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Has anyone else found that it is insanely easy for about 7 or more normal sized models charging a Rhino full of men to surround it and glance it to death Killing the Occupants.
I have done this about 10 times now with grey hunters to plague marines, sterngaurd or, tacticals. In the old edition I only ever did this once and that was with 13 jump packing men and a very very lucky melta shot.
But what are peoples view on this tactic has it happened to you much, and with bikes hitting the field in numbers thanks to chaos, its going to be super easy to quickly surround transports and glance so long as they have Av10 on the rear.
But seriosuly have people encoutered this yet, and if you have how do you deal with it.

I'm pretty sure that they can just get out 6" away from the tank. Emergency disembarkation, I don't have my brb or I would look it up.

As long as you can surround the entire vehicle, then emergency dissembark doesn't apply.

I've not used this tactic yet, but was thinking the same.
How to kill off an Ork horde, before it can pile out of a Trukk.
It is one reason I do like my Eldar transports. They're huge, compared to most transports, and harder to surround.

Edit:
Emergency is 3" from any point, I think.
They've still got to have a gap of at least 1" from all enemy models.

But agaisnt a Rhinoe sized transport 6 guys can completely surround it fairly easily, and honestly just imagine bikes who could turn side ways, this tactic in my opinion is a game changer especially agaisnt such armies that realy on elites troops like plague marines, the ability to kill a whole unit in a snap is just awsome.

I highly doubt 6 dudes could surround a rhino like that. However, this is not a new tactic, its been around since I started playing. It is horrible to have happen to you, but hilarious if you do it.

Maybe best way to pull this one off would be large warrior squad out of a scythe for easy delivery. All that gauss, up to a 15 man squad can pile out of the thing....probably the best way to do it, based on super mobility, super glancing, and large squad size.

This is why I do not take the catacomb command barge as much. Telefrag death = sad face

It is a good tatic to be wary of. Even if they do disembark through a gab they can't assault you as the vehcile (Rhino in this case) is not an assault vechile. Does not appile to open topped.

Shhhhhhhh, someone delete this thread plase, my Necron Warriors would like to keep that tactic to themselves

6 25mm bases will not surround a rhino. In 5th, assaulting the back and side with, let's say genestealers, would block access points and possibly glance/pen to death the rhino and the embarked squad, in 6th, not so much. It would take about a dozen to block any egress from a wrecked rhino, because emergency disembarkation is a 6" halo around the vehicle, not just the access points.

Can the Emergency Disembark go through enemy models, as long as they end up 1" away?

Nope. It would be like moving through an enemy unit.

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
6 25mm bases will not surround a rhino. In 5th, assaulting the back and side with, let's say genestealers, would block access points and possibly glance/pen to death the rhino and the embarked squad, in 6th, not so much. It would take about a dozen to block any egress from a wrecked rhino, because emergency disembarkation is a 6" halo around the vehicle, not just the access points.

Not true. 6 25mm bases with proper spacing will be able stop emergency disembark completely. Rhino is 4.5" long and 3" wide and each model blocks 3" diameter space. So Rhino circumference is 15" and those 5 models can block slightly less than 18" of circumference.

You've seem to how misunderstood how emergency disembark works: You don't just place the models in the 6" circle around the model.
Instead, it works same way as normal disembark: choose a model, place it in contact with hull (AP in case of normal disembark) and more than 1" away from any enemy models. Then, you're allowed to make normal move, but must end their move wholly within 6" vehicle (AP in case of normal disembark), which drops to 3" in case of Wrecked result.

It's a dumb bit of rules-lawyering (a bit like surrounding the perimeter of the board with Kroot to prevent the enemy from bringing any models on from Reserves) that assumes the enemy is dumb enough to load an expensive unit into a Rhino and then sit it close enough to your lines that you can get troops surrounding it anyway. It's a rare enough situation that you're pretty much never going to see it happen on the tabletop anyway.

Night scythe full of warriors: dead transport full of whatever.

They don't need to be close enough, they need to be on the board period.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
It's a dumb bit of rules-lawyering (a bit like surrounding the perimeter of the board with Kroot to prevent the enemy from bringing any models on from Reserves) that assumes the enemy is dumb enough to load an expensive unit into a Rhino and then sit it close enough to your lines that you can get troops surrounding it anyway. It's a rare enough situation that you're pretty much never going to see it happen on the tabletop anyway.

It's not stretching the rules at all, its using the rules to full advantage, and unlike s in most other cases, what happens is very black and white.
Plus it happens more often then you think.

Not true. 6 25mm bases with proper spacing will be able stop emergency disembark completely. Rhino is 4.5" long and 3" wide and each model blocks 3" diameter space. So Rhino circumference is 15" and those 5 models can block slightly less than 18" of circumference.

There's an issue with your way of thinking there ... You have to be pretty close to the Rhino to do so as it takes a whole lot of movement allowance to go around and it the other extremity of the metal coffin
It can be done, but it ain't easy, and if the opponent let you get close enough to a fully-packed rhino, then he got what he deserved

TanKoL wrote:

Not true. 6 25mm bases with proper spacing will be able stop emergency disembark completely. Rhino is 4.5" long and 3" wide and each model blocks 3" diameter space. So Rhino circumference is 15" and those 5 models can block slightly less than 18" of circumference.

There's an issue with your way of thinking there ... You have to be pretty close to the Rhino to do so as it takes a whole lot of movement allowance to go around and it the other extremity of the metal coffin
It can be done, but it ain't easy, and if the opponent let you get close enough to a fully-packed rhino, then he got what he deserved

Surround with 1 unit, shoot with another.

Someone said scarabs? Large bases, high movement. Trololol.

It doesn't even take that much movement to go around it.
Assuming half the models could make contact with one side, the worst case for the extra movement required to completely encircle Rhino is just 8.5". Jump infantry who use Jump Packs while charging can drop it easily to 4-5.5".

Realistically,you're generally talking about 6-7" of extra movement required. Against normal troops, you should keep the Rhino at least 6", preferable 8"+ away from enemy units if you want be 100% sure this doesn't happen. Against JI/beasts/Cavalry, we're talking about 14" or so. Add 2-3 inches if enemy has Fleet.

Of course, all this calculations assume there's nothing blocking the way around Rhino. But on other hand, those can also stop you from disembarking...

My point really was that crafty opponent can easily surprise you (not you specifically, but "you") with these kind of tactics, unless you have taken them into account.

Ir is going to be an advantage of assault marines, scarabs and the like. Fast move to get into position and then execute the charge to surround the vehicle.

That said, it should happen to 5th ed players once or twice and then they should learn to slow down their advance just a little bit to avoid dying to being overly aggressive.

Yet another change to assaults in 6th edition.

Luide wrote:

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
6 25mm bases will not surround a rhino. In 5th, assaulting the back and side with, let's say genestealers, would block access points and possibly glance/pen to death the rhino and the embarked squad, in 6th, not so much. It would take about a dozen to block any egress from a wrecked rhino, because emergency disembarkation is a 6" halo around the vehicle, not just the access points.

Not true. 6 25mm bases with proper spacing will be able stop emergency disembark completely. Rhino is 4.5" long and 3" wide and each model blocks 3" diameter space. So Rhino circumference is 15" and those 5 models can block slightly less than 18" of circumference.

You've seem to how misunderstood how emergency disembark works: You don't just place the models in the 6" circle around the model.
Instead, it works same way as normal disembark: choose a model, place it in contact with hull (AP in case of normal disembark) and more than 1" away from any enemy models. Then, you're allowed to make normal move, but must end their move wholly within 6" vehicle (AP in case of normal disembark), which drops to 3" in case of Wrecked result.

Emergency disembark gives permission to exit the vehicle in base contact with any point on the hull, even if within 1" of an enemy. At least that's my reading of "If any models cannot disembark, because of enemies..." The emergency disembark then allows them to move up to 6" with the normal restrictions, but can't do anything else for the turn. If the disembark is caused from a Wreck, the range is limited to 3". Forcing the destruction of the transported squad would be quite difficult without a lot of attacking models, imo.

Snapshot wrote:
Emergency disembark gives permission to exit the vehicle in base contact with any point on the hull, even if within 1" of an enemy. At least that's my reading of "If any models cannot disembark, because of enemies..."

It doesn't. What that sentence means, is that if enemy blocks your vehicles Access Points, you may still emergency disembark (staying at least 1" away from enemy models). Exactly as the picture on page 79 shows, where Eldar Guardians have blocked the rear access point of Chimera and the guardsmen are based on contact with hull, then moved. (Note that you should technically place one, move it and repeat).

The "Models cannot move within 1" of enemy model" is rule that you can break only if you have explicit permission, like for charging.

Luide wrote:

Snapshot wrote:
Emergency disembark gives permission to exit the vehicle in base contact with any point on the hull, even if within 1" of an enemy. At least that's my reading of "If any models cannot disembark, because of enemies..."

It doesn't. What that sentence means, is that if enemy blocks your vehicles Access Points, you may still emergency disembark (staying at least 1" away from enemy models). Exactly as the picture on page 79 shows, where Eldar Guardians have blocked the rear access point of Chimera and the guardsmen are based on contact with hull, then moved. (Note that you should technically place one, move it and repeat).

The "Models cannot move within 1" of enemy model" is rule that you can break only if you have explicit permission, like for charging.

Re-reading, I think you're right. Thanks.

I have never encountered this, but I'm glad you pointed this out to me before it happened!

Use massive squad of reaver bikes?... The one list ive seen play runs 27 total lol and with turbo boosting 36inch could be pulled off relativly quick/easy for the no disembark, and 1 in 3 can have anti tank weapon so its feasible.

Also, large groups of hellions? lol Since baron makes them troops. (6 squads of 20)

Squads of Haywyches work best for this.

But you'd better be damn sure you can completely surround the vehicle before you pull it off.

Otherwise they will pile out, they will pass their pinning test, and they will shoot that squad of Wyches to death end of story.

But yeah, I try to pull this off whenever I can without leaving my ass hanging out in the wind should I fail. Two squads of 5 wyches coming from opposite sides works exceptionally well.

It's a handy tactic but it went horribly wrong in 5th when I tried it against a monolith. It had some stupid rule about you not been allowed to block the portal. My unit got mauled

I'm a noobie to this matter and would like a full explanation as to how this tactic works? Thanks

Gargoyles have always been good at this. even in 5th edition when you placed units in the "crater" it was limited to how far they could be before they where 1" away.

Redacted

 Brometheus wrote:
"Disembark" is different than "moving through enemy units".

Not so much.

 Brometheus wrote:
"Disembark" is different than "moving through enemy units".

No it isn't. If you read the rules, to disembark you place all the models in base contact with an access point and then move like a normal move; this disallows them from moving through or within an inch of enemy models.

The taticis harder to do, as you need to cover the whole tank now rather than just the doors, but it still works.