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 Mike1975 wrote:
Christmas Gift

Is this 98% officially fan made? Or a hint of things to come? The Robotech marines book was supposed to come out June 2013 to January 2014 (when I stopped paying attention to the ever sliding release date and to my knowledge still hasn't come out). Is the rotary energy cannon a thing for veritechs with the UEEF marines?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 paulson games wrote:

Each story arch for Robotech is largely the same, humans vs an alien horde enemy. Given that they want to closely mirror the elements of the cartoon I'd imagine that even with adding Malcontents into the mix the Malcontents are still using Zentraedi units and Zentraedi horde tactics. So you get to fight RDF forces vs Zentraedi, or Zentraedi in a different color.


Another potential pitfall is the limitations of the Robotech license, once they've dropped their load of models for the arc there's no further expansion to be had. You can do the later arcs but Robotech has never evolved as an independent property beyond what they culled directly from the animation. Other games that are created of their own IP can create new units whole cloth and add to the setting at the whim of the owning company. Robotech has a much smaller pool to draw from and that places a limit on where they can expand to, unless they make a very significant change in how they've been handling the property. Unlike battletech, the Robotech IP really hasn't evolved or expanded in the 30+ years it's been around, Leading game companies like GW and Privateer Press are constantly adding new units/characters/things to their lines as they can create as much new material as they want.

There's certainly enough material to give the game a good run in the short term, but it won't turn into an industry giant like other IPs that are free to expand in their own setting.

While I agree that the potential for a licensed and now strictly regulated IP is less than something completely original, there is room for more than just 2 factions in each era if they just bring in the stuff that they previously disavowed. If the "experimental" mecha are ok, then why not the ZSB prototypes, super alphas, or the sentinels micronian pods?



Then there are the marginally different factions like the marines for the UEDF. They may not be a completely new faction but they're frankly not much more unique than most space marine chapters are from each other. In the end, it's not an issue though until after they hit the big 6 factions in the 3 eras first as that is where the money is.


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 judgedoug wrote:


From what I gather, PB is a blind idiot giant fumbling around smashing into things and incapable of doing anything at all while simultaneously being an evil mustache twirling mastermind completely redesigning rulesets and weighting forums users posts to send their KS packages later than others based on an evil algorithm

Gotcha.

You've been playing too much Halo or 40k. Palladium is not a single hive mind flood type gestalt creature but rather a group of individuals. You can easily have a blind idiot giant working side by side with a mustache twirling villain to use your own words.

 warboss wrote:

While I agree that the potential for a licensed and now strictly regulated IP is less than something completely original, there is room for more than just 2 factions in each era if they just bring in the stuff that they previously disavowed. If the "experimental" mecha are ok, then why not the ZSB prototypes, super alphas, or the sentinels micronian pods?

Spoiler:

My eyes, they burn!!!! why... why would you do that?!

HG or PB cannot make designs that borrow from macross (thank god). That's why during HG's failed ks they borrowed from other anime for designs.

 paulson games wrote:

 warboss wrote:

While I agree that the potential for a licensed and now strictly regulated IP is less than something completely original, there is room for more than just 2 factions in each era if they just bring in the stuff that they previously disavowed. If the "experimental" mecha are ok, then why not the ZSB prototypes, super alphas, or the sentinels micronian pods?

Spoiler:

My eyes, they burn!!!! why... why would you do that?!

Those designs are all awesome! The two last Zentraedi pods look better than 90% of the wave 1 mini designs.

Man, You trippin' like Ed 209 on a flight of stairs.

Those mechs are a train wreck of aesthetics. They can't decide if they want to be boxy with round parts, or round with boxy parts. The reason why Kawamori's designs for Macross/Robotech (and the Transformers) characters all work so well is that he has a very unified and clean cohesion in the design aesthetics. RDF Destroids are boxy throughout the whole design, Veritechs, Zentaedi, Bioroids, Invid are all rounded organic shapes.

Those Palladium designs just a jumble. The one that looks the best is probably the officer pod with the color where most of it flows with the exception of the arms. The second version doesn't even look like it could move, it's legs are just straight tubes and boxes with no appearance of articulation. Every part on that drawing seems to be a conflict between 50% round and 50% box. It tries to ape the officer pod in a very basic form but misses almost every design element that establishes the flow and balance in Kawamori's iconic Glaug design.



They remind me of the quality work that you see airbrushed on the side of a 70's style van. Wizards, Dragons, and Unicorns etc with lightning bolts, magic auras and attempts at mood lighting. The ideas are obviously pretty grand in the artists head but the execution is pretty flat and disjointed so it just doesn't come out right.

 paulson games wrote:
Those mechs are a train wreck of aesthetics. They can't decide if they want to be boxy with round parts, or round with boxy parts. The reason why Kawamori's designs for Macross/Robotech (and the Transformers) characters all work so well is that he has a very unified and clean cohesion in the design aesthetics. RDF Destroids are boxy throughout the whole design, Veritechs, Zentaedi, Bioroids, Invid are all rounded organic shapes.

Those Palladium designs just a jumble. The one that looks the best is probably the officer pod with the color where most of it flows with the exception of the arms. The second version doesn't even look like it could move, it's legs are just straight tubes and boxes with no appearance of articulation. Every part on that drawing seems to be a conflict between 50% round and 50% box. It tries to ape the officer pod in a very basic form but misses almost every design element that establishes the flow and balance in Kawamori's iconic Glaug design.

They're supposed to be a mix of the two design aesthetics because the mechs in the RPG fluff are a mix of the two. They're human designed mechs for zentraedi soldiers that retain the basic shape and similar handling (but improved with better tech) to outfit the zentraedi who left with the REF from earth. What you see as a problem is the exact goal they're working towards so I guess they spectacularly succeeded.

Soul Samurai wrote:
So I've started skimming the rules. Am I reading this right? A standard VF-1A in Guardian mode can move 40 inches in a single turn and then fire all it's weapons? If that's the case, then that's pretty insane. I mean, that's pretty much a whole table width! Coming from Warmachine, I just don't get that.

What's more, if I'm right, in Fighter mode it can "only" move 36 inches, and only in a straight line? So it's faster in Guardian mode than in Fighter mode as well as being more manoeuvrable? And fire more weapons to boot? That makes even less sense to me.

Oops, looks like I was wrong before; missed the Afterburner rule: in Fighter mode it can move 72 inches in a single turn! Is that right?

Yes.....and No.

A player can boost 2x with a VF-1A. This forces it to move 6-12 inches on the first move plus another 6-12 for each time it boosts. The Afterburner part is not optional and it WILL move another 12 inches plus 12 for each time it boosted it's speed. Each boost attempt, note this is an attempt, costs one command point and will require a 6+ adding the units PIL. The second move must be the full amount.

So yes a VF-1A can potentially move 72 inches in a turn. A VF-1J on the other hand can potentially move 96 inches since it has a PIL of 3 and the VF-1S has a PIL of 4 and can potentially move 120 inches in a single activation.

Leaving the table at present makes the unit effectively dead. Also if you boost 3 times hoping to get 2 successful rolls but get 3 the present rules force you to use all 3 successes. I'm hoping that will change.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On a side note the FPA can also boost and potentially move 48 inches in one activation with no risk of being forced to fly off the table.

Thanks for the heads-up on the "CoolStuffInc" sale, I bought more Warhammers... er,... "Tomahawks", I like them, I will get Moar!
Oddly enough, some Battletech stuff I wanted on sale as well so it all worked out, you guys are awesome.

Robotech a dead game?
It will only be as alive as those willing to play it.
Like others, I am getting close to a minimal force for both sides together.
I plan on a demo at the FLGS as soon as I have something looking OK.
I like what we got being somewhat self-contained.
Since PB likes to let their product "ride" as-is the GW constant push to upgrade is not a factor.
I figure getting enough for a bit of everything is the goal and then purchasing is done.
Buying battleoids for Battletech is just a side bonus for PB.
I think I will see if I can demo for Hotlead (http://www.hotlead.ca/) which is held late March.
It seems like a reasonable goal and is the ideal venue to showcase: most people go to this to try games they usually do not play.

I have been seeing a few good YouTube videos of fantastic painted miniatures so they are slowly getting out there.
Seeing the tiny decals added successfully was a great moral booster: they are done easily AND happen to look awesome.

What about Wave 2??
I think all the Ninja / PB talk is a roundabout way of expressing concern of how will Wave 2 go.
Some of the top wanted items are in that (armored and "super" Valkyrie) and getting a few Zentradi foot pounders I would like to see.
The silence from PB at this time I think is more due to them working more than they had in decades and are probably taking a rest even if our "down-under" friends are getting unnecessary delays.

Only in Amerika!!!
The discussion of American vs. everyone else customers is rather silly: pretty much any company will state if "foreign" sales/shipping is done.
PB had the opportunity to choose to restrict their backers to USA or North America only but they did not.
So figuring out cost effective means of getting shipping they had time and external resources available to draw-on.
I think they have a "not done here" mentality that they must handle everything themselves where they can (external groups have less control = not work to PB best interest) cause these fun moments.
Sorry, I cannot accept that the "foreign" backers should have some blame for the delay and "should have known better", consumers should expect good service when it is made available to them. Having only one place to go for Robotech tabletop pretty much forces the customer to purchase anyway: there was no other choice.

Bone to pick...
Complaining of past fiascos as rather pointless now (other than for taking present and future official statements with a grain of salt), all we can do is hold their feet to the fire for wave 2 and point to the FAQ/Errata/Update being a needed and a normal thing for war gaming.
If the updates do not happen, then Robotech for "official" support will die on the vine but will give opportunity for fan-base "official" changes (thinking of how Epic 40k is handled).

At least now that items are released to retail, I do not have to deal directly with PB which is a wonderful feeling.

Can you link the fantastic painted minis vids? I've only found mediocre to awful.

Depends on where you look. Here are a few pics, sorry no vids, from the last couple days in Facebook.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Here's some more
http://robotechrpgtactics.boards.net/thread/78/first-batch-battlepods

 Mike1975 wrote:
Yes.....and No.

A player can boost 2x with a VF-1A. This forces it to move 6-12 inches on the first move plus another 6-12 for each time it boosts. The Afterburner part is not optional and it WILL move another 12 inches plus 12 for each time it boosted it's speed. Each boost attempt, note this is an attempt, costs one command point and will require a 6+ adding the units PIL. The second move must be the full amount.

So yes a VF-1A can potentially move 72 inches in a turn. A VF-1J on the other hand can potentially move 96 inches since it has a PIL of 3 and the VF-1S has a PIL of 4 and can potentially move 120 inches in a single activation.

Leaving the table at present makes the unit effectively dead. Also if you boost 3 times hoping to get 2 successful rolls but get 3 the present rules force you to use all 3 successes. I'm hoping that will change.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On a side note the FPA can also boost and potentially move 48 inches in one activation with no risk of being forced to fly off the table.

120? Jeez! Does Rick add another point of PIL to that?

To be honest, I'm kinda warming to the idea of being able to zoom your mechs crazy distances; as long is it's balanced, it sounds like a fun thing to do. Being able to fly a Guardian 40 inches or more and then buy tons of attacks I'm not so sure about. Well, I'm still stuck in a Warmachine mindset, so I don't know how it will actually play out on the table.

Soul Samurai wrote:

 Mike1975 wrote:
Yes.....and No.

A player can boost 2x with a VF-1A. This forces it to move 6-12 inches on the first move plus another 6-12 for each time it boosts. The Afterburner part is not optional and it WILL move another 12 inches plus 12 for each time it boosted it's speed. Each boost attempt, note this is an attempt, costs one command point and will require a 6+ adding the units PIL. The second move must be the full amount.

So yes a VF-1A can potentially move 72 inches in a turn. A VF-1J on the other hand can potentially move 96 inches since it has a PIL of 3 and the VF-1S has a PIL of 4 and can potentially move 120 inches in a single activation.

Leaving the table at present makes the unit effectively dead. Also if you boost 3 times hoping to get 2 successful rolls but get 3 the present rules force you to use all 3 successes. I'm hoping that will change.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On a side note the FPA can also boost and potentially move 48 inches in one activation with no risk of being forced to fly off the table.

120? Jeez! Does Rick add another point of PIL to that?

To be honest, I'm kinda warming to the idea of being able to zoom your mechs crazy distances; as long is it's balanced, it sounds like a fun thing to do. Being able to fly a Guardian 40 inches or more and then buy tons of attacks I'm not so sure about. Well, I'm still stuck in a Warmachine mindset, so I don't know how it will actually play out on the table.

Rick adds +1 PIL AND one free Boost without paying Command Points. That being said Boosting as it is a double edge sword. You can fly over something and strafe or bomb them but if you fly off the table.....

I'd houserule for now that if you fly off you can come back on the same edge you left in D3 turns or something. Also allow a player to reduce the # of boosts if he makes more than he needs.

You can zoom up and deal out some destruction but any unit you do that to is extremely vulnerable. A unit without it's squadron can be slaughtered pretty easily.

 Mike1975 wrote:
Also allow a player to reduce the # of boosts if he makes more than he needs.

You can't measure beforehand?

You can measure beforehand but if you want to boost once, fear you are going to fail and make 2 rolls and both succeed, you are forced to move 36 inches during your afterburner movement.

Sounds like there's a built in risk... Why make it a no-brainer?

It all depends on table size in the end. With smaller tables you will never boost in fighter mode.

 Mike1975 wrote:
http://robotechrpgtactics.boards.net/thread/78/first-batch-battlepods

That guys is very inspiring. I think my January downtime (working less at work) is going to be split between Robotech and Bolt Action.

Joyboozer wrote:
Can you link the fantastic painted minis vids? I've only found mediocre to awful.

This guy seemed pretty good: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheRendar/videos
Another:http://mindofkeifus.blogspot.ca/2014/11/robotech-vf-1j-valkyrie-veritech-fighter.html
Another:http://thepaintingchallenge.blogspot.ca/2014/12/from-byronm-15mm-wwii-germans-and.html
Ya'know:http://theminiaturespage.com/boards/msg.mv?id=365308
Ditto:http://cornumortem.blogspot.ca/2014/11/robotech-regult-battlepod.html

Hope that helps.

I just picked up the basic boxset,a nd looked at all the sprues. I was a bit unnerved looking at the Valks.

I am wondering when the Spartans/Gladiators (or whatever they are called now) Destroid boxes are coming out?

Also, since I am lazy, does anyone want to tell me what is in Wave 2?

 Easy E wrote:
I just picked up the basic boxset,a nd looked at all the sprues. I was a bit unnerved looking at the Valks.

I am wondering when the Spartans/Gladiators (or whatever they are called now) Destroid boxes are coming out?

Also, since I am lazy, does anyone want to tell me what is in Wave 2?

Can get the Spartans and Gladiators now in a separate box.

There's a flyer in the basic box that has Wave 1 on one side and Wave 2 on the other side

Hmmmm, my FLGS did not have the other Destroid box, so they lost my money.... For now.

The painting examples are very helpful.

It appears to me that these models are designed to be washed and stained. Drybrushing gives a really harsh look that does not photograph well (although it probably looks just fine on the tabletop).

 paulson games wrote:

 warboss wrote:

While I agree that the potential for a licensed and now strictly regulated IP is less than something completely original, there is room for more than just 2 factions in each era if they just bring in the stuff that they previously disavowed. If the "experimental" mecha are ok, then why not the ZSB prototypes, super alphas, or the sentinels micronian pods?

Spoiler:

My eyes, they burn!!!! why... why would you do that?!

HA HA HA! I feel the same way every time I look at the Sentinels stuff. It was pointed out by someone that the same people made Southern Cross. Hiroshi OGAWA was the lead mechanical designer. But according to the Sentinels WIKI (I know, Primary sources and all that) HG was very much in control of the design process and sent many things back to be redone. Including a de-emphassis on Rick and Lisa. From what I understand HG cannot do the further adventures of rick and lisa becuase they are not allowed derivative use of the Macross IP. (unless they play nice Big West)

I do worry about robotech being a very limited IP and the company controlling that IP (HG). The most popular setting (macross) can only use the stuff from SDF Macross. This is more limiting that is seems because a lot of people take Macrosso You Remember Love for granted. Like Strike Valkyries and even the reconfigured cockpit. The back story fleshed out in Macross Zero is out even though it was quite compelling. Becuase the popularity of macross eclipsed the other two properties so greatly there is not a ton of information or notes on Super Dimensional Calvary Southern Cross or Genesis Climber Mospeada. You can get a few model kits but that's about it.

I do find it interesting that for all the slaming of SC. It was not a ratings failure but rather it's Toy Company Went out of Business. A lot like the Sentinels and Matchbox.

rigeld2 wrote:
Sounds like there's a built in risk... Why make it a no-brainer?

Also, you're using up command points you could use to defend the mech you're likely putting into harm's way. And, since I haven't played, how likely is it you will actually have enough command points to triple move + max attack (+dodge/roll)?

Anyone else gotten and used their laminator that was posted earlier in the thread? I got mine and used it for some robotech cards in case I ever play a game. It works quite quickly although the surface seems a bit visually (but not tactile) splotchy when looked at from an angle even when I ran it through twice. I don't think is due to the admittedly mediocre printer I used as I didn't notice it before laminating. Ultimately, it was a great deal for the price.

 warboss wrote:
Anyone else gotten and used their laminator that was posted earlier in the thread? I got mine and used it for some robotech cards in case I ever play a game. It works quite quickly although the surface seems a bit visually (but not tactile) even when I ran it through twice. I don't think is due to the admittedly mediocre printer I used as I didn't notice it before laminating. Ultimately, it was a great deal for the price.

My acid tape (lamination sheet) works quite well. Now I've this crazy urge to laminate some military maps

 warboss wrote:

 paulson games wrote:
Those mechs are a train wreck of aesthetics. They can't decide if they want to be boxy with round parts, or round with boxy parts. The reason why Kawamori's designs for Macross/Robotech (and the Transformers) characters all work so well is that he has a very unified and clean cohesion in the design aesthetics. RDF Destroids are boxy throughout the whole design, Veritechs, Zentaedi, Bioroids, Invid are all rounded organic shapes.

Those Palladium designs just a jumble. The one that looks the best is probably the officer pod with the color where most of it flows with the exception of the arms. The second version doesn't even look like it could move, it's legs are just straight tubes and boxes with no appearance of articulation. Every part on that drawing seems to be a conflict between 50% round and 50% box. It tries to ape the officer pod in a very basic form but misses almost every design element that establishes the flow and balance in Kawamori's iconic Glaug design.

They're supposed to be a mix of the two design aesthetics because the mechs in the RPG fluff are a mix of the two. They're human designed mechs for zentraedi soldiers that retain the basic shape and similar handling (but improved with better tech) to outfit the zentraedi who left with the REF from earth. What you see as a problem is the exact goal they're working towards so I guess they spectacularly succeeded.

Even back in the 90's they were terrible designs. I hope those abominations never see the light of day. I have to agree with Paulson on this. I'm just to used to the designs of kawamorri. They look too much like cheap knock offs.

rigeld2 wrote:
Sounds like there's a built in risk... Why make it a no-brainer?

I agree, the fact that you're likely to fly off the table and "die" if you try to go too fast sounds like a good way to balance the speed boost with a risk/reward mechanic. Plus there's a cinematic quality to boosting as much as you can to make sure you can fly across the entire table and deliver a single, potentially game-winning shot, even though you know you're dooming yourself (well, your model). Reminds me of that one time in that Macross OVA when the guy takes the limiters off his veritech and pushes it so hard that his eyes explode.

Personally, I think tying too many mechanics to the PIL stat was a mistake; it makes it harder to allow a model to do a few things better/worse without letting it do EVERYTHING better/worse (case in point: a couple of extra points of piloting makes a mech many, many times faster), at least without having to write lots and lots of special rules which you wouldn't have needed if you'd just added a new stat.

Still, so far the speed and movement mechanics are looking to me like the most unique feature this game has (at least compared to the few tabletop games I have experience with) and I imagine would give it a very different feel in practice. I'm actually starting to want to try to play the game after all. Overall I feel like the Command Point mechanic makes a nice half-way point between the very limited Focus mechanic of Warmachine and the completely unlimited Action Points mechanic of Infinity.

Does anyone else thinking actually manually swapping Veritech models every time you change mode will be a big pain? I'm thinking of just using some kind of custom counter to denote what mode each model is in. The added advantage of this is that you only have to assemble and paint each game model once, not THREE TIMES.

BTW it's probably been mentioned but I'd rather not have to go searching for it, so does anyone know if the "super" veritechs (the ones with just the extra missles and thrusters, not the extra armour) will be single models or add-on bits? I assume they will be part of Wave 2, so not expecting them anytime soon? I'm just wondering if it will be possible to magnetise the extra bits and add them to an existing model. Not that I think it will save any effort or anything, I just think it would be cool.

 warboss wrote:
If the "experimental" mecha are ok, then why not the ZSB prototypes, super alphas, or the sentinels micronian pods?

I'm going to go a bit against the grain, but I kinda like the Z1.

Adding a set of arms to the basic Z Pods is a generally good idea. Arms do improve the design, bringing the Pods more in line with the Glaug, MPA and FPAs. The arms don't need to (and shouldn't) be those particular arms, but should be slim with big hands, to match the slim legs with giant feet.