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how so? It's definitely a tabletop wargame, that can be played as a board game.
new update... in short, ks exclusives are now available individually, anyone who was confused if the silhouettes revealed yesterday were only available in the bundles were put right (they're not, there will be other ways to get them) and a cool new t-shirt was added.
Between KoW, the latest Dreadball debacle and the Unknown That is Deadzone, I don't feel comfortable enough to trust Mantic with any more preorder money.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/24 15:47:24
I'm in two minds right now have the BotB level which gives me $325 credit, so long as I can fill that with terrain, the trucks - basically anything generic and non Martian I'll stick with it as the game which I've no interest in is effectively free anyway at that level. currently I can fill about $150 worth which would mean I'm better off just going for the $1 add on level and get what I really want but if they add intact buildings then the $325 should be easy to spend. this will involve some last minute juggling I think.
Of course in the back of my mind is the thought that everything I want will be available next year and do I really want to spend that amount of money now on what's effectively a preorder. It might be time to go back to picking up bits and pieces as needed rather than one big KS splurge for everything in this case particularly as I'm not in it for the actual game so the added stuff means little to me.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/10/24 16:09:39
Costs you nothing to stay in until the last day, that way at least you help unlock stretch goals, maybe they will make something that will convince you to stay.
The old meta is dead and the new meta struggles to be born. Now is the time of munchkins.
Between KoW, the latest Dreadball debacle and the Unknown That is Deadzone, I don't feel comfortable enough to trust Mantic with any more preorder money.
Going to join you in that if it's not sorted by the time the KS ends. If it's this likely there will be substantial problems with the KS rewards that the release version doesn't get, count me out. They need to issue a "we screwed up, we'll make this right and won't pull a stunt like this again". It's still very fixable if they replace them for everyone that wants them mind you.
lord_blackfang wrote: Costs you nothing to stay in until the last day, that way at least you help unlock stretch goals, maybe they will make something that will convince you to stay.
It does however send a strong signal to Mantic. For most issues with a KS sure, but I can definitely understand why someone would pull now. I'm trying to decide whether I should do the same on principle.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/10/24 16:44:07
I dropped my 140$ early bird as well. I just don't trust Mantic enough after reading through the other KS threads. Plus I'm only interested in this as a board game, so I really just wanted the base models and some extra terrain. If the quality is there at retail I'll grab it then.
Did anyone else get the "Hey why'd you leave!?" survey?
Spoiler:
Mantic Games says:
Hi,
Hope you're well!
After a successful start to our Mars Attacks Kickstarter we're doing some research into everyone who has adjusted their pledge, and why. We are after your thoughts about the project so we can better learn from the experience and make sure we go about doing things the right way so that everyone is happy.
I was wondering if you could answer some questions for me?
- was it something we did or said that led to the adjustment?
- Is there anything we could be doing better to make sure that everyone's satisfied with what they are getting?
- What could we do to bring you back?
Thank you for your time, and I look forwards to any insight you can offer us
Thanks,
Sarah
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/24 17:21:38
I dropped too. For me, I think it was the entire add-on system that killed it.
I've seen all the calculations that it's more or less the same "value", if not better, than Deadzone, DreadBall, etc.., and I know most pledges come with X-amount of "free" credits for add-ons, but "subjectively / psychologically", it just turned me off.
With DreadBall / Deadzone, each day and each stretchgoal felt like getting a little surprise gift in the form of another free mini or two.
With Mars Attacks, each day and each stretchgoal felt like a salesmen with a foot inside my door (or inbox) trying to sell me another add-on.
Still in for $141 but am thinking of getting out. Nothing against Mantic but I don't have room for another boardgame in my house.
I got out of it to. I had a BotB pledge but I just didn't want to wait till next year when I got thing now I need to pay (like bills...). For what i want to do with the game, it was oing to cost as much as a 40K army, so it was kind of hard to invest that much money in a counts as army. I think I am going to wait till later on and see how they do the army deal for Warpath (I was told by Mantic that they was going to make a army deal next year and rules for Warpath).
The only thing that will keep me from getting stuff next year is the cool exclusives only available to preorders. There is just way too many of them that you only get on the KS. I think maybe one or two would be nice but there is just too many KS exclusives.
I guess I wouldn't mind PDF rules for the martians in dreadball or deadzone, but I don't want them added into the main rules of the game.
I am also still on the edge of bumping up a level to the 150 (or EB if I find one), or staying at 90. At 90 I would just get the expansion, but I feel like the 150 would be a nice level to be at.
$150 is a cool place to be. You can still get an awful lot of extras to enhance your board game, but you haven't started spending proper wargame prices yet... not really. Watch out for Alien Abduction. That one starts the slippery slope of doing AA+IA or doubling the $300 pledge level just because... =/
As to your mention of PDF... how would them being in an official PDF not be adding them to the main rules of the game? No they won't get their own pages into the main rulebooks in future prints... but they'd be 100% viable and usable etc. I guess its a fluff thing, to me it seems like making rules at all soft-weaves them into the universe.
GrimDork wrote: $150 is a cool place to be. You can still get an awful lot of extras to enhance your board game, but you haven't started spending proper wargame prices yet... not really. Watch out for Alien Abduction. That one starts the slippery slope of doing AA+IA or doubling the $300 pledge level just because... =/
As to your mention of PDF... how would them being in an official PDF not be adding them to the main rules of the game? No they won't get their own pages into the main rulebooks in future prints... but they'd be 100% viable and usable etc. I guess its a fluff thing, to me it seems like making rules at all soft-weaves them into the universe.
I guess I would be more happy if they had rules that made them playable, but not in the core universe and rules. Like how White Dwarf used to have rules for unique army lists, like IG with all battletanks and no foot troops. A PDF will make it happen, but it shouldn't (well LR as troops should) be in the main rules of the game.
I think I see where you're going. You want to have a martian dreadball team/ deadzone team/warpath army, but you don't necessarily want the Mars Attacks! martians incorporated into the Warpath universe in a fluff sense. I can understand that. I personally don't mind, and find it kind of funny. But the Martians are kind of zany and random enough that just randomly popping in and invading suffices for 'fluff' and they don't *need* to be included. Mantic probably couldn't write them in officially anyway what with the IP belonging to Topps and all of that.
Nice update for those wanting freebies, with 5 Tiger Corps Marines:
"These are a fantastic range of great looking figures based on the previously unseen cards. They will sell individually for $8 each, and as a bundle for $25.
However, for everyone who has backed the Mars Attacks Kickstarter so far and new pledges made before the end of Sunday 3rd November, we will throw the first 5 of them into pledges of The Will of Man ($100 and Early Bird) and up!"
I want those freebies, but I have no need to pledge at the Will of Man level because my brother is already getting BOTB. Will they still be available as a paid add on?
jmw23 wrote: I pledged around $150...what are Mantic's issues with other KS campaigns? I love the look of the martians, but I'm not married to my pledge.
KoW - great value in initial pledges, delivered first wave early and half of 2nd wave on time (second half of 2nd wave was late but they included extras as a 'sorry'!), had lots and lots of freebie stretch goals, but many final sculpts of freebie figures did not match concept art (this is where the KoW negativity comes from due to the big offenders such as the Men At Arms plastics, trolls, battle nuns, etc; there were excellent sculpts from this such as the paladins, gargoyles, golems, mincers, fleabags, etc; so a very mixed bag)
Dreadball - great value in pledges with tons and tons of freebies (free alternate sculpts, prone figures, free mvp's, etc) delivered all waves early or on time, iffy initial sculpts, 2nd wave sculpts great but had some casting issues, 3rd wave sculpts excellent with almost no casting issues but the initial production for 3rd wave pvc plastics did not meet expected demand (demand was very high) so many backers got metal figs instead of pvc plastic figs for some 3rd wave items - Mantic chose to deliver on time instead of delay for the pvc plastic restock from china
Loka - delivered on time afaik (did not personally participate in this one)
Deadzone - so far on time and some initial sculpts that fans did not like were changed (for the better) due to response, recent preview pics and models have had a majority good opinions, appears to be on-time
Mars Attacks looks to be avoiding their previous problems of concept art not translating to final models, as you can see the physical Mars Attacks models or 3d models well in advance and are not just some concept art.
other than that they have the best KS record of delivering early or on-time
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/10/25 20:24:10
"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke
jmw23 wrote: I pledged around $150...what are Mantic's issues with other KS campaigns?
Well, and for DreadBall, most initial releases (both the initial box and again now Ultimate) were/are available with retailers and on conventions long before they were shipped to backers, so non-Backers tend to have their stuff faster, weeks in some cases (as with the Ultimate box which has been on sale since Sept., while some backers are still waiting).
DreadBall initial launch also had limited-time mega-bundles that were the same value as the Kickstarter-sweet-spot pledges (and, as said, available through retail earlier), negating the price-benefit of Kickstarter as well as the time-benefit. Haven't seen those bundles since though. Will be interesting if Deadzone will have em.
jmw23 wrote: I pledged around $150...what are Mantic's issues with other KS campaigns?
Well, and for DreadBall, most initial releases (both the initial box and again now Ultimate) were/are available with retailers and on conventions long before they were shipped to backers, so non-Backers tend to have their stuff faster, weeks in some cases (as with the Ultimate box which has been on sale since Sept., while some backers are still waiting).
DreadBall initial launch also had limited-time mega-bundles that were the same value as the Kickstarter-sweet-spot pledges (and, as said, available through retail earlier), negating the price-benefit of Kickstarter as well as the time-benefit. Haven't seen those bundles since though. Will be interesting if Deadzone will have em.
Source please? I've not seen this at all.
Some Dreadball copies went out as a pre-release before all the backer shipments had gone out. This was only the core game that was released and didn't include any of the extra teams that the backers received. It also wasn't "weeks", it was a week.
And really going to have to see a source on these limited-time mega-bundles please. I have never heard of them. Best I can think is that some retailers pledged and just sold them straight back on. Bear in mind that all the Kickstarters have had "retailer only" pledges which could account for this.
It took them about a month to ship all the Dreadball wave 3 stuff (began just after 23rd September, ended 23rd October) and I'm pretty sure the other two waves were similar, maybe longer for wave 1 as they had to pack the game boxes
as china didn't bother
DIstributors/stores got their stock near the beginning of each wave (I suspect in part as it's easy to ship game boxes only, and in part as it frees up warehouse space to work)
so if you were unlucky enough to be in the last days shipment you could be watching people play for a month or so
Now this is not something that bothers me (I got wave 3 last day shipping, but that was a positive as I got some metal minis for my nameless team),
but if it does bother you then beware as I'm sure they'll follow the same pattern with Deadzone & Mars Attacks
jmw23 wrote: I pledged around $150...what are Mantic's issues with other KS campaigns?
Well, and for DreadBall, most initial releases (both the initial box and again now Ultimate) were/are available with retailers and on conventions long before they were shipped to backers, so non-Backers tend to have their stuff faster, weeks in some cases (as with the Ultimate box which has been on sale since Sept., while some backers are still waiting).
DreadBall initial launch also had limited-time mega-bundles that were the same value as the Kickstarter-sweet-spot pledges (and, as said, available through retail earlier), negating the price-benefit of Kickstarter as well as the time-benefit. Haven't seen those bundles since though. Will be interesting if Deadzone will have em.
Source please? I've not seen this at all.
Some Dreadball copies went out as a pre-release before all the backer shipments had gone out. This was only the core game that was released and didn't include any of the extra teams that the backers received. It also wasn't "weeks", it was a week.
And really going to have to see a source on these limited-time mega-bundles please. I have never heard of them. Best I can think is that some retailers pledged and just sold them straight back on. Bear in mind that all the Kickstarters have had "retailer only" pledges which could account for this.
Not sure what source you want or need? Release bundles were up on Mantic's website and they are no longer, as they were limited. In essence, they were the 3 or 4 most popular pledges from the KS as a "bundle-deal" through their online store. I didn't take a screenshot. Not sure if somebody did. If you don't believe they existed, don't.
DreadBall retailer releases, etc.. it's the same. Look at the Salute reports, etc.. People picked up loads of DreadBall stuff at events like these, long before Backer's got theirs. My club is one of many who had DreadBall (through Wayland Games) weeks before I (Kickstarter-backer) ever got them. It was several weeks. As noted above, Ultimate between the retail release (Sept. 23rd) and the last shipments (about now) is already a month once again, and Ultimate was available at GenCon too I think (August?).
Again, it doesn't seem to bother most people, which is fine.
It annoyed me with DreadBall, and I only picked up the KS-exclusive hardcover from Deadzone more or less. I am not looking to pick up the discussion again, simply to point it out to the (minority of) people that care.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/10/25 22:32:48
Strange. I got my Dreadball wave 1 pledge before retailers. It shipped early to backers and I got mine in November. I think you're confusing the two different pledge levels Mantic had. the firsr one had a december delivery date and that ran out, the second had a january delivery date. They shipped both early. I was in the first portion if backers so I got mine before retail release; the second portion was sent at the same time as retail release
"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke
Gotta remember that retailers can be backers too, and there are special retailer only backer levels just for that case. So they'd get it as early as any other backer and be legit to sell them so.
judgedoug wrote: Strange. I got my Dreadball wave 1 pledge before retailers. It shipped early to backers and I got mine in November. I think you're confusing the two different pledge levels Mantic had. the firsr one had a december delivery date and that ran out, the second had a january delivery date. They shipped both early. I was in the first portion if backers so I got mine before retail release; the second portion was sent at the same time as retail release
A quick gander at the flags will solve the mystery methinks.
So, I guess I won't need anyone to grab me Blaine: I pledged a buck so I can add Blaine on. He's a good poster boy for Mantic (I like him better than Orcy), and I'll be happy to keep collecting models of him. $9 for the $1 pledge and $8 add seems fine to me.
Reality is a nice place to visit, but I'd hate to live there.
Manchu wrote:I'm a Catholic. We eat our God.
Due to work, I can usually only ship any sales or trades out on Saturday morning. Please trade/purchase with this in mind.
Loka - delivered on time afaik (did not personally participate in this one)
Has it shipped? I went in for just the Alessio figure on Hippo, but haven't heard anything about it and certainly haven't seen it. They must still be shipping?
As for MA, it looks like they have a little under 14 more days to add some more plastic scenery to the campaign, or it'll be time for me to drop my $300 pledge as well...
I wouldn't mind some more plastic scenery for it myself. After I let myself go a little too crazy on Bones2, I think BotB is all I can let myself do for MA. So I'm switching from *get a full-on martian army with saturation of most of the cool stuff* to *maybe get one of everything I particularly like and or will make for more interesting scenarios*. I think $325 in credit should be enough for the latter goal, I may have to skip some things, but not most.
and 
WIP
