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since when have they removed ALL of the painting articles off there website?

A while ago now. It's part of their policy to remove anything useful that doesn't make them money. But we won't go there.

It's been a long time since those were up. GW should've left them up, outdated paints or not.. they have a conversion chart, don't they?

its an absolute pain that they constantly try to destroy the community that has built up around there products

also do art products have to be tested in the uk like they do in the us? could les make his washes in the uk?

They got rid of their main facebook page too. Kinda sucks

 progreen10 wrote:
They got rid of their main facebook page too. Kinda sucks

I didn't know that... but having just looked and checked it really is gone - now it is just a page saying who else on my friends list likes them and if there are any posts about them

this conversion chart?

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2320032a_Citadel_Conversion_Chart

GW just wants to sell you models, the game and how you paint them are irrelevant to them
get them to buy as much as they can and then get them out

Yeah, GW pulled all articles from their site. Or at least the links to them. Some pdf's are still on their server. Sadly non of the painting ones. For the rest of them here is a linklist to them.
http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=93560

what does it benifit them to pull all painting files from the server?

I think their reasoning is due to renaming all paints those guides are outdated or something. (And GW probably wants to sell their "how to paint" book more ... )

They said everything was outdated, what with new models and paints. They could've made new ones though.

Actually it's down to a legal reason.
They no longer own the names to the old paints, the old company that made the paints held the rights to the names.

Therefore the only article you'll find the name of the old paints is the conversation chart, which they will have had to pay the old company rights for to publish.

Meaning they have little choice but to pull the rest, they don't own the paints they are suggesting you use and I imagine somewhere in the background a legal battle was fought and lost.

You lot are always far too synical

Quite why they don't just call the damn colours what they are - a vibrant red, orange-brown (for example), rather than try to up sell their own (oft time gakky) paints is beyond me.

winterdyne wrote:
Quite why they don't just call the damn colours what they are - a vibrant red, orange-brown, rather than try to up sell their own (oft time gakky) paints is beyond me.

They either have to name them with code, Red: 001 Red: 002, Red 003, Dark Red: 001 Dark Red 002...

Or we name them, which is far more interesting.

The reason they changed suppliers is also down to the fact they kept having missing orders from the old supplier, (example: all the pinks went missing at one stage, i think they just decided to discontinue some of them) The old supplier werent enthusiastic at all, so instead they bought out the company that now supplies them, pays everyone more, and designed the new range of paints to go with it.

Downside: Rename everything and lose the copyright to the old names.

No, I meant in the painting guides or modelling articles. Unless deliberately aping GW, that what I'd do. For example, I paint red by starting with a dark red-oxide sort of colour, then go through a vibrant red, up to red orange for the basic blend, then edge with a colour similar to a peach yoghurt. That my dark red tends to be VMC Burnt Cadmium Red, my vibrant red is GW Blood Red (or similar) is irrelevant to the meat of the description or technique involved. Of course, it's convenient to have this particular tone premixed in a pot and that's where the sales pitch can come: one of convenience rather than a (false) implication of requirement.

I agree, but the false implication of requirement sells more products than the convenience of them already being premixed.

If people knew how cheap the alternatives really were, and there was only a suggestion toward buying citadel paints for convenience, people would start to use alternatives and less profit would be made.

And we all know:

Step 1. Sell Models and Paints
Step 2. Underpants.
Step 3. ???
Step 4. Profit.

I disagree here. I'm a pro painter, and some citadel products really are very good and can be upsold not just as a minor convenience, but a great help. Also if selling the actual paints used on the example, those following the guide are likely to use them. Older guides can and should be updated with the appropriate conversions to the new range.

In particular Devlan Mud was superb. In the current range there are a lot of places where I find only Mephiston Red will do. Foundation yellows were awesome, thank goodness VGC Opaques copied them very closely. Really GW should rely on their painters to find and employ techniques which show their range of products in a good light comparatively. Every range of paints has advantages in certain situations, and highlighting those is where I think 'good' sales practices lie.

I agree with you winter, I honestly do. The citadel paints ARE good, and there are few paints that I've found work as well, but there are some out there that do the job.

They SHOULD update the guides, Really, I mean I for one cannot understand why they haven't updated them, except the obvious answer of pure laziness.

But GW are notorious for expecting you to buy their product. They won't even acknowlege red as a colour, it's Mephiston Red. And we're constantly reminded of that, just incase we forget.

They do not want you to purchase any paints other than their own.

It's the way they've always worked, and it's working for them. Still, the OP has a point, and I tried to answer it the best I could.

Conversely, some citadel products are the worst pile of crap I've ever had the misfortune to try to use. Ulthuan grey is particularly bad in my opinion.

The reason they didn't update the guides is so they can sell the new ones they put out on the iPad etc. Very much a dick move, even White Dwarf now only has what I'd call at best rudimentary painting guides and at worse misleading. People are now asking what sort of paint a 'glaze' is. It's a frickin' TECHNIQUE. Not according to our friends in GW marketing. Now you can only do a glaze with Citadel Glaze Paint (tm).

[insert barely coherent rant here]

Sorry if I seem opinionated on this. My hobby is my job and I love it. It gets my goat when the company that pretty much introduced me to the hobby, and from whose publications I learned a lot of the tricks I know has reduced itself to desperately trying to simplify the hobby and its many aspects to 'The Hobby', with its blinkered approach.

I have used GW paints for longer than any other company and in general I love them. The basecoat paints are used with every game system I play, as well as the washes.

I find GW basecoat paints, then Vallejo or P3 'layer' or normal paints, plus GW washes are my current strategy.

If they took down the painting guides because of legal reasons, taking down some of the modelling articles was really silly IMO. I really liked the tutorial of converting one of the Eldar wraithlords into a "sniper" look, and at the time many of their Tyranids articles were very cool. Why were those taken down?

 Deunstephe wrote:
If they took down the painting guides because of legal reasons, taking down some of the modelling articles was really silly IMO. I really liked the tutorial of converting one of the Eldar wraithlords into a "sniper" look, and at the time many of their Tyranids articles were very cool. Why were those taken down?

Obviously to sell more books.

Coming soon "Citidels how to convert models" only 50$

 Desubot wrote:

 Deunstephe wrote:
If they took down the painting guides because of legal reasons, taking down some of the modelling articles was really silly IMO. I really liked the tutorial of converting one of the Eldar wraithlords into a "sniper" look, and at the time many of their Tyranids articles were very cool. Why were those taken down?

Obviously to sell more books.

Coming soon "Citidels how to convert models" only 50$

Goddammit. But that book might be pretty cool.

Why are the new codices 50 bucks anyway, just for being hardcover? The 5th ed rulebook cost that much, and I don't want to pay 50 dollars for terrible Ward-written articles and rules. Poor Orks, I hope Ward gets pulled..

Its 50 bucks because we will pay 50bucks for it. Pure and simple. People can blame costs, etc etc. but I'm pretty sure there are still hardcover books being sold with 3x the pages for half the price and the number of copies sold still a lot less than GW gets for Codex prints. It didn't need a hardcover, that was just the cover for them bumping up the price by double.

Paitryn wrote:
Its 50 bucks because we will pay 50bucks for it. Pure and simple. People can blame costs, etc etc. but I'm pretty sure there are still hardcover books being sold with 3x the pages for half the price and the number of copies sold still a lot less than GW gets for Codex prints. It didn't need a hardcover, that was just the cover for them bumping up the price by double.

But the pretty colour pages.

Old codexes had colour pages, they were just in P&M.

 Deunstephe wrote:
Old codexes had colour pages, they were just in P&M.

sigh and they moved the P&m into its own 50$ book. why gee dubs why.

 progreen10 wrote:
They got rid of their main facebook page too. Kinda sucks

They got rid of their facebook page because the community wouldn't stop whinging and spamming it with complaints.

Don't know why they removed the painting articles though. I guess it was too much effort to keep them up.

Yeh all the articles are gone. Sucks cause they had a few army lists there that I had considered buying stuff for.