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I don't understand the people who rather play against an army that that splashed with random paint than any painted army.
In my opinion those armies are more a pain to the eye than unpainted ones.

I always scare the new kids by saying that unpainted models will always fail their saves/shooting/other stuff. After all blue paint makes 'em lucky.

One time I was playing against this kid who had terminators unpainted. I said to him "Those terminators are extra unlucky and propably will fail" He just scoffed at my comment. Turn 2 those termies deepstrike infront of my csm, shoot and kill nothing. In my turn I attack them 5 man csm squad with a sorcerer and a flamer. Lets just say there was nothing to assault.

I resent the insinuation that I have not painted my army because I'm lazy. I have not painted my army because I'm deluded, meticulous, egotistical, have the artistic abilities of a slightly rotten carrot, AND am lazy.

 Kaldor wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
People have their own time commitments. Making a rule that disadvantages them because they don't conform to your idea of hobby time is extremely disrespectful.

I have to say, I don't think painting falls under some elitist idea of 'hobby time'. I think painting models falls under the most basic and generic definition of the wargaming hobby. I just don't understand why someone would choose a hobby that involves painting, if they don't like painting.

Because it's wargaming. He enjoys putting his army on the table for a few hours and being social. He would rather do that with any free time he can dedicate to the game than sit at a table being unsocial painting. People enjoy the hobby for different reasons - no one is more right than anyone else. You enjoy what you enjoy. If he had the time to paint, he would (and he used to). He simply doesn't get that time anymore, so he doesn't.

Incidentally, he has asked me about ways to paint quickly. I did mention to him the prime/touch up/dip or wash method, and he was super keen to give it a try. Then Army Painter discontinued the colour primer he wanted to use (their dark blue spray). While he is occasionally looking for other ways, his only chance to get it done is the quick and dirty method, which he has no qualms doing. He just doesn't even find the time to do that.

The OP mentioned he works 60 hour weeks. So does my friend. On top of having 3 kids and a wife and all the responsibilities that come with having a family. Hobby time isn't easy to come by for some, and for some, like him, having a fun game is more important than making some plastic soldiers look pretty.

 Peregrine wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
He also works nights, has 3 kids and is married.

So he has time to play and time to assemble his models, but not enough time to spend an hour or two doing a basic paint job on the entire army? Maybe he should just give up a single game of 40k and spend that time painting everything so he never has to paint again.

I am guessing you are single? Or have no kids?

At my current pace it will take me a year to finish my army, if I lucky.
A rule like this would effectively punish me for being disabled in a hobby and game I enjoy.
Even when I do get the chance to paint I may not desire to paint a 40k army, which can often have 30+ of the same model in it.
And how could you enforce such a rule agenst new players, who often get pushed to purchase more models than they can paint quickly by this very community.
In this you have large army's for a standard games often, I just can't see anyone being able to enforce it without cutting there longer players from the new players.

I'm a wargamer who likes the challenge of a game, loves the background, and uses the hobby as one of my main social activities. I also don't like painting - I'm really slow and very bad at it, and it's disheartening and demotivating to spend so much time on doing something when the results are so mediocre at best - especially when those with fully painted armies are also excellent painters. There's always been a feeling along the lines of "I can leave my models unpainted and look rubbish compared to them, or I can spend ages painting my models... and still look rubbish compared to them."

I know this is a weakness I have, and so with my new army I'm forcing myself to spend the time to get each unit painted to a basic tabletop standard before I start on the next.

The best way I've found to get stuff painted to a basic level is to get your friends to help. They will appreciate playing against a painted army as much as you will appreciate having on. Therefore buy them pizza, supply a decent DVD, and get 4-6 people round for an evening's production line painting. Your painted model count will go up like anything...

Forterix wrote:
I resent the insinuation that I have not painted my army because I'm lazy. I have not painted my army because I'm deluded, meticulous, egotistical, have the artistic abilities of a slightly rotten carrot, AND am lazy.

- best thing I've read all day

And on topic -

I voted for.

Just because I prefer to see armies painted on the table. It beats seeing things like a 4 way battle, with grey knights, space wolves, dark eldar and blood angels with nothing painted. Then when squads die, they were just scooped up and dropped into a 'dead pile'. I know they are well within their rights to do this but I just felt disappointed that they didn't show the same care and attention most of the people I regularly play against do (and also it seemed they'd all gone for the 'latest kill everything army' this was during 5th ed)

The other good use for painting mini's is to stop theft/arguments - If someone tried to walk off with any of my eldar I'd immediately know. Because I don't think anyone else has used Warlock Purple and Skull White as the base for an eldar army. Hearing two kids each trying to claim in GW that it's "My (completely unpainted/damaged) Abaddon" was a little depressing.

I'm not fussed about extra rules gamewise and I'd still play against unpainted armies, but I'd love there to be an incentive for everyone to have everything painted all the time. But then, I'd also quite like world peace, which judging by the 2 sides in the thread is possibly more likely

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
He also works nights, has 3 kids and is married.

So he has time to play and time to assemble his models, but not enough time to spend an hour or two doing a basic paint job on the entire army? Maybe he should just give up a single game of 40k and spend that time painting everything so he never has to paint again.

I am guessing you are single? Or have no kids?

Kids, I wouldn't know. But if you are struggling to find your own time when you've got a girlfriend you need to man up. If i had to spend every minute of my non working life with a woman I'd go insane.

 Glorioski wrote:

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:
He also works nights, has 3 kids and is married.

So he has time to play and time to assemble his models, but not enough time to spend an hour or two doing a basic paint job on the entire army? Maybe he should just give up a single game of 40k and spend that time painting everything so he never has to paint again.

I am guessing you are single? Or have no kids?

Kids, I wouldn't know. But if you are struggling to find your own time when you've got a girlfriend you need to man up. If i had to spend every minute of my non working life with a woman I'd go insane.

Lol based on that statement I know you aren't married. And if that's your attitude then you probably never will be.

Ever heard the saying "Happy wife, happy life?"

I'm just saying if "manning up" and painting my army means I'm sleeping on the couch for a while then I'll be more than happy with my grey plastic minis.

I cheat - I get my wife to paint

Solves all the problems. That and she's better at it than I am.

CrowSplat wrote:
Ever heard the saying "Happy wife, happy life?"

wife..happy life?

I'm all for promoting the hobby and using painted models as much as possible, but I wouldn't play in a club/store/tournament that has this rule, and I have enough painted stuff to never field unpainted models.

 Glorioski wrote:
It is interesting how many people are seeing this as a penalty/punishment for unpainted armies rather than a reward for painted ones.

It is both of these things at the same time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Peregrine wrote:

 curran12 wrote:
Honestly, you keep putting your personal experience as "fact of the world that is irrefutable." My personal experience is different, I play with folks big into fluff, and we are back into this circular argument. You are not the world. Your personal experience is not the world.

Sure, and in that situation refusing to spend even a small amount of time coming up with some basic fluff would be disrespectful and I would have no problem with imposing a penalty on no-fluff armies.

. This game is different things to different people and expecting all of the other players to look at the game with your priorities is disrespectful and completely unrealistic. For me, the Fluff is completely irrelevant, it is in a very distant third place compared to painting and actual gameplay (IMO the most fun part of the hobby). My main army is fully painted, but mostly because I bring it to tournaments and I want to get a full paint score. I would have painted it eventually anyway, but the tournaments were the spur that got me to complete it. I have no problems playing against people that have unpainted (or even not fully assembled) units. It just doesn't bother me at all as long as I can determine what is what when the game starts. I might prefer playing fully painted armies, and I do enjoy getting compliments for mine and giving the same for other armies that I see, but for me it all comes down to rolling the dice on the table.

 Fafnir wrote:

SBG wrote:
It's easy to do given enough time.

That's a luxury I'd love to have. I really would. I haven't had a chance to paint in months. I'm sure there are plenty of people out there in a similar boat.

QFT

I do have a painted 40k Army that comes in at around 3000 pts painted

However most of my fantasy is unpainted (You try painting over 300 tiny rats with details).

Painting is a choice I have a friend who is a VP in a spin-off company from a large government contractor. He has 3 huge armies and he has most of his models assembled but to be hinest he doesn't even have as much time as i do to paint ( I get 2-3 models done a week.)

People should nvere be penalized for enjoying the hobby. Now if it has been approximately 3 months and you know they have plenty time then there is no excuse for not having started.

Also I feel Most tournaments using painting as a way to keep people from just building an army and hopping from codex to codex with out effort.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Eldarain wrote:
I'd be fine with it amongst a group of friends trying to motivate each other to get everything painted.

I'd be opposed to it as a set rule at a store or club. I think new players should be able to begin painting at their own pace. It can be incredibly daunting to attack these expensive kits with an unskilled hand.

GOod points this explains how i feel concisely.

Wait Wait Wait. I have maybe 3 hours of free time each evening and I should get punished because I dont spend every moment of that painting?

I have 3 armies with about 2000 points in each. They are getting done slowly but I'm not going to rush them just so they're done.

I'm sorry but this is a silly idea, it wouldn't work. New players wouldn't want to play because they'd be at such a disadvantage (Even more than usual) and people without the time or interest to paint would just stop the hobby altogether, it would kill GW.

i voted against cause frankly i can see why people wouldnt want to paint all there models or any.
i dont spend every night painting but in about 2 weeks (4 days of actual painting) i only have 21 ork boyz ready and compared to most people they look awfull, its frankly daunting to keep going at it because i would like a green tide so badly, just the thaught of having to paint 100+ models is just well discouraging, i will paint them all.
anyhow what im trying to say is dont punish people for an unpainted army as far as im aware it doesnt state in the rulebook that your army has to painted to enjoy the game.
tourneys might have rules on that but other then that let the people enjoy the game

 Reeeen wrote:
Wait Wait Wait. I have maybe 3 hours of free time each evening and I should get punished because I dont spend every moment of that painting?

I have 3 armies with about 2000 points in each. They are getting done slowly but I'm not going to rush them just so they're done.

I'm sorry but this is a silly idea, it wouldn't work. New players wouldn't want to play because they'd be at such a disadvantage (Even more than usual) and people without the time or interest to paint would just stop the hobby altogether, it would kill GW.

I think you are taking the OP's discussion off track. He's not saying you need to spend all your spare time painting, he's just saying you spend too much time doing other things....

Seriously, the OP may want to get out of the basement, have a drink, and get laid. Proposed a rule like this is ridiculously elitist, not to mention asinine and divisive. There are some of us who enjoy this hobby that have time issues, like two jobs, kids, significant others, etc. Not all of us have the advantage of living in our parents' basements, not having a job, and having alk the time in the world to have Golden Demon-ready armies for playing.

Seriously, if you voted anything but against on this, you really need a life.

Some people just like to see two fully painted armies face off.
2 wweeks ago, a guy came in and asked me right off the bat to play?
Why? Because im one of the few who has an entirely painted army there and he thought it would look great and cinematic.
Looking at a table of fully painted models is great. I put time into every model i paint so i can have that impressive look on the table.
It just sucks that no one else feels that way sometimes.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Some people just like to see two fully painted armies face off.
2 wweeks ago, a guy came in and asked me right off the bat to play?
Why? Because im one of the few who has an entirely painted army there and he thought it would look great and cinematic.
Looking at a table of fully painted models is great. I put time into every model i paint so i can have that impressive look on the table.
It just sucks that no one else feels that way sometimes.

Don't get me wrong, I love painting and I love seeing fully painted and modelled armies. However, things like life can get in the way. So you're telling me that, in our hypothetical gaming club, my friends would penalize me for not having the same dedication to thw game that they do? What's next? My army loses a mini everytime I don't talk like 40k character? Or that my flyers are grounded because I didn't wear a custom made costume of a Necron lord?

This thread is asinine trolling at its finest.

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:


Seriously, if you voted anything but against on this, you really need a life.

I agree, its great to see a fully painted army, but people also need to do other things

As for me, I paint as much as I could, I am very slow as I want perfection and take days to decide even tiny details of my armies, I love them really. I never field bare plastic, everything is at least primed and really dislike plastic on the field.

That said, it's a game first with models and fluff second, otherwise the whole affair just doesn't make sense and I may as well buy 40 times the same book to collect on my shelf. Tons of boardgames have unpainted plastic figures or blocky pieces of wood for units and have great gameplay and guess what, mood. The rule is HAAC TFG facist collectors idea that would be laughed at when applied to any other serious game around as it's the game that is important not looking at pretty dioramas, do it at home if you love it so much.

I came to like painting but at the beginning it's a chore and I can imagine that for most people it's a huge waste of time. On the other hand it is huge waste of money to buy a beautiful 70$ model and leave it plastic grey, that's not my business though but the owner.

 Glorioski wrote:
Kids, I wouldn't know. But if you are struggling to find your own time when you've got a girlfriend you need to man up. If i had to spend every minute of my non working life with a woman I'd go insane.

So... you don't know what it's like being married and having kids. Yet you are arguing as if you do know. How about you man up and admit that your are wrong here?

Nah, that's not going to happen.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Glorioski wrote:
Kids, I wouldn't know. But if you are struggling to find your own time when you've got a girlfriend you need to man up. If i had to spend every minute of my non working life with a woman I'd go insane.

So... you don't know what it's like being married and having kids. Yet you are arguing as if you do know. How about you man up and admit that your are wrong here?

Nah, that's not going to happen.

Wrong about what? I have barely made any objective statements in this thread so far.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Glorioski wrote:
Kids, I wouldn't know. But if you are struggling to find your own time when you've got a girlfriend you need to man up. If i had to spend every minute of my non working life with a woman I'd go insane.

So... you don't know what it's like being married and having kids. Yet you are arguing as if you do know. How about you man up and admit that your are wrong here?

Nah, that's not going to happen.

I'm married with kids. I think all wargamers should be able to take the time to get their models painted. Especially the people in this thread who have time to post on Dakka, but apparently don't have time to paint...

 Kaldor wrote:
I'm married with kids. I think all wargamers should be able to take the time to get their models painted. Especially the people in this thread who have time to post on Dakka, but apparently don't have time to paint...

I don't know about anyone else here, but I do most of my posting and forum reading while at work. Busting out some paints and toy soldiers in my cube might attract a bit more notice.

 Kaldor wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:

 Glorioski wrote:
Kids, I wouldn't know. But if you are struggling to find your own time when you've got a girlfriend you need to man up. If i had to spend every minute of my non working life with a woman I'd go insane.

So... you don't know what it's like being married and having kids. Yet you are arguing as if you do know. How about you man up and admit that your are wrong here?

Nah, that's not going to happen.

I'm married with kids. I think all wargamers should be able to take the time to get their models painted. Especially the people in this thread who have time to post on Dakka, but apparently don't have time to paint...

Posting to dakka from work? from your mobile when bored on a train? That is a silly point to try and make

Voted against, fairly surprised at some of the reactions in this thread...Didn't realise that certain people feel so strongly about playing against unpainted armies, don't think any one of my friends has a fully painted army. Most of us barely have the time to get a 2 hour game in once every month or so, let alone paint an army lol...

Some people don't like how other people spend their off time when playing a tabletop war game? I really could care less. I have a fully painted army and I try to field only painted models. But that is my choice that I made. I would never try to impose my own personal standards on someone else.

Though if I ever met someone who really hated playing against an I painted army that he'd make a judge of character or expect a penalty, I'd like to know. Because I'd never play against them or at an establishment that would enforce such a policy. I don't care how pretty your models are. It's not going to make you less of a jerk on the inside. And that's really what I care about in this game. The people.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Some people don't like how other people spend their off time when playing a tabletop war game? I really could care less. I have a fully painted army and I try to field only painted models. But that is my choice that I made. I would never try to impose my own personal standards on someone else.

Though if I ever met someone who really hated playing against an I painted army that he'd make a judge of character or expect a penalty, I'd like to know. Because I'd never play against them or at an establishment that would enforce such a policy. I don't care how pretty your models are. It's not going to make you less of a jerk on the inside. And that's really what I care about in this game. The people.

So most tournaments go worse and disallow unpainted armies altogether. Are their TOs also jerks?