Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Eldercaveman wrote:

Plumbumbarum wrote:

 King Pariah wrote:

Plumbumbarum wrote:
...but Tau don't fit 40k at all.

Yeah, because the galaxy is too small a setting to have that kind of variety.

It is big enough to have the variety of the bar form Star Wars (where Kroot would fit greatly btw), why do it though.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Y'know what doesnt fit in 40k? Orks, They are just to silly to be a serious threat.

They're a ridiculous, OTT and brutal, they fit much more than Tau imo, I know what you mean but 40k is not hard sf but space fantasy. It is grimdark though and Tau as a contrast are not needed, they spoil it imo.

Besides nice greys dressed as samurai are just as silly as space orks.

Who says Tau aren't Grimdark?

Designer notes afair. They claimed they want Tau to be good naive race to bring contrast to all the evil grimdark dark and grim. They suggsted later than Tau might be mind controling and just as bad as everyone else but didn't go there enough imo. I prefer evil everywhere and everyone, good race just makes 40k your next varied and making sense universe (bleh), gravitating towards kind of gritty medival Mass Effect or sth.

Damn, I'm liking that Riptide more and more. I was just going to get the lad one for Christmas, along with the flyer, new Battle force, two Broadsides and the pathfinders.

Looking at it though, I'm tempted to get a second with the Codex just to put one together next month for his fledgling force he got last year at Christmas. (The old Battle force, two crisis suits and a Piranha).

 Gornall wrote:
How long has the Hammerhead not been available?

I just noticed this too. I was going to buy one in the run up to the new codex as I start to build up a smaller army to game with once the new rules hit. I hope it's not gone forever!

I'm curious what the FW team come up with to one up the riptide design. Will it be conversion bits or a whole new model? Like the way FW salvaged the stormturkey into the eagle and the crises suits themselves.

 Davylove21 wrote:

 Gornall wrote:
How long has the Hammerhead not been available?

I just noticed this too. I was going to buy one in the run up to the new codex as I start to build up a smaller army to game with once the new rules hit. I hope it's not gone forever!

It is. No point in separate Hammerhead kit when there's Skyray kit.

Is it possible that I am the only one why awaits new Tau Codex because of the fluff that will be written in it?

Plumbumbarum wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Y'know what doesnt fit in 40k? Orks, They are just to silly to be a serious threat.

They're a ridiculous, OTT and brutal, they fit much more than Tau imo, I know what you mean but 40k is not hard sf but space fantasy. It is grimdark though and Tau as a contrast are not needed, they spoil it imo.

Tau are grimdark. It's just that their designers put some thought to it (unlike with, say, Necrons) and they are presented in more subtle way. People who don't look closely don't get it.

Originally, 40k was silly rather than grimdark, hence things like Squats and Orks.

 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
Based on the group pic its roughly 2.5 crisis suits high at its tallest point, not even close to 12 -15 inches tall, thats titan size, my guess is its at best 6" tall, and thats streching it a bit, plus if you really want to, model it kneeling, like in one of the pics And cover saves depend on the terrain and table, the ones I play on with buddies has terrain easily capable of concealing even superheavies. Just did a quick check and a crisis suit with base is about 2.2" tall, so the riptide at around 6" is my best guess on its height.

It's on same base than Dreadknight, comparing it to the base it looks like it's slightly taller than DK. Personally I think they made it too big, suit of that size is somewhat difficult to justify fluff-wise since you already have tanks which can float. A suit maybe 2 times bigger than XV-8 would have made more sense.

I think there either is or was a plan for new updated crisis suits that should be larger at some point. Should make the transition to the riptide make more sense, as the crisis suits are undersized right now.

Backfire wrote:

Plumbumbarum wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Y'know what doesnt fit in 40k? Orks, They are just to silly to be a serious threat.

They're a ridiculous, OTT and brutal, they fit much more than Tau imo, I know what you mean but 40k is not hard sf but space fantasy. It is grimdark though and Tau as a contrast are not needed, they spoil it imo.

Tau are grimdark. It's just that their designers put some thought to it (unlike with, say, Necrons) and they are presented in more subtle way. People who don't look closely don't get it.

Desgners themselves stated they were created good and naive. They gained a little suspicion of grimdark but to nulify that early statement and be redeemed Tau would have to go full genocide, concentration camps and mind control.

Backfire wrote:
Originally, 40k was silly rather than grimdark, hence things like Squats and Orks.

It was silly and grimdark the same time, lot of art in Rogue Trader was mad, gigerish, dark and opressive. There were jaguar pants too ofc.

http://warpsignal.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/rogue-trader-emperor.jpg

Backfire wrote:

 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
Based on the group pic its roughly 2.5 crisis suits high at its tallest point, not even close to 12 -15 inches tall, thats titan size, my guess is its at best 6" tall, and thats streching it a bit, plus if you really want to, model it kneeling, like in one of the pics And cover saves depend on the terrain and table, the ones I play on with buddies has terrain easily capable of concealing even superheavies. Just did a quick check and a crisis suit with base is about 2.2" tall, so the riptide at around 6" is my best guess on its height.

It's on same base than Dreadknight, comparing it to the base it looks like it's slightly taller than DK. Personally I think they made it too big, suit of that size is somewhat difficult to justify fluff-wise since you already have tanks which can float. A suit maybe 2 times bigger than XV-8 would have made more sense.

To be perfectly honest, this is one of those cases where a model is so awesome, it doesn't even need a mega fluff justification. It just looks so darn good!

Also this is the same universe that has Titans. Hmm on saying that, would love to see those fellas in epic.. shame.

Plumbumbarum wrote:


It was silly and grimdark the same time, lot of art in Rogue Trader was mad, gigerish, dark and opressive. There were jaguar pants too ofc.

http://warpsignal.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/rogue-trader-emperor.jpg

Which could as well be said for the Tau (upon introduction) as well.

They were both a naive, "good" race to provide a counterpoint (if that's what you wanted to emphasise) and (!) they were an analogy on mind-control, a ginormous project in "civilization engineering" that makes the Emperor's Primarch/Space Marine project look like child's play and a 40K-tribute to Asimov's 1000-year-plan and his creation of a sci-fi cliche of a 2nd, inclusive Galactic Empire created to mitigate the future cataclysm resulting from the "big galactic empires" presaged/foretold/predicted/eventual collapse.

A lot of the fluff in the old Tau stuff lived up to that. Farsight could be played as heroic rebel, breaking from the stiff caste system or as a doomed, dark soul corrupted by a cursed sword.

It's ambiguity like that, and the implicit "make-it-your-own" in (particularly the old) 40K fluff that made it so great.

In some parts (e.g. New Necrons), they managed to recapture that "sand-box" approach recently. In others (e.g. Horus Heresy stuff by BL/FW), Games Workshop seems very busy killing their best and brightest legacy in the name of minting more cash.

Let's keep the "designers lied about Tau being grimdark" nonsense out of this news& rumour thread. Don't feed the troll who just wants to discuss his hate for Tau.

On topic, on the tank commander::

The Dude wrote:I was told (and put in the roundup a while ago) that he allows the tank to Overwatch, which may not be too handy for the tank itself, but adds more firepower to the 6" support Overwatch if true.

Plumbumbarum wrote:

Backfire wrote:

Tau are grimdark. It's just that their designers put some thought to it (unlike with, say, Necrons) and they are presented in more subtle way. People who don't look closely don't get it.

Desgners themselves stated they were created good and naive. They gained a little suspicion of grimdark but to nulify that early statement...

What "early statement"? Tau have been same from very first codex.

Basically, Tau are very clever role-reversal. They have nearly all human scifi clichees, but dressed in an alien form. This is why many people think they are annoying, they are designed that way, to throw naive representations of humanity from Star Trek, B5 etc back to readers face.

hm, odd Double post?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Backfire wrote:


What "early statement"? Tau have been same from very first codex.

Basically, Tau are very clever role-reversal. They have nearly all human scifi clichees, but dressed in an alien form. This is why many people think they are annoying, they are designed that way, to throw naive representations of humanity from Star Trek, B5 etc back to readers face.

But that is not all of it.

This interpretation is missing the crucial aspect of artifice that underpins the entire Tau Civilization.

They were raised (not by themselves) from primitive savages to space-faring Empire by "somebody", hidden behind a convenient Warp Storm and controlled by the mysterious appearance of the Ethereal.

Tau fit those clichees, true, but they are also "a creation" for an unknown purpose, adding a level of galaxy-scale intrigue and mystery.

I Assume the Crisis suits are about 10% Smaller than they should be to Scale with Fire Warriors? I always imagined the torso opening up with that hatch coming down and then the smaller hatch at the top tilting back raising the head section. The rest then opening out a bit like a split ribcage. At the current scale I thought firewarriors could fit in that space but it would probably be a tight squeeze.

 Kroothawk wrote:
Let's keep the "designers lied about Tau being grimdark" nonsense out of this news& rumour thread. Don't feed the troll who just wants to discuss his hate for Tau.

On topic, on the tank commander::

The Dude wrote:I was told (and put in the roundup a while ago) that he allows the tank to Overwatch, which may not be too handy for the tank itself, but adds more firepower to the 6" support Overwatch if true.

Oh wow - that didn't occur to me. AN IC charges a squad of lowly firewarriors just to be overwatched by not just the warriors but also by a rail Cannon toting Hammerhead - potentially nasty.

And also very nice "fluff-wise" for an army that is all about working together and backing each other up.

Backfire wrote:
representations of humanity from Star Trek

IMO, the tau are more Dominion than Federation.

 Medium of Death wrote:
I Assume the Crisis suits are about 10% Smaller than they should be to Scale with Fire Warriors? I always imagined the torso opening up with that hatch coming down and then the smaller hatch at the top tilting back raising the head section. The rest then opening out a bit like a split ribcage. At the current scale I thought firewarriors could fit in that space but it would probably be a tight squeeze.

Spoiler:

Scale? In 40k? Surely you jest!

In all seriousness, scale has often been out of whack between infantry and vehicles in 40k; there is no way you can fit 10 SM models into a Rhino model, for example. But, yes, the pilot loads in from the front with the suit opening up in a similar manner to that.

I imagine that the Riptide is going to be about 6-8 inches tall by the looks, which is really a really massive unit for standard games of 40k. Somebody also mentioned FW taking on the Riptide...IMHO, I don't see that happening. Just doesn't seem like something FW would do.

If the fireblades are cheap HQ guys, I'm going to model min with Gunbai!

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Gunbai_fan

Fireblade sounds like a job for those promo models from a while back that looked like pathfinders with FW armor plates.

Neronoxx wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Ant news on Stealth suits?

Ant news?
Gnat yet!

Well played, sir.

Who says Tau aren't grimdark? They're based on 1980s "real robot" anime. You know what the common ending was for most robot shows in the 80s? Either "and then everybody died horribly" or "and then everybody except maybe a dozen people died horribly."

You're approaching grimdark from the edgy 12 year old "everybody is evil" perspective. Tau approach it from the "everybody is doomed" perspective.

 spectreoneone wrote:

 Medium of Death wrote:
I Assume the Crisis suits are about 10% Smaller than they should be to Scale with Fire Warriors? I always imagined the torso opening up with that hatch coming down and then the smaller hatch at the top tilting back raising the head section. The rest then opening out a bit like a split ribcage. At the current scale I thought firewarriors could fit in that space but it would probably be a tight squeeze.

Spoiler:

Scale? In 40k? Surely you jest!

In all seriousness, scale has often been out of whack between infantry and vehicles in 40k; there is no way you can fit 10 SM models into a Rhino model, for example. But, yes, the pilot loads in from the front with the suit opening up in a similar manner to that.

I imagine that the Riptide is going to be about 6-8 inches tall by the looks, which is really a really massive unit for standard games of 40k. Somebody also mentioned FW taking on the Riptide...IMHO, I don't see that happening. Just doesn't seem like something FW would do.

I could have sworn I've seen a conversion once with space marines inside a rhino, actually fitting in there^^ (sadly I cannot find a picture anywhere.. :( )
But yea, the suits could be a little larger. Then again I don't really mind their current size, it just seems to fit somehow. (not from a logical stand, but purely visual)

What I'm missing on the riptide is some sense of it's scale.
Like parts that you can actually associate with hatches/vision slits/steps, stuff that puts the model into proportion. (like you have on the krisis suit)

RogueRegault wrote:
Who says Tau aren't grimdark? They're based on 1980s "real robot" anime. You know what the common ending was for most robot shows in the 80s? Either "and then everybody died horribly" or "and then everybody except maybe a dozen people died horribly."

You're approaching grimdark from the edgy 12 year old "everybody is evil" perspective. Tau approach it from the "everybody is doomed" perspective.

I wouldn't say 12 years old. I'd rather think of it as Noir. As in grim"dark"? So 1930s.

Everybody is doomed is more of a millenarist thing, also tied to environmentalism in the 1970s.

I think we need to stop this fluff thing though and get back to the N&R aspect of this thread.

Anyone bothered by the weird built of the huge gun arm that is essentially underslung from the elbow down? It seems like it will exert a lot more cantilever force than necessary, no?

I'm more concerned as to how difficult/easy it will be to magnetize the Riptide suit as well as the new flyer kits.

 tetrisphreak wrote:
I'm more concerned as to how difficult/easy it will be to magnetize the Riptide suit as well as the new flyer kits.

I was actually thinking about this last night too. That big gun arm may be hard to magnetize becuse it will be so heavy. A pin and magnet arrangement may need to be implemented.

I'm turning blue with excitement!

Any news on what that X3 missile pod dude in the 2-page pic is?

Lucarikx

Also, as an aside. For those who want to go full gundam on a budget... Hobby Link Japan has classic designs for around 6$US. I can't imagine shipping would be prohibitive to the point of making it a moot point.

Samurai_Eduh wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:
I'm more concerned as to how difficult/easy it will be to magnetize the Riptide suit as well as the new flyer kits.

I was actually thinking about this last night too. That big gun arm may be hard to magnetize becuse it will be so heavy. A pin and magnet arrangement may need to be implemented.

Just use a larger/stronger magnet. the 1/16 and 1/32 magnets with .1 and .3 pounds of pull force are fine for arms on infantry models, but a slightly larger magnet will work fine for the riptide. Good magnet selection means that even titans can be magnetized with force alone, no pins.