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Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 d-usa wrote:
Government employee doing the shooting? More evidence for a false flag operation!

Or going proverbial postal?


Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

He fired upon a screening point, right? Who would have stopped him with it before then?

I mean, I think about the Cincy airport, and I really don't think there's any kind of security recourse UNTIL the screening checkpoints, and even then the TSA agents aren't armed. And everyone has their shoes and belts off...

People in LAX are LUCKY it appears to be a targetted shooting as opposed to a "kill as many people as possible" shooting.


 
   
Made in us
Posts with Authority






Yeah, the only real barrier to something like this before a checkpoint would be roving cops happening upon him and noticing the weapon.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Leerstetten, Germany

 cincydooley wrote:

People in LAX are LUCKY it appears to be a targetted shooting as opposed to a "kill as many people as possible" shooting.



Checkpoints are the perfect place for an attack.




Dense crowd, hard to move around and escape, no shoes, no belts to keep your pants from falling off while trying to get away, lots of luggage in the way, depending on the airport the area is self contained with only small entry and exit points.

The way we do airport security has just moved the target from the plane to the checkpoint.

Of course that is just my anti-security-theater opinion...
   
Made in us
Secret Force Behind the Rise of the Tau




USA

I'd say that in light of current events, it's not a terrible opinion XD Clearly our next resort is to search people in the parking lot

   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in south-central England.

Better to search people at home so you can get a better picture of their overall lifestyle and personality.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in ca
Grizzled MkII Monster Veteran




Toronto, Ontario

In terms of 'where the attack happens', if we want to be coldly calculating, pushing the location back from the plane to the lobby may present a ton of victims for whatever horrors a person or group wish to commit, but I'd rather be belt and shoeless in a lobby than belted and shoed in a pressurized metal tube 30,000 feet in the air.

I mean, ideally it wouldn't happen at all, but we're long past the ideal when people start shooting up airports.

Hell, if someone wanted to do something terrible, the perfect time is coming; Black Friday crowds already have a yearly death toll. Now THAT is a cluster of humanity in a tightly enclosed space with a minimal security presence.

Edit: though to be fair, the same can be said of just about any bustling shopping mall too.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/01 20:24:46


 
   
Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

Yeah, that was my point d-USA. From my understanding of the news thusfar, he only targeted tsa employees, right?

I mean, let's not kid ourselves. If you're using an AR and you've fired it at least once or twice, you should be pretty lethal at those types of close distances. It's a blessing there aren't more victims.

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Leerstetten, Germany

Well, sounds like anti-government lone lunatic who targeted TSA agents in particular.

   
Made in us
Blood Angel Captain Wracked with Visions






Has it been confirmed yet whether mental health was a factor?

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Leerstetten, Germany

Seems like most I have seen so far talks about weird text messages he send his family and a "suicide text" he send to his family that morning. No official "he was a patient" or anything like that.
   
Made in us
Sniping Reverend Moira





Cincinnati, Ohio

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:
Has it been confirmed yet whether mental health was a factor?


At the risk of being overly obtuse, I'd like to think anyone that opens fire In a public place probably has some mental health issues, diagnosed or otherwise.

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

From ABC news:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/lax-shooting-unfolded-nj-father-called-police-20765631
Seeking to stir fear in "traitorous minds," a man suspected of a shooting spree at Los Angeles airport allegedly set out to kill employees of the Transportation Security Administration in the attack that left one person dead and others wounded, authorities said.

At a news conference Saturday announcing charges against Paul Ciancia, U.S. Attorney Andre Birotte Jr. spelled out a chilling chain of events at LAX that began when he strode into Terminal 3 Friday morning, pulled a Smith & Wesson .223-caliber assault rifle from his duffel bag and fired repeatedly at point-blank range at a TSA officer. The officer was checking IDs and boarding passes at the base of an escalator leading to the main screening area.

After shooting a TSA officer and going up an escalator, Ciancia turned back to see the officer move and returned to finish him off, according to surveillance video reviewed by investigators.

Investigators said Ciancia, an unemployed motorcycle mechanic, fired on at least two other uniformed TSA employees and an airline passenger, who were all wounded. Airport police eventually shot him as panicked passengers cowered in stores and restaurants.

Ciancia, 23, remained hospitalized Saturday after being hit four times and wounded in the mouth and leg. The FBI said he was unresponsive and they had not been able to interview him.

The duffel bag also contained a handwritten letter signed by Ciancia stating he'd "made the conscious decision to try to kill" multiple TSA employees and that he wanted to "instill fear in their traitorous minds" said FBI Agent in Charge David L. Bowdich.

Federal prosecutors filed charges of first-degree murder of a federal officer and committing violence at an international airport. The charges could qualify him for the death penalty.

The FBI was still looking into Ciancia's past, but investigators said they had not found evidence of previous crimes or any run-ins with the TSA. They said he had never applied for a job with the agency.

Authorities believe someone dropped Ciancia off at the airport. Agents were reviewing surveillance tapes to piece together the sequence of events.

"We are really going to draw a picture of who this person was, his background, his history. That will help us explain why he chose to do what he did," Bowdich said. "At this point, I don't have the answer on that."

The note found in the duffel bag suggested Ciancia was willing to kill almost any TSA officer.

"Black, white, yellow, brown, I don't discriminate," the note read, according to a paraphrase by a law enforcement official briefed on the investigation. The official spoke on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak publicly.

The screed also mentioned "fiat currency" and "NWO," possible references to the New World Order, a conspiracy theory that foresees a totalitarian one-world government.

When searched, the suspect had five 30-round magazines, and his bag contained hundreds more rounds in boxes, the law-enforcement official said.

Terminal 3, the area where the shooting happened, reopened Saturday. Passengers who had abandoned luggage to escape Friday's gunfire were allowed to return to collect their bags.

The TSA planned to review its security policies in the wake of the attack. Administrator John Pistole did not say if that would mean arming officers.

As airport operations returned to normal, a few more details trickled out about Ciancia, who by all accounts was reserved and solitary.

Former classmates barely remember him and even a recent roommate could say little about the young man who moved from New Jersey to Los Angeles less than two years ago. A former classmate at Salesianum School in Wilmington, Del., said Ciancia was incredibly quiet.

"He kept to himself and ate lunch alone a lot," David Hamilton told the Los Angeles Times. "I really don't remember any one person who was close to him .... In four years, I never heard a word out of his mouth."

On Friday, Ciancia's father called police in New Jersey, worried about his son in L.A. The young man had sent texts to his family that suggested he might be in trouble, at one point even saying goodbye.

The call came too late. Ten minutes earlier, police said, he had walked into the airport.

In the worrisome messages, the younger Ciancia did not mention suicide or hurting others, but his father had heard from a friend that his son may have had a gun, said Allen Cummings, police chief in Pennsville, a small blue-collar town near the Delaware River where Ciancia grew up.

The police chief called Los Angeles police, who sent a patrol car to Ciancia's apartment. There, two roommates said that they had seen him a day earlier and he had appeared to be fine.

But by that time, gunfire was already breaking out at the airport.

"There's nothing we could do to stop him," Cummings said.

The police chief said he learned from Ciancia's father that the young man had attended a technical school in Florida, then moved to Los Angeles in 2012 hoping to get a job as a motorcycle mechanic. He was having trouble finding work.

Ciancia graduated in December 2011 from Motorcycle Mechanics Institute in Orlando, Fla., said Tina Miller, a spokeswoman for Universal Technical Institute, the Scottsdale, Ariz., company that runs the school.

A basic motorcycle mechanic course takes about a year, she said.

On Friday, as swarms of passengers dropped to the ground or ran for their lives, the gunman seemed to ignore anyone except TSA targets.

Leon Saryan of Milwaukee had just passed through security and was looking for a place to put his shoes and belt back on when he heard gunfire. He managed to hide in a store. As he was cowering in the corner, the shooter approached.

"He looked at me and asked, 'TSA?' I shook my head no, and he continued on down toward the gate," Saryan said.

Authorities identified the dead TSA officer as Gerardo I. Hernandez, 39, the first official in the agency's 12-year history to be killed in the line of duty.

Friends remembered him as a doting father and a good neighbor who went door-to-door warning neighbors to be careful after his home was burglarized.

In brief remarks outside the couple's house, his widow, Ana Hernandez, said Saturday that her husband came to the U.S. from El Salvador at age 15.

"He took pride in his duty for the American public and for the TSA mission," she said.


So, TSA traitors, conspiracy, NWO...

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/11/02/splc-right-wing-lax-shooters-note-reportedly-said-f-u-to-bull-dyke-napolitano/

The note that 23-year-old Paul Ciancia carried with him as he charged into Los Angeles International Airport and opened fire on Friday reportedly referenced right-wing conspiracy theories amid homophobic rants about former Department of Homeland Security director Janet Napolitano and other government officials.

According to the Southern Poverty Law Center, a law enforcement source confirmed that he note contained racist, homophobic and sexist slurs aimed at government officials, security agencies, liberals and racial minorities.

Raw Story noted on Friday that police reported that Ciancia was carrying a document that referred to the “New World Order,” a favorite phrase of the conspiracy-minded right used to describe an amorphous group of world elites who seek to impose one world government on all people. Both Alex Jones and Glenn Beck have included the phrase in their rantings.

The SPLC said that “a knowledgeable source with ranking law enforcement contacts” had read Ciancia’s manifesto and that its contents placed him squarely in the right-wing “Patriot” movement of anti-government conservatives.

Mark Potok of the SPLC’s “Hatewatch” blog wrote, “So-called Patriots also increasingly see the DHS, which produces intelligence assessments of extremists that are distributed to other law enforcement agencies, as an enemy and even a collaborator in the New World Order conspiracy. Many believe DHS has targeted their movement and is somehow connected to the alleged construction of concentration camps by the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA).”

The TSA, agents of which Ciancia targeted in his attack, is considered to be the most visible arm of the DHS. The attack on Friday killed 39-year-old Gerardo I. Hernandez and wounded six others.

Ciancia was shot in the chest multiple times by police and is currently receiving medical treatment under police guard.



So, we are now reaping the benefits of the rantings of Alex Jones, Glenn Beck and other wellsprings of right wing political conspiracy rhetoric. These people are empowered to spew hatred and sedition, along entirely partisan lines, and the end result is disturbed people take this gak and act on it.

How long can the freedom of speech be used as an excuse for these demagogues to spin evil and hatred and then shrug when what they've incited means people are dead?




 
   
Made in us
Fate-Controlling Farseer





Fort Campbell

Got that BS out of your system now?

The mentally ill will always find something to latch onto. Had those people you referenced never existed, something else would have fixated his attention.

Full Frontal Nerdity 
   
Made in us
Imperial Admiral




 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
How long can the freedom of speech be used as an excuse for these demagogues to spin evil and hatred and then shrug when what they've incited means people are dead?


Are you thinking internment camps, or just outright execution?
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

 Seaward wrote:
 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
How long can the freedom of speech be used as an excuse for these demagogues to spin evil and hatred and then shrug when what they've incited means people are dead?


Are you thinking internment camps, or just outright execution?


Actually I was thinking of laws against inciting violence based on ideology or voting behavior, similar to the incitement to racial hatred law in the UK which can be used to shut up people like Abu Hamza, but thanks for adding your usual level of cerebral acrobatics to the discussion.



 
   
Made in us
Imperial Admiral




 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Actually I was thinking of laws against inciting violence based on ideology or voting behavior, similar to the incitement to racial hatred law in the UK which can be used to shut up people like Abu Hamza, but thanks for adding your usual level of cerebral acrobatics to the discussion.

You're going to find America very unpleasant if you continue to pine for that sort of legislation. It's not happening. We've already got laws against incitement to violence, and they're plenty good enough. Your political enemies, sadly, are not breaking them.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

 djones520 wrote:
Got that BS out of your system now?

The mentally ill will always find something to latch onto. Had those people you referenced never existed, something else would have fixated his attention.


So you think that these people being able to broadcast nationally and find corporate sponsorship to peddle calls for armed uprising are fine?

Because you're right, the mentally ill always will find something to latch onto, cloud patterns or next door's Labrador giving him detailed instructions from God, but these people are endorsing and promoting conspiracy and violent rhetoric to combating it, you cannot say there is not correlation between these broadcasters constantly barraging 'news' of the NWO and tyrannical government and disturbed people believing this and acting on it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Seaward wrote:
We've already got laws against incitement to violence, and they're plenty good enough.


If they are good enough, why are disturbed people acting on what they hear and 'learn' and shooting people to death?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/03 17:17:16




 
   
Made in us
Imperial Admiral




 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
If they are good enough, why are disturbed people acting on what they hear and 'learn' and shooting people to death?


You'd need to prove they are, first, which is a hurdle you've yet to clear. Quoting the SPLC, who heard it from somebody else, is hardly cast iron proof, given their strong biases.

We didn't ban Catcher in the Rye just because Hinckley read it before shooting at Reagan. If you want to ban anything containing anti-government sentiment, you ought to start with a whole lot of Thomas Jefferson's works.

   
Made in us
Fate-Controlling Farseer





Fort Campbell

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
 djones520 wrote:
Got that BS out of your system now?

The mentally ill will always find something to latch onto. Had those people you referenced never existed, something else would have fixated his attention.


So you think that these people being able to broadcast nationally and find corporate sponsorship to peddle calls for armed uprising are fine?



The only mention of "armed uprising" comes from the political opponents of the people you mentioned, who say that is what they are pushing for.

If they are good enough, why are disturbed people acting on what they hear and 'learn' and shooting people to death?


Good question. Why don't we ask Britain how well their laws work against it.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/05/29/uk-soldier-killed-in-london-died-from-stab-wounds/

Oh... they don't seem to stop it. Norway?

http://www.npr.org/2012/08/24/159975478/breivik-sentenced-to-prison-for-norways-mass-murder

Damn, not there either. Maybe you can point out a place where the laws always stop insane people from killing people.

Full Frontal Nerdity 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

Seaward wrote:
 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
If they are good enough, why are disturbed people acting on what they hear and 'learn' and shooting people to death?

You'd need to prove they are, first, which is a hurdle you've yet to clear. Quoting the SPLC, who heard it from somebody else, is hardly cast iron proof, given their strong biases.
We didn't ban Catcher in the Rye just because Hinckley read it before shooting at Reagan. If you want to ban anything containing anti-government sentiment, you ought to start with a whole lot of Thomas Jefferson's works.


I would no more want Catcher banned than any other book, I at no time said I wanted to ban 'anything containing anti-government sentiment' so please refrain from further strawman in that regard. I suggested legislation against calling for violence or murder against political or ideological opponents, which is something these broadcasters have pushed.



djones520 wrote:
If they are good enough, why are disturbed people acting on what they hear and 'learn' and shooting people to death?


Good question. Why don't we ask Britain how well their laws work against it.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/05/29/uk-soldier-killed-in-london-died-from-stab-wounds/

Oh... they don't seem to stop it. Norway?

http://www.npr.org/2012/08/24/159975478/breivik-sentenced-to-prison-for-norways-mass-murder

Damn, not there either. Maybe you can point out a place where the laws always stop insane people from killing people.



Do we have radio stations and tv shows ideologically promoting and supporting either of those murderers in those countries? I wasn't aware of a nationwide radio show in the UK demanding that muslims dismember servicemen.



 
   
Made in us
Imperial Admiral




 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I would no more want Catcher banned than any other book, I at no time said I wanted to ban 'anything containing anti-government sentiment' so please refrain from further strawman in that regard. I suggested legislation against calling for violence or murder against political or ideological opponents, which is something these broadcasters have pushed.

This is where things get interesting. Can you point to any examples of Glenn Beck calling for violence? I'd certainly hope so, else you're flirting with outright lying.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




 MeanGreenStompa wrote:



So, we are now reaping the benefits of the rantings of Alex Jones, Glenn Beck and other wellsprings of right wing political conspiracy rhetoric. These people are empowered to spew hatred and sedition, along entirely partisan lines, and the end result is disturbed people take this gak and act on it.

How long can the freedom of speech be used as an excuse for these demagogues to spin evil and hatred and then shrug when what they've incited means people are dead?




While we're at it we should ban all violent video games, movies, and sexually suggestive music videos, eh?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/03 18:47:01


 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Omadon's Realm

 Seaward wrote:
 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I would no more want Catcher banned than any other book, I at no time said I wanted to ban 'anything containing anti-government sentiment' so please refrain from further strawman in that regard. I suggested legislation against calling for violence or murder against political or ideological opponents, which is something these broadcasters have pushed.

This is where things get interesting. Can you point to any examples of Glenn Beck calling for violence? I'd certainly hope so, else you're flirting with outright lying.



"Drive a stake through their hearts"

"Put a bullet in their heads"

He has constantly claimed that the government is: Nazi, Fascist, Communist, Terrorist and is already the Manchurian regime, brainwashing children and utterly at odds with the founding fathers, Christianity and everything that 'good and decent' Americans should hold dear.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Relapse wrote:


While we're at it we should ban all violent video games, movies, and sexually suggestive music videos, eh?


Do music videos, video games or movies claim to be factual? No, didn't fething think so.

While we're at it, debate the issue raised or leave the room. Don't hop in here with that puerile strawman.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/03 18:47:27




 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
 Seaward wrote:
 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I would no more want Catcher banned than any other book, I at no time said I wanted to ban 'anything containing anti-government sentiment' so please refrain from further strawman in that regard. I suggested legislation against calling for violence or murder against political or ideological opponents, which is something these broadcasters have pushed.

This is where things get interesting. Can you point to any examples of Glenn Beck calling for violence? I'd certainly hope so, else you're flirting with outright lying.



"Drive a stake through their hearts"

"Put a bullet in their heads"

He has constantly claimed that the government is: Nazi, Fascist, Communist, Terrorist and is already the Manchurian regime, brainwashing children and utterly at odds with the founding fathers, Christianity and everything that 'good and decent' Americans should hold dear.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Relapse wrote:


While we're at it we should ban all violent video games, movies, and sexually suggestive music videos, eh?


Do music videos, video games or movies claim to be factual? No, didn't fething think so.

While we're at it, debate the issue raised or leave the room. Don't hop in here with that puerile strawman.


That is part of the issue, though. You say that people are influenced by one form of media and not another? There are studies that state emphatically that violence in movies and games encourage people to act out on them, and here we have you stating emphatically that Glen Beck has some form of mesmeric powers to influence people into going on a killing spree.


Here we have you advocating the destruction of church buildings in the same spirit of Glenn Beck talking about driving a stake through someone's heart. Are we to blame you and seek to gag your comments if one gets blown up?



 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'm going to go push over a Mormon church.

Look at this dangerously unstable collection of rocks that might fall and injure or kill a child! I'm going to knock that fether down!





This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/11/04 00:07:20


 
   
Made in us
Crazed Bloodkine




Baltimore, Maryland

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

"Drive a stake through their hearts"

"Put a bullet in their heads"


Thats some solid monster slaying advice from Glen Beck. He should write a book.

"Sometimes the only victory possible is to keep your opponent from winning." - The Emperor, from The Outcast Dead.
"Tell your gods we are coming for them, and that their realms will burn as ours did." -Thostos Bladestorm
 
   
Made in us
Fate-Controlling Farseer





Fort Campbell

 NELS1031 wrote:
 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

"Drive a stake through their hearts"

"Put a bullet in their heads"


Thats some solid monster slaying advice from Glen Beck. He should write a book.


So people can blame him if someone kills a bunch of goths?

Full Frontal Nerdity 
   
Made in us
Imperial Admiral




 NELS1031 wrote:
Thats some solid monster slaying advice from Glen Beck. He should write a book.

That's assuming he said it, in the context our British friend claims.

Why are we tossing out Sean Penn's suggestion to just forcibly intern them in a mental institution so rapidly, anyway?
   
Made in us
Legendary Master of the Chapter





SoCal

So, when moderate Muslims don't condemn their violent far-right coreligionists, they are culpable for allowing the hostile atmosphere and deserve scorn, but if a right wing extremist acts of the crazy rhetoric coming out of the right wing, the party is blameless and had no responsibility to police itself?

It does seem a bit hypocritical to me. I would also condemn any leftists who didn't make some serious introspection should some liberal extremist start shooting up wall street or the GOP or something. However, that doesn't seem to have happened yet. (I do actually expect something to occur due to some of the "we need a violent revolution" chatter one hears from time to time.)

At least this guy didn't go full Brevik.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/11/03 19:18:07


   
Made in us
Imperial Admiral




 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, when moderate Muslims don't condemn their violent far-right coreligionists, they are culpable for allowing the hostile atmosphere and deserve scorn, but if a right wing extremist acts of the crazy rhetoric coming out of the right wing, the party is blameless and had no responsibility to police itself?

I don't think you'll find anyone condoning this guy's actions, which is where your comparison breaks down.
   
 
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