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Now I feel bad for selling my GK lol.. wait... no I don't.

FOR GRANDFATHER NURGLE!!!

Puscifer wrote:
Now I feel bad for selling my GK lol.. wait... no I don't.

FOR GRANDFATHER NURGLE!!!

Ironically, this has just made me think.

We lost collar of Khorne. Pretty much everything became psykers. We lost eternal warrior.

Are grey knight's now UTTERLY unbeatable by daemons? Daemon princes and greater daemons and flies, and beasts, and cavalry, and heralds, all die to force weapons D:

I'm watching a GK vs Daemon game today - I'll let you know after the game.

Should be good though, both players are tourney level.

One is a veteran GK player and the other has a point to prove that Daemons are broken in 40k.

It's all well and good talking abut all the crazy combos and lists you can make to take advantage of the the new codex but the question I ask myself is how are we going to deliver these units.

Against an IG gun line, Balanced Necron footlist, GK Henchman spam etc. 20 Bloodletters sounds great until you get shot off the table before doing anything. With much cheaper troops you could by the MTO game but even then a smart player will bubble wrap his troops. You can still Derp strike them but that didn't work too well last codex. Daemons do have very fast units (Steeds Flys Screamers Blood Crushers )that could easily be in assault turn 2 giving your troops time to walk/Deep strike.


I've only read the codex once but I did see a lack of AT, apart from the cute Plague swords. The old codex relied heavily on Bolt of Tzeetch which was pretty rubbish against Av14. So how will Daemon cope with Land Raiders?

 Nakor The BlueRider wrote:
It's all well and good talking abut all the crazy combos and lists you can make to take advantage of the the new codex but the question I ask myself is how are we going to deliver these units.

Against an IG gun line, Balanced Necron footlist, GK Henchman spam etc. 20 Bloodletters sounds great until you get shot off the table before doing anything. With much cheaper troops you could by the MTO game but even then a smart player will bubble wrap his troops. You can still Derp strike them but that didn't work too well last codex. Daemons do have very fast units (Steeds Flys Screamers Blood Crushers )that could easily be in assault turn 2 giving your troops time to walk/Deep strike.


I've only read the codex once but I did see a lack of AT, apart from the cute Plague swords. The old codex relied heavily on Bolt of Tzeetch which was pretty rubbish against Av14. So how will Daemon cope with Land Raiders?

Land raiders? On the very rare occasion I see them, I can glance it to death with plagueswords, or have a monstrous creature drop down and smack it about.

And my solution, to the getting to the front problem, is to use infiltrating nurgling bases. They can infiltrate 18 inches away from the enemy in the open, so I'm going to create a nurgling barricade, meaning if they shoot at anything through the nurgling's, I get big cover saves, if they shoot at the nurglings, meh, I only lost nurglings, and now my fast stuff is moved up

 Evileyes wrote:

 Nakor The BlueRider wrote:
It's all well and good talking abut all the crazy combos and lists you can make to take advantage of the the new codex but the question I ask myself is how are we going to deliver these units.

Against an IG gun line, Balanced Necron footlist, GK Henchman spam etc. 20 Bloodletters sounds great until you get shot off the table before doing anything. With much cheaper troops you could by the MTO game but even then a smart player will bubble wrap his troops. You can still Derp strike them but that didn't work too well last codex. Daemons do have very fast units (Steeds Flys Screamers Blood Crushers )that could easily be in assault turn 2 giving your troops time to walk/Deep strike.


I've only read the codex once but I did see a lack of AT, apart from the cute Plague swords. The old codex relied heavily on Bolt of Tzeetch which was pretty rubbish against Av14. So how will Daemon cope with Land Raiders?

Land raiders? On the very rare occasion I see them, I can glance it to death with plagueswords, or have a monstrous creature drop down and smack it about.

And my solution, to the getting to the front problem, is to use infiltrating nurgling bases. They can infiltrate 18 inches away from the enemy in the open, so I'm going to create a nurgling barricade, meaning if they shoot at anything through the nurgling's, I get big cover saves, if they shoot at the nurglings, meh, I only lost nurglings, and now my fast stuff is moved up

You read my mind there.

Also - I agree with the Land Raiders. In my Meta, I'm the only player who uses them and I run two. But in that respect, I have never had one destroyed or even a HP knocked off.

Daemons suffer from ranged Anti Tank, but not at CC.

 Evileyes wrote:

And my solution, to the getting to the front problem, is to use infiltrating nurgling bases. They can infiltrate 18 inches away from the enemy in the open, so I'm going to create a nurgling barricade, meaning if they shoot at anything through the nurgling's, I get big cover saves, if they shoot at the nurglings, meh, I only lost nurglings, and now my fast stuff is moved up

With army-wide 5++, I can only see Nurgling screens being of use to units that themselves have Shrouding.

 lindsay40k wrote:

 Evileyes wrote:

And my solution, to the getting to the front problem, is to use infiltrating nurgling bases. They can infiltrate 18 inches away from the enemy in the open, so I'm going to create a nurgling barricade, meaning if they shoot at anything through the nurgling's, I get big cover saves, if they shoot at the nurglings, meh, I only lost nurglings, and now my fast stuff is moved up

With army-wide 5++, I can only see Nurgling screens being of use to units that themselves have Shrouding.

Nurgle ^^

 Nakor The BlueRider wrote:
It's all well and good talking abut all the crazy combos and lists you can make to take advantage of the the new codex but the question I ask myself is how are we going to deliver these units.

Against an IG gun line, Balanced Necron footlist, GK Henchman spam etc. 20 Bloodletters sounds great until you get shot off the table before doing anything. With much cheaper troops you could by the MTO game but even then a smart player will bubble wrap his troops. You can still Derp strike them but that didn't work too well last codex. Daemons do have very fast units (Steeds Flys Screamers Blood Crushers )that could easily be in assault turn 2 giving your troops time to walk/Deep strike.


I've only read the codex once but I did see a lack of AT, apart from the cute Plague swords. The old codex relied heavily on Bolt of Tzeetch which was pretty rubbish against Av14. So how will Daemon cope with Land Raiders?

I've played around with a CSM daemon prince of Tzeentch with mastery 1 and wings, and I can promise you that the possibility of bringing three of those mother-fethers to the field will turn your average tank retinue into a smoking pile of scrap metal, faster than you can say "OP!".

Selym wrote:

 Nakor The BlueRider wrote:
It's all well and good talking abut all the crazy combos and lists you can make to take advantage of the the new codex but the question I ask myself is how are we going to deliver these units.

Against an IG gun line, Balanced Necron footlist, GK Henchman spam etc. 20 Bloodletters sounds great until you get shot off the table before doing anything. With much cheaper troops you could by the MTO game but even then a smart player will bubble wrap his troops. You can still Derp strike them but that didn't work too well last codex. Daemons do have very fast units (Steeds Flys Screamers Blood Crushers )that could easily be in assault turn 2 giving your troops time to walk/Deep strike.


I've only read the codex once but I did see a lack of AT, apart from the cute Plague swords. The old codex relied heavily on Bolt of Tzeetch which was pretty rubbish against Av14. So how will Daemon cope with Land Raiders?

I've played around with a CSM daemon prince of Tzeentch with mastery 1 and wings, and I can promise you that the possibility of bringing three of those mother-fethers to the field will turn your average tank retinue into a smoking pile of scrap metal, faster than you can say "OP!".

4, plus a lord of change xD

 Evileyes wrote:

Selym wrote:

 Nakor The BlueRider wrote:
It's all well and good talking abut all the crazy combos and lists you can make to take advantage of the the new codex but the question I ask myself is how are we going to deliver these units.

Against an IG gun line, Balanced Necron footlist, GK Henchman spam etc. 20 Bloodletters sounds great until you get shot off the table before doing anything. With much cheaper troops you could by the MTO game but even then a smart player will bubble wrap his troops. You can still Derp strike them but that didn't work too well last codex. Daemons do have very fast units (Steeds Flys Screamers Blood Crushers )that could easily be in assault turn 2 giving your troops time to walk/Deep strike.


I've only read the codex once but I did see a lack of AT, apart from the cute Plague swords. The old codex relied heavily on Bolt of Tzeetch which was pretty rubbish against Av14. So how will Daemon cope with Land Raiders?

I've played around with a CSM daemon prince of Tzeentch with mastery 1 and wings, and I can promise you that the possibility of bringing three of those mother-fethers to the field will turn your average tank retinue into a smoking pile of scrap metal, faster than you can say "OP!".

4, plus a lord of change xD

*Evil Grin*

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Generalian wrote:

 Eldarain wrote:

 Generalian wrote:

Lovepug13 wrote:

 lordofthegophers wrote:

 Sasori wrote:

 lordofthegophers wrote:
I can see opponents getting frustrated with Soul Grinders of Nurgle behind an aegis. 2+ cover save anyone?

Won't cover enough of the Soulgrinder, sadly.

Really? That sucks, I don't own the model so I'm not sure how big the thing is, but yeah looking at it now you're probably right. Still, if you can get it behind something...

You need to see the model

We just checked at our local GW. The aegis defense line does cover 25% of the model and therefore gives the soulgrinder a +2 cover save.

SO AWESOME!

Is it modeled doing the splits?

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no.
We used a soulgrinder made by a manager of Games Workshop used in multiple sponsored tournaments.
We measured the model and the Aegis line and then did the math.
The aegis walls (not the raised parts) covers a little more (by almost 3cm) then 25% of the model and is therefore legally giving it cover.

And you took into account that most of the mass is on top of the Soul Grinder and therefore not obscured?

Doesn't matter. As long as 25% of the model is covered... it legally has cover.

 Evileyes wrote:
How about this one then? Flying tzeentch daemon prince (Or lord of change for a cheaper version, if you want to)

Give it full mastery level, wing's, armour, and the tzeentch primaris power. Take off and fly up behind that nasty flyer. 4d6 strength 5 shot's with skyfire into it's butt, hitting it on 2's (Hitting flyers on 2's *squee*)

Before you even shoot it, you can vector strike the flyer for d3+1 strength 6 hits, then shoot the warpfire bolt's out of your butt at it's rear armour.

Heck, if that's not strong enough, you can still pick 2 other powers, and either use those powers combined with this, or spend all warpcharge on adding d6's to the shots you get.

This thing is a strength 5, flying minigun

Regardless of mastery level, FMCs may only use 2 witch fires max per shooting phase, and only 1 if they have done a vector strike. You're better off using the charged up primaris, but good luck denting a storm raven with s5.

 Generalian wrote:
The dual soulgrinder behind an aegis with mark of nurgle and phlgem
(+3 cover with skyfire and ridiculous shooting)
(khorne herald manning the auto cannon with his BS 7)

A normal bloodletter is BS 5. That's all you need to man the gun. Those heralds are gems and should be used doing work up close and personal.

You can't hide 25% of the soulgrinder behind an aegis. Blame those spiderly legs. Its 25% of the vehicle, not 25% from the bottom. Try it and see. You will get maybe 7% covered.

Soulgrinders getting cover? I never thought I'd wish for the days of 5th when vehicles had to have their HULL covered 25% to receive a cover save.

 Generalian wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Generalian wrote:

 Eldarain wrote:

 Generalian wrote:

Lovepug13 wrote:

 lordofthegophers wrote:

 Sasori wrote:

 lordofthegophers wrote:
I can see opponents getting frustrated with Soul Grinders of Nurgle behind an aegis. 2+ cover save anyone?

Won't cover enough of the Soulgrinder, sadly.

Really? That sucks, I don't own the model so I'm not sure how big the thing is, but yeah looking at it now you're probably right. Still, if you can get it behind something...

You need to see the model

We just checked at our local GW. The aegis defense line does cover 25% of the model and therefore gives the soulgrinder a +2 cover save.

SO AWESOME!

Is it modeled doing the splits?

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no.
We used a soulgrinder made by a manager of Games Workshop used in multiple sponsored tournaments.
We measured the model and the Aegis line and then did the math.
The aegis walls (not the raised parts) covers a little more (by almost 3cm) then 25% of the model and is therefore legally giving it cover.

And you took into account that most of the mass is on top of the Soul Grinder and therefore not obscured?

Doesn't matter. As long as 25% of the model is covered... it legally has cover.

That's the thing though; most of the surface area that needs to be covered is way above the aegis.

Doesnt soulgrinder get a 5++ for being a daemon?

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Doesnt soulgrinder get a 5++ for being a daemon?

probably. And that makes it able to deflect 1/3 of any hits

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Generalian wrote:
The dual soulgrinder behind an aegis with mark of nurgle and phlgem
(+3 cover with skyfire and ridiculous shooting)
(khorne herald manning the auto cannon with his BS 7)

A normal bloodletter is BS 5. That's all you need to man the gun. Those heralds are gems and should be used doing work up close and personal.

You can't hide 25% of the soulgrinder behind an aegis. Blame those spiderly legs. Its 25% of the vehicle, not 25% from the bottom. Try it and see. You will get maybe 7% covered.

Not true. The legs are absolutely a core part of the model, not just the upper part. No where do the rules state this is not the case.

If you measure from the top to bottom of the model, it is more than 25% covered and would benefit from aegis.

I feel like people are ignoring the massive flaws of this codex. Not one of the new units is great, skullcannon is situational and wouldn't be needed if we could actually get assualt grenades. Soulgrinders only have 3 shots at BS3, I don't know why people are getting excited for 140 point autocannons. Everything in the elites section is worse than it was before, and none used them before so they are hardly usable now. The unkillable GUO will be ignored, he's slow enough and lacks any hitting power to be viable. The only units I feel will do anything are mass bloodletters, mass demonettes, screamers(much worse than before but still one of our better choices), seekers, and greater demons seem alright. It feels like we haven't got a single new unit and most of the old ones have been nerfed into the ground. At least I don't have to buy new models?

magicafiend wrote:
I feel like people are ignoring the massive flaws of this codex. Not one of the new units is great, skullcannon is situational and wouldn't be needed if we could actually get assualt grenades. Soulgrinders only have 3 shots at BS3, I don't know why people are getting excited for 140 point autocannons. Everything in the elites section is worse than it was before, and none used them before so they are hardly usable now. The unkillable GUO will be ignored, he's slow enough and lacks any hitting power to be viable. The only units I feel will do anything are mass bloodletters, mass demonettes, screamers(much worse than before but still one of our better choices), seekers, and greater demons seem alright. It feels like we haven't got a single new unit and most of the old ones have been nerfed into the ground. At least I don't have to buy new models?

I watched a game last night where the GUO took out 2 big units of Meganobz by himself. He only took 1 wound in the entire process....

He is hard to ignore when spearheaded correctly, and is shrouded.

The Codex requires skill to run now, which is a good thing. But, yes, it is extremely competitive.

The quadgun also gives cover, so behind the quadgun and the aegis, the soulgrinder easilly has 25%

That's just a bad ork player then, he should have either run away or tarpitted with grots or boys. GUO's aren't exactly hard to get away from.

magicafiend wrote:
That's just a bad ork player then, he should have either run away or tarpitted with grots or boys. GUO's aren't exactly hard to get away from.

The option to run away and/or tarpit is not always there. Suppose the GUO parked himself on an objective that you had to take to be able to win? Then what?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

magicafiend wrote:
That's just a bad ork player then, he should have either run away or tarpitted with grots or boys. GUO's aren't exactly hard to get away from.

The option to run away and/or tarpit is not always there. Suppose the GUO parked himself on an objective that you had to take to be able to win? Then what?

Then the daemon player is smart, and spending that many points wisely.

magicafiend wrote:
That's just a bad ork player then, he should have either run away or tarpitted with grots or boys. GUO's aren't exactly hard to get away from.

Unless you cut of retreat from behind with some speedy slaanesh units [As you can see, all you need to succeed is a little thinking].

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

magicafiend wrote:
That's just a bad ork player then, he should have either run away or tarpitted with grots or boys. GUO's aren't exactly hard to get away from.

The option to run away and/or tarpit is not always there. Suppose the GUO parked himself on an objective that you had to take to be able to win? Then what?

And that is exactly what happened. The mission was the Relic. There was no avoiding the GUO. He sent the Meganobz right into it, not knowing just how damn nasty it was.
Not a bad player at all. It is not like he had the new book memorized after the Codex has been out for a day.....

Most 6th Edition missions are objectives, it is tough to avoid the GUO in the hands of a good daemon player.

There's only a 1/6 chance you'll get both iron arm and the re-roll invuls. 50% chance to get iron arm and a 33% chance to get the re-roll.
Is 300 points worth the 1/6 chance of getting a beastly unit?

 Blaggard wrote:
There's only a 1/6 chance you'll get both iron arm and the re-roll invuls. 50% chance to get iron arm and a 33% chance to get the re-roll.
Is 300 points worth the 1/6 chance of getting a beastly unit?

I would wager yes, as it has other qualities besides those two buffs. The major ones being that it is an MC, and has a ridiculously high toughness.

Selym wrote:

 Blaggard wrote:
There's only a 1/6 chance you'll get both iron arm and the re-roll invuls. 50% chance to get iron arm and a 33% chance to get the re-roll.
Is 300 points worth the 1/6 chance of getting a beastly unit?

I would wager yes, as it has other qualities besides those two buffs. The major ones being that it is an MC, and has a ridiculously high toughness.

Yes, it is worth it. Even without the buffs he is beastly. And he can always cause instant death.

The GUO one didn't even have Iron Arm in last night's game. He had balesword, re-roll invulns, endurance, and warp speed.