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just saw this today: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/LEGION_DEIMOS_PATTERN_WHIRLWIND_SCORPIUS.html

experimental rules here: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/s/Relic_Scorpius.pdf

thinking strictly in terms of casual 40k games (not heresy, not major tournaments), what are your thoughts? as a vanilla marine player that sees a lot of MEQ, this looks pretty damn sexy. if I'm honest, it almost looks too sexy... D3+1 str8 ap3 blasts with av13 front? ouch. would you field one or more of these in a 1500+ point game? why or why not?

It looks reasonably balanced. It's price puts it in the same slot as a vindi or an auto/las pred. So less "whirlwind support" and more "medium tank"

I think the d3+1 smalls are going to be roughly the same as the vindi's pie plate for removing squads. Yes, you need to sit still to get those, but you have range and a turret mount, so not a big deal. Roughly equal for removing MEQ, worse at TEQ and vehicles. Perk of range and better armor, not as good as shooting on the move.

Vs. the auto/las. Scorpious is better vs. troops, with the blasts. Worse at stripping hull points off tanks. At best you get 4 shots, where the pred gets those guaranteed. Pred can shoot at flyers. Scorp has one gun in the turret, so is better at hiding behind stuff and shooting.

I don't see why it has 12 side armor. That goes against the grain of modern marine tanks. Not sure if that is a normal thing on HH marine tanks.

But for the most part, I think it's fine. It might be slightly underpriced (due to the extra side armor over it's peers) but otherwise seems balanced.

I want it.

 varl wrote:
just saw this today: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/LEGION_DEIMOS_PATTERN_WHIRLWIND_SCORPIUS.html

experimental rules here: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/s/Relic_Scorpius.pdf

thinking strictly in terms of casual 40k games (not heresy, not major tournaments), what are your thoughts? as a vanilla marine player that sees a lot of MEQ, this looks pretty damn sexy. if I'm honest, it almost looks too sexy... D3+1 str8 ap3 blasts with av13 front? ouch. would you field one or more of these in a 1500+ point game? why or why not?

Hmm...more shots than a Manticore, better AP, higher Rate of Fire, and 5 more armor points all around...and it's 45 points less.

People wonder why many tournaments do not allow Forge World?

 NuggzTheNinja wrote:

 varl wrote:
just saw this today: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/LEGION_DEIMOS_PATTERN_WHIRLWIND_SCORPIUS.html

experimental rules here: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/s/Relic_Scorpius.pdf

thinking strictly in terms of casual 40k games (not heresy, not major tournaments), what are your thoughts? as a vanilla marine player that sees a lot of MEQ, this looks pretty damn sexy. if I'm honest, it almost looks too sexy... D3+1 str8 ap3 blasts with av13 front? ouch. would you field one or more of these in a 1500+ point game? why or why not?

Hmm...more shots than a Manticore, better AP, higher Rate of Fire, and 5 more armor points all around...and it's 45 points less.

People wonder why many tournaments do not allow Forge World?

Experimental rules=/=what it will have in the final running.

This is FW releasing a model, saying "here, help us playtest this a bit" and then after seeing how it preforms they release the final, traditionally more balanced model.

You kind of need permission to play with experimental rules anyway.

yeah, that's a fair point. it's likely things will be tweaked a bit in the final rules. on that note, how long does FW typically take to finalize rules for newly released models?

 varl wrote:
yeah, that's a fair point. it's likely things will be tweaked a bit in the final rules. on that note, how long does FW typically take to finalize rules for newly released models?

Not particularly long, usually just a few months.

 Nevelon wrote:
It looks reasonably balanced. It's price puts it in the same slot as a vindi or an auto/las pred. So less "whirlwind support" and more "medium tank"

I think the d3+1 smalls are going to be roughly the same as the vindi's pie plate for removing squads. Yes, you need to sit still to get those, but you have range and a turret mount, so not a big deal. Roughly equal for removing MEQ, worse at TEQ and vehicles. Perk of range and better armor, not as good as shooting on the move.

Vs. the auto/las. Scorpious is better vs. troops, with the blasts. Worse at stripping hull points off tanks. At best you get 4 shots, where the pred gets those guaranteed. Pred can shoot at flyers. Scorp has one gun in the turret, so is better at hiding behind stuff and shooting.

I don't see why it has 12 side armor. That goes against the grain of modern marine tanks. Not sure if that is a normal thing on HH marine tanks.

But for the most part, I think it's fine. It might be slightly underpriced (due to the extra side armor over it's peers) but otherwise seems balanced.

Good break down. Wouldn't hurt it to go up 10-15 points though, and drop back to 11 side armor.

 NuggzTheNinja wrote:

Hmm...more shots than a Manticore, better AP, higher Rate of Fire, and 5 more armor points all around...and it's 45 points less.

People wonder why many tournaments do not allow Forge World?

The blasts are also not Strength 10 so they're not as good at cracking armor, and they're much smaller blasts. In addition, they're playtest rules, as has been stated.

That said, this is still a sexy tank. The kit is lovely, and these rules are rock solid. It's basically a krak missile machine.

 Brother SRM wrote:

 NuggzTheNinja wrote:

Hmm...more shots than a Manticore, better AP, higher Rate of Fire, and 5 more armor points all around...and it's 45 points less.

People wonder why many tournaments do not allow Forge World?

The blasts are also not Strength 10 so they're not as good at cracking armor, and they're much smaller blasts. In addition, they're playtest rules, as has been stated.

That said, this is still a sexy tank. The kit is lovely, and these rules are rock solid. It's basically a krak missile machine.

Agree with you there! It looks fantastic!

 NuggzTheNinja wrote:
Hmm...more shots than a Manticore, better AP, higher Rate of Fire, and 5 more armor points all around...and it's 45 points less.

So what? It also has only 3" blasts (so rarely hitting more than one model per shot at maximum coherency distance), only STR 8 instead of STR 10, is not ordnance, only 48" range instead of full-table range, and only gets its full firepower if it doesn't move. Is it a better MEQ killer than the Manticore? Sure, but who cares? The Manticore isn't a MEQ killer, it's an anti-vehicle/anti-horde unit, and it's far better at those roles than the Scorpius.

People wonder why many tournaments do not allow Forge World?

Probably because people jump to conclusions and don't really understand the rules they're talking about. As demonstrated by this post.

Forgeworld: Crowdsourcing before Kickstarter made it cool.

And I like that, let's me get my hands on shinies earlier.

It fills a lovely hole in my Black Templars army; I now have something that can deal with troops behind Aegis defense lines from a distance reliably.

I want the model so I can field it as a normal Whirlwind