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 Zweischneid wrote:

 Krinsath wrote:


Still waiting to see where my best value is since I want Enforcers and terrain, but am also one of those terrible impulse buyers that Z refers to.

Hey, I never said it's terrible!

Quite the opposite. It strikes me as far more human and relatable than the assumed "coldly-calculating", "robot-like" consumer people keep bringing up when they're saying that GW (or whoever else) is doing it "wrong".

Companies like GW, Kickstarter or Mantic Games don't have the power to change human psychology. They can only try to thrive as a business knowing how it works (or fail as a business by catering mainly to some imaginary, economically prudent 20-year-long-time-customer, of which I would argue not enough exist - and those that do don't spend enough - to drive a business like theirs).

Forgive my imprecision on the language; I meant that I am a terrible impulse buyer in that I drop tons of money into things and don't use them, not that impulse buyers are terrible.

For example, I recently finished my second Tau unit for a 2k point army.....that I bought when they were released back in 3rd edition. I think I could never buy another model and still not finish what I have.

And yet here I am planning on buying hundreds more...

Oh well. I can sympathise with that (though I try hard to not fall for that... and managed alright in pre-Kickstarter days).

I guess my excuse now is that most of what I bought hasn't even been shipped yet. No pile of minis looking at me accusingly.

 scarletsquig wrote:

Exactly, they see all the exclusives they can't get and then either go "screw it" and play something else, OR they spend $1000 on ebay to buy a complete set of the KS exclusives.
And that above figure is not an exaggeration, early on in the DZ KS comments, someone stated that they managed to sell their complete season 1 set of exclusives for that price.
As it stands, 5 of the mercs in Deadzone will be available to buy at retail, and 5 will not. If they make the last 5 too hard to get via mantic points, *and* the last 5 have really good, fun, rules then that's a real problem, since KS backers will have an in-game advantage over retail buyers.

There's a bit of a difference between the $4/500 exclusives, since those are freebies at the really high level pledges via the KS system only and ones that everyone in the KS can buy (and assuming that people can get them via the PM later on as well). I don't mind a couple being like that, but it can get a bit ridiculous (Zombiecide/Sedition Wars) and as we've discussed, Mantic might make a few (thousand) more bucks this way, but it works out badly for them in the longer-term since it either ends up as backers upset because their exclusive sculpts end up "cathorsed", or they "waste" good sculpts that they direly need. One positive thing about the way that Zombicide managed it is they released the rules for their KS exclusives, so players can always proxy models for them.

^ That's the other weird thing about having KS exclusives which aren't alt sculpts, but have their own rules - Your business model at retail has to actively encourage your customers to buy proxy models from other companies because you're not allowed to sell your own.

The only tangible thing this thing has done is got me looking at other mini lines to see what I can use to proxy for Rebs to get the alt sculpts I want, because I'm not allowed to buy the alt sculpt from Mantic.

 scarletsquig wrote:
^ That's the other weird thing about having KS exclusives which aren't alt sculpts, but have their own rules - Your business model at retail has to actively encourage your customers to buy proxy models from other companies because you're not allowed to sell your own.

The only tangible thing this thing has done is got me looking at other mini lines to see what I can use to proxy for Rebs to get the alt sculpts I want, because I'm not allowed to buy the alt sculpt from Mantic.

That's at retail, which is months away. KS is a cash grab, and a cash grab that Mantic is going to milk for all of their lines- and most likely, all of their editions or new armies.

The other effect of some super secret specialty models that the people who got in at the ground floor are using, and a retail customer cannot get, is to encourage both the possessor of that model and the one who wants to buy it to support the next KS. It may lose them a few dollars here and there, but if each exclusive model out there generates a pledge or more for their next KS, it will continue to snowball the same way that this KS has surpassed the Dreadball one.

It is a valid business strategy, and one that works better for a company with a very diverse base, like Mantic, than it would for a kickstarter making a one-off line (like Ouze's FABs). It just isn't one particularly geared towards the retail customer. Mantic has always targeted the pre-order market more heavily than the retail group.

The rebs booster has some great looking concepts. I love the ragtag multi race thing they have going. Judwan, Zees, Sphyr, Kraaw, they all look great.

Yay! Plague Booster is unlocked. So my $50 will go towards one Enforcer and one Plague.

I think I'm done with this one.

 scarletsquig wrote:

 Buzzsaw wrote:
I would seriously consider buying an alt version of the Reb commander, but given the KoW fulfillment, working off of concept art alone is not something Mantic does that inspires enormous amounts of confidence...

I already own two.



From the Urban War range, lovely sculpts, perfect for this.

Bit pricey for troops but perfect for characters.

I love that model on the left . Had always intended to pick it up, but as you say, a bit pricey and for me they were a little hard to find, too.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yay! Plague Booster is unlocked. So my $50 will go towards one Enforcer and one Plague.

I think I'm done with this one.

You're not done - not yet you aren't!

That $50 terrain bundle is kinda tempting...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
That $50 terrain bundle is kinda tempting...

Do it....do it....do it...

There is no such thing as "too much terrain".

 Krinsath wrote:


There is no such thing as "too much terrain".

This is true! Would love to get another couple of sprues added to Strike!

I would like to see the Alt Reb Commander and Plague Phase 1 as add-ons. Even if they aren't resin

^ Mention that on the kickstarter page!

That's where they'll read it.

If enough people mention it, they might make it happen.

Moving along nicely now!

$740,000 - FREE Blaine, Mercenary (Kickstarter exclusive)
$765,000 - Rebs Faction Booster
$775,000 - Solo Play and A.I. Cards
$800,000 - Marauder Faction Booster

So hopefully we'll see Forge Father and Asterian Boosters at $835K an $870K, respectively?

But, have these boosters even been hinted at officially?

Pledges are picking up nicely:

Well, I guess I was wrong about seeing that boost earlier. We got a decent one overnight it look like. I am fine with this, and Blaine is already almost unlocked.

 Alpharius wrote:
Moving along nicely now!

$740,000 - FREE Blaine, Mercenary (Kickstarter exclusive)
$765,000 - Rebs Faction Booster
$775,000 - Solo Play and A.I. Cards
$800,000 - Marauder Faction Booster

So hopefully we'll see Forge Father and Asterian Boosters at $835K an $870K, respectively?

But, have these boosters even been hinted at officially?

I think they mentioned boosters but there may be a few more models to add to the starters first.

 scarletsquig wrote:

As it stands, 5 of the mercs in Deadzone will be available to buy at retail, and 5 will not. If they make the last 5 too hard to get via mantic points, *and* the last 5 have really good, fun, rules then that's a real problem, since KS backers will have an in-game advantage over retail buyers.

It's not a problem, except for the OCD.

Having extra characters to choose from is great option, and reward, for the kickstarter backers. It does not ruin the game for people without those 5 extra choices. The vast majority of players of Deadzone will never own EVERY Deadzone figure, even without considering Limited Edition figures. The game will still be playable and enjoyable without them.

Zombicide is the perfect example of this. The game plays perfectly with or without Exclusive figures. The difference between Deadzone and Zombicide, and why it's a bigger non issue in Deadzone, is Season 1 Zombicde players only had 6 choices without the LE's. Getting the LE's in Zombicide greatly increased player options. Deadzone already starts with many more option than two players can field at any time. 4 Factions with more models than can be fielded simultaneously. When you already have more options than can use at once, 5 more optional choices isn't that big of a deal.

Also, if the rules for the limited figures prove to be great, and you can't get access to the limited edition model, just proxy/convert a model.

Wish I had the cash to get in on this .. all tapped out thanks to Secret weapon and Robotech

 adamsouza wrote:
Also, if the rules for the limited figures prove to be great, and you can't get access to the limited edition model, just proxy/convert a model.

This!

I recently sold my 2nd Wave of Zombicide Survivor/Zombvivors (for what I consider an obscene amount) on the eBay as while I liked the Zombie Nick and the Cardboard Tube Samurai I would rather turn that little box into into just under $200 to cover my costs of the Zombicide game and and put another $50 into Deadzone.

Conveniently these $50.00 bundles have come out just in time to grab some speccy new figures.

If I really get the urge to play as those characters I can proxie them or put a token on or under the regular survivor mini.


edited to add the point of my post.

 pretre wrote:
Pledges are picking up nicely:

Where the hell is Earth Dragon these days?!?

We're seeing a nice run up to what I hope will be a runaway last 2 days!

 Vain wrote:

 adamsouza wrote:
Also, if the rules for the limited figures prove to be great, and you can't get access to the limited edition model, just proxy/convert a model.

This!

I recently sold my 2nd Wave of Zombicide Survivor/Zombvivors (for what I consider an obscene amount) on the eBay as while I liked the Zombie Nick and the Cardboard Tube Samurai I would rather turn that little box into into just under $200 to cover my costs of the Zombicide game and and put another $50 into Deadzone.

Bought 2 of everything in Zombicide Season 1. Sold one set and payed for BOTH.

Considering that Zombicide recently finished their second kickstarter at $2,255,018, Deadzone may benefit from that approach.

I'll wave my hipster flag here and say I don't personally back kickstarters with the idea that I can/will turn around and sell the contents... I back projects that I want to help make happen.

Yes, those 2 don't have to be mutually exclusive... but the "pile o' miniatures you can resell" doesn't appeal to me for a campaign. And honestly I think is quite a bit of a risk applying Zombicide results to Mantic, as I'm not sure if you'd be seeing that kind of resale value for KoW pledges.

Again, not that that's necessarily a problem, as if I was pledging for this it wouldn't be to resell... but it also means it's not necessarily a selling point that you can resell the minis to recoup your investment (or even to make money). At least, to me

Not an huge fan of exclusives either, but I will end up getting all of the ones currently announced.

Love the concept art for the Judwan medic and the Zee scavengers. Hope the models do them justice.

If anyone from Mantic is listening: Contact James VanSchaik (sp?). He is a good sculptor who shows very consistent putty work, which you would benefit from greatly. Since I'm armchairing, get Kev White to teach all of your sculptors (even Remy) about anatomy and posing. Some are decent at them, some are good at one but not so good at the other. Remy is great at anatomy (and sculpting in general) but his posing sometimes leaves a bit to be desired. Not trying to pile on Remy here, he is an awesome sculptor, the KoW thread just made me think of this.

@adamsouza: Wish I'd thought ahead and done that. As it is, I'm probably going to sell the one set I did get and pay for Deadzone and Robotech with the money.

~Eric

I'd really like to know just how big those Teratons are.

From the concept art they look fairly large and chunky.

Is that mutated one going to be comparable to a 1st gen Plague? Or more in line with the 2nd gens?

I haven't seen any Teraton figures from Dreadball in person or compared with a typical Mantic figure, so not sure just how big they're going to be.
The bigger the better obviously.

I'm not advocating that people run out and buy extra sets for resale later. The point was that Limited Edtion figures usually have an inflated resale value. This prompts people to back the kickstarter instead of waiting to buy it later online at a discount.

From my own personal history, the limited edition and freebie stuff are the ONLY reasons I backed Zombicide, Zpocalypse, Dreadball, Deadzone, and Loka.

I bought them with the intent to play, not to resell, but I made hefty profits on both Zombicide and Zpocalyspe

LE's drive sales to completionists and speculators, while benefiting the regular player base by giving them more options.

LE's are definitely something that encourage me to buy stuff in bulk from KS rather than picking it up in piecemeal from general release.

I tend to do that for ones I want though, not to sell, but I have taken bulk add-ons with the intention of selling some of them to take advantage of the discounts (like EOTD carriages for £10 each instead of £25, if I buy 4. I don't want 4, but even selling 2 for £10 each saves me a lot of money, or the Reaper KS where I'll probably sell off about half of it to recoup most of my costs).

They probably do go for enough of a premium after the fact to be worthwhile even if you don't actually want them.

 Alpharius wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yay! Plague Booster is unlocked. So my $50 will go towards one Enforcer and one Plague.

I think I'm done with this one.

You're not done - not yet you aren't!

Come on man.. use that pot of money you've put aside for the single box of Cadians, $680AUS or whatever they cost now!

We're already at 'second best day' for this one, with some time to go.

Looks like we could get near to the $800K stretch and be into 'fresh territory' early tomorrow.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Vermonter 8 minutes ago

@Ronnie - Can you calm my nerves regarding finishing the Asterian and Forge Father starters?

Creator Mantic Games 5 minutes ago

@ Dorthonion - I like the ring of that! hi back.

@ Vermonter - let your nerves be calm - have you seen the speed we are moving? And they both get some serious love next!