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If your already running a buff commander, a 3 man squad of suits with Mpods and TL wtih marker drones are a good spot to stick your commander. They benefit just as much as the broadsides, maybe even more since now you commander if making those marker drones you bought BS5 and TL, and all the Mpods in the squad match up with the Hympods in the broadsides at that point.

 syypher wrote:
Hahahaha $450 worth of broadsides... Nuff said!

Are people really paying full price? There are many stores and resellers that will at least give you 10-20% off of that.

So now it is only $360? Well worth it!

Broadsides have the offense advantage. Riptides have the mobility and resiliency advantage. A good Tau army should include both. Personally, I prefer the riptide because I prefer a more mobile army. The new trend currently is mobile firepower. In that regards, broadsides are a little behind the times.

I have 9x Crisis Suits. All with TL Missile Pods and Smart Missile Systems.

I'm thinking of converting 3 of them to Plasma/Fusion Blaster for Deepstriking tank popping capabilities. Thoughts? This too many points for achieving this? Is there more efficient points spent elsewhere for some more AP1/AP2? As it stands I think only my Riptides can dish out AP1/2 shots.

Also any more C&C on my lists would be welcome. Still unsure if I need more marker light support or if it's pretty balanced out the way it is already. Really appreciate all the input I've been getting here. It's really opening my eyes onto how to play Tau more effectively and make my lists a bit sharper.


1500
Commander (M3S, Puretide chip, C&C Node)
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO) - debating on if I should put fusion blasters on, 18" range kind of makes me rather use the SMS
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO) - debating on if I should put fusion blasters on, 18" range kind of makes me rather use the SMS
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
Sky Ray (Disruption Pod)
3 man Broadside Squad (TL SMS, TL HYMS, Targetlock)
Farseer + Jetbike
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Cannon, Holo)
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Cannon, Holo)

1850
Commander + 2 Marker Drones (M3S, Puretide chip, C&C Node, Drone Controller)
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO)
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO)
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
Sky Ray (Disruption Pod)
Sky Ray (Disruption Pod)
3 man Broadside Squad + 6x Missile Drones (TL SMS, TL HYMS, Targetlock)
Farseer + Jetbike
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Catapult, Holo)
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Catapult, Holo)
Nightspinner

So for the 1850 list the Commander is suppose to join the RipTides or the Broadsides. He'll give them Tank/Monster Hunter and give all the drones TL. Marker Support is coming from the Commander Marker Drones + the 2x Skyrays. The 1500 list only has the 1 Skyray for Marker support.

 Zagman wrote:

 syypher wrote:
Hahahaha $450 worth of broadsides... Nuff said!

Are people really paying full price? There are many stores and resellers that will at least give you 10-20% off of that.

Theres two very common reasons why people pay full price and why its quite common

1) Idiots dont know how to interwebz a deal.

2) Supporting FLGS rather than saving a few bucks.

And it still an insane cost for 9 models lol

I have 9x Crisis Suits. All with TL Missile Pods and Smart Missile Systems.

Wait, what? Did you just get your units mixed up lol. Crisis suits cant get SMS systems (god i wish they did)

 syypher wrote:
I have 9x Crisis Suits. All with TL Missile Pods and Smart Missile Systems.

I'm thinking of converting 3 of them to Plasma/Fusion Blaster for Deepstriking tank popping capabilities. Thoughts? This too many points for achieving this? Is there more efficient points spent elsewhere for some more AP1/AP2? As it stands I think only my Riptides can dish out AP1/2 shots.

Also any more C&C on my lists would be welcome. Still unsure if I need more marker light support or if it's pretty balanced out the way it is already. Really appreciate all the input I've been getting here. It's really opening my eyes onto how to play Tau more effectively and make my lists a bit sharper.

Spoiler:

1500
Commander (M3S, Puretide chip, C&C Node)
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO) - debating on if I should put fusion blasters on, 18" range kind of makes me rather use the SMS
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO) - debating on if I should put fusion blasters on, 18" range kind of makes me rather use the SMS
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
Sky Ray (Disruption Pod)
3 man Broadside Squad (TL SMS, TL HYMS, Targetlock)
Farseer + Jetbike
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Cannon, Holo)
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Cannon, Holo)

1850
Commander + 2 Marker Drones (M3S, Puretide chip, C&C Node, Drone Controller)
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO)
Riptide (IA, TL SMS, EWO)
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
10 man Kroot Squad + Kroot Hound
Sky Ray (Disruption Pod)
Sky Ray (Disruption Pod)
3 man Broadside Squad + 6x Missile Drones (TL SMS, TL HYMS, Targetlock)
Farseer + Jetbike
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Catapult, Holo)
5 man DA + WS (TL Scatter, Shuri Catapult, Holo)
Nightspinner

So for the 1850 list the Commander is suppose to join the RipTides or the Broadsides. He'll give them Tank/Monster Hunter and give all the drones TL. Marker Support is coming from the Commander Marker Drones + the 2x Skyrays. The 1500 list only has the 1 Skyray for Marker support.

I don't understand the Target Lock on the Broadsides, I would if you give them Marker Drones instead of Missile Drones. Also, EWO is a solid support system for them.

Also, I don't think you meant SMS on your Criris Suits.


I like your allied Eldar contingent, where are you planning to hide the Farseer? I'd like to see you find the points to make that Nightspinner a Wraithknight, but that is because I really like the Knight.

Overall, I think it is turning into a solid list.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Are people really paying full price? There are many stores and resellers that will at least give you 10-20% off of that.

Theres two very common reasons why people pay full price and why its quite common

1) Idiots dont know how to interwebz a deal.

2) Supporting FLGS rather than saving a few bucks.

And it still an insane cost for 9 models lol

Eh, FLGS always charge a little more than the cheapest internet site, but not much.

Except south korea. Feth that place. The ONLY gaming score in the entire country is in Seoul and the ass that owns it actually charges more than GW does. Needless to say i never bought from there lol

I could technically save 3-10 dollars per model if i went to the internet with my orders vs my gamestore, but i'd rather support them. Its the only place to play after all lol literally everyone in this meta has no room for a table and no terrain. I would set one up and invite people over, but i live in a dinky 25by30sqft apartment lol. Dirt dirt cheap and i dont need more space so not like i care. Staying here till im done with colleges so i can save money better.

Could someone do a favor for people that don't own the book and list what the special systems do? Points are not necessary as they are easily found on army builder, and listing the cost of the points is against dakka policies.

It's pretty much known some of the upgrades give bonuses to the squads like tank hunter, ignore cover, or tl.

About all you need to know is:

Crisis Iridium Suit - +1Toughness and 2+ armor for the bearer.

Multi-Spectrum Sensor Suite (M3S) - If the model bearing this upgrade does not shoot in the shooting phase, his unit ignores cover. Does not work in overwatch or interceptor.

Command and Control Node - If the model bearing this upgrade does not shoot in the shooting phase, his unit may reroll failed to hit rolls. Does not work in overwatch or interceptor. (Yes they stack too)

Puretide-chip - At the start of the owner's turn the bearer chooses Monster Hunter, Tank Hunter, Furious Charge, Stubborn, or Counterattack and ONLY the model with the upgrade gains this rule (Note: Stubborn, Monster Hunter, and Tank Hunter rules spread to the unit anyway)

The others are either pointless or so situational you might see them taken but never actually used (Gauntlet is always taken but unless you charge the unit with the buffmander you will never see it used (single attack S10 AP1 at initiative, cannot make other attacks).

 syypher wrote:

So for the 1850 list the Commander is suppose to join the RipTides or the Broadsides. He'll give them Tank/Monster Hunter and give all the drones TL.

Don't join the commander to the riptide, he will make the majority toughness 4.

 lambsandlions wrote:

 syypher wrote:

So for the 1850 list the Commander is suppose to join the RipTides or the Broadsides. He'll give them Tank/Monster Hunter and give all the drones TL.

Don't join the commander to the riptide, he will make the majority toughness 4.

He is absolutely right, I didn't see you added drones at the 1850 level. One T4 Model and one T6 Model is still majority T6, but once you add even one drone Majority T goes to4.

The Farseer WAS going to either be hiding with the Broadsides if I had a Commander on the Riptide or he was going to be with the Riptide.

With Iambsandlions suggestion him and his drones joining a riptide would make the Majority Toughness 4. So I might just be keeping my commander with the Broadsides.

I'm planning to keep the Farseer (since he's only 1 model) bouncing between Riptides. They will still be majority toughness for the Riptide. He will be taking the TL psychic ability that lets you reroll hits.

 syypher wrote:
The Farseer WAS going to either be hiding with the Broadsides if I had a Commander on the Riptide or he was going to be with the Riptide.

With Iambsandlions suggestion him and his drones joining a riptide would make the Majority Toughness 4. So I might just be keeping my commander with the Broadsides.

I'm planning to keep the Farseer (since he's only 1 model) bouncing between Riptides. They will still be majority toughness for the Riptide. He will be taking the TL psychic ability that lets you reroll hits.

To be honest Buffing commanders are a little too expensive to add to a single riptide. They are 160pts at the cheapest and don't shoot so you have to ask yourself would you pay about 360 for a riptide that ignores cover and is twin linked? When added to a unit of 3 broadsides and 6 drones he becomes more like a 20pt upgrade that allows tank/monster hunter, twin linking and ignore cover, plus a meat shield.

Joining the farseer to the riptide is a great plan. This protects the farseer, allows him to use his powers on the riptide and allows him to get close enough to use any maledictions he may have.

 Zagman wrote:
I don't understand the Target Lock on the Broadsides, I would if you give them Marker Drones instead of Missile Drones. Also, EWO is a solid support system for them.

Using a Rhino for ex.
If the Broadsides have Targetlock then the 6x Missile Drones can fire at the Rhino and the 3x Broadsides can fire at 3 different targets. Say 3 other Rhinos. Right? Or am I not using Targetlock correctly.

Targetlock is usually what i put on my broadsides, i kinda stopped puting EWO on them because the drones dont shoot during it and now theyre forced to fire at the unit you intercepted at, whether it died or not (since i cant find anything allowing otherwise, and it still falls under the whole "One unit fires at one unit" thing).

Reason for it is theres usually only 2-3 targets, usually large blobs of units or fliers, that you'd WANT to fire that many shots at. Im not shooting 24 S7 AP4 shots and 12 S5 AP5 shots at a single rhino lol

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Targetlock is usually what i put on my broadsides, i kinda stopped puting EWO on them because the drones dont shoot during it and now theyre forced to fire at the unit you intercepted at, whether it died or not (since i cant find anything allowing otherwise, and it still falls under the whole "One unit fires at one unit" thing).

Reason for it is theres usually only 2-3 targets, usually large blobs of units or fliers, that you'd WANT to fire that many shots at. Im not shooting 24 S7 AP4 shots and 12 S5 AP5 shots at a single rhino lol

Aside from the face they fire in two distinct phases. The Missile Drones are free to fire at whatever target they want in your shooting phase. Who the Broadsides Intercepted has no bearing on who they can target in your shooting phase. Only stipulation is that any weapon that intercepted cannot fire in your following shooting phase.

This is one of the most interesting, and useful threads I've read on this forum for quite some time, thanks so far for the information. I've been playing Imperial fists for some time, since I had a battle company worth of marines in various states of disrepair, but I've recently made the decision that once my yellow paint runs out, I shall bring my tau out of retirement.

I've been on the receiving end of a few nasty lists, and one thing I noticed is the distinct lack of crisis suits in most of the hard core lists. So, is the crisis team dead? And are broadsides and Riptides to blame? What role can the crisis teams fill that would be useful? With the lack of reliable weaponry to crack open AV14 are twin fusion blaster DS suits viable? Or should the crisis teams be reserved for farsight only lists? And whatever happened to the reliable fire-knife?

madtankbloke wrote:
This is one of the most interesting, and useful threads I've read on this forum for quite some time, thanks so far for the information. I've been playing Imperial fists for some time, since I had a battle company worth of marines in various states of disrepair, but I've recently made the decision that once my yellow paint runs out, I shall bring my tau out of retirement.

I've been on the receiving end of a few nasty lists, and one thing I noticed is the distinct lack of crisis suits in most of the hard core lists. So, is the crisis team dead? And are broadsides and Riptides to blame? What role can the crisis teams fill that would be useful? With the lack of reliable weaponry to crack open AV14 are twin fusion blaster DS suits viable? Or should the crisis teams be reserved for farsight only lists? And whatever happened to the reliable fire-knife?

The Riptide has replaced the Crisis Suit in most competetive lists. They aren't bad, but bring less durability than the Riptides and arguably more firepower. Though, they have a place in the Farsight Enclave and Farsight Bomb and can be used as cheap scoring units or get to really spread their winds in different loadouts. Running dual Missile Pods Target Locks and Marker Drones can be a great home for a Drone Controller Commander.

The Fireknife and all mixed weapon suits have fallen out of favor for the more efficient mono weapon units. I've seen good arguments for spending a left over systems slot on a flamer.

Dual Fusion suits are still a vialbe DS strategy and one of the Tau's only effective anti AV14 solutions. Though, currently AV14 has fallen out of favor. I'd expect to see a resurgence of it due to the reduction in melta spam.

 Zagman wrote:

madtankbloke wrote:
This is one of the most interesting, and useful threads I've read on this forum for quite some time, thanks so far for the information. I've been playing Imperial fists for some time, since I had a battle company worth of marines in various states of disrepair, but I've recently made the decision that once my yellow paint runs out, I shall bring my tau out of retirement.

I've been on the receiving end of a few nasty lists, and one thing I noticed is the distinct lack of crisis suits in most of the hard core lists. So, is the crisis team dead? And are broadsides and Riptides to blame? What role can the crisis teams fill that would be useful? With the lack of reliable weaponry to crack open AV14 are twin fusion blaster DS suits viable? Or should the crisis teams be reserved for farsight only lists? And whatever happened to the reliable fire-knife?

The Riptide has replaced the Crisis Suit in most competetive lists. They aren't bad, but bring less durability than the Riptides and arguably more firepower. Though, they have a place in the Farsight Enclave and Farsight Bomb and can be used as cheap scoring units or get to really spread their winds in different loadouts. Running dual Missile Pods Target Locks and Marker Drones can be a great home for a Drone Controller Commander.

The Fireknife and all mixed weapon suits have fallen out of favor for the more efficient mono weapon units. I've seen good arguments for spending a left over systems slot on a flamer.

Dual Fusion suits are still a vialbe DS strategy and one of the Tau's only effective anti AV14 solutions. Though, currently AV14 has fallen out of favor. I'd expect to see a resurgence of it due to the reduction in melta spam.

Thanks for the answer
So it's a major switch from the generalist setups of the last codex to more specific ones in the current one? I take it then, because the riptide is so good, and I must get some but only after my painting is done!, that crisis suits are only taken if you have a specific build in mind, such as a marker drone blob, tank killing or some such, and broadsides are better for missile spam, and riptides for killing MEQ and TEQ. That being the case, since I have 10 crisis suits I'll have to find some way to make them useful.

Since my ally is Eldar I have actually even thought to replace the DS Crisis Fusion suits with a Fire Dragon + Wave Serpent squad.

1) I get a Wave Serpent...
2) Fire Dragon's guns aren't as far range but I get more bang for the buck (shots)
3) I get another Wave Serpent. That in itself is very powerful.


And I totally agree, this thread rocks. I started it just trying to learn Tau from just jumping back into 40k from 5th. Questions answered opened up more questions and they were answered very very well! I honestly can't really think of much more to ask lol

Almost the entirety of the old codex tactics are gone. If you knew anything about the old lists, ignore them. There are 4 big reasons:

1) Markerlights are actually available now. They were too expensive before so we relied on the upgrade for +1BS instead.
2) Broadsides are nerfed to hell and back (railguns anyway)
3) Dual non-TL weapons removing the unusual long range + short range gun combos.
4) Riptides lol

There isnt a single thing i used in old dex or seen used that is still around. This is probably the biggest flip a race has taken lol but hten again that was one hell of an old codex.

Whats ironic about this last post is that I have found myself using Crisis Teams which I never did like doing before. Ironic because the meta SAID it was good in the old codex and now I feel they actually ARE.

And I'm BACK to using Kroot, because when 6E hit, Kroot went from meh, to Gawd awful. And now that the new codex is here, they're back better than ever! So in some ways, the more things change, the more they stay the same.

Oh and I am plotting world domination with my Stingwings. I always liked Stingwings. Now I like them a lot. =).

So I'm not sure that everything about the old Tactica has changed. But I'll say this much: I would ACTUALLY use a Skyray in a competitive list. Now THATS a flip.

Crisis are a bit better too, only reason i didnt include them because majority of players go riptide spam.

Allowing crisis teams to take 2 of the same weapon non-twinlinked was an insane buff to them. Giving them built in BSFilter and Multi-tracker was icing on the cake lol.

Its easier to have special operations-type crisis suits now. I havnt had a game yet where i didnt have my deepstriking melta-bomb because it always wrecks stuff my riptides shouldnt be shooting at (note that they COULD but be a dumb idea to, such as high armor)

I have two single model crisis squads; dual flamer & FB. How do they sound?

They are apart of an Enclave primary (Skyrays, 2 XV88's, IA XV108, Pathfinders, 3 suits + 6 marker drones, fireblade) with a Tau Empire allied secondary (24 pathfinders, ethereal, pathfinders). 1500pt

Cheap solodin style troops, drop em, hide em. Use markerlights to make the fusion gun reliable, otherwise they are standalone with suit mobility & 2x Flamers.

Regular flamers are complete crap yaknow. I dont even take it for a point dump lol.

My only Crisis team uses a TL Melta and a Flamer on each suit. Pure flexible win.

 Zagman wrote:

 lambsandlions wrote:

 syypher wrote:

So for the 1850 list the Commander is suppose to join the RipTides or the Broadsides. He'll give them Tank/Monster Hunter and give all the drones TL.

Don't join the commander to the riptide, he will make the majority toughness 4.

He is absolutely right, I didn't see you added drones at the 1850 level. One T4 Model and one T6 Model is still majority T6, but once you add even one drone Majority T goes to4.

riptide drones are t6 homie. Unless you are talking about the commanders' drones

 Largeblastmarker wrote:

 Zagman wrote:

 lambsandlions wrote:

 syypher wrote:

So for the 1850 list the Commander is suppose to join the RipTides or the Broadsides. He'll give them Tank/Monster Hunter and give all the drones TL.

Don't join the commander to the riptide, he will make the majority toughness 4.

He is absolutely right, I didn't see you added drones at the 1850 level. One T4 Model and one T6 Model is still majority T6, but once you add even one drone Majority T goes to4.

riptide drones are t6 homie. Unless you are talking about the commanders' drones

If you had actually read any of the posts you would see that he has no Riptide drones, so obviously I was talking about the T4 Commander's Drones. Homie, dawg, g.

 Zagman wrote:

 Largeblastmarker wrote:

 Zagman wrote:

 lambsandlions wrote:

 syypher wrote:

So for the 1850 list the Commander is suppose to join the RipTides or the Broadsides. He'll give them Tank/Monster Hunter and give all the drones TL.

Don't join the commander to the riptide, he will make the majority toughness 4.

He is absolutely right, I didn't see you added drones at the 1850 level. One T4 Model and one T6 Model is still majority T6, but once you add even one drone Majority T goes to4.

riptide drones are t6 homie. Unless you are talking about the commanders' drones

If you had actually read any of the posts you would see that he has no Riptide drones, so obviously I was talking about the T4 Commander's Drones. Homie, dawg, g.

Alright dogs lets chillax yo? Aight? Fa realz

I'd prefer to stay more Tau if at all possible when I'm doing my Eldar allies. Read what you guys were saying with the dual fusion blaster Crisis Suits and now it's got me back on the fence. I'd REALLY like someone to push me over to the side that says Crisis Suits + Dual Fusion Blasters > Fire Dragons + Wave Serpent. But I'm having a hard time because of how sick awesome Wave Serpents are.

Why Crisis Suits over the FD + WS?