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 Alpharius wrote:
Without even once threatening to do so - I just...did it.

You mean like I just did in the AVP campaign?

I could've sworn you waffled and or threatened there too, didn't you?!?

Nope. The first time I mentioned dropping was after I'd done it. I even checked.
I was very much "US shipping isn't free because XYZ" and "Grabbed the high pledge because it was limited instead of waiting till the end, will wait and see over the next three weeks how it goes."

This game should be pretty playable out of the box. 20ish models a side, newly upgraded 3d card counters for those who don't get the car/bug/cows/civilians/etc. Usable paper mat, dice rules, cards. The $150 level adds escalation for bigger games, martian mayhem for more fun stuff, and core expansion 1 for a fancier gaming experience at the basic game size and a couple more scenarios (plus cards, yey!).

The models are even color coded plastic, martians are teal, soldiers are green, survivors are red I think.

Oh, and everything in the game box should be single piece plastic, save for the little domes which are supposed to pressure-fit well enough to get by.

Double Oh (seven?), The $350 model is the alt sculpt for supreme regent. It was the only one initially, but then they added the one to whichever pledge levels so this high level backer tier is to be an alternate sculpt of the same concept. And I don't think we have anything beyond vague-ish concept art for either (so its a toss up as to which art would apply to which model).

Really happy to see the miniatures looking good. If they can pull off decent hard plastics for Enforcers this might get me back into Science Fiction games again!

If my enforcers look as cool and are as endearing as I'm thinking they're going to be... My 4500 points-ish of various space marines are going to be looking for a new home, brand new codex be damned!

I'm with you, grimdork. I think enforcers have the capability to be better than space marines. They already look better in my eyes, they're just a PITA to assemble.

Azazelx wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
Without even once threatening to do so - I just...did it.

You mean like I just did in the AVP campaign?

Alpharius wrote:I could've sworn you waffled and or threatened there too, didn't you?!?

LOL, half his posts in the thread included a disclaimer of backing out at a latter date if the value isn't good. There is nothing wrong with that btw (and I didn't pledge in the first place for the very same reason) but to say that he just backed out without warning would be... incorrect. Thanks to dakka's nifty filter thread feature, here are some post quotes in order during the KS.

No EBs, so I went in on a "Game Over, Man" level, which I may or may nor keep until the campaign concludes, as it seems more than a little light on models at this point for the price.

I'm going to do my usual. Sit back and let my pledge ride, than decide in the last days if I still want/need it and if the final product warrants the amount of money. At this point, for me it doesn't - but that seems to be the way many of these things go nowadays - stripped-down boardgames so that stretch goals can refill them with the rest of the components you'd actually expect...

Yep, the only reason I went in at all right now was the potential for 100 copies of my charming little head to put onto other models!
Otherwise, I'd be right with you, waiting it out for the three weeks, based on the price for what's on offer at present...

If I weren't sitting on a limited pledge, I'd be playing wait and see for a day or two under 3 weeks, as many others here appear to be saying they will do, which doesn't help their momentum.

It also looks like it's caused them to lose 62 or so backers since it was posted.

Including me. Dropped my "Game Over, Man" $600 pledge since the "extras" were the same as the lower level unlimited pledges anyway, give or take a couple of facehuggers. While I can handle EB levels, I'm not a fan of time-limited rewards that penalise people who back a campaign earlier or later, and this kind of manipulation pisses me off. Back to the sidelines for the next three weeks for me.

I don't know if this is the right place, but since the dreadball thread has been locked, is there anybody else who has not yet received their season 3 shipment?

 warboss wrote:

LOL, half his posts in the thread included a disclaimer of backing out at a latter date if the value isn't good. There is nothing wrong with that btw (and I didn't pledge in the first place for the very same reason) but to say that he just backed out without warning would be... incorrect. Thanks to dakka's nifty filter thread feature, here are some post quotes in order during the KS.

No EBs, so I went in on a "Game Over, Man" level, which I may or may nor keep until the campaign concludes, as it seems more than a little light on models at this point for the price.

I'm going to do my usual. Sit back and let my pledge ride, than decide in the last days if I still want/need it and if the final product warrants the amount of money. At this point, for me it doesn't - but that seems to be the way many of these things go nowadays - stripped-down boardgames so that stretch goals can refill them with the rest of the components you'd actually expect...

Yep, the only reason I went in at all right now was the potential for 100 copies of my charming little head to put onto other models!
Otherwise, I'd be right with you, waiting it out for the three weeks, based on the price for what's on offer at present...

If I weren't sitting on a limited pledge, I'd be playing wait and see for a day or two under 3 weeks, as many others here appear to be saying they will do, which doesn't help their momentum.

Yep, and none of those are "I'm now thinking of pulling out" - in fact they're all "I'm in earlier than I'd usually be in for something like this since there aren't any EBs - and for far more than I expected to be at that, and happy to wait and see how it goes." Of course none of them are "OMFGBBQWOW This is the awesomest thing EVAR" but then I'm never going to be like that at the start of a campaign. Though the Battle Systems terrain KS is pretty close as it has had no issues with value at all since I first saw it and backed it a few days ago, because it's pretty awesome and has just gotten better.



grrr. messy quote tags.

hey James -

any more pics of production minis? painted up?

also what's to be done for peeps like me, who ordered lots of Enforcer stuff in the survey (including individual Enforcer models)?

thanks!

I have attached one model I have painted, it's a promo model for demos. It was easy to clean up and great to paint. You are all in for a serious treat. Will post an enforcer later


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And the enforcers are lush. A little more cleaning time on these but well worth it. Will post photo in abit

Thanks!

Oh thank god, my phone was really hard to see detail on today, I was kind of unimpressed. It looks much better on my larger monitor screen.

Man, those guys have some really meaty arms. Guess it justifies their increase in combat ability.

Thanks for sharing

 judgedoug wrote:
hey James -

any more pics of production minis? painted up?

also what's to be done for peeps like me, who ordered lots of Enforcer stuff in the survey (including individual Enforcer models)?

thanks!

Hello! Sorry, didn't spot this until now. Got distracted by shiny Plague models.

The only Enforcers that are going into hard plastic are the ones from the basic Faction Starter (i.e. the ones in the boxed game). Now, as far as I'm aware - and don't take this as 100% accurate until I've checked with the studio manager (who has now gone home for the night) - every Faction Starter you ordered will get you a bag of restic Enforcers now with hard plastics later. I think. Again, I will check this. However, whatever the case, it's only Faction Starters that were affected. Everything else is still restic, and will still be coming out as normal. I will check this tomorrow and come back to you!

I think my enforcer count is going to almost double after this all arrives. And I just found another ten sitting in a box. I believe I have between 72 and 82 enforcers now (2 captains). Plus the two faction starters giving me 5 restic each, plus the 8? 10? each, we're up to at least 98 minimum, plus 2 of the big kits that give multiple shield/shotgun guys, couple medics, couple snipers, couple more captains and 10 peacekeepers, plus whatever else I see when models hit. I could do a full count tonight, but it's safe to say I'll have at least 120 enforcers after these shipments hit.


Turns out I'm getting another 70 enforcers through Deadzone. Yup. Doubled my amount.

 lagoon83 wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:
hey James -

any more pics of production minis? painted up?

also what's to be done for peeps like me, who ordered lots of Enforcer stuff in the survey (including individual Enforcer models)?

thanks!

Hello! Sorry, didn't spot this until now. Got distracted by shiny Plague models.

The only Enforcers that are going into hard plastic are the ones from the basic Faction Starter (i.e. the ones in the boxed game). Now, as far as I'm aware - and don't take this as 100% accurate until I've checked with the studio manager (who has now gone home for the night) - every Faction Starter you ordered will get you a bag of restic Enforcers now with hard plastics later. I think. Again, I will check this. However, whatever the case, it's only Faction Starters that were affected. Everything else is still restic, and will still be coming out as normal. I will check this tomorrow and come back to you!

shiny models?! post pics!

Specifically, the pledge manager allowed us to add extra individual models. I did this as I'm planning on using my Enforcers in sci fi games like Tomorrow's War, so I made an entire reinforced platoon based on modern military structure; so I needed some extras _after_ ordering multiple Enforcer Starters and several Enforcer Boosters.

So for example, from my DeadzoneKickstarter Survey Summary email:

* Enforcers with Heavy Rifles x 3 - $10: 2

I ordered two extra sets of three Enforcers with heavy rifles at ten bucks per set of three. What does that translate to?

NB I specifically have ordered only Deadzone Enforcers versus current existing Warpath Enforcers, as I don't like the Warpath Enforcer's "skinny knees" and the Deadzone ones on the KS had much thicker knee areas.

Got my Nameless, not too pleased. Heavy flash on the metal models, a mix of restic and metal models as I feared. Planning to ebay them, but if someone wants them cheap and to save me the trouble please PM me (like, a team plus 2 models, big monster, John Doe MVP, 2 keepers, 4 prones, and a bunch of clear hex bases for $25...).

 RiTides wrote:
Got my Nameless, not too pleased. Heavy flash on the metal models, a mix of restic and metal models as I feared. Planning to ebay them, but if someone wants them cheap and to save me the trouble please PM me (like, a team plus 2 models, big monster, John Doe MVP, 2 keepers, 4 prones, and a bunch of clear hex bases for $25...).

PM Sent!

Aww, damn.. out of all the backers on this KS I really wanted you to be happy with your Nameless RiTides. Sorry it didn't work out as well as I was hyping it at the time, I didn't see the sudden metal switch coming either. :(

The thing I don't understand is.. if you're gonna make a unit in metal instead of restic, why not MVPs instead of teams?

I really don't understand the economics angle on it, Mantic should avoid taking their accountant's advice as gospel... the logic doesn't feel right to me... "we're concerned that we might sell hardly any models of this unit so lets make the material worse to make sure that we do".

Which of course, creates a vicious circle of flawed reasoning and self-fulfilling prophecy... "Oh look, that unit we released in metal/ hybrid restic at £3/mini didn't sell so well, guess the accountant was right, we dodged a bullet there!". Negative feedback loop that results in a stream of flawed product and makes the company looks like it lacks self-confidence in its own product.

As someone who is a huge fan of it all, it strikes me as especially bizarre, it feels like I like Mantic's stuff and am more positive about where the company can/will go than Mantic is. I definitely see KoW and Warpath as the primary pick-up games in the UK by 2020, split roughly 50/50 with 40k and warhammer in the same way that Privateer Press has around 50% of the US market (remember PP was just as niche as Mantic 10 years ago, if not moreso). They can get there faster if they just stop hamstringing themselves and admit that they're bloody good at what they do.

I was hoping Mantic would leave that "nervous beancounter" approach to business behind with the support of Kickstarter but it seems to be stuck in old habits a little still (the same old habits that decided fantasy orcs and dwarfs with goggles to launch a new sci-fi line would be a good idea). It really wouldn't have killed them to put in a little extra considering that dreadball sold triple outside of the KS as a result of the money that KS backers put in. Make no mistake, it wouldn't have been as big a hit at retail with only 2 restic teams and £3/mini metal for everything else as per the original plan,so IMO Mantic should have put its backers first and pumped a bit of that money back into making sure that the last few season 3 models were done right instead of adding a negative to the end of an otherwise successful campaign.

I am very concerned about anyone who isn't happy with backing a KS, and the season 3 alts are a critical issue because the backers who bought them are typically the ones who dropped $4-500+ on the KS to get everything (all teams, all completionist sets).. you want to keep people like that with that much money and commitment to the company on-side, not risk losing their support for future kickstarters. I don't think that aspect was properly considered. "Customer-first" attitude is even more extremely important when your customers are also your seed capital.

And all of that is what keeps me slightly nervous still about my very large Deadzone pledge.

Fingers crossed...

I really appreciate the sentiment squig, thanks. And I'm not bitter, hopefully they will make kilcin very happy!

I am pleased with my golems from the KoW campaign, and pledged for the big bugs on Mars Attacks, too. But definitely on more fine / slight models like the Nameless, I probably will want to see a cast in the future. The painted pre-production models really had me excited for them, and I'm sure a good modeller could make them shine, but they were a let down for me.

Interestingly, I think my John Doe looks better- I got him in January, and he's a lighter colored restic. I can't remember if folks were saying lighter or darker colored was better, but he certainly looks better and he's lighter than the Season 3 restic stuff (maybe it's just a better sculpt shining through, though?).

^ Ah, brilliant. Mars attacks bugs were definitely cool, think I talked someone into getting an army of them for KoW (perfect for a goblin army, I may pick up a bunch more for use as trolls).

One thing you can at least be happy about is that the deadzone rules will be solid.

There is already a FAQ/ errata for the deadzone rulebook, as soon as the .pdf went out the internet got hold of it, found a few oddities (biggest one was that 2 identical models in a campaign could have different points values depending on how experienced they were when they picked their skills).

Al of it relayed straight to Jake, several long discussions ensued and we now have a FAQ out within the space of 2 weeks:

http://quirkworthy.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/dz-faq.pdf

Only one errata so far, it basically states "ignore the rank-based costing for skills, just use the first value in the column regardless of what rank you were when you got it".

Can't wait to get hold of the minis, only 15 days to go! As far as I'm aware the booster bundles will be wave 1 too so I'll have production pics of the entire Rebs and Enforcer mini line up on Dec 1st.

I, like SS, was a bit sad to hear RiTides didn't like his nameless; I've noticed RiTides and I liking similar things and thought it was cool. Figured least I could do was give him an easy transaction to get rid of them.

So far in putting my Nameless together I haven't had any issues. The only metal I got was two keepers (I believe that's what they are) so I didn't have an issue with them being metal. The flash on the metal was a bit more than I have been used to lately but easy to clean and no where as bad as some stuff years ago. Liking this rendition of the restic more then the previous stuff. Now I just need a Nameless faction in Deadzone/Warpath.

Only reason why I split Dreadball with a friend was because of the Nameless. A few people in my gaming group kept pestering me about getting in on it; after they showed off the art for John Doe I told them I would only get in on it if they released a team like him. And now here I am, with two teams worth of the Nameless.

Hey RiTides, give me a jersey number and I'll stick it on a big guy in your honor.

Hah, that's awesome . Definitely number 7 if you want single digits, or 42 if you want double digits!

Let me know what you think about the material on John Doe when you get the package. He is a fantastic model, imo, and I'm curious if this one is the same as the one you already have. Sounds like what you received was a similar condition (metal keepers, etc) so it probably is

I probably should have confirmed if any of the retail season 3 kits that I ordered were metal, I had ample time over the 7 weeks it took Wayland to ship my stuff.

Anyone know if retail versions of any of these will be metal?
Kalimarin Ancients - Nameless Team
Koeputki Kolossals - Zees Team
Shan-Meeg Starhawks - Asterians Team
Ukomo Avalanchers - Teratons Team
Whatevers in Dreadball Ultimate

Only the Keepers and booster upgrades (aka the 'alt' sculpts) for season 3 models will be in metal in general release.

If you buy a normal 'team' set of the initial models or the giants they'll be restic and you'll be fine.

Cheers Compel, I'll try to remember that so I know what I need to stay away from buying and make conversions for instead. You put my mind at ease for the meantime though!

 scarletsquig wrote:
I am very concerned about anyone who isn't happy with backing a KS, and the season 3 alts are a critical issue because the backers who bought them are typically the ones who dropped $4-500+ on the KS to get everything (all teams, all completionist sets).. you want to keep people like that with that much money and commitment to the company on-side, not risk losing their support for future kickstarters. I don't think that aspect was properly considered. "Customer-first" attitude is even more extremely important when your customers are also your seed capital.

Like me backed for "everything" in both DB and DZ (which is approx $1,300 I think), and never again after the S3 alts issue.

Also, as an accountant who specilises in that sort of work, only a bad accountant would give that sort of advice. Good accountants take the time to understand wider market issues which might for example include things like "wargaming customers get quite emotional* about the different materials that can be used".

*Maybe "emotional" is not the right word, but I think people get what I mean.

Emotional wargamer synonyms: Rabid Internet Troll, Overhyped Youngin', Jaded Old Man, Enraged Snorlax.

If Mantic sticks to what they've said recently re. being up front about the Deadzone plastics and letting us get refunds before they ship them, at worst we can't get burnt anymore. I hope this is the last lesson they need to learn. They copped a lot of flack for the plastic Basileans and metal Dreadball so I expect they have and I'm confident enough to give them my money... though of course, I *wasn't* burnt by those two issues which helps.

--

Wild West Exodus minis are arriving in the wild atm, and a "similar" thing seems to have happened there - more minis than expected were tooled in delicious WGF hard plastic instead of resin. It *was* announced that they'd try to do this though, but there has already been a "damn, I would have preferred resin". IMO WWX is in the clear since they said up front it could happen whereas Mantic did not, but it's a relevant comparison. (Also I love good plastic above all else so I may be biased)