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RoW shipping from china + coupon would be the best thing you could do for Aussies I think Mark (above and beyond what's expected btw). With China so close, local manufacturing isn't necessary. We have some great manufacturers such as Vic and shadowforge but they don't have the scale or deal with plastics.

 NoseGoblin wrote:


We have talked about that... and adding to the current KS is a nightmare for them. How would you feel about a discount coupon that can be redeemed at the WGF website? I cannot promise anything but I did bat the idea around with WGF a couple months back.

Let me know your thoughts.....

If the coupon is for KS backers only, then I would like to see it give a better discount than local retailers like Miniature Market or The War Store. Also, I would appreciate a decent window of opportunity to use it. Otherwise, it's a case of:

 HisDivineShadow wrote:
They should be excited to do Dream forge kits, since they show off what they can actually produce. They are far superior to any of there other kits.

This is EXACTLY what I was thinking.

Maybe I don't know all the relevant info, but if I ran WGF, I would drop everything else and hire Mark on full time to produce the entire Iron-Core (?) universe. I don't think I've seen anything Mark has done that I didn't think was really great (even the stuff I am not interested in owning myself). And I'm pretty damn catty and judgmental when it comes to aesthetics. Mark's just light years ahead of nearly any other individual designer (save for Jes Goodwin) and most entire design teams. At least when it comes to Sci-Fi influenced by historical elements (WWII/Wermacht, etc.)

I suspect that a number of y'all who regularly post in this thread would agree with me

-C6

I do, unequivocally.

I do as well. I also support the coupon plan that Mark has laid out. That would be a very nice thing to do for backers! I know I want a 20 trooper and 20 valkir box myself, maybe some more black widows... and an APC... and.... oh dear.

A coupon would be very dangerous to my paycheck (I do want more things that I didn't order!)

a coupon? SHUT UP AND TAKE MORE OF MY MONEY

A coupon? I could get behind that.
I don't really have anything more to order troop wise (I bought a full playable guard army through this) but I could use a few more transports/artillery. I also only bought one leviathan and didn't get either in 15mm, so maybe...
Now if only I hadn't been cheap and had gone for wave shipment.
At the time I was all, "I'm a patient person, and I don't like paying for intangibles like shipping when I could spend that money on beer or minis," but now I'm losing my mind. I almost ordered some of the stormtroopers from WGF because I wanted to play with some so badly!
I can't wait until all the waves are done and sorted so I can finally get my hands on all these wonderful goodies!

After seeing the latest Kingdom Death update, I think we now know why there's been a delay. The KD test sprues look a lot like WGF sprues.

Yep... but I can only hope that DreamForge wave 3 doesn't get pushed behind KD. I know Mark said there are separate people / machines working on the projects... but Mark's has been in the pipeline longer and is farther behind.

Hopefully, the influx of money means better results for DreamForge, and Kingdom Death, for future work...

Although it has been slow, if WGF keeps up this rate and great looking models, I see them putting a big hurt on GW. Especially because they are willing to work with 3rd party companies to produce miniature lines. Only downside is they could hurt other companies too. Places like Mantic will have to step up their game or be drowned out.

We can only hope Sparky. Competition is sorely needed, and with Eisenkern going to have a nearly full IG replacement suite by the end of wave 3 (if Mark adds a flyer... *hint*), not to mention a great contender to space marines, they'll need to lift their game.

Frankly, that sucks.

The Leviathan has been sitting on the shelves of my FLGS for months (!!!) and mind should've been delivered in March (!) from Dreamforge, yet it's been delayed for over half a year (and counting) for promises to some Gen Con companies (was Gen Con in March 2013?).

At the very least, there should be an option to re-jig my pledge to exclusively Wave 2 stuff, if it takes so goddamn long, so I can at least go buy a Leviathan somewhere else.

Or do the honorable thing like Relic Knights did and give backers at least a chance to cancel the pledge if Gen-Con companies are more important than backers.

 Zweischneid wrote:
Frankly, that sucks.

The Leviathan has been sitting on the shelves of my FLGS for months (!!!) and mind should've been delivered in March (!) from Dreamforge, yet it's been delayed for over half a year (and counting) for promises to some Gen Con companies (was Gen Con in March 2013?).

At the very least, there should be an option to re-jig my pledge to exclusively Wave 2 stuff, if it takes so goddamn long, so I can at least go buy a Leviathan somewhere else.

Or do the honorable thing like Relic Knights did and give backers at least a chance to cancel the pledge if Gen-Con companies are more important than backers.

What are you going on about?

 Yonan wrote:

What are you going on about?

About the DreamForge Kickstarter?

What exactly was unclear?

What you're going on about. That's the unclear bit.

 Yonan wrote:
What you're going on about. That's the unclear bit.

1) The delivery of my Leviathan Titan is some 7 months late (and counting).

2) Other Kickstarters with similar (or even less) delay at least made an effort to accommodate backers in some way (Relic Knights pledge-changes & cancellation, Kingdom Death added freebies).

3) Gen-Con as an excuse for a shipment that should've come in in March strikes me as a poor excuse.

4) Leviathans are sitting in stores all around me literally for months, but I still can't have it - paid for in September 2012 - because of GenCon?

Clearer?

1. If you still don't have your wave 1 goods, that's a problem you should have looked into a while ago. Unless you went for combined shipping at the end of wave 3?

2. DFG/WGF have made lots of accomodations, including shipping waves 1 + 2 together for free to people who chose combined shipping in wave 3 due to the delay.

3. This isn't a thing, nfi where you got that from.

4. I have my leviathan from the KS. If you don't have yours, you should track it down. Or you didn't pay extra to get it shipped when wave 1 was ready - your fault.

 Yonan wrote:
1. If you still don't have your wave 1 goods, that's a problem you should have looked into a while ago. Unless you went for combined shipping at the end of wave 3?

I did. And I did again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again.

 Yonan wrote:

2. DFG/WGF have made lots of accomodations, including shipping waves 1 + 2 together for free to people who chose combined shipping in wave 3 due to the delay.

Not for me they haven't. Despite 1) above.

 Yonan wrote:

3. This isn't a thing, nfi where you got that from.

The most recent Kickstarter update.

 Yonan wrote:

4. I have my leviathan from the KS. If you don't have yours, you should track it down. Or you didn't pay extra to get it shipped when wave 1 was ready - your fault.

I paid to have em shipped March 2013 (combined Wave 2). I have nothing from Wave 3. How is it my fault I still don't have em by now (by my calender, March is over for a while now). And I've been tracking it for months. But, you know, there was a total communication black-out, until the update with the issue seen in 3).

If your problem is really that Wave 1 didn't arrive, then that sucks. If they've been stonewalling you on this, I'd like to see the emails since the other shipping problems from it that I heard about were resolved quickly.

The gencon stuff has nothing to do with the march shipment.

I said it was your fault IF you didn't pay extra for each wave to be posted separately.

 Yonan wrote:



I said it was your fault IF you didn't pay extra for each wave to be posted separately.

I don't want each wave posted separately. I want all of the stuff posted in March 2013 as promised.

IF there is a significant delay in Wave 2, it would've been nice to see DFG accommodate backers in some way (e.g. offer to ship separately despite a different "lock-in" in September 2012, offer to re-change the pledge to get more Wave 2 stuff and buy Wave 1 stuff from retailers, freebie-add ons like Kingdom Death, something...).

Of course it is my fault. I backed this Kickstarter after all, so I signed up to the risks that come with backing Kickstarters... and this one was .. ultimately ... a very poor one where the Kickstarter-risk has bitten me in every way possible short of the project not delivering at all. Probably the poorest out of the ~ 12 Kickstarters I backed in terms of delivery.

So I am disappointed with it. And I am allowed to say so, no?

If your experience with DFG was better, I envy you for it.

So you didn't pay for each wave to be shipped separately? Your problem is just that there have been (substantial admittedly) delays for the items to be shipped?

IF there is a significant delay in Wave 2, it would've been nice to see DFG accommodate backers in some way (e.g. offer to ship separately

I just said that this is what's happening! Wave 1 and 2 is being shipped soon to users who didn't pay extra for each wave to be shipped separately and who otherwise would have had to wait until the end of wave 3.

Did we ever get a final breakdown of what the weapons were going to be for the Valkir? Like how many of each type come in the set?

I don't think so, Mark is waiting for wave 2 to be finished before he starts talking about what's going on with the stuff in wave 3.

 Yonan wrote:
So you didn't pay for each wave to be shipped separately? Your problem is just that there have been (substantial admittedly) delays for the items to be shipped?

IF there is a significant delay in Wave 2, it would've been nice to see DFG accommodate backers in some way (e.g. offer to ship separately

I just said that this is what's happening! Wave 1 and 2 is being shipped soon to users who didn't pay extra for each wave to be shipped separately and who otherwise would have had to wait until the end of wave 3.

No, I didn't pay for each (of the 2 first waves) to be shipped separately on the assumption that it would ship roughly March 2013. As said, I don't have Wave 3 stuff.

The offer to ship separately to people who are locked in Wave 3 is precisely the kind of thing I would've liked to have seen for people locked into Wave 2 as well. Shipping Wave 1 separately, despite a different lock-in, can't be much of a problem, as that stuff ships regularly across the pond, as evidenced by the boxes in my FLGS or in the inventory of etailers like Wayland Games.

At the very least - once it became clear that Wave 2 would be significantly delayed - the option to a) change from combined shipping to separate shipping or b) change from Wave 1 and Wave 2 stuff to only Wave 2 stuff (and by Wave 1 stuff through different channels) would have been welcome, and would have cost DFG nothing at all.

Ok, so at least we're clear now on why you dodn't have your stuff. That was not at all clear from your first few messages.

If you check back the last couple pages, you'll see that it's a huge problem to let us change our orders around as you're suggesting. They won't even do it so we can give them more money - that's how much of a problem it is.

Just so we're clear, did you see that you are getting, for free, your wave 1 and 2 stuff shipped to you very soon now that wave 2 is almost finished? And then when wave 3 is ready, that will be sent as normal.

 Yonan wrote:
Ok, so at least we're clear now on why you dodn't have your stuff. That was not at all clear from your first few messages.

If you check back the last couple pages, you'll see that it's a huge problem to let us change our orders around as you're suggesting. They won't even do it so we can give them more money - that's how much of a problem it is.

Just so we're clear, did you see that you are getting, for free, your wave 1 and 2 stuff shipped to you very soon now that wave 2 is almost finished? And then when wave 3 is ready, that will be sent as normal.

I have no Wave 3 stuff ordered. So that helps my nothing. Again, if there was a way to change my Wave 1 stuff to Wave 3 stuff, we'd be talking.

If changing stuff is such a huge problem, why do other delayed Kickstarters manage to do it nonetheless? Or, if its too much administrative effort, give people the option to opt out ala Relic Knights. Or, in ... say.. April or May 2013, when Wave 2 was already late and clearly not finished "tomorrow", allow people to switch to separate shipping?

And to stress that point again, DFG can run their show any way they like. I thought they looked like a competent company back in September, so I backed it, knowing all the risks. All I am saying is that - compared to a dozend or so other Kickstarters I backed - this one turned out to be one of the worst, relatively.

I have no Wave 3 stuff ordered. So that helps my nothing. Again, if there was a way to change my Wave 1 stuff to Wave 3 stuff, we'd be talking.

Ok, you have no wave 3 stuff. That means you'll be getting all your stuff very soon as wave 2 is about to be shipped right?

 Yonan wrote:

I have no Wave 3 stuff ordered. So that helps my nothing. Again, if there was a way to change my Wave 1 stuff to Wave 3 stuff, we'd be talking.

Ok, you have no wave 3 stuff. That means you'll be getting all your stuff very soon as wave 2 is about to be shipped right?

Presumably. Yes. I'll get my Leviathan Crusader before Christmas, yes.

Except Zwei doesn't have anything in Wave 3, so he's gotten all of the delay and no even remotely concillatory benefit.

I can certainly see his argument that once say, May or June rolled around they probably could have gone through and looked for the people who only had Wave 1+2 stuff and shipped the Wave 1 things. Would've been nice, but the fulfillment end is entirely WGF (a fact you seem to be overlooking, DFG doesn't touch the boxes), and if they didn't want to do it, or just didn't think of it, then there's not much Mark can do.

The new shots of the KD:M stuff does seem to indicate who one of those "cash customers" was though. Makes me happy for KD, but kind of frustrated with WGF at the same time. I understand wanting to land that contract for both prestige and cash, but it does kind of seem like it came at the expense of existing projects. Hopefully they'll do something to make up for that, and as an additional hope maybe folks like Zwei (because I doubt he's unique, and if he was well, there's the problem ) can take advantage of it.

EDIT: Needed to emphasize the logistics of fulfillment are all on WGF.