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Then I'll remain optimistic. But whatever those grey renders are, they're really bad.

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
Yeah, but these aren't Red Box Games gnolls, and Tre Manor certainly isn't sculpting them, so you gotta cut Northstar a *little* slack.

No, no we don't. They exist in the world with Reaper, Otherworld, and Gale Force 9's Gnolls. They are competing for the same market and dollars.

I'll cut them even less slack having read some of the tantrums thrown by the owner when he didn't get a sufficiently adoring response to his products.

~Eric


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 MLaw wrote:

 Cruentus wrote:
Those are actually three-ups for the plastic gnolls? Ugh. This went from a must buy (likely several boxes - I love the concept of gnolls) to total pass. Shame.

He's assuming those are 3ups. Why would they paint a 3up? I don't think I've ever seen a company do that..

No, I'm not assuming anything. The owner stated they were 3ups.

They look on par with the other frost grave plastics in all honesty. I feel like I'm crazy for not expecting these to look as good as Metal or Resin Sculpts. Like, their are some pretty potato looking faces in these releases let's be honest. Also everything they have done up to this point has been in wired GW heroic proportions.




I feel like that awsome art work got people's hopes up alot higher then what frost grave is actually able to deliver.

They're plastic and fairly cheap so I'll probably pick one box up for the D&D campaign I'm running.

I'll cut them even less slack having read some of the tantrums thrown by the owner when he didn't get a sufficiently adoring response to his products.

Do you have a link to that? I'm curious.

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

I'll cut them even less slack having read some of the tantrums thrown by the owner when he didn't get a sufficiently adoring response to his products.

Do you have a link to that? I'm curious.

Seconded.

 Lockark wrote:
They look on par with the other frost grave plastics in all honesty. I feel like I'm crazy for not expecting these to look as good as Metal or Resin Sculpts. Like, their are some pretty potato looking faces in these releases let's be honest. Also everything they have done up to this point has been in wired GW heroic proportions.

I feel like that awsome art work got people's hopes up alot higher then what frost grave is actually able to deliver.

Their Soldiers and Cultists are bad to mediocre too. And they fell woefully short of their box art also. So the Gnolls missing the mark isn't surprising, really.

They had a great opportunity with the Gnolls that they didn't have with the others. The closest thing to these in the market are GW Beastmen. I can't think of anything else out there.

~Eric

I rather agree. I sort of like the soldiers in an old school, sort of cartoony way. The cultists though... those are some bad faces. Stupid swords, too, but seriously, what is that guy on the left's mouth doing?

Not sure where everyone is seeing cartoony for the soldiers....they look on par with offerings from Gripping Beast and Fireforge. And when painted in less-gaudy colors, I think they turn out ok.



A few of the cultist heads are a bit exaggerated, though, and I've refrained from using them for mine. But the rest of the kit is actually pretty nice, and the details are improved from the soldier kit.

I'll postpone my judgement on the gnolls until I have plastic in hand. Often times, painted 3-ups have a tendency to misrepresent the plastic model at actual size.

~iPaint

 Taarnak wrote:

I'll cut them even less slack having read some of the tantrums thrown by the owner when he didn't get a sufficiently adoring response to his products.

Link?


And I'm sadly in agreement. I was hyped when I saw the fantastic box art. Having seen the figures, I am much disappoint.

Sadly, I must say that I agree with the consensus. While I like Frostgrave soldiers and cultitst, the gnolls, so far, are simply not doing it for me.

Hopefully, other builds will make me change my mind

Maybe a bit of pinning and greenstuff could extend the neck and give them a more hunched appearance.

Making me feel bad for liking the gnolls so far, and the minis they have made already. Except that one cultist that has Klingon ridges...

@-iPaint-:
Put the Frost Grave Plastics next to perry brother's Historicals. They look Cartoony just as much as GW's stuff will look cartoony.

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Making me feel bad for liking the gnolls so far, and the minis they have made already. Except that one cultist that has Klingon ridges...

Don't worry. I like the gnolls so far also. I'm still looking foreword to buying a few boxes.

Frostgrave stuff looks fine next to GW stuff.

Yeah I like the GW and Frostgrave it feels more 'heroic' in a D&D vein.

The historical are...okay. Very thin though...those Napoleonic soldiers need a sandwich. (I have no idea if they are actually French. Just playing)

 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Yeah I like the GW and Frostgrave it feels more 'heroic' in a D&D vein.

The historical are...okay. Very thin though...those Napoleonic soldiers need a sandwich. (I have no idea if they are actually French. Just playing)

Yah, my point is that frostgrave have some stylistic/heroic scale things going on. Kar posted some nice properly proportioned historicals, so figured it was only fair to point out that nothing in the frostgrave range is in that "style". Everything is more "heroic scale" as you put it.

So I can understand why some people may not like them. But personally i'm loving them so far, and frostgrave stuff has always looked good next to my GW stuff and I feel these will too. I know I'm going to order a couple of these boxes when they come out.

 MLaw wrote:

 Cruentus wrote:
Those are actually three-ups for the plastic gnolls? Ugh. This went from a must buy (likely several boxes - I love the concept of gnolls) to total pass. Shame.

He's assuming those are 3ups. Why would they paint a 3up? I don't think I've ever seen a company do that..

Northstar have shown fully painted 3-ups before. They had them on display at Salute 2015 on their stand: http://legatuswargamesarmies.blogspot.co.uk/2015/04/salute-2015.html

I actually really like the Frostgrave soldiers kit, I think it works very well and the proportions don't look weird at all to me even though they are heavily heroic. They are well done. The Cultists have some badly sculpted parts though and these gnolls... yeah, the box art had my hyped but the sculpts look nothing like it.

 KingmanHighborn wrote:

The historical are...okay. Very thin though

By thin you actually mean 'to scale'. I have had no issues with mine in terms of fragility, in fact I am planning on buying another 150-200 of them....

Perry's plastics are excellent and significantly cheaper per model than most 28mm plastic kits.

There are few Frostgrave miniatures that I actually like, basically this one:


These Gnolls don't seem to be an exception.

I like the soldiers box a lot. I don't think they have to be cartoony -- the only one that seems so is the guy with the tache. Don't use that head if you don't like taches!

Here's some of mine, WIP paintjobs, bad camera, etc., alongside (far left) two Hasslefree minis (my Wizard & Apprentice). Note that the 4 in the middle are made with Statuesque Heroic Scale heads, with only the 2 on the far left having FG soldier box heads.

Yes I know I need to get around to painting the faces. Painting faces is hard! Can't we just give them all Space Marine helmets.

I found the Cultists box really good too. There was one of the poses that had slightly weird, leaping clown kind of legs. The rest was great though.

Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Do you have a link to that? I'm curious.

Nostromodamus wrote:
Seconded.

Azazelx wrote:
Link?

Here is a link to his LAF posts. If you dig through you'll find lots of condescending and bitchy posts. Some of the worst stuff from the initial release I couldn't find, so they may have been cleaned up a bit.

Some of you folks here know that I'm not prone to hyperbole, so take my words as you will.

Edit: It appears that you need to be signed in to view that link. It is a good board to be a member of, especially if your interests extend beyond GW games.

~Eric

I like the Gnolls, and the fact they aren't roided out and 8ft tall.

When the D&D plastics and Reaper beefed them up, it looked cool, but it doens't match their stats in D&D.

Like someone else already suggested, these will be fine for rank and file, and make the Reaper/D&D ones stand out as commanders.

Let's also remember they are being made for Frostgrave, where I doubt their statline would require them to be huge and beefy.

Quite disappointed with the gnolls. The cover art is great though.

 adamsouza wrote:
I like the Gnolls, and the fact they aren't roided out and 8ft tall.

When the D&D plastics and Reaper beefed them up, it looked cool, but it doens't match their stats in D&D.

Like someone else already suggested, these will be fine for rank and file, and make the Reaper/D&D ones stand out as commanders.

Let's also remember they are being made for Frostgrave, where I doubt their statline would require them to be huge and beefy.

My dislike of them has nothing to do with their amount of muscle, but rather their posture and general humanoid appearance. The artwork has them looking much more feral, hunched over like hyenas. The models just look like guys with hyena heads and dog legs.

Haha, you shouldn't compare Perry historicals to GW anything - Perry figures will always make GW figures look like the turdpiles they are.

Probably best not to compare _anyone's_ sculpting of humans to the Perry brothers, actually. Perry sculpts will always look better, because they are better.

Now back to the gnolls. Otherworld Gnolls are certainly better than the Frostgrave gnolls. Not so sure about the Reaper guys - they look way too World of Warcraft/Pathfinder/DragonBall MEGA POWER SHOULDER PAD aesthetic which I absolutely loathe.

But, Frostgrave gnolls will be like a buck fifty apiece. Which means I can own one Otherworld gnoll champion or ten Frostgrave plastic gnolls.

Now, I don't know about you guys, but since I spend much of my hobby time actually playing games, my models are over three feet away from me at any given point, and not blown up to a foot tall on a computer screen. This is how I can justify using Warhammer models when playing games, despite how laughably bad and poorly sculpted most of the entire Warhammer range is. The gnolls will fit right in (and, whew, already look an order of magnitude better than, say, the 7th edition Empire plastics.)

 judgedoug wrote:
Haha, you shouldn't compare Perry historicals to GW anything - Perry figures will always make GW figures look like the turdpiles they are.

Probably best not to compare _anyone's_ sculpting of humans to the Perry brothers, actually. Perry sculpts will always look better, because they are better.

You do realise that the Perry Brothers are responsible for a huge part of the Lord of the Rings and Hobbit range, don't you?

 judgedoug wrote:
Haha, you shouldn't compare Perry historicals to GW anything - Perry figures will always make GW figures look like the turdpiles they are.

Probably best not to compare _anyone's_ sculpting of humans to the Perry brothers, actually. Perry sculpts will always look better, because they are better.

Now back to the gnolls. Otherworld Gnolls are certainly better than the Frostgrave gnolls. Not so sure about the Reaper guys - they look way too World of Warcraft/Pathfinder/DragonBall MEGA POWER SHOULDER PAD aesthetic which I absolutely loathe.

But, Frostgrave gnolls will be like a buck fifty apiece. Which means I can own one Otherworld gnoll champion or ten Frostgrave plastic gnolls.

Now, I don't know about you guys, but since I spend much of my hobby time actually playing games, my models are over three feet away from me at any given point, and not blown up to a foot tall on a computer screen. This is how I can justify using Warhammer models when playing games, despite how laughably bad and poorly sculpted most of the entire Warhammer range is. The gnolls will fit right in (and, whew, already look an order of magnitude better than, say, the 7th edition Empire plastics.)

Just cause you don't like the design GW and Reaper have doesn't make them turdpiles. I don't care for the historical shown, they are fine if you are making an 8th grade diorama for history on the battle of Waterloo. But they aren't models I'd want to use for a game. Proportion might be 'right' in scale but as I mentioned before they look downright anorexic. Too thin and weak to be 'heroes'. GW and these figures actually look like they can scrap, and aesthetically for a 'fantasy' wargame are gorgeous and much better.

Also be nice to Reaper, I was able to make my Gnoll Paladin with one:

 Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:
Haha, you shouldn't compare Perry historicals to GW anything - Perry figures will always make GW figures look like the turdpiles they are.

Probably best not to compare _anyone's_ sculpting of humans to the Perry brothers, actually. Perry sculpts will always look better, because they are better.

You do realise that the Perry Brothers are responsible for a huge part of the Lord of the Rings and Hobbit range, don't you?

Yeah, my favorite range GW has ever done (and still actively collecting models for). You guys know I meant Warhammer and 40k.


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 KingmanHighborn wrote:
Just cause you don't like the design GW and Reaper have doesn't make them turdpiles. I don't care for the historical shown, they are fine if you are making an 8th grade diorama for history on the battle of Waterloo. But they aren't models I'd want to use for a game. Proportion might be 'right' in scale but as I mentioned before they look downright anorexic. Too thin and weak to be 'heroes'. GW and these figures actually look like they can scrap, and aesthetically for a 'fantasy' wargame are gorgeous and much better.

Ah, you caught my sarcasm at all these posters writing their subjective opinion as objective fact!

OMG I can't even imagine playing ACW or AWI or Naps or WSS with GW Melonhead McHamfist models.

Also, disagree with fantasy needing to look like a terrible Saturday Morning cartoon. As Shadow Captain Edithae pointed out, GW's best sculpts - by the Perry bros - are their LotR/Hobbit range, which are all fantasy, with far better design sensibilities than, for instance, 7th ed Empire soldiers who can't afford shoes.

 judgedoug wrote:


Yeah, my favorite range GW has ever done (and still actively collecting models for). You guys know I meant Warhammer and 40k.

No I didn't. You said "anything GW", not "Warhammer". Say what you mean in future. The typical Warhammer player and collector is fairly ignorant of the SBG, so it was a reasonable assumption that someone who does not play and collect it would not know who sculpted the range.

And yes, I too think the LOTR/Hobbit range (at least those sculpted by the Perry brothers) are by far GW's best sculpts (in technical terms - aesthetic taste is subjective). I'm using them for my Dungeons and Dragons 5e campaign, along with Hasslefree Miniatures.

 -iPaint- wrote:
Not sure where everyone is seeing cartoony for the soldiers....they look on par with offerings from Gripping Beast and Fireforge. And when painted in less-gaudy colors, I think they turn out ok.

Spoiler:

A few of the cultist heads are a bit exaggerated, though, and I've refrained from using them for mine. But the rest of the kit is actually pretty nice, and the details are improved from the soldier kit.

I'll postpone my judgement on the gnolls until I have plastic in hand. Often times, painted 3-ups have a tendency to misrepresent the plastic model at actual size.

~iPaint

By "cartoony" I didn't really mean "bad", I just meant stylized instead of properly scaled. Stylized can be fine, and like I said, I like the soldier kit pretty well for what it is. I don't generally like heroic scale stuff, and I think GW went WAY over the top with it as one example, but PP is often guilty of similar things. I think the Frostgrave soldiers are stylized pretty well, and give off an old school vibe I like.

Would I like them better if they were scaled properly? There's a good chance of that, but I don't dislike them as is. The cultist heads and definitely the gnolls pushed the stylization a bit too far and in the wrong direction I think. Stylization works when it conveys the ideas behind a character, but you can go too far, such as the "I use compact cars as shoulder pads!" look in many PP models, or "I ALWAYS skip leg day!" in Mantic and PP stuff. Obviously GW commits many sins of that sort as well.

To look at it another way, compare the Frostgrave model's hyena bits to the hyenas from the Lion King:


Heavily stylized, but you know they are hyenas instantly. All the characteristics that trigger "hyena" in our brains are there. When looking at the Frostgrave gnolls, honestly if they showed the model without saying what it was "gnoll" might not be my first guess. The digitigrade legs help, but that face could be simian or any other combination of animal and man done poorly. Or a goblin.

 KingmanHighborn wrote:


Just cause you don't like the design GW and Reaper have doesn't make them turdpiles. I don't care for the historical shown, they are fine if you are making an 8th grade diorama for history on the battle of Waterloo. But they aren't models I'd want to use for a game. Proportion might be 'right' in scale but as I mentioned before they look downright anorexic. Too thin and weak to be 'heroes'. GW and these figures actually look like they can scrap, and aesthetically for a 'fantasy' wargame are gorgeous and much better.

Yeah, because models that look like actual humans who actually fought and died is for 8th grade dioramas. Thin people can't be heroes- they all have to look like roided bald men with hands and feet the size of their head!

Audie Murphy would have a word on what a real hero looks like. Heck, even the big heroes don't have hamfists and balls of muscle on muscle- look at John Keller.

Sorry, but while you may have accepted GW's ridiculous proportions (and some of their models are nice), but when you dump on reality, it just comes across poorly. Saying, "Certain manufacturers have adopted their own proportions and I like/prefer/etc." is one thing. Saying proportional models don't look good for wargaming is quite another.... Strikes me of saying Haggar the Horrible cartoons better capture the spirit of battle than actual Norse battles.