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 tre manor wrote:
Well I honestly thought the footmen would be more popular than the bonebacks.

I have shipped 250 some odd orders and will be shipping a load more today......unfortunately though I simply cannot afford to do the double shipment thing as I had hoped I would. The postal service has DRASTICALLY increased their prices lately. Such that I am going to be some $4,000.00 over budget in shipping as it is now. If I tried to ship twice I would literally not enough money to do it.

Freebies....... cannot do them. I have priced these things as low as possible and giving anything away is just going to be counter productive. If the value is not there as is then it just is what it is I am afraid. I wish it was but.........

Actually I am already losing money on this new kickstarter because of the shipping costs. :/
I am sorry this has not gone well guys. Believe me that there is no one more disappointed by the development of the KS fulfillment than I am.

I'm personally not worried about freebies (I've not backed this KS at this stage) but it's a key component of all the Kickstarters that make a killing. It's pretty much a matter of trimming any profits down to the bone and just paying for the retooling - I guess the problem there is that you no longer have much in the store at all and still need to eat and pay bills, etc.

Basically, in my opinion you've been severely screwed over by the conversion to Trollcast in several ways - In terms of discontinuing your old ranges and cutting off your previous income stream, to the number of screwups and delays (the first KS is now hitting the 4th month of overdue) so you have neither replacement stock for the webstore or retailers, nor will you able to fulfil the original KS orders before this one finishes - which means this KS is going to take in a LOT less than it might have. Ed's worker being sick and the endless casting issues have dragged this one months over time, and now, as mentioned, the USPS has raised prices dramatically. Being beholden to Ed's schedule window for creating the moulds for your figures, while also needing to wait on him to get the figures finished has forced you to start a new KS before the first one is actually finished, and pushed your KS1 ship date into a new postal price band.

I have nothing against Ed, he seems a very nice guy. But you've essentially dumped all your eggs into the one basket. If anything happens to Ed, you're proper fethed. You've already been kicked in the 'nads by the whole venture. If you have a supplier who still has the metal moulds, I'd be getting some stock in for the webstore. Before it was discontinued, your range was a lot bigger than the Helsvakt and the Goblins. Get some income coming back in, quicksmart - before this dead period kills your business.

One of the things that I find questionable is that Ed is doing molds and casting Impact's stuff and yet the RBG figs are all not done yet.

I suspect it's that Ed himself is the only one capable of handling the tricky RBG stuff (which is what's left) in terms of mould making

He'll also be training Brian and the new worker(s) he's hired/is hiring, but that will work better on simpler stuff at least to start with, perhaps some of impacts stuff

Brian can do casting now and maybe some of the simple mould makeing (again some of impacts stuff may fit this)

so it may well make sense to be finishing off Tre's stuff while making a start on Impacts (I think it's mainly masters/tests so far rather than full on casting)

I will likely be ordering in the Hellsvahkt guys when they become available. I really wish I had the cash for the original kickstarter, but wasn't able to at the time. Hope everything works out well for you Tre, you have some really cool sculpts for your stuff.

Hindsight is 20/20. I give kudos to Tre for taking a risk and going with trollcast. I am sure he has a pretty big learning curve to get up to speed with the new process. I think in the end everthing will work out. Just not in the time frame he predicted.

I agree with Scipio that Freebies have become almost mandatory for a very successful Kickstarter, but i also feel that including a ton of freebies doesn't always necessarily mean that the campaign will become larger success.

For example: Ed's alien assimilation KS gave away roughly 45 models with the $110 pledge level, while the Imbrian Arts KS included only 5 free models with the $110 pledge. Granted both campaigns did very well, (Ed's managed to hit 54k while Imbrian reached 62k.) I think it does show that quite a few people out there do prefer quality over quantity when it comes to KS freebies.

Since the campaign has stalled a little over the past few days, i think that Tre should consider moving the Wolf riders down to the 25k-35k stretch goal. And bumping the Troll brothers up to the 35k-45k goal. As for the goblin characters Dog's Bane, Gore Fang and Black Tongue, what about potentially using them as smaller goals that are in between the larger stretch goals? (E.g. a new character is unlocked at 20k, 30k, 40k.)

@Tre,
Is the model Einar March Warden Captain really being discontinued. or will she turn up in trollcast for the Aelfar KS? I've been a fan of that model for a while, and just panicked a little when i saw her in the discontinued section of your website...

Einar is a HE!

I will probably revisit that model. I have wanted to for quite a while. He should have been a single piece figure from the word go. I have learned a lot since then. When I revisit Einar I will be creating a unit of modular footmen to accompany him.

Reshuffling...... yeh maybe it is time to do that. With the number of contributors lost over the past 3 days we would have already gone over the 15 K mark.

Mahrdol wrote:
Hindsight is 20/20.

I've been saying all of that since before this KS went live.

Tre has shuffled the stretch goals a little. The footmen are now funded. Dogsbane and Blacktongue fund at 15k. Bonebacks stay at 25k. Wolfriders in at 35k, trolls at 45k and crowbiter at 50k.

Then I suppose it is on to the Dvergr.

New pledge options with savings break down and dollar value when models are unlocked:

SOLOS ($5)
Runty Gob Archers (3 figures) Unlocked
Dogsbane (1 figures) 15k
Black Tongue (1 figures) 15K
Gore Fang (1 figures) ?? (not mentioned anymore)
Crowbiter (1 figures) 50k

LESSER RANKS ($25)
Runty Gob Spearmen (12 figures) Unlocked
Runty Gob Foorment (12 figures) Unlocked

SPECIAL RANKS ($35)
Goblin Bonebacks A (12 figures) 25K
The Troll Brothers (2 figures) 45K
Runty Gob Wolf Riders A (4 figures) 35k

$30 level, no saving
$55 level, saves $5
$90 level, saves $10
$115 level, saves $20
$165 level, saves $40

There are two new pledge levels for folks interested mostly in the special ranks (trolls, bonebacks)

90 dollars - three special options, 2 solo - savings - $25
120 dollars - three special options, 3 solos, 1 lesser rank - savings - $25

Hopefully putting things "in sight" a little more will encourage some more pledges. I hope we reach the bonebacks and wolf riders!

Unlocking the footmen and the two heroes puts 15 new models up for grabs for me, so I'm happy.

The footmen are really awesome. I consider them really to be the best looking ones with the most character than any available goblin as of yet. They are really good.

Yeah, now that they're unlocked I've put forward a little more to get a regiment of them and a regiment of the speargobs.

Wolf riders at 35K, woot! We can get there by the end

czakk wrote:

$30 level, no saving
$55 level, saves $5
$90 level, saves $10
$115 level, saves $20
$165 level, saves $40

There are two new pledge levels for folks interested mostly in the special ranks (trolls, bonebacks)

90 dollars - three special options, 2 solo - savings - $25
120 dollars - three special options, 3 solos, 1 lesser rank - savings - $25

Those levels are interesting. Really, you don't really get any "benefit" from backing the KS over waiting and buying them from a 10% retailer (many who offer free shipping). In addition, you will have a wait of at least 2 months before you get your figures after paying for them. So basically the main/almost the only reason to back this KS is to be altruistic towards Tre and support his business.

Which is fine for what it is. But it's not going to move the earth or get the backing to fly particularly high. It's going to make those stretch goals a real stretch to get to as well.

Dreamforge wasn't much of a discount over Warstore prices (just revealed) but a great product will draw backers, and as has been pointed out, this isn't far from KS1 pace moneywise. Sending KS1 pledges will help too obviously!

Those levels are interesting. Really, you don't really get any "benefit" from backing the KS over waiting and buying them from a 10% retailer (many who offer free shipping).

I do not supply any discounters. Standing policy.

The rewards are structured in a way so as to allow me to offer a significant discount to people building armies ( which I assumed would be the majority of backers. ) and at least a moderate discount to all others. This is not injection cast plastic ( which literally costs pennies per cast ) it is cheaper than metal but it is still not super cheap.

Interesting that you don't supply to discounters. Why is that? I would buy direct when buying from a smaller outfit like yours but I thought you did supply to some other places like maelstrom? Or am I wrong?

I guess I don't look at the KS as being a way to get cheap miniatures, just a way to get the miniatures that I am interested in. It doesn't bother me that this campaign doesn't have freebies (though obviously if it did that would be cool) because I want these minis. Actually, I want the entire red box line bar HelsVakt I think!

I would like to see something from the Wolf Riders end of things though. I think it would drum up some more excitement. I'm definitely happy with the new organisation of the goals, since what I want is Speargobs, Footgobs, Archers, Hobgobs and Wolf gobs!

FRP Games had some so you don't (or didn't always have to buy direct.

Well, to be fair - no-one knew what the retail for the Dreamforge stuff was going to be until about 2 days ago (if that). The Warstore's discount seems to be a lot more than 10% as well.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 tre manor wrote:

Those levels are interesting. Really, you don't really get any "benefit" from backing the KS over waiting and buying them from a 10% retailer (many who offer free shipping).

I do not supply any discounters. Standing policy.

The rewards are structured in a way so as to allow me to offer a significant discount to people building armies ( which I assumed would be the majority of backers. ) and at least a moderate discount to all others. This is not injection cast plastic ( which literally costs pennies per cast ) it is cheaper than metal but it is still not super cheap.

Depends who/what you consider a discounter. Most internet retailers do 10%, and your stuff was available at Maelstrom before the collapse (10%) and also FRP (who seem to discount most everything as well at various percentages) until they just cleared the metal at insane prices...

Pictures of the trollcast stuff 'in the wild' are starting to pop up:

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=509357569114785&set=a.496764463707429.126957.161379913912554&type=3&theater

and a painted wolf:
http://imgur.com/fj2RZM1

Thanks Czakk.

Discounters...... Yeh I have a standing policy that any retailer who carries the line cannot discount any figures in the line for more than 20% off the MSRP for more than 72 consecutive hours more than once a year. If they break this rule I stop supplying them.

I supplied a distributor early in the game who's business never really justified the discount vs investment, AND I stopped all trade to any known discounters ass it was killing my business. I NEVER made more than break even on trade sales and my business was int he toilet the entire time. Within a month of discontinuing trade I was suddenly out of the red and actually turning a profit month to month.

Distro ONLY works when it is in large quantity.

 tre manor wrote:
Thanks Czakk.

Discounters...... Yeh I have a standing policy that any retailer who carries the line cannot discount any figures in the line for more than 20% off the MSRP for more than 72 consecutive hours more than once a year. If they break this rule I stop supplying them.

That makes sense. I guess it's just a matter of perspective on what we each consider "discounter" - I think of 10% as a discounter, given what Australian prices for games are like. I guess people in the US have a fair few places that go much deeper than that. Even Maelstrom's "big" sales were 17% o 18%.

Yeah, I guess to make a significant profit if you're discounting heavily you'd have to sell a large amount.

Reckon your miniatures are fairly reasonably priced anyway, especially as singles and so on. But as I've mentioned a few times, $25 for 12 unique sculpts is actually cheaper than what GW is charging for 12 practically monopose moria goblins. I like the moria goblins, but the sculpts don't justify the costs.

Agreed about the 12 for $25, Da Boss. Hopefully more folks get their stuff and decide to pledge based on what they see.

Thanks for understanding guys.

 scipio.au wrote:

czakk wrote:

$30 level, no saving
$55 level, saves $5
$90 level, saves $10
$115 level, saves $20
$165 level, saves $40

There are two new pledge levels for folks interested mostly in the special ranks (trolls, bonebacks)

90 dollars - three special options, 2 solo - savings - $25
120 dollars - three special options, 3 solos, 1 lesser rank - savings - $25

Those levels are interesting. Really, you don't really get any "benefit" from backing the KS over waiting and buying them from a 10% retailer (many who offer free shipping). In addition, you will have a wait of at least 2 months before you get your figures after paying for them. So basically the main/almost the only reason to back this KS is to be altruistic towards Tre and support his business.

Which is fine for what it is. But it's not going to move the earth or get the backing to fly particularly high. It's going to make those stretch goals a real stretch to get to as well.

This to some extent. For $110 in the previous KS, I got 7 characters, 6 ranks of 4-5 guys, 4 bonus figures and 18 bonus zombies. For a similar amount, I get less individual figures, (not to mention smaller) for this one. I'm guessing Tre ran the first at a loss maybe?

That and I havent seen anything from the first KS, so I havent been able to evaluate the material myself (the see through shields and broken weapons people posted left me somewhat concerned) meant this one was a pass for me. I do wish it well, and will pick up some bone backs at release though.

all those "bonus" figures in KS1 were unlocked at high stretch goals (many of them at $40k or higher).

 judgedoug wrote:
all those "bonus" figures in KS1 were unlocked at high stretch goals (many of them at $40k or higher).

Understood, however he said he wouldnt be able to do freebies on this one (unless I missed something). Which is why I was wondering if the first one was run at a loss (or ended up being one due to the initial casting difficulties). So I get being cautious on this one (its mostly the lack of being able to evaluate a new medium that's held me back from some kind of pledge).

I think the big nosed goblins also probably have a bit more limited appeal than the helsvakt (or however its spelled) due to their unique aesthetic. I'd use them as xvarts or something to differentiate them from all my other goblins. Plus xvart is fun to say. Xvart.

Well I won't call the KS1 an overall loss. I did make a profit from it, BUT I effectively sold through all of the zombies I will probably ever sell and when I say sold through I mean gave away for nothing once all of the costs were deducted. Additionally, I probabyl gave away at least 2 or 3 other figures for all intents and purposes as well. I never expected the campaign to go as high as it did and as a result I added too many freebies in at too low of a level. Then as the quantity added up those freebies became a stone around my neck.

My first campaign is an excellent example of what it looks liek to be totally unprepared for success and totally mismanaged to make as much of a success as possible. I panicked when the campaign began to roll backwards and started adding on more than I coudl actually afford to.

This time aroudn I am keeping my expectations realistic. Even if the final dollar amount is less I intend to make as much success from it as possible.