Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Had a kunnin' plan and thought I'd better see if I'm missing anything before I try it. I'm thinking of putting my soon to be competed Shokk Attack gun in a unit of Kannons, maybe two Kannons and max out on extra crew. That would give the Mek a T7 if he get's shot, plenty of ablative extra krew and I could even put a Runtherd in there to get squished if something scary jumps on them and issues a challenge. If I roll snake eyes...oh well, it's just a couple of kannons. Not like a whole unit of Lootaz or something important.
Seems like a good idea. Jobs a good 'un, right?

Actually i dont know if he gets the T7 since hes not the crew, technically....not sure how that works.

The issue i'd see is it then limits the SAG's range to 36inches unless you want to waste not firing the 2-3 kannons. The SAG's main threat is its a potential instapaste against anything on the whole table, i usually stick him in the back corner of the table with a ball of grots. Very hard to reach him without deepstrike, and if theres deepstrike i bubblewrap the hell outta myself anyway.

he doesnt get t7(kinda)but you use the T its the most of in a unit but having a shock attack gun, as vine said you will get less targets etc.

i could see it being a much better bubblewrap if you have a heavy slot to spare and just get 1 gun + the extra crew. Put all except one grot in front of the gun to soak wounds, then let that 3+ save do its damn job. That way its only a few points more than a grot bubble, is T7 till the grots/gun die, and has a 3+ save for awhile. Yes you lack the 10 Grotblastas but...honestly who gives a damn lol ive actually used them ONCE in many games of bubblewraping my SAGs but i could definately use a random 36inch Str8 Ap3 shot or a small blast.
The other downside is the crew despite being grots are still counted as Heavy so they cannot score unless its Big Guns Never Tire, in which case its now 2 victory points chilling in the back instead of 1 and a big gun.
If your SAG is your warboss you have issues lol so i wont say its 3 points. A SAG should never be your only HQ unless youre running two of them, which is weird and risky.

 Mr. Konrad wrote:
Had a kunnin' plan and thought I'd better see if I'm missing anything before I try it. I'm thinking of putting my soon to be competed Shokk Attack gun in a unit of Kannons, maybe two Kannons and max out on extra crew. That would give the Mek a T7 if he get's shot, plenty of ablative extra krew and I could even put a Runtherd in there to get squished if something scary jumps on them and issues a challenge. If I roll snake eyes...oh well, it's just a couple of kannons. Not like a whole unit of Lootaz or something important.
Seems like a good idea. Jobs a good 'un, right?

Actually, Kannons are more valuable than you give em credit for, IMO. Big Mek with the SAG will not benefit fromt he T7 of the Kannons as, as Vineheart pointed out, he's not apart of the actual crew. So if you want a bubble wrap for a SAG, go with grots and dump them in area terrain. So if your situation pops up of rolling the deuce, you're just out the SAG and a bunch of grots instead of losing both the SAG and an entire Kannon battery.

 DieselJester wrote:


Actually, Kannons are more valuable than you give em credit for, IMO. Big Mek with the SAG will not benefit fromt he T7 of the Kannons as, as Vineheart pointed out, he's not apart of the actual crew. So if you want a bubble wrap for a SAG, go with grots and dump them in area terrain. So if your situation pops up of rolling the deuce, you're just out the SAG and a bunch of grots instead of losing both the SAG and an entire Kannon battery.

I agree with what you're saying regardless, but in a kannond battery, doesn't he still use majority toughness anyway? (and would therefore be T7)

As I see it just make sure he is in the rear and they are hitting the t7 grots anyways. Unless singled out by a character or a barrage.

Edit if you want to extend the range you could consider lobbas instead of kannons. I would prefer the kannons myself but you might get conflicted deciding to shoot either the kannons and SAG at something in range both or just the SAG at something dangerous out of the kannons range.

 Awesomesauce wrote:

 DieselJester wrote:


Actually, Kannons are more valuable than you give em credit for, IMO. Big Mek with the SAG will not benefit fromt he T7 of the Kannons as, as Vineheart pointed out, he's not apart of the actual crew. So if you want a bubble wrap for a SAG, go with grots and dump them in area terrain. So if your situation pops up of rolling the deuce, you're just out the SAG and a bunch of grots instead of losing both the SAG and an entire Kannon battery.

I agree with what you're saying regardless, but in a kannond battery, doesn't he still use majority toughness anyway? (and would therefore be T7)

Debateable, but it still boils down to the fact that you're bubblewrapping a SAG with a major, hardhitting unit that you're running the risk of all of them disappearing into the warp on a snake eyes roll. Not worth the risk, IMO.

Can the SAG even join the Kannon Krew? Even if he did join them, why would his SAG range be limited to 36"? His SAG profile goes much higher than that.

A Big Mek is an IC, which can join any unit. So yes, they can technically join the Artillery Crew. However, per the Artillery description in the BRB, they cannot officially crew the weapon as they do not have the knowledge to do so.

Thanks for the comments. I will take a 2nd look to make sure that the Mek will benifit from the T7. I assumed he would by virtue of majority Toughness. Thats the only reason I'm considering it. If not, I'll find different bubble wrap.
I don't have a huge collection, no dreads or battlewagons, so I don't have anything that competes for my Heavy slots yet. So that is not a consideration for me. (yet).
I don't consider Big Gunz a "hard hitting unit". I've fielded them in earlier editions and they were a great annoyance unit. I had great success "lobbing" Pathfinders. But they are not going to wipe whole units off the board like IG ordinance. They are dirt cheap though for what the do.
I'm thinking Kannon over Lobbaz or Zzrap guns because they are 1. the cheapest 2. most versitile 3. I have the bitz to cobble together two in an afternoon.
Lobbaz while having good range, are no good vs vehicles\ elite armored troops and they are best when you hide them. I want the Big Gunz and crew taking the hits for the Mek.
Zzrap gunz are tempting. Better range and are fun and random and zappy like a Shokk Attack Gun, but cost more and have a chance of killling my own crew. I need those guys to hang around to catch enemy bullets after all.
2 Kannon 6 crew and a Runt herd, is like 68 pts? I could add some ammo runts and still not break the bank.

HIS range wouldnt be limited to 36inches, the Kannons would be useless unless he fired that close because now theyre 1 unit and are forced to fire at the same target. You could take Lobbas instead (cost a bit more) to make that a 48inch range though.

I doubt he can man it because theres a rule somewhere (forget if its in the FAQ or the BRB) that says if all the crew die the guns are removed, and only the grots are actually called crew (theyre different grots too, technically, as these ones dont have guns).
I wouldnt even get a runtherd, every time i bubblewrap my SAG with grots its not a charge that killed them its some nasty big gun or a LOT of fire. The one time someone charged my grotbubble it was with Wraiths which are not challengable anyway. Save dem points.

Arent Zzap guns 36inches too? I never use them because on average theyre weaker than the shell from kannons and have a chance to kill crew. The one time i did use them i rolled Str2-4 every single damn time...never again lol.

Funny thought....i wonder if when he joins the big gunz squad if the Ammo Runts merge so you can technically get 4 ammo runts on the SAG. I imagine thats never been brought up before...outta check that out...that alone would be worth the extra points and the heavy slot if you werent needing all 3 for boomguns or wagons.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
HIS range wouldnt be limited to 36inches, the Kannons would be useless unless he fired that close because now theyre 1 unit and are forced to fire at the same target. You could take Lobbas instead (cost a bit more) to make that a 48inch range though.

I doubt he can man it because theres a rule somewhere (forget if its in the FAQ or the BRB) that says if all the crew die the guns are removed, and only the grots are actually called crew (theyre different grots too, technically, as these ones dont have guns).
I wouldnt even get a runtherd, every time i bubblewrap my SAG with grots its not a charge that killed them its some nasty big gun or a LOT of fire. The one time someone charged my grotbubble it was with Wraiths which are not challengable anyway. Save dem points.

Arent Zzap guns 36inches too? I never use them because on average theyre weaker than the shell from kannons and have a chance to kill crew. The one time i did use them i rolled Str2-4 every single damn time...never again lol.

Funny thought....i wonder if when he joins the big gunz squad if the Ammo Runts merge so you can technically get 4 ammo runts on the SAG. I imagine thats never been brought up before...outta check that out...that alone would be worth the extra points and the heavy slot if you werent needing all 3 for boomguns or wagons.

There is a note in the artillery rules while ICs can join artillery units, they cannot man the guns. I was thinking Kannons were only 32 inches. They are 36!
I'm pretty sure you would not "merge" ammo runts. The Ork codex says, "models equipped with ammo runts" not "units". It would be very Orky though. "Oi! I'm outta snotlings. You! Into da chute!"