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 Aipoch wrote:

He will effectively allow for one of two nasty things to happen. The first is the old trick of just flat out ignoring miscasts. We know what this is good for. He will then get debuffed. As a HE player, I promise you I could care less if he is S1 T1. If I allow either of those two factors to come into play for him, I've done something wrong and he deserves to die.

Which he only gets to do once, in the entire game, resulting in the T1. Not every phase, not a couple of times, just once. And if he does choose this use for his Staff then this:

The second nasty thing is what will happen when your HE player rolls for a big magic phase. Activating the second option for his staff, allowing him to roll an extra dice with every casting attempt, is going to be a very big headache.

Becomes a non issue. Because it is also a one time use ability, and it is a one time use that it shares with the first ability. It's either or. And even if he does use his second option, it is only for one phase. It's one extra dice to throw at spells during a turn.

So its not "the first nasty thing that will happen and the second nasty thing that will happen" at all.

it's "Either this nasty thing happens once (at a price) or the second nasty thing happens once".

Either he rolls the regular amount of dice, and ignores miscasts (which are less likely with rolling less dice) or he rolls more dice and can't ignore his miscasts.

1-2 dicing on Teclis is bad cuz if he fails to meet the casting requirements he's done which is a really terrible way to use a one use item. I think he's going to hold it for miscast avoidance and throw a zillion dice at stuff.

Didn't they lose the d3 power dice banner? Jesus, I gotta get back home >.<

Yah, no power dice other than one use. So it's still possible for armies to overwhelm with dice. Like TK. Maybe even Doc by mega channeling.

d-usa wrote:

 Aipoch wrote:

He will effectively allow for one of two nasty things to happen...

Which he only gets to do once, in the entire game, resulting in the T1. Not every phase, not a couple of times, just once. And if he does choose this use for his Staff then this:

The second nasty thing is what will happen when your HE player rolls for a big magic phase. Activating the second option for his staff, allowing him to roll an extra dice with every casting attempt, is going to be a very big headache.

Becomes a non issue. Because it is also a one time use ability, and it is a one time use that it shares with the first ability. It's either or. And even if he does use his second option, it is only for one phase. It's one extra dice to throw at spells during a turn.

So its not "the first nasty thing that will happen and the second nasty thing that will happen" at all.

it's "Either this nasty thing happens once (at a price) or the second nasty thing happens once".

Either he rolls the regular amount of dice, and ignores miscasts (which are less likely with rolling less dice) or he rolls more dice and can't ignore his miscasts.

Flaming Sword is 8+. Let's take that as your first one.

There is a 7 out of 12 chance he fails that just throwing 1 die, as he'll total 7 or less. Or 58%.

Then you blew your item on your first cast and Teclis, your >500pt hero, is 1/1 and did nothing for one round.

Start off with multi dice and decline as you go. But you don't tempt fate that early. Be careful with average, if 51% is average, you still got a 49% of failure.

...You're forgetting to add in his free dice? That's the whole point of the staff...

He must use at least 1 dice from the power pool, and gets to add 1 more free dice from using his staff. So, let's try the math again.

Flaming Sword Requirement: 8+
Wizard Level: 5
Minimum Dice Roll Needed: 3+
Number of 2 dice combinations which do not equal 3+: 1

So, again, 1/36 chance he does not cast an 8+ spell.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, on throwing a single dice, he has a 1/3 chance of failing, not a 7/12.

Oh yeah, I forgot his level. Which is an awful lot.

Agreed. Being level 5 actually makes his default casting stronger than it used to be. Hell, have him cast certain spells on a unit with the avelorn banner, and he is freaking +9 to cast before the dice are even rolled.

As to the original OP, his tricks are one use only, his point value is appropriately increased, and he is not invincible. I see no reason he would be banned by any local group.

Yeah, I don't think so. I think he was a bit overnerfed. And then they took the spillover Teclis and added it to other sc's.

I mean the # of wards and KB makes this forum look tame.

In regards to the "get an extra power die with each casting of a spell" thing... can't Slann already do this EVERY magic phase?

You can't take the Avelorn banner unless you take Alarielle. Considering she's a lord choice you won't have both her AND Teclis in normal points levels.

Teclis is a lvl 5 wizard, he gets +6 (!) when casting High Magic, can pick 1 spell from every lore there is, can ignore two miscasts or Loremaster (High Magic).

High Magic has a ridiculously overpowered lore attribute that works extremely well with the lore's spells due to having very low casting values and is a very versatile lore overall.

The main problem is his ability to pick one spell from each lore. He is weaker than before, but still not balanced. As far as we can tell now.

...and seriously, the Avelorn banner is just 105% Mat Ward.

I think Alarielle is more broken then Teclis, and shes cheaper.

It's her banner that's hilariously broken. I mean, really, with this thing, any lvl 2 sorcerer suddenly gets a whopping +6 (!) to any casting attempts for Lore of Life / Light.

How does Teclis ignore two miscasts? I know he ignores one via staff. Where is the other one coming from?

My bad

 Sigvatr wrote:
Didn't they lose the d3 power dice banner? Jesus, I gotta get back home >.<

Yes banner of Sorcery is gone I would gladly trade Botwd to get it back.

 Sigvatr wrote:
It's her banner that's hilariously broken. I mean, really, with this thing, any lvl 2 sorcerer suddenly gets a whopping +6 (!) to any casting attempts for Lore of Life / Light.

Any casting attempts cast at the unit with the Banner. If you're going to call stuff OP, get it right.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
It's her banner that's hilariously broken. I mean, really, with this thing, any lvl 2 sorcerer suddenly gets a whopping +6 (!) to any casting attempts for Lore of Life / Light.

Any casting attempts cast at the unit with the Banner. If you're going to call stuff OP, get it right.

It's an honest mistake and the book is very new still, no need to get bent out of shape. It's still OP

 pities2004 wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
It's her banner that's hilariously broken. I mean, really, with this thing, any lvl 2 sorcerer suddenly gets a whopping +6 (!) to any casting attempts for Lore of Life / Light.

Any casting attempts cast at the unit with the Banner. If you're going to call stuff OP, get it right.

It's an honest mistake and the book is very new still, no need to get bent out of shape. It's still OP

You have to take it on the BSB and won't have a 2+ armour save unless he's going in a Cavalry unit, in which case Alarielle isn't in the same unit because putting Alarielle in a Cavalry unit would make 0 sense. Hardly OP.

 Tangent wrote:
In regards to the "get an extra power die with each casting of a spell" thing... can't Slann already do this EVERY magic phase?

Yeah. But it's not an 8th book. See what happens later this year.

DukeRustfield wrote:

 Tangent wrote:
In regards to the "get an extra power die with each casting of a spell" thing... can't Slann already do this EVERY magic phase?

Yeah. But it's not an 8th book. See what happens later this year.

Yeah the slann are really good in the 8th environment, but that average level of power went up with the new HE book.

GW is all over the place. Even just completely forgetting about the banner and you can see the demon codex is just gak compared to the HE book. You would think they werent even made by the same company. There is just no predicting how the lizardman book will turn out it could be anywhere from crap to overwhelming.

you shouldnt ban teclis. just because you cant fight him, you want to ban him? PLEASE.

either have a blanket special rule of no special characters or dont.

but banning a specfic SC because hes over the top in your opinion, or the internets is BS.

stop whining, read his rules, learn to fight him and grow a pair.

The problem I see with Teclis, in his latest format, is still getting to choose spells after seeing what his opponent will be. This means he can see what army he'll be against, and can then pick the hardest "counter" to that army,

ie.. Oh, i'm playing DE/ WE .. we should pick dwellers for str tests
or.. I'm playing Orcs/ Ogres/ Undead, lets take PoS for initiative tests

That ability to be able to "react" after seeing what an opponent has brought is what is, in my honest opinion, the only thing that is over powered

Hetelic wrote:
The problem I see with Teclis, in his latest format, is still getting to choose spells after seeing what his opponent will be. This means he can see what army he'll be against, and can then pick the hardest "counter" to that army,

ie.. Oh, i'm playing DE/ WE .. we should pick dwellers for str tests
or.. I'm playing Orcs/ Ogres/ Undead, lets take PoS for initiative tests

That ability to be able to "react" after seeing what an opponent has brought is what is, in my honest opinion, the only thing that is over powered

He's also an absolute b***** if you slap him into a unit of Phoenix Guard w/Skill Banner plus 2 other characters to push Teclis into the second rank...

Not only can you pick your instant kill 'uber spell of choice, but you can pick some rather disgusting buffs/hexes to turn those PG's into an absolute nightmare who are then backed up by not only their innate ward save, but a 2++ against almost every serious counter bar Dwellers/Final Trans or a few non-magical war machines.
It's pts denial shinanigans at it's finest!

Still, with the new High Elves, I'd rather deal with Teclis than Alarielle!

And he is how many points for a one-turn wonder that will be hurting for magic dice most of the time?

To be fair, you only need one good turn of buffs.

 d-usa wrote:
And he is how many points for a one-turn wonder that will be hurting for magic dice most of the time?

With a casting bonus of +5, you only need 2 dice (avg. 7, thus total casting average per spell = 12) to reliably cast any buff in the game on your units. And with a total of 7 PD, on average, that still is a reliable way to get the spells you picked before off.

Spells that will kill you reliably, or keep his own units alive reliably?

Lets face it, Teclis went from IF casting #6 spells every turn, ignoring miscasts and getting lots of bonus-dice each turn from other gadgets to being a solid support caster that can do reliable buffs and debuffs and spend one turn either killing one of your spells or guarantee casting a super spell, but not both, and then end up T1. For a big chunk of points.