HeroQuest 25th Anniversary Edition - Crowdfunding Shutdown yet again.

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**Catyrpelius**

decker_cky wrote:
Catyrpelius wrote:An interesting thread from The Geek, going into more depth about potential trademark issues with actual information.

Heroquest

There's no real legal information there.

Actual legal information on Spanish IP law seems to be here:
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/1076998/kickstarter-live/page/3

Search for the post by razagul, then it continues onto later pages. Not sure about the actual law behind it, but he does talk about Spanish IP law.

The link I posted shows that Gamezone has the Trademark for the name in Spain and Canada. No one knows if this was intentonal or not... However from what I've read I'm more inclined to belive the following. Hasbro unknowingly let the Trademark to the game slip in Spain and Canada, Gamezone was able to register the trademark before Hasbro could fix the problem. Kickstarters can only be run in three curancys, US, Canadian and UK, this explains why they are using the Canadian $, they don't have the rights to the game in the US or the UK. It also explains why they aren't using any of their established worldwide distributers, if they were to ship a shipping container worth of Hero Quest to anywhere but Spain and Canada it could be seized at customs and either destroyed, impounded or returned.

**decker_cky**

It shows they have the trademark in Spain, not in Canada. In Canada, the Hasbro trademark was expunged in 2007 for failure to renew.

http://www.ic.gc.ca/app/opic-cipo/trdmrks/srch/vwTrdmrk.do?lang=eng&status=&fileNumber=0676315&extension=0&startingDocumentIndexOnPage=1

The fact that Gamezone had the spanish trademark was already on page 3 of this thread.

**Catyrpelius**

decker_cky wrote:
It shows they have the trademark in Spain, not in Canada. In Canada, the Hasbro trademark was expunged in 2007 for failure to renew.

http://www.ic.gc.ca/app/opic-cipo/trdmrks/srch/vwTrdmrk.do?lang=eng&status=&fileNumber=0676315&extension=0&startingDocumentIndexOnPage=1

The fact that Gamezone had the spanish trademark was already on page 3 of this thread.

That doesn't really change my theory unfortunalty...

**corgan**

Pacific wrote:
carboncopy wrote:
I just find this funny how blindly people are throwing money at this

While at the same time the AVP kickstarter, people seem almost as skittish over, and have very little of the concerns above. It's arguably a larger license, but may not appeal to as many people.

While I agree with you to an extent Carboncopy, taking it from a 'glass half full' perspective.. (or 'overflowing tankard of dwarven ale' might be more appropriate!)

*No minis presented, not even renders, just drawings
1. Have you seen this company's back catalogue? A lot of people actually prefer to buy Gamezone miniatures to GW, despite them being similar price. That tells you something. They've made some stunning miniatures over the years, and this is actually the part of it I am most excited about.

*Company's first kickstarter
2. A lot of 1st time KS have been successful to an extent.. From the blurb it sounds like they have done some preparation - hopefully at worse this will be Sedition Wars, rather than Gates of Antares.

*Questionable licensing concerns
3. No sense in worrying about that, if some legal action starts the worse thing that can happen is the KS gets cancelled, we get our money back. Personally I think this is quite unlikely, considering Hasbro's track record and the fact that the guy who designed the original has not been heard from in 20 years within the industry.

*Questionable shipping concerns.
4. No worse than many other KS - chances are the value of the overall product will more than compensate.

*Unclear on mini material (Restic? could be just me who is unclear)
5. Don't really care about material, as long as its not the low grade stuff that Mantic used for their goblins or Finecast. Again, prepared to trust a company that has a proven track record.

*Multiple stretch goals that are more insulting than having no stretch goals (a boulder, blank cards, a chipboard tile)
6. Don't think that really matters that much TBH?

*So far, next to no communication.
7. Understandable given the language barrier, and that we are less than 24 hours in. Also, they can't possibly have expected it to move this much this quickly. It would have been nice to have an English-speaking company involved, but then you can blame that on the dumb-ass company or individuals who have been sitting on an absolute gold-mine of license for all these years and not done anything with it.

And that this is approaching AvP's pledge level within 24 hours I think tells you something about how popular the license is!

You put good points here I have to admit but there is one thing which I cannot accept and it has been mentioned before several times. There is no excuse for the language matter. If you want to sell your product internationally and when your biggest part of future clients are mainly native english speakers, there is no excuse for language problems. I can't believe that there is no adequate English speakers in the whole Spain which could deal with this (I personally know many).
Therefore the lack of communication,which for me is the most serious issue in this case, simply means at least bad organization if not anything more. It is really unacceptable to have gathered that amount of money, to have more than 3,000 comments on your project from people having serious questions and remain inaccesible...

And I have to recognise that Gamezone has greatly looking metal miniatures and an excellent in quality alternative in plastic dark elves (and recently also high elves), which will expand in other lines as well.

**Triple9**

I'm finding the lack of interaction from Gamezone a little concerning. Compare their interaction with Total Extinction, another Spanish KS, who have had amazing communication even if the project has struggled at points. I wonder if this is what they're like when the KS is running, what will it be like after it closes. We're not seeing any cheerleader messaging to keep the motivation up over the next 30 days.

**Absolutionis**

On the other hand, they're constantly updating their stretch rewards. I just don't think they figured out where the "Updates" button on Kickstarter is yet.

They're supposedly putting up an update in 50min.

First update at 18:00 EST / 00:00 CET(GMT+1) Stay tunned. - Kraken

**choasdwarflord**

*Questionable licensing concerns
3. No sense in worrying about that, if some legal action starts the worse thing that can happen is the KS gets cancelled, we get our money back. Personally I think this is quite unlikely, considering Hasbro's track record and the fact that the guy who designed the original has not been heard from in 20 years within the industry.

Problem is if it happens after it funds, there is zero guarantee you will get your money back. There is no protection under KS. Or it gets tied up in court for years and years to the same result, your out of money with no game in hand.

**corgan**

Absolutionis wrote:
On the other hand, they're constantly updating their stretch rewards. I just don't think they figured out where the "Updates" button on Kickstarter is yet.

They're supposedly putting up an update in 50min.

First update at 18:00 EST / 00:00 CET(GMT+1) Stay tunned. - Kraken

If this is so, then bad organization and planning is confirmed.
It seems impossible not someone from the company not read the comments on the kickstarter page as well as here...

**Hellfury**

I find the quip on the Guillotine secret pretty funny...

"Recently used on our shipping cost calculator designer"

XD

**TheAuldGrump**

I wa happy to read that the Kickstarter had begun, then made the mistake of calling my girlfriend during her dinner break to let her know - HeroQuest was the very first fantasy game that she ever played.

Have you ever had a thirty-three year old fangirl go 'EEEEEEEEEE

' in your right ear?

I expected her to be happy, I didn't expect her to be that happy - my ear is still ringing!

I pulled out one of my old Heroquest games a few weeks ago, because she had fond memories of the game. (And it is still a really fun game!)

And... now, I know what one of her Christmas presents is going to be - I own two copies of the original game. She knows about one, but does not know about the spare.... ('Merry Christmas honey! Here, have a twenty-four year old boardgame!'

)

The Auld Grump

**DaveC**

Ùpdate and it's a long un

Update #1

Nov 27, 2013
THE DAILY QUEST. #1
Comment
Before we go any farther, we would like to thank you all. Your support and comments are helping to make this project grow and mature.

After the first 24 hours, which have been long to say the least, we would like to share with you all, how we will be handling the updates and in what form we will be managing our communication with this community.

Every day there will be an official update, The Daily Quest, at 16:00 EST in the USA. In it we will go over what things we have been updating, centering our attention on, and how the development of the game parts are proceeding.

Also we will talk about the things you are worried about, to clarify as many doubts that you might have.

Seeing how the first day of this KS campaign has generated such a large quantity of questions, we see fit to dedicate this first update to a FAQ

Although, before anything, let’s go to our ELEPHANTE in the room and the cause of so much distress: shipping costs. We would like to say we are sorry as the shipping calculator was thought to be programmed to facilitate the correct shipping costs with your pledge, evidently that didn’t happen. The designer has been dealt with accordingly.

We are checking it out at the moment, making the appropriate changes to fix it and make it usable. Once we are certain that it is working correctly, we will make sure you are informed immediately.

And how the questions:

Can I buy more than one box? Yes, of course. It’s as easy as selecting more than one of the boxes you want. There is no limit

What language will the game be in? English, Spanish, French, German, Italian, and Russian. Each backer can choose what they want. Even if you have several games selected you can choose the language for each one. My language is not in the group of announced languages the game comes in.

Is there any way to get it translated? Of course there is, but there will have to be a minimum of people that want it for it to be in a language that is not already registered. We cannot set up a translation for a language for only 12 people as you can understand. Pass on the word, get other people to participate that speak your language and have them solicit it as well, this way we can truly attend to your petition. Fortunately it’s a big world.

The figures all have the same action stance? No figure from the box set or the add-ons will repeat its stance. Each one is individual and unique.

What size are the figures? 28/30 mm it is the same scale and general appearance as those of warhammer as compatible as well.

Are the silhouetted items in the core set works-in-progress or are they SGs? Works in progress. The SGs are not represented on the box content as they are all extra material.

Will you be providing additional information for the new heroes? YES, of course! All in good time we will make that information available

Can fans/backers provide ideas for new heroes? We love the idea, we actually do! As we have said, this is a project that is in the making, it is growing and maturing with everyone’s help and we will take advantage of the situation to turn it into something very alive! Stretch Goals

Can you provide more information for each of the SGs? In each daily update we will add information about the stretch goals that have been unlocked the day before.

For the blank card SG – are they just magic cards, or other cards? All the possible types, including the character control cards.

- For the blank card SG – how many are included? This depends on each type and how mant SDs are unlocked

Is the Ogre SG the same as the core set Ogre? No, every miniature is a unique person, different and with individual poses. In the development of the adventures the will also have different names and characteristics

For the two captive SGs – Are they just cool board pieces or are they part of quests? Part of the quests.

How is the “Primordial” Chaos card SG different than the core set Chaos cards? The knowledge of the primordial magic consumes the life points of the characters that use them. They can be very destructive but also for those who use them.

Can you provide hints or more information about upcoming SGs? No, we are sorry but no. the SGs will remain secret until the end. The entirety of the SG will be a great benefit to you. We are sure of this.

Is the secret room SG part of the quests? Yes, every piece we pffer has its place in some part of an adventure.

Will any additional heroes/monsters in the SGs also come with cards? Yes Is the descending ladders SG a replacement for an existing stairs token? No, it is an element that indicates an access to a lower (more sinister) level.

Will professional translations be done for all of the final products? Yes, each translation will be done by a professional with the help of native players

Can you clarify the shipping costs? You can use the calculator at (http://www.gamezoneminiatures.com/tienda/en/86-heroquest) to work out the final cost. Although to your great shame and disgrace at this moment is defunked and being refitted to work correctly.

Will you explore cheaper shipping options? We work with the Spanish postal service, that is the standard rate. It is true however that we are working to reduce the shipping costs. If anyone can help with their collaboration to find real options that lower the actual rate that would be amazing to say the least, we would all benefit from that as we as a company do not benefit from shipping costs in any way.

the voucher system on your website? Will it be part of the kickstarter? We are studying the possibility. This system works very well with our web page and our clients are quite satisfied with it up till now.

Will there be legal issues we should be worried about? No, GZ possesses the rights to this product there is no possible C&D

Is the target audience kids or adults? HQ has always been a game for everyone, and this version will be like by both young novice players to weather beaten veterans. It is not a Childs game, but it will not be unadvisable for young people to play.

Will the game be play tested for kids or adults? The game will be tested by veteran players from various countries.

Will you let fans/backers help play test? Actually the play tester group is closed, for the Alfa version, but feedback is always taken at face value and greatly appreciated.

Where is the Fimir? And what is a Drrakk? The fimir are an IP that does not belong to us. The Drrakk will be present. Alittle later on we will present them to you. (they are getting hungry)

Will you be using “Zargon” or “Morcar”? Yes, both of these characters will have outstanding parts in our quests, Both!

Will there be quests designed for solo play? We are studying this posiblity. Our intentions at the moment are to add solo play rules to a later expansion itself.

Will you maintain the HQ25 website for the fans in the future? (Example – forums, ordering additional or replacement models, downloading card templates, news and information on expansions, etc.) All of the HQ material will be perminatly avalible at the GZ online store, with the posiblity to buy all of the components seperatly. Forums no, that is HQ’s fans job.

Why is the kickstarter in CAD and not USD or Euros? Because the project is being funded threw Canada.

Do I add shipping charges to my Kickstarter pledge? Shipping costs exist, this is very unfortunate but true, although we will work to reduce them.

Will the game mechanics be the same as the original? Can you provide information about possible changes? The Spirit of the original is very present, but the mechanics are being optimized

Will the figures be the same size as the original game? The miniature will be “heroic Scale” 28mm

What material will the models be made of? Resin. High quality plastic resin.

Will you be doing daily updates if there is new information to share? Yes, the plan is a daily updaye.

Will the box include each language? Or will we need to each specify a language? Each backer will choose the language they wish to receive their edition in.

Will the same quests be used from the original HQ? NO! there will be 50 new and exciting adventures

Will the hero sheets be tear-off pads? We are studying this at the moment

Will there be Kickstarter addons? Yes, always optionals.

A poll about the daily update time.

We would like to know if the time we have established for our daily update sits well with the community or if it would be more convenient to change it to a better time that is more readily available for the majority of those interested. We will proceed with the poll to help os orientate ourselves to what is best. Thank you for your collaboration and patience. -

Remember we are working for you.

updated stretch goal chart - all in addition to boxed content

Spoiler:

**Wolfun**

Damn. Why is it at the same time as Xmas. And AVP. =(
I can't afford everything.

**Pacific**

Great, thanks for posting that DaveC !

Now, I guarantee that the next 10 pages of this thread will be spent having to quote that, answering questions that could have been answered by reading that comment.

**Hellfury**

Pacific wrote:
Great, thanks for posting that DaveC !

Now, I guarantee that the next 10 pages of this thread will be spent having to quote that, answering questions that could have been answered by reading that comment.

Prolly. But the important part is that the info is not only available, but it is consistent as it is not being filtered down the telephone game. Just direct them to the faq and the jobs done.

An idea so crazy, it just might work.

**kojku**

Game Zone has only the trade name for Spain. Any work derived from an original without permission is not legal. The trade name does not give you legal to copy that original.Han changed almost everything with the original, but if you call 25 anniversary ....
http://www.oepm.es/es/signos_distintivos/detalle.html?ref=M%203040965
I hope you do not judge all companies Spanish games for them, I think this will end badly

**Joyboozer**

Still no close ups of the minis?

**judgedoug**

kojku wrote:
Game Zone has only the trade name for Spain. Any work derived from an original without permission is not legal. The trade name does not give you legal to copy that original.Han changed almost everything with the original, but if you call 25 anniversary ....
http://www.oepm.es/es/signos_distintivos/detalle.html?ref=M%203040965
I hope you do not judge all companies Spanish games for them, I think this will end badly

Didn't TSR learn the hard way you can't patent game mechanics? I think the only notable, protected patent on game mechanics is "Tapping" granted to WotC.

Gamezone owning the trade name for Heroquest in Spain is all they need. I could make a carbon copy of Heroquest and call it Judgedougquest, a dungeon crawl game with heroes and monsters and some funny dice that plays exactly like Heroquest and I'd be just fine.

**Grot 6**

Hellfury wrote:
Alpharius wrote:
Yikes - settle down there!

Gamezone themselves are sort of encouraging this type of talk by only kind of sort of hinting and talking about whatever it is they had to do in order to feel like it was OK to make "Heroquest".

Sorry. The intent for the caps lock was not to yell or set on cruise control for cool.

But because this point keeps getting missed when people discuss this issue and then lather themselves into a furor, especially where GW is concerned when they are entirely a non issue for this game.

Its like discussing the weather in Philly, but because there was a tornado in wisconsin off and on for a few years, then there has to be a hurricane coming to that will lay waste to Philly.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Bolognesus wrote:
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
You know it'll be fun though

(and to stay on topic, Heroquest you gotta love it!)

Oh, just brilliant. Hordes of blithering idiots without the first *actual* clue of how IP law (tends to) work, for example already asserting there's 'no way' to legally use existing game mechanics - this'll be fun if watching a horde of mentally challenged forum posters be unshakably certain of their own little legal fairytales. Have fun, I'm out

Precisely. And apparently discussing such issues is "On Topic".

Throw the subject out an airlock, I say. Because in space, nobody can hear your nonesense.

Oh settle down there sparky.

Its a relevent question, and its already been answered, but don't let that stop a good dose of moral outrage while you wave your IPeen around. I've already got a few of thier figures, and said ALREADY that I was interested in this one and was going to back it in a week or so, so your overreaction is just that...

I gives a feth about IP law by the way, so intelligent or not, the concerns on the table is about getting this puppy funded and then halfway through next year to have some clownass come up behind us and say- "Yo, we've come across an issue, sorry but we had some ... issues and we can't get the game out like we wanted..." without so much as a reacharound.

It happens with something this popular sometimes. I/E Axes and Anvils. I/E Fully funded, but craps the bed.

Even so, what do you care? People are asking some relevent questions and all you have for them is to shout them down? You'd think YOU were married to the project or something.

They want around 150.00 a pop, don't you think that deserves even just a little discussion, or should we just sit around here like Oliver, asking for "MORE" as these KS projects come and go?

Point I'm at right now, I'm getting burned out on "Kickstarter, and really do long for the days of just up and going down to the store for a new game or two, and NOT having to sacrifice a goat and two mutts over it.

And FWIW, Gamezones minies are BETTER then the ... other ones. Get one or two for a laugh and compair them. GREAT figures, WORTH the price.

**Hellfury**

To be clear, I don't have an issue with the legal discussion as a topic unto itself.
Its just difficult to read info about a game when each an every game has its own legal eagle team debating the finer points in the middle of the crowd.

I am being completely honest when I say that I see so many legal expert discussions taking place, that it really does deserve its own subforum. Just look at posting habits since the GW crackdown of 2009.

**Herzlos**

Hellfury wrote:
judgedoug wrote:
Grot 6 wrote:
As much as I'd like it, I don't know how its going to fair. Some clownass is going to throw the IP hammer at them and GW's law dogs are more then likely going to pee in the punchbowl.
This is a very streamlined project, though. LOOK at that. easy to read, good looking figures right there, and a simple streach goal list, that grows. MIght have to slip them a C note and see how it does.

Its getting the funding, thats for sure.

GW literally has nothing to do with it, and they only barely had anything to do with the original Heroquest (they were contracted for character designs).

Also this.Why is this so hard for people to grasp?

They did the minis and some background. All of which has been removed from this edition, including fimir.

Again, GW HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS AND IF THEY MADE CLAIMS OTHERWISE THEY WOULD BE LAUGHED OUT OF COURT.

That's never stopped GW in the past. I'm sure what's left of the legal team are already trying to find ways to shut this down.

That said, I'm still pretty interested in this, especially with the stretch goals, so I'm going to wait and see what happens.

**Reecius**

Glad to see this one doing so well, I absolutely loved KS as a kid! This brings back good memories, good luck with your KS, guys!

**Catyrpelius**

judgedoug wrote:
kojku wrote:
Game Zone has only the trade name for Spain. Any work derived from an original without permission is not legal. The trade name does not give you legal to copy that original.Han changed almost everything with the original, but if you call 25 anniversary ....
http://www.oepm.es/es/signos_distintivos/detalle.html?ref=M%203040965
I hope you do not judge all companies Spanish games for them, I think this will end badly

Didn't TSR learn the hard way you can't patent game mechanics? I think the only notable, protected patent on game mechanics is "Tapping" granted to WotC.

Gamezone owning the trade name for Heroquest in Spain is all they need. I could make a carbon copy of Heroquest and call it Judgedougquest, a dungeon crawl game with heroes and monsters and some funny dice that plays exactly like Heroquest and I'd be just fine.

You can get a patent for a game mechanic, it's difficult to the point where it's been rarely done... WotC's "Tapping" mechanic is the most notable.

Your also correct that you could make Judgedougquest and be perfectly fine. What you couldn't do is use the Heroquest name/brand to sell or promote your game.

Finding out that Gamezone only has the rights to the brand in Spain answers most of the questions I had about this... Now that I know it doesn't make me feel any better about this project. I really think that with this project there is a very good chance that if it sucessfully makes it to funding that down the road backers will be hit with either a loss of their money/product or extremly long delays.

**judgedoug**

Catyrpelius wrote:

Your also correct that you could make Judgedougquest and be perfectly fine. What you couldn't do is use the Heroquest name/brand to sell or promote your game.

Finding out that Gamezone only has the rights to the brand in Spain answers most of the questions I had about this... Now that I know it doesn't make me feel any better about this project. I really think that with this project there is a very good chance that if it sucessfully makes it to funding that down the road backers will be hit with either a loss of their money/product or extremly long delays.

That's absurd. So you're saying the video game company Enix couldn't make Dragon Quest in Japan because the name "Dragon Quest" already existed for a product in the United States. (Actually, they did, and retitled it Dragon Warrior when it was then officially distributed in the USA) However, it was still _perfectly legal_ to import Dragon Quest back in 1988 or whenever it came out for the Famicom.

If they own the name Heroquest in Spain, then they can manufacture something called Heroquest in Spain. And then thanks to globalism, anyone in the world whose country doesn't have an embargo on imports from Spain can then -- *gasp* -- import the game!

Which is what we're doing.

Regardless, none of this matters AT ALL.

And hey guys, guess what? I just did a search on the US Patent and Trademark office, and ALL the Hasbro trademarks (Heroquest) _AND_ Games Workshop trademarks (Advanced Heroquest) have lapsed (listed as DEAD) - in fact, the only Heroquest trademark is from Greg Stafford in 2012 for Glorantha/RuneQuest - which he's actually had the HeroQuest trademark for since 2003!

So, again:

- Hasbro doesn't own HeroQuest trademark
- Games Workshop doesn't even own Advanced HeroQuest trademark

Do a trademark search for HEROQUEST or HERO QUEST on the USP&TO site http://www.uspto.gov/trademarks/index.jsp

Gamezone is entirely within their legal right to own the trademark in Spain and manufacture a product called HeroQuest in Spain. And we are free to import it.

**decker_cky**

I'm curious - is the Glorantha HeroQuest distributed from anywhere outside the United States? Trademark registration in some jurisdictions (Canada for sure) doesn't necessarily mean you actually have the trademark (can have trademark without registration, registration just gives a presumption that you have the trademark).

**choasdwarflord**

the UK is much more problematic where hasbro owns many trademarks for heroquest including rpg/board games/miniatures/video games/etc.

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355869

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355870

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355871

**judgedoug**

choasdwarflord wrote:
the UK is much more problematic where hasbro owns many trademarks for heroquest including rpg/board games/miniatures/video games/etc.

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355869

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355870

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355871

but not in Spain. the whole point of my post was pointing out that it doesn't matter what stuff is called in another country as long as it's legal in your own.
Gamezone owns HeroQuest in Spain. We are importing their product. It's 100% fine.

**Alpharius**

judgedoug wrote:
choasdwarflord wrote:
the UK is much more problematic where hasbro owns many trademarks for heroquest including rpg/board games/miniatures/video games/etc.

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355869

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355870

http://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001355871

but not in Spain. the whole point of my post was pointing out that it doesn't matter what stuff is called in another country as long as it's legal in your own.
Gamezone owns HeroQuest in Spain. We are importing their product. It's 100% fine.

Wait - are you a lawyer?

And if yes, or even no, are you able to see into...The Future?

**judgedoug**

Alpharius wrote:

Wait - are you a lawyer?

And if yes, or even no, are you able to see into...The Future?

Sorry, I must be misunderstanding.

Gamezone owns HeroQuest in Spain - not up for argument, the Spanish trademark office shows it.
Both Hasbro and Games Workshop do not own the trademark for HeroQuest in Canada (expunged), or even in the USA (status being Dead), both confirmed by the respective country's trademark and patent offices.

So I have yet to see any reason why Gamezone can't release Heroquest in Spain. They own the name, and game mechanics cannot be copyrighted (and only patented, and in very few instances, and there certainly wouldn't be a 25-year retroactive patenting for... what, 6-sided cubes with symbols on them? moving pieces around on a board?)

Then, we, as consumers, may purchase products from other countries... which is what this Kickstarter is allowing us to do. We are buying a product from a Spanish company.

**Catyrpelius**

judgedoug wrote:
Alpharius wrote:

Wait - are you a lawyer?

And if yes, or even no, are you able to see into...The Future?

Sorry, I must be misunderstanding.

Gamezone owns HeroQuest in Spain - not up for argument, the Spanish trademark office shows it.
Both Hasbro and Games Workshop do not own the trademark for HeroQuest in Canada (expunged), or even in the USA (status being Dead), both confirmed by the respective country's trademark and patent offices.

So I have yet to see any reason why Gamezone can't release Heroquest in Spain. They own the name, and game mechanics cannot be copyrighted (and only patented, and in very few instances, and there certainly wouldn't be a 25-year retroactive patenting for... what, 6-sided cubes with symbols on them? moving pieces around on a board?)

Then, we, as consumers, may purchase products from other countries... which is what this Kickstarter is allowing us to do. We are buying a product from a Spanish company.

The trademark isn't dead in the US, it's just not regestered to Hasbro...

Registration Number 4082281, (REGISTRANT) Stafford, Francis Gregory

This is why Gamezone isn't running the campaign in the far more common currencies of USD or British Pounds. It's also why they aren't using exsisting distributers to drastically lower shipping costs.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
In addition where it gets even more fuzzy is if Spain has the equivalant of Common Law Rights.

**judgedoug**

Catyrpelius wrote:

The trademark isn't dead in the US, it's just not regestered to Hasbro...

Registration Number 4082281, (REGISTRANT) Stafford, Francis Gregory

This is why Gamezone isn't running the campaign in the far more common currencies of USD or British Pounds. It's also why they aren't using exsisting distributers to drastically lower shipping costs.

Yup, Greg Stafford swooped in and grabbed it ~2002 in the USA when Hasbro and GW let it lapse (IIRC, Heroquest was the original titles for his Glorantha stuff in the early 80's, but Hasbro trademarked it first - I could be mistaken on this part)
In Spain, however, Gamezone very definitely owns the trademark.

I believe using Canada is dual-purpose - no legal challenge of the trademark in Canada, plus bypassing Amazon Payments. Canadian funding is your credit card; so companies don't get double-charged from Kickstarter and then from Amazon for pledges. I'd honestly do the same and only lose 3-4% instead of 5-8% or whatever it is.