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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/18 23:27:17
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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Well, me and my friend just came up with the idea for Chaos Vehicle Marks, and would like to know what to community thought of them.
Mark of Tzeentch: Would stay the same, +1 to an invun roll (Daemon on Heldrakes etc) +15pts
Mark of Nurgel: It will not die. +15pts
Mark of Slaanesh: +3" to movement. +10pts
Mark of Khorne: (transports only) Gives the Assault Transport special rule. +15pts
What do people think?
I would appreciate feedback, we might actually try them in a friendly game
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Experience is something you get just after you need it
The Narkos Dynasty - 15k
Iron Hands - 12k
The Shadewatch - 3k
Cadmus Outriders - 4k
Alpha Legion Raiders - 3k |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/19 00:29:10
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Fireknife Shas'el
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I think the Tzentch one should cost a bit more. The ability to give the Heldrake a 4+ invul save might be a bit much for 15.
Love the idea though.
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I'm expecting an Imperial Knights supplement dedicated to GW's loyalist apologetics. Codex: White Knights "In the grim dark future, everything is fine."
"The argument is that we have to do this or we will, bit by bit,
lose everything that we hold dear, everything that keeps the business going. Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky."
-Tom Kirby |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/19 01:26:58
Subject: Re:Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Maniacal Gibbering Madboy
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I like these. Just thinking all the prices should be increased by 10-15 points. Giving a vehicle an extra 3" movement is too good for 10 points.
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2000 points
4 Wins/ 5 Draws/ 2 Losses
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/19 02:13:00
Subject: Re:Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
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Big Mek Grodclog Mekgrim wrote:I like these. Just thinking all the prices should be increased by 10-15 points. Giving a vehicle an extra 3" movement is too good for 10 points.
Going off the Orks' ability to give a vehicle +1" move for 5pts it should be 15pts. Or 10pts for +d3". Something like that.
Awesome idea, though as has been said they're a tad underpriced.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/19 02:22:53
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Fireknife Shas'el
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The Maulerfiend can't get the mark of slaneesh. That'd make it insanly fast.
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I'm expecting an Imperial Knights supplement dedicated to GW's loyalist apologetics. Codex: White Knights "In the grim dark future, everything is fine."
"The argument is that we have to do this or we will, bit by bit,
lose everything that we hold dear, everything that keeps the business going. Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky."
-Tom Kirby |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/19 04:02:57
Subject: Re:Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Bane Lord Tartar Sauce
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All the marks are overcosted if they are available to all options in the codex at that price, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that all the Daemon Engines already had IWND, making the Mark of Nurgle useless on them. The big issues with the Marks of Nurgle and Tzeentch could be fixed by not allowing Daemon Engines to take marks (as whatever the nature of the daemon and which god it serves is overridden by the fact that it is bound into a physical shell) or by having variable costs for marks depending on what is taking it (ie, Daemon Engines get the Mark of Tzeentch for at least 25 points, maybe even 30 or 35 for the Helldrake since it is already hard to hit), however the Mark of Khrone needs to be either much more expensive or completely reworked.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/19 16:43:36
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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Thanks for the feedback guys.
Ill have a word with my mate, see if he can come up with anything else Automatically Appended Next Post: Mark of Tzeentch: Would stay the same, +1 to an invun roll. +15pts. +25pts on daemon engines (Heldrakes, Helbrutes, Forge/Maulerfiends)
Mark of Nurgel: It will not die. +15pts (unavailable to daemon engines)
Mark of Slaanesh: +D3" to movement (roll at start of movement, counts as moving the one below*). +10pts (+ 25pts on Maulerfiend)
Mark of Khorne: (transports only) Gives the Assault Transport special rule. +35pts
*it counts as moving at closest normal speed, eg 9" counts as 6"
Hows it now?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/11/19 17:11:47
Experience is something you get just after you need it
The Narkos Dynasty - 15k
Iron Hands - 12k
The Shadewatch - 3k
Cadmus Outriders - 4k
Alpha Legion Raiders - 3k |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/19 18:03:44
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Warp-Screaming Noise Marine
Canada!
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yeah 15 points is really worth it for +6 and the difference between +5 and +4 on 3 HP is totally worth 25 points.
You can try limiting when the khorne one gets to be an assault vehicle or give it a downside when it's played that way to keep it from a billion dollars.
Chaos vehicles aren't amazing already. Have you seen how mediocre the chaos vehicles tend to be. Like the dreadnaughts and the fiends only get 2 attacks base. The landraider is so meh for it's cost and that goes same for just about everything but the rhinos and the drakes only one of which is unique.
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It's just a show, I should really just relax... It's just a show, I should really just relax... It's just a show, I should really just relax... It's just a show, I should really just relax... |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 14:30:07
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Daemonic Dreadnought
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They need to made a bit more generic so they can be applied to all vehicles, not just some. How about...... Nurgle - x points +1 to Front and side armour facings (to a maximum of 14) Tzeentch - x points Bolters, Combi Bolters, Heavy Bolters have Inferno Bolts OR The vehicle counts as having a 4+ Cover/Invul Save Khorne - x points Walkers gain the Rage and Fleet special rules Tanks and Skimmers count as Open Topped Slaanesh - x points Warp Amp - any enemy units assaulting the vehicle are bombarded by dischordant cacophony from the vehciles warp tained interior. The unit must pass a toughness test in order to complete their charge. I leave the points arguement to others as i am rubbish at working them out. My first guess was abotu 30 points each. I have also got some rules (and a model) for a Chaos Land Raider variant. Essentially it's a Crusader but with a Hades Autocannon up front and TL heavy Bolter Sponsons.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/11/20 14:37:41
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 14:38:43
Subject: Re:Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot
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What about this:
Khorne: Assault Vehicle, +2 to Deny the Witch rolls
Tzeentch: 6+ invu or +1 invu
Nurgle: +1 HP
Slaanesh: Stealth, Night Vision, Fear
All of them for +15 points each. Transport with a mark cannot transport a unit with a different mark. Dedicated transports can only take the same mark as their units.
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My armies:
14000 points |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 14:49:06
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Sneaky Lictor
Wherever they tell me
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I think that they need to be more generic as well, but this is the way I'd go about it.
Tzeentch
+1 to Invul save, 5+ if no save previously.
10 points per hull point
Slaanesh
+3" movement when moving flat out, Walkers gain fleet
5 points per hull point
Khorne
Transports become assault vehicles, Tank shocks inflict D6 S (front armor -6) AP - hits, Walkers gain rage.
5 points per hull point
Nurgle
Before any blows are struck, all enemy models in base contact in the assault phase are wounded on a 4+ with armor saves allowed.
5 points per hull point
The points obviously need to be balanced, but these are my 2 cents.
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Tyranids 10000 points
Orks 3500 points
Raven Guard 3000 points
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 15:40:15
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Killer Klaivex
Oceanside, CA
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I'd keep them pretty tame, to add flavor.
Tzeench: Warp Flames, the vehicle can overwatch doing 1D6 S4 AP5 hits. Other weapons cannot overwatch unless normally allowed to do so (walkers).
Slaanesh: Warp Amplifiers: Unit assaulting (that loses combat) or being tank shocked tests at -1 leadership.
Khorne: Extra Spiky: When tank shocking/ramming, does D6 hits, at current hullpoints x2 for strength.
Nurgle: Nurglings, in any assault, does D6 hits Init1 fleshbane 4+, AP-.
I'd rate these upgrades in the 10-15 point range.
I liked the idea of open-topped rhinos of khorne, but assault rhinos is a pretty big change.
Oh, and of course, if you're adding vehicle marks, I'd say that marked units with dedicated transports must buy a matching mark for their transport.
-Matt
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 16:02:59
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Daemonic Dreadnought
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Well yeah. the reason i sadi open-topped instead of assault is so there is a down-sdie (easier to take out with the +1 on the damage table)
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 19:18:26
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Regular Dakkanaut
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this would be awesome... CSM have a horrible time with assault now because of the 6th Ed rules and disembarkment. With only 1 assault vehicle available at over 200pts it a bit harsh.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 20:39:03
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Proud Triarch Praetorian
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Ok, so how is this?
Mark of Tzeentch: 20pts. Vehicle has 4+ invun.
Mark of Nurgle: 20pts. +1 to all armour facings, to a max of 14.
Mark of Slaanesh: +15pts. +D3" to movement, roll at start of movement phase.
Mark of Khorne: +35pts. +D6 to strength of any ram or tank shock. Transports count as assault transports.
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Experience is something you get just after you need it
The Narkos Dynasty - 15k
Iron Hands - 12k
The Shadewatch - 3k
Cadmus Outriders - 4k
Alpha Legion Raiders - 3k |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/20 22:46:14
Subject: Re:Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Nigel Stillman
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Don't worry about Points, worry about the actual designs. Note how Marks cost different points for different models, the same should go for these marks. Make Mark of Khorne: This vehicle gains the Assault Vehicle special rule. Any models assaulting from this vehicle count as making a Disordered Charge. (This balances it out a little bit and makes it less expensive.)
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/11/20 22:46:26
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/21 10:11:33
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Daemonic Dreadnought
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decoste007xt wrote:this would be awesome... CSM have a horrible time with assault now because of the 6th Ed rules and disembarkment. With only 1 assault vehicle available at over 200pts it a bit harsh.
Playing Devils Advocate......what assault options to loyalist SMs have other than Land Raiders/Storm Ravens? I suppose there's the Land Speeder Storm
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/21 14:45:09
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Nigel Stillman
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Praxiss wrote:decoste007xt wrote:this would be awesome... CSM have a horrible time with assault now because of the 6th Ed rules and disembarkment. With only 1 assault vehicle available at over 200pts it a bit harsh. Playing Devils Advocate......what assault options to loyalist SMs have other than Land Raiders/Storm Ravens? I suppose there's the Land Speeder Storm Too bad we're talking about CHAOS Space Marines or you'd have a point. They're supposed to be different from loyalist Space Marines. You may as well ask why Chaos Space Marines have access to more walker variants than Space Marines too. They're different armies.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/11/21 14:49:32
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/21 22:46:28
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Stone Bonkers Fabricator General
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Vladsimpaler wrote: Praxiss wrote:decoste007xt wrote:this would be awesome... CSM have a horrible time with assault now because of the 6th Ed rules and disembarkment. With only 1 assault vehicle available at over 200pts it a bit harsh.
Playing Devils Advocate......what assault options to loyalist SMs have other than Land Raiders/Storm Ravens? I suppose there's the Land Speeder Storm
Too bad we're talking about CHAOS Space Marines or you'd have a point. They're supposed to be different from loyalist Space Marines.
You may as well ask why Chaos Space Marines have access to more walker variants than Space Marines too. They're different armies.
yes, but CSM are supposed to be a more assault oriented army with 5 units that have no shooting weapon at all, but then they only have 1 assault vehicle. C: SM are supposed to be a more shooty army and they have 4 assault vehicles.
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Dark Mechanicus and Renegade Iron Hand Dakka Blog
My Dark Mechanicus P&M Blog. Mostly Modeling as I paint very slowly. Lots of kitbashed conversions of marines and a few guard to make up a renegade Iron Hand chapter and Dark Mechanicus Allies. Bionics++ |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/21 23:07:54
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Nigel Stillman
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Exergy wrote: Vladsimpaler wrote: Praxiss wrote:decoste007xt wrote:this would be awesome... CSM have a horrible time with assault now because of the 6th Ed rules and disembarkment. With only 1 assault vehicle available at over 200pts it a bit harsh.
Playing Devils Advocate......what assault options to loyalist SMs have other than Land Raiders/Storm Ravens? I suppose there's the Land Speeder Storm
Too bad we're talking about CHAOS Space Marines or you'd have a point. They're supposed to be different from loyalist Space Marines.
You may as well ask why Chaos Space Marines have access to more walker variants than Space Marines too. They're different armies.
yes, but CSM are supposed to be a more assault oriented army with 5 units that have no shooting weapon at all, but then they only have 1 assault vehicle. C: SM are supposed to be a more shooty army and they have 4 assault vehicles.
Ask yourself; is that good game design or is it a mistake? Assault is already punished enough in 6th as is, I seriously doubt that a 50 point assault Rhino for Khorne Berzerkers (which are already overpriced) is going to annihilate game balance.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/22 14:30:54
Subject: Chaos Vehicle Marks
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Fireknife Shas'el
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I did wonder why they made so many CSM units assualt heavy, but no way to assualt.
Like Mutilators and Warp talons that are supposed to deepstrike, wait an entire enemy turn, then maybe assualt.
I think the price justifies it's ability. For a rhino, it's a pricey upgrade that makes it extremely useful for one squad, but also makes it a big and vulnerable target.
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I'm expecting an Imperial Knights supplement dedicated to GW's loyalist apologetics. Codex: White Knights "In the grim dark future, everything is fine."
"The argument is that we have to do this or we will, bit by bit,
lose everything that we hold dear, everything that keeps the business going. Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky."
-Tom Kirby |
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