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That is implied to be the possible aswell. But it does seem from the book tau do have a sexual dichotomy when it comes to the raising of kids, it it the females job.

Are Tau even mammalian enough to need nursing mothers?

They probably lay eggs.

You just game me a disturbing image. Very very disturbing.
But they have hooves. hooves are mammilian right?

Hooves are not a mammalian trait, though coincidentally they are only seen on mammals in the current era to the best of my knowledge.

However, Tyranids have hooves. Tau have soft camel-feet, not hooves.

Oh I know! Forget about the discrepancies for the power requirements of lasguns and even how a band of CSM can kill the ENTIRE population of a planet (14B) in a short number of months, but take it at face value as insult to women in general!

Yeah, no. Why is this even a thing?

I'm not really certain what you're responding to.

Although I'm not likely to care, given how dismissive you are of the entire topic it makes me wonder why you're even posting? It's not like I go around saying "marines suck" in every single thread about space marines.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
That is implied to be the possible aswell. But it does seem from the book tau do have a sexual dichotomy when it comes to the raising of kids, it it the females job.

Aren't Tau supposed to be raised in a creche? That seemed to be the case in Firewarrior. They also did not choose with whom they could breed, and I thought it was as much a part of their job as "stand here", "shoot that" and "wait"..?

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
That is implied to be the possible aswell. But it does seem from the book tau do have a sexual dichotomy when it comes to the raising of kids, it it the females job.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing, that the Tau probably outright enforce the "family or career" thing.

Somehow I doubt it. They enforce the "Greater good". A general can serve the greater good better by being a general than by retiring in the middle of a campaign and leaving the army leaderless to be a parent.

 Melissia wrote:
I'm not really certain what you're responding to.

Although I'm not likely to care, given how dismissive you are of the entire topic it makes me wonder why you're even posting? It's not like I go around saying "marines suck" in every single thread about space marines.

Because it's entirely fair to say 40K, its creators and/or its fanbase hates women. The topic's already been debunked in previous posts (I bothered to read ten or so pages before giving up), so right now I'm stating how baseless the topic is to begin with. Hopefully that's okay with you, I wouldn't want to appear misogynistic myself.

Though marines do suck when you realize they're genetically-modified, hyper-genocidal and ultra-religious space monks/knights -- but that's another topic for another time.

I don't think that the ominously dark far-future is the perfect place for 'love' as such, but I do think that having more normal female characters would be nice. I think that Eldar, Dark Eldar and Imperial Guard are prime places to expand upon strong, non-crazy female characters because they already have a bit of it hard wired into their fluff.

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
That is implied to be the possible aswell. But it does seem from the book tau do have a sexual dichotomy when it comes to the raising of kids, it it the females job.

Aren't Tau supposed to be raised in a creche? That seemed to be the case in Firewarrior. They also did not choose with whom they could breed, and I thought it was as much a part of their job as "stand here", "shoot that" and "wait"..?

I thought this also - their society being much like the BattleTech Clans?

I think that Eldar, Dark Eldar and Imperial Guard are prime places to expand upon strong, non-crazy female characters because they already have a bit of it hard wired into their fluff

Hmmm Dark Eldar women are usually by other races standards pretty crazy, sadistic etc - the corsair captain in Path of the Outcast was pretty close to being "Eldar normal" but she def changed when back mixing with her dark kin....

 guyperson5 wrote:
I don't think that the ominously dark far-future is the perfect place for 'love' as such, but I do think that having more normal female characters would be nice. I think that Eldar, Dark Eldar and Imperial Guard are prime places to expand upon strong, non-crazy female characters because they already have a bit of it hard wired into their fluff.

There is no Dark Eldar who would be "sane" by human standards.

 The Airman wrote:
Because it's entirely fair to say 40K, its creators and/or its fanbase hates women.

Oh, you were just attacking a strawman then.

Nevermind, I thought you had something of value to add, my mistake, false alarm.

 Void__Dragon wrote:
There is no Dark Eldar who would be "sane" by human standards.

To be fair, I don't think there's craftworld Eldar who are sane by human standards.

 Melissia wrote:

 The Airman wrote:
Because it's entirely fair to say 40K, its creators and/or its fanbase hates women.

Oh, you were just attacking a strawman then.

Nevermind, I thought you had something of value to add, my mistake, false alarm.

Then perhaps the meaning of 'misogyny' changed when I wasn't looking.

 The Airman wrote:

 Melissia wrote:

 The Airman wrote:
Because it's entirely fair to say 40K, its creators and/or its fanbase hates women.

Oh, you were just attacking a strawman then.

Nevermind, I thought you had something of value to add, my mistake, false alarm.

Then perhaps the meaning of 'misogyny' changed when I wasn't looking.

I think the poll demonstrates a moderate level of desire for more female equality in the models and books.

I wasn't aware there was an inequality between the genders to begin with in a far-fetched, hobbyist tabletop board game within a grimdark setting where [almost] everything and everyone dies horrifically. There're plenty of characters both man and woman but nothing to suggest an inherent inequality for one side or another.

 The Airman wrote:
I wasn't aware there was an inequality between the genders to begin with in a far-fetched, hobbyist tabletop board game within a grimdark setting where [almost] everything and everyone dies horrifically. There're plenty of characters both man and woman but nothing to suggest an inherent inequality for one side or another.

I'm saying 58% of people disagree with you vs the 42% who don't. That is a pretty damn strong majority. Even if you don't buy into the legitimacy of the poll it still means there are a large number of people with an opposite opinion.

They aren't featured as much in the action because they are all in the kitchen, where they belong.

/joke

 The Airman wrote:
I wasn't aware there was an inequality between the genders to begin with in a far-fetched, hobbyist tabletop board game within a grimdark setting where [almost] everything and everyone dies horrifically. There're plenty of characters both man and woman but nothing to suggest an inherent inequality for one side or another.

Go find me some GW female Cadian models then.

 The Airman wrote:
I wasn't aware there was an inequality between the genders to begin

Yeah, I can tell that you don't pay any attention at all and haven't actually bothered to read the debate.

 The Airman wrote:
I wasn't aware there was an inequality between the genders to begin with in a far-fetched, hobbyist tabletop board game within a grimdark setting where [almost] everything and everyone dies horrifically. There're plenty of characters both man and woman but nothing to suggest an inherent inequality for one side or another.

You can find good female characters in novels, but they are poorly represented on the tabletop and gak, is what people are saying.

I haven't voted on the poll because I'm not entirely certain what the OP's stance was. ^^;

Psienesis wrote:

 The Airman wrote:
I wasn't aware there was an inequality between the genders to begin with in a far-fetched, hobbyist tabletop board game within a grimdark setting where [almost] everything and everyone dies horrifically. There're plenty of characters both man and woman but nothing to suggest an inherent inequality for one side or another.

Go find me some GW female Cadian models then.

Eldar/Dark Eldar beat you to it. Additionally, men and women look about the same in body armor so your squad can have goth genders if you like.

Melissia wrote:

 The Airman wrote:
I wasn't aware there was an inequality between the genders to begin

Yeah, I can tell that you don't pay any attention at all and haven't actually bothered to read the debate.

Or that I find the premise of the OP's argument to be rediculous. If you think the way 40k is presented fails to show women in a larger role, the you have a problem with Space Marines, in which is GW's primary focus and what the focus most of their marketing on. And it's more likely the castrated space monks are keeping potential customers away, so again, not only is the premise rediculous but also a strawman.

You about done?

 The Airman wrote:
Or that I find the premise of the OP's argument to be rediculous

There have been thirty-six pages of discussion since then.

 Melissia wrote:

 The Airman wrote:
Or that I find the premise of the OP's argument to be rediculous

There have been thirty-six pages of discussion since then.

Unfortunately it's still an open discussion. And the OP should feel bad about what they've accomplished here.

 The Airman wrote:

 Melissia wrote:

 The Airman wrote:
Or that I find the premise of the OP's argument to be rediculous

There have been thirty-six pages of discussion since then.

Unfortunately it's still an open discussion. And the OP should feel bad about what they've accomplished here.

On the contrary, the OP should not feel bad for starting this discussion. It is an important discussion to have.

I have given up trying to follow the tennis match that is this thread. He said, she said. Jeez. However it is obviously very important to some so I will not belittle it.

A couple points, raised by a friend while discussing this subject (yes I have even got to the stage of talking about this outside in the real world).

Firstly if anyone has already raised this sorry, cant be bothered to trawl through 36 pages to see if anyone was actually thinking.

Secondly it will never change anything. GW will never conform to the wishes of the fans.

And lastly have you seen the cost of a setting up injection moulding. That is why they have cut the whole universe into tiny little bits now. Suddenly the whole universe is full of Cadian IG only. (don't troll me, I know there are others out there, but GW push cadians so hard.) Dont see many others these days. And in truth there are only about 5-6 models for the Cadians, Same for all armies really. The choices we had when it was all metal where vaste compared to the plastic range. Orks had what, six totally different clans, they are now just orks. So to give us a little variety, like including females across the universe, is simply too expensive and not worth it to GW. The argument, sorry discussion is good and it's nice to air our opinions, but do we not think it is mute, as GW are not going to do anything about it.!!!

PS I would rather they spent the money on updating all the codex. Including proper codex for SoB.

Yeah, actually, I have. For something the size of the 40K minis? $60 grand, brand new. Seems a lot, but that's also the price of a decent car. A company with a credit line could get one rather easily.

You can get larger injection molding machines that build much larger pieces of injection-molded plastic for like a quarter-mil... but why would you? They're not building life-sized Rhinos here.

Also, if they did make such an investment, and started producing a decent line of female characters for the various IoM armies that have female characters (IG, Inquisition, SOB, etc), you gotta take into account the sales volume and potential new customers (and thus new business) they would attract, off-setting the cost.