have accomplished you attribute to the wisdom of your goddess, who is nothing but the voices of your dead echoing for all eternity. She moors you to the past, serving as a leash that keeps you as little better than apes, sad parodies of civilization that lack that special spark to become something more.

"We have come to your world in search of resources. Whether your actions drive us back or we take what we want and move on, the outcome is the same. We will depart from your wretched planet, leaving you behind. And in a thousand years, you will not have changed from this contact with another world. You will remain in your trees, hunting your prey, communing with your goddess, until your sun burns out and your world dies.

"And above your tomb, the stars will belong to us..."

Am I the only one that really wanted to see drop pods coming down on those silly blue people at end?

Nope, you're not alone. That would actually probably have been better than the daisy cutter bomb they used because of the plasma sheath burning through the undergrowth. Honestly why they didn't just kill it with fire is beyond me.

Why they didn't send in the marines with flame throwers and carpet bombed it is beyond me.

But yes I agree Space Marines dropping down on the Navi Planet would be quite enjoyable

 yeri wrote:
Nope, you're not alone. That would actually probably have been better than the daisy cutter bomb they used because of the plasma sheath burning through the undergrowth. Honestly why they didn't just kill it with fire is beyond me.

That and I always wondered why they didn't just bombed them from orbit.

Well, in the movie the RDA was severely limited in terms of materiel. Possessing but a handful of men and rotorcraft, and a repurposed industrial spaceplane, their only option was a desperate all-out airstrike confiding the na'vi wouldn't have the means to stop it. Obviously they were wrong, but I can't blame them. Noone expects a race of primitive bluish cat folk to defend themselves with Hollywood magic, after all.

The Imperial Guard (much less the Space Marines, if they're involved) would normally not face such shortages, so they'd have different options at their disposal. Like shelling the na'vi tree from afar. Dropping a couple deathstrike cruise missiles in the general vicinity of the target would help, too. Or carpet-bombing it into oblivion with Marauders. Or drop-podding demo squads into weak spots. Or just nuking the entire site from orbit... you know the drill...

Of course, a similar scenario can be imagined. Think an unsanctioned Ordo Xenos op, acting with just a few PDFs, house guards or mercenaries at their disposal. In that case, I'd say an assortment of Vultures, Valks and Vendettas could be fine replacements for the Samsons/Scorpions. If the Imperium has large VTOLs like the Dragon in their stocks we actually don't know. As for the shuttle, it's another of those nasty gaps in the fluff. We jump from the minuscule Arvus, the tiny Aquila and the small Valkyrie to ginormous landing barges capable of carrying entire companies in their holds, leaving quite a gap of unknown medium to large landers in between. Also, civilian equipment like the RDA Valkyrie seldom gets represented in the tabletop, the Arvus (and, to some extent the Aquila) being the only exceptions. If you're interested in running this "Avatar" scenario for a campaign or in an RPG, just make up some rules for an unarmed "heavy duty shuttlecraft", use some toy or kitbash count-as, and call it a day

Now I think of it, you'd be better off using Space Marines. Maybe it's a lone company operating deep into enemy territory and cut away from their barge/strike cruiser. In such case, Stormtalons and Stormeagles/Stormravens might stand in for the gunships while a Thunderhawk plays the role of the Valkyrie. I don't see a Thunderhawk being used to ferry a jury-rigged bomb to the enemy, though (It packs weapons designed to take on capital ships after all), but there's nothing a timely malfunction or battle damage can't justify.

 Bobthehero wrote:
Am I the only one that really wanted to see drop pods coming down on those silly blue people at end?

Definitely not the only one! But I don't think space marines are the answer to the units question. It seems like the Imperial Guard (Catachans) fit the role of the invading forces (the humans or whatever) quite well, considering they have the manpower, as well as the vehicles. And for the Na'vi the Tau Kroot actually come pretty close despite not being blue and what not. They have the creature variety too. Obviously it's damn difficult to mimic all the species and vehicles but between these two races you can get pretty close.

I've actually thought about this myself. The Invaders space marines are the humans

The scorpion gunships are Storm Talons (come on, does nobody see the similarity?) They and a bunch of Land Speeder Tempests escort a thunderhawk towards a xenos idol. On the ground, Invaders on foot and their dreadnoughts are advancing. In the thunderhawk the invaders captain rubs his hands in delight as he prepares to crush the xenos.

Suddenly, the auspex picks up movement in the trees. The ground forces hold. Somethings coming, targets closing, range four hundred meters. As the ground forces prepare to engage, a flock of shadows falls across the Invaders airforce. Then...
BANG!
Something smashes into one of the Storm Talons. It drags it downwards and hurls it into a cliff.
Suddenly, everywhere, xenos fliers are dropping down on the space marines, hurling spears into canopies or flying directly into their engines in suicide attacks that send marine craft spinning out of control.
"Weapons free! Weapons free!" cries the space marine captain as a Storm Talon hurls into a cliff just outside his window and explodes.
On the ground, the enemy is in sight...
WAAAAAAAGH!!
Snakebite orks.
Atop their cyboars, thousands of tribesmen are shooting bows or blasting with primitive slug weapons. In the air, smoking sputtering rockets propel mad Snakebite stormboyz through the air or giant birds bear crews of the toughest nobs into battle.
After a long bloody fight on the ground, the space marines push back the orks. Things take a turn for the worse when a stampede of squiggoths explode from the jungle, trampling the space marine ground force. Though the war in the air was costly for the orks, the crushing weight of numbers wins. The thunderhawk is forced to the ground and Warboss Sully claims the captain's head. It is impaled on a spike in the ork's throne room, next to the head of a blue skinned alien girl and her human boyfriend.

It has to end with a dying Farseer pointing to the sky and saying "No... This planet is theirs".

 n0t_u wrote:
It has to end with a dying Farseer pointing to the sky and saying "No... This planet is theirs".

What you did there, I saw it.

There would be no battle as Tyranids already came thru and ate them after they ate the squats!...

Well the IG can elbow anyone else off the planet so im good

 Agent_Tremolo wrote:
Well, in the movie the RDA was severely limited in terms of materiel. Possessing but a handful of men and rotorcraft, and a repurposed industrial spaceplane, their only option was a desperate all-out airstrike confiding the na'vi wouldn't have the means to stop it. Obviously they were wrong, but I can't blame them. Noone expects a race of primitive bluish cat folk to defend themselves with Hollywood magic, after all.

The Imperial Guard (much less the Space Marines, if they're involved) would normally not face such shortages, so they'd have different options at their disposal. Like shelling the na'vi tree from afar. Dropping a couple deathstrike cruise missiles in the general vicinity of the target would help, too. Or carpet-bombing it into oblivion with Marauders. Or drop-podding demo squads into weak spots. Or just nuking the entire site from orbit... you know the drill...

Of course, a similar scenario can be imagined. Think an unsanctioned Ordo Xenos op, acting with just a few PDFs, house guards or mercenaries at their disposal. In that case, I'd say an assortment of Vultures, Valks and Vendettas could be fine replacements for the Samsons/Scorpions. If the Imperium has large VTOLs like the Dragon in their stocks we actually don't know. As for the shuttle, it's another of those nasty gaps in the fluff. We jump from the minuscule Arvus, the tiny Aquila and the small Valkyrie to ginormous landing barges capable of carrying entire companies in their holds, leaving quite a gap of unknown medium to large landers in between. Also, civilian equipment like the RDA Valkyrie seldom gets represented in the tabletop, the Arvus (and, to some extent the Aquila) being the only exceptions. If you're interested in running this "Avatar" scenario for a campaign or in an RPG, just make up some rules for an unarmed "heavy duty shuttlecraft", use some toy or kitbash count-as, and call it a day

Now I think of it, you'd be better off using Space Marines. Maybe it's a lone company operating deep into enemy territory and cut away from their barge/strike cruiser. In such case, Stormtalons and Stormeagles/Stormravens might stand in for the gunships while a Thunderhawk plays the role of the Valkyrie. I don't see a Thunderhawk being used to ferry a jury-rigged bomb to the enemy, though (It packs weapons designed to take on capital ships after all), but there's nothing a timely malfunction or battle damage can't justify.

I was thinking of a joint Operation between Space Marines and Imperial guard but good idea on the Ordo Xenos op, perhaps a Deathwatch thunderhawk as the Valkyrie and such(since their resources would be somewhat limited due to the Operation being unsanctioned. Also great idea for the guard b/c I can definitely imagine retired/defunct regiments being called in as Mercenaries.

Alternatively, I can see a Stormraven with Chapterhouse studios true scale conversion kit being used for the same purpose

The closest approximation of this battle that could be made would be between a Space Marine or IG flyer based force and an Exodite Eldar force. They have a world-spirit, they have "dragons", they can teleport said dragons and dragon riders from across the entire planet to protect a single node. They have a verdant and hard world filled with carnosaurs and other dangerous wildlife. The biggest difference I imagine is that exodites are not entirely low-tech, but rather have fairly complex and powerful lance weaponry that they carry or mount on their carnosaurs and "dragons".

Valkyries with rocket pods and a bunch of Kroot. The Kroot/Na'vi have no means of actually shooting them down and lose. Also there are Sentinels but they have giant combat knives, which is pretty darn cool.

One word: Swordwind.

IG and grey knights vs tau and eldar seems the most appropriate to capture the feeling of it.

I imagien they would just have the Imperial Navy bomb it to oblivion with a fligth of Marauders, then follow up with a large scale assult by several regiments of IG or a designated killteam from the Ordo Xeno.

That T.L;DR quote from Yeri was actually pretty epic, and accurate.

The final battle closely resembles a Dark Eldar raid on an Exodite World in Path of the Renegade. The Exodites summon the creatures of the world which swarm the DE aerial fleet.

In any regard, Imperium wouldn't have tried the initial diplomatic/soft power option so things would have gone quite differently.

I'll just leave this here

Here is what would happen, IF the imperium lost.
They would come back with even bigger guns

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Here is what would happen, IF the imperium lost.
They would come back with even bigger guns

That's what happened in real life too.

Which i why avatar doesnt work for me.
I mean, Firebombing that planet, in which it can still be mined, is what is going to happen.

The security forces commander summed it up like this.



http://1d4chan.org/images/e/ea/HFY_Avatar.png

Kroot devour the navi for trying to knock them off the 40k nature race mantle.

There was actually a short story from "let the galaxy burn" that was very similar to this situation cept the natives had squiggoth sized beasts that beat up even titans.

Suffice it to say that the imperium just couldn't let that get away from them forever.

So guard are sent in first, guard get slaughtered. Ghosts of Tanith show up and slaughter the entire alien species