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So from this thread I have gotten that I am apparently the devil incarnate for not really bugging opponents whose lists are slightly over the limit to play exactly or under the points limit. Huh...

If you want to play the victim, sure. You can absolutely take it that way.

Or, being a reasonable and rational person, you can accept that what you and your group enjoy is not necessarily what other groups enjoy.

And that's 100% ok.

Happy gaming.

 kronk wrote:
If you want to play the victim, sure. You can absolutely take it that way.

Or, being a reasonable and rational person, you can accept that what you and your group enjoy is not necessarily what other groups enjoy.

And that's 100% ok.

Happy gaming.

Are you saying one doesn't have to get offended on the internet? What are you? Crazy?

I'm offended by your post telling me not to get offended!

I am fairly simple on how I handle that issue. Everyone around here plays exact or under. On the one time a guy came up to me and explained that his list was slightly over, I inquired how much. I looked over his list and asked him, very carefully, "Is there absolutely nothing you can do to make it exact or under, easily?" He said no, and I said fine. I then pulled out 1 extra 'nid and matched his list on price, exactly. I told him that these lists would be balanced, and he agreed.

The thing I ALWAYS do with a codex, is what i call the 5-0 method. Whenever I run through a codex, I never go for the "full package". I build each unit to an acceptable point, and make sure that each one ends in point price of either a 5 or 0. That way, no matter what happens, I can quickly configure a list that will always end up being exact.

But what if you play 1999 and he goes 1 point over and brings a double FoC list with 4-5 helldrakes ?

1. Did you agree with a 1999 point game or a 2000 point game?
2. Do you not want to play against double FOC? Make that point clear.
3. Do you not want to play against more than 4 hell drakes? Make that point clear.

You can play what if games all day, or just tell the other person what kind of game you are interested in playing. No sense in losing sleep over it.

 kronk wrote:
If you want to play the victim, sure. You can absolutely take it that way.

Or, being a reasonable and rational person, you can accept that what you and your group enjoy is not necessarily what other groups enjoy.

And that's 100% ok.

Happy gaming.

Some of the opinions here seem to disapprove of people like me who don't care about our opponent's going over (heck I can't be assed to call someone out on cheating more often than not) for encouraging bad play.

What you agree to allow your opponent to do is your business. Never let someone else stick their nose in your business.

You and your friends should always have YOUR fun.

It's mostly because after carefully packing and carrying around hundreds of nids, orks, chaos, and valhallans, shuffling through a binder to get a list, carefully unpacking all the models, and of course making a multihour drive across hellish traffic I really just want to play, I lack the energy to quibble over minor cheating. Especially not when I'm going to have to deploy model spam armies and spread them out to coherence for big games. After what seems like an eternity of setting up and laser pointing to ensure straightness at that point my brain really doesn't want to go through an argument.

I'm okay with going a little bit over, but conditionally.

For one, if it's a friendly game and you threw a list together in the last ten minutes, then I don't care if you're a couple points over. So long as it's a friendly game, go ahead, have fun with your 2003 point list.

That said, if it's a more official setting and you've had time to build your list, then you should have had time to figure out how to build a list at or under the points limit. If you've had a week to put together a list, then you've had a week to tinker with the units and hit that limit dead-on. I can sympathize if you play a codex with genuinely weird point values (Eldar, Tau, possibly Necrons) but still, you've had the time, drop a piece of wargear or a model from a squad.

Oh, and zero sympathy if you play Marines of any flavor. Seriously, almost every point value ends in a 5 or 0.

I go by the guidelines of 5% either way, and trying to chop off upgrades until you're at the points limit if possible.

 Selym wrote:
I go by the guidelines of 5% either way, and trying to chop off upgrades until you're at the points limit if possible.

5%? For 1500, that's 75 points, for some army, you can buy an extra cake with that, and probably some posh tea to go with that! That's quite a very generous margin to give.

Not saying you're wrong or anything, just surprised!

I personally dont mind one single point over, as a WOC player in fantasy my units mostly get odds here and there and cause me to have weird costs.

And my Eldar allies cost 161 aswell...However, prefer to stick within the limits myself, my Tau list is at 1k exactly despite something that is "less than optimal" but it filled out the points, and my WoC list is at 1996 out of 2000, because screw odds.

Baronyu wrote:

 Selym wrote:
I go by the guidelines of 5% either way, and trying to chop off upgrades until you're at the points limit if possible.

5%? For 1500, that's 75 points, for some army, you can buy an extra cake with that, and probably some posh tea to go with that! That's quite a very generous margin to give.

Not saying you're wrong or anything, just surprised!

Right? Thanks for the extra unit of 19 gretchin and a runtherd.

I'm thinking he meant 5 points. Otherwise, yes. I'll take a free 5-man sniper scout squad in my 1500 point list.

Makumba wrote:
But what if you play 1999 and he goes 1 point over and brings a double FoC list with 4-5 helldrakes ?

At that point he isn't doing it accidentally, he is doing it with full intent to piss you off. If he goes over the point limit like that, on purpose, just so he can take 4-5 helldrakes (which, I don't think I would play regardless. I don't see that as a fun game for my foot guard...) then you need to have a small chat with this man about sportsmanship...

 Kain wrote:
Some of the opinions here seem to disapprove of people like me who don't care about our opponent's going over (heck I can't be assed to call someone out on cheating more often than not) for encouraging bad play.

Disapproving of opponents going over is not the same as disapproving of people who don't care if their opponents go over.

You're reading something into the thread that just isn't there. It's entirely up to you what you choose to allow or not allow from your opponent.

I think saying 1-10 won't give you good info, I think a poll going 1-3, 4-~7, 8-15. I'm ok with MAYBE 2 points over, but mostly am pretty strict with the points limit. It's a limit, not a round number.

4 points is about my limit, I personally play same points or under, but if my opponent is like 4 points over im okay with that, 5 points over and you can probably drop a melta bomb, combi weapon, or something.

 conker249 wrote:
4 points is about my limit, I personally play same points or under, but if my opponent is like 4 points over im okay with that, 5 points over and you can probably drop a melta bomb, combi weapon, or something.

Why can't you drop that melta bomb or combi weapon at 4 points over?

 Kain wrote:
It's mostly because after carefully packing and carrying around hundreds of nids, orks, chaos, and valhallans, shuffling through a binder to get a list, carefully unpacking all the models, and of course making a multihour drive across hellish traffic I really just want to play, I lack the energy to quibble over minor cheating. Especially not when I'm going to have to deploy model spam armies and spread them out to coherence for big games. After what seems like an eternity of setting up and laser pointing to ensure straightness at that point my brain really doesn't want to go through an argument.

This.

As for going over purposely and then doubling FOC - at this point I'll probably ask to switch my warboss for Mekboss Buzzgob. RAW he comes riding a Stompa, and is a legal HQ for regular 40k Ork armies. Stompa > Helldrakes.

 DeffDred wrote:

Baronyu wrote:

 Selym wrote:
I go by the guidelines of 5% either way, and trying to chop off upgrades until you're at the points limit if possible.

5%? For 1500, that's 75 points, for some army, you can buy an extra cake with that, and probably some posh tea to go with that! That's quite a very generous margin to give.

Not saying you're wrong or anything, just surprised!

Right? Thanks for the extra unit of 19 gretchin and a runtherd.

Note the "chop off upgrades until you're at the points cost" part.



It includes chopping off whatever you can.

I'm fine with 5 pts either way (some codex's are frustrating with odd point items that make it difficult to get to a round number. Obviously I let my opponent know in advance (or the other way round)

It's not about being all evil and Rarrrrrr so angry, when I say I don't like it when someone is a point over. It's just, there is always a way to get yourself at or under the points limit, and going over it, just isn't playing fair. -just- taking one more meltabomb, weapon, man, whatever, might be the thing that scores you the game. It's unlikely, but it's better to just avoid it altogether.

As long as the army looks reasonable for the amount of points we agreed upon for the game..I truly can care less at any overage, but I play with friends and fellow military vets, so we don't sweat the small stuff, just play and have fun.

 Peregrine wrote:

 conker249 wrote:
4 points is about my limit, I personally play same points or under, but if my opponent is like 4 points over im okay with that, 5 points over and you can probably drop a melta bomb, combi weapon, or something.

Why can't you drop that melta bomb or combi weapon at 4 points over?

im not a stickler for points, most if not all my games are friendly based, so ill ask if they can, and if they dont they dont, ill still drink a beer with them afterwards.

Everyone in my meta would rather be under then try to squeak though with one or two points over.

I'm fine with someone being one point over in casual games.

But, I do my best to be at 1500pts exact, or even under, and I expect my opponents to do the same. I'm currently running a list that's 1495pts, because I don't have any Melta Bombs laying around to throw on one of my sergeants, nor do I have anything else i could buy that would keep me on the points limit.

It's generally good sportsmanship to be on or under the points limit.

As for WYSIWYG, I'm pretty lax about it, mostly because my vindicators do not have Stormbolters modeled on, as I built them during 3rd/4th Edition, before they came with them baseline. (also, I can't tell most Xenos weapons apart at a glance, for the most part. Well, lances are obvious, but other than that, beats the hell out of me.)

 Selym wrote:

 DeffDred wrote:

Baronyu wrote:

 Selym wrote:
I go by the guidelines of 5% either way, and trying to chop off upgrades until you're at the points limit if possible.

5%? For 1500, that's 75 points, for some army, you can buy an extra cake with that, and probably some posh tea to go with that! That's quite a very generous margin to give.

Not saying you're wrong or anything, just surprised!

Right? Thanks for the extra unit of 19 gretchin and a runtherd.

Note the "chop off upgrades until you're at the points cost" part.



It includes chopping off whatever you can.

Oh! Now that's just no fun! I'll still take a venom though, tyvm.

If you have no issue playing with someone who is a little over, that's fine. What isn't fine is making your list, discovering that it is one point over, and saying "eh, whatever, it's one point, no one will care." At that point, you are basically forcing any polite player to let you play with extra points or unfairly make them look like a hardass when they aren't. You build your list below the points limit. If it comes out over, you adjust. It doesn't matter how much you are over, you just don't go over. If the other guy goes over, and you really don't care., it's none of my business and you can do what you want. But it is wrong to build a list in advance, find it is a couple points over, and brin it in anyway, expecting your opponent to be ok with it and essentially pressuring them into letting you do that or look like TFG.