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2013/11/26 13:49:54
Subject: Re:Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
If you read the original script for Prometheus you can see what could have been. Makes a bit more sense and was quite interesting. Was canned because they didn't want the Xenomorph in the film. I recommend reading through it, grab a cup of tea and enjoy!
Medium of Death wrote: If you read the original script for Prometheus you can see what could have been. Makes a bit more sense and was quite interesting. Was canned because they didn't want the Xenomorph in the film. I recommend reading through it, grab a cup of tea and enjoy!
Medium of Death wrote: If you read the original script for Prometheus you can see what could have been. Makes a bit more sense and was quite interesting. Was canned because they didn't want the Xenomorph in the film. I recommend reading through it, grab a cup of tea and enjoy!
Another chapter in the great book known only as "What could of been", currently being co-authored by George Lucas.
Little orphans in the snow
With nowhere to call a home
Start their singing, singing
Waiting through the summertime
To thaw your hearts in wintertime
That's why they're singing, singing
2013/11/26 18:01:15
Subject: Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
I actually liked Alien: Resurrection last time I saw it. You just kinda have to be willing to go with it since it's basically a comedy movie rather than ultra serious. If you can get past that it's enjoyable.
I can see why some people might not be able to, though. It's a bit of a departure.
2013/11/28 22:34:11
Subject: Re:Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
Just to note - it's not a remake, it's a prequel. it's about what happened to the station that found the Thing first, and ends exactly where the first movie starts. Aside from better creature effects, the visuals all blend in as well. I was pretty impressed with how they managed that. The only downside is there's almost zero tension.
Ah that's a shame then.. actually the thing I thought most striking about the Kurt Russell film was the tension!
And the special effects kind of had a charm of their own.. almost in the same way that the effects in the original Red Dwarf series were a million times better than the CGI in the more modern re-launch
master of ordinance wrote:
... I actually preferred AvP:R to it.
Now look.. I was actually taking you seriously until that point
So, I re-watched AvP today, and something struck me.....
Spoiler:
Lance (who plays Weyland) is stabbed by one of the Predators because he flamed it in the back (dumb move!).
He falls to the ground, and for all appearances....seems to be dead.
*IF* he wasn't dead at that moment in time....
I would think that the huge ass fireball/explosion and the accompanying disintegration of the ground around the area where he fell would have finished the job (sorry, I don't believe there was any way that he crawled anywhere safe if he were alive).
So....
Does AvP have any real place in the Ridley Scott canon of the Aliens world?
If so....how did Weyland survive?
I destroy my enemies when I make them my friends.
Three!! Three successful trades! Ah ah ah!
2013/12/03 04:33:23
Subject: Re:Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
TheMeanDM wrote: So, I re-watched AvP today, and something struck me.....
Spoiler:
Lance (who plays Weyland) is stabbed by one of the Predators because he flamed it in the back (dumb move!).
He falls to the ground, and for all appearances....seems to be dead.
*IF* he wasn't dead at that moment in time....
I would think that the huge ass fireball/explosion and the accompanying disintegration of the ground around the area where he fell would have finished the job (sorry, I don't believe there was any way that he crawled anywhere safe if he were alive).
So....
Does AvP have any real place in the Ridley Scott canon of the Aliens world?
If so....how did Weyland survive?
Spoiler:
I guess you can choose either the Weyland of AvP or the Weyland of Prometheus as the prequel to the latter movies. Or neither. I think I'm going with neither.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/04 03:34:48
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
2013/12/04 02:37:44
Subject: Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
(watched it again for the benefit of, my son...it's funny, but even at 10 he could foretell what was going to happen to whom, etc...no fear whatsoever--he wants to make a Minecraft mod of it!).
The one Predator that cuts off the tail of the Xenomorph has his hand blades melted by the acid.
Their armor, when splashed with the acid, begins to melt.
But the spear? And the Krull-like weapon?
Neither are at all damaged.
Kind of bugs me....
I destroy my enemies when I make them my friends.
Three!! Three successful trades! Ah ah ah!
2013/12/04 13:52:51
Subject: Re:Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
Now look.. I was actually taking you seriously until that point
Hey, atleast AvP:R had actual Xenomorphs in it but its still down at the bottom. The same level as Prometheous. Neither should have been made as they where.
TheMeanDM wrote:Something else that bugs me about AvP
(watched it again for the benefit of, my son...it's funny, but even at 10 he could foretell what was going to happen to whom, etc...no fear whatsoever--he wants to make a Minecraft mod of it!).
The one Predator that cuts off the tail of the Xenomorph has his hand blades melted by the acid.
Their armor, when splashed with the acid, begins to melt.
But the spear? And the Krull-like weapon?
Neither are at all damaged.
Kind of bugs me....
That actually got me too. In the fluff their weapons and armour are immune to the acid blood. I think that some parts are actually made out of Xenomorph chitin. So why do they melt
And i personally observe Prometheous as non canon and unrelated. So the AvP Weyland is the nearest i get to a canon Weyland.
Free from GW's tyranny and the hobby is looking better for it
DR:90-S++G+++M++B++I+Pww205++D++A+++/sWD146R++T(T)D+
2013/12/09 22:00:30
Subject: Re:Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
Even if you didn't like it (and it was broken on so various levels), at least it represented some kind of effort by the creators. There are so many little touches, the atmosphere of the movie, the references to philosophy that underpins the whole thing - you can tell a lot of thought went into (look it up - there are a fair number of article and forum groups talking about it). What I'm trying to say is that, even if something falls on its arse and doesn't set out what it tried to originally achieved, there has to be some merit given for the attempt. AvP was so fething gak on multiple levels, singularly lacking in any kind of vision, creativity, story, even the gore and action because the gutless studio couldn't do without the clink of teenagers pocket money.. it fails at all of them. So.. in that sense, I think saying Prometheus is on the same level is.. well, kind of insulting I feel.
AvP: Requiem at least had the advantage of, in following the first movie, the entire film could have been a 90-minute still shot of the Predators anus, and still received more favourable reviews than its predecessor.
I regard Prometheus as something of a broken masterpiece - it had a lot of vision, some tremendously tense moments, some hand-on-mouth moments (the 'self surgery') and a wonderful sense of mystery surrounding things - my friends and I spent hours talking about it in the pub afterwards, which has to say something. And even though Charlize Theron wasted her role (as well as not being able to run left or right) Idris Elba & Noomi Rappace made up for that. And Michael Fassbender was bloody brilliant.
Pacific wrote: Even if you didn't like it (and it was broken on so various levels), at least it represented some kind of effort by the creators. There are so many little touches, the atmosphere of the movie, the references to philosophy that underpins the whole thing - you can tell a lot of thought went into (look it up - there are a fair number of article and forum groups talking about it). What I'm trying to say is that, even if something falls on its arse and doesn't set out what it tried to originally achieved, there has to be some merit given for the attempt. AvP was so fething gak on multiple levels, singularly lacking in any kind of vision, creativity, story, even the gore and action because the gutless studio couldn't do without the clink of teenagers pocket money.. it fails at all of them. So.. in that sense, I think saying Prometheus is on the same level is.. well, kind of insulting I feel.
AvP: Requiem at least had the advantage of, in following the first movie, the entire film could have been a 90-minute still shot of the Predators anus, and still received more favourable reviews than its predecessor.
I regard Prometheus as something of a broken masterpiece - it had a lot of vision, some tremendously tense moments, some hand-on-mouth moments (the 'self surgery') and a wonderful sense of mystery surrounding things - my friends and I spent hours talking about it in the pub afterwards, which has to say something. And even though Charlize Theron wasted her role (as well as not being able to run left or right) Idris Elba & Noomi Rappace made up for that. And Michael Fassbender was bloody brilliant.
Anyway!
Yeah, AvP was basically just a z-movie, throwing out the same old crap for a non-critical audience that just wanted to see their favourite movies fight, and it wasn't even a very good effort at that.
I agree that Prometheus was ambitious, aiming to combine sci-fi and mythology in a really interesting and potentially thought provoking way. Unfortunately none of it was really explored in any real depth, instead things were just mentioned and moved past as some other issue was raised.
The question then, is whether we give Prometheus more credit just for trying, and I'm not sure the answer is that we should. Thing is, there aren't a lot of big budget films aimed squarely at adults who like to think, and I think the major reason why is because no-one has made a lot of money making films like that. So they don't get made, and so we don't get one that makes a lot of money, and so they don't get made and so on. Prometheus was the film that could change all of that, because the commercial viability was there with the connection to the Alien franchise, and they had a serious, heavyweight director wanting to tackle interesting material. This could have been the movie that paved the way for a resurgence of big budget, serious sci-fi.
But they flubbed it, and the movie sucked, and as much as people might have talked about the film afterwards, no-one left saying 'I really want to go and see more movies that treat sci-fi concepts in a serious, adult way'. And maybe that's a little unfair and Prometheus shouldn't be judged on anything other than the movie that it is, and in that case yeah its a lot better than crud like AvP, but I just can't see it that way, what I can see is that when they make an adult sci-fi film and they make it badly, that makes it so much harder to get another one made.
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
2013/12/13 22:34:43
Subject: Re:Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
Yes think that's a pretty fair thing to say Sebster. Not sure about another one being made? Obviously the ending was made with sequels in mind, but not sure what the takings of the film were on top of what was probably quite expensive to make.
Interesting you saying about ideas being mentioned but then not possibly explored, I agree and wonder if this was another one of Ridley Scott's films that suffered badly in the editing room? I remember reading about Gladiator, and how we still haven't seen the film as Ridley Scott intended; whole sequences dealing with the politics going on throughout the film (with Derek Jacoby's sequences in particular suffering badly) - apparently much more was made of the story in terms of historical context, of how Maximus was the linchpin of a coup, really transforming it beyond an action film into a true swords & sandals epic. But, it would have pushed the film above 4 hours and so deemed unsuitable for theatrical release. I wonder if this was the same case for Prometheus?
Anyway, I know Prometheus tends to be a really contentious film, but now for something hopefully less divisive!
The playtester's comments certainly sound very encouraging.
I may be wrong with this, but wasn't there another game years ago that followed a similar kind of format? Almost a Monkey Island/King's Quest style point and click game, where you played a single character running around and trying to escape with an alien after you? This is possibly going back 20 years or so, a PC game..
With all this talk of the new Alien game it reminded me of another exciting game in the works called "Routine". It's survival horror on an 80's inspired Moon station. What's not to love?
It's an indy game that seems to have gone quite. I really, really, really hope it doesn't fade away.
This sounds like very much what they'd be going for with Isolation.
I can't get hyped up for Isolation. Colonial Marines really took a crap from on high on my faith in a decent Alien game. I'll have my fingers crossed, but I won't let them hurt me again!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/01/09 01:20:21
Ouze wrote: I guess it's about time for some video game developer to take another dump on the franchise. I look forward to another solid 30/100 on metacritic.
I can understand people being massively cynical after Colonial Marines, and some of the other games over the years (the AvP RTS springs to mind also), but it's definitely worthwhile reading the write-up on that link I posted.
I'm not going to try to kick that football again, Lucy - this time, I'm waiting until it comes out and gets reviews better than 60% before I even think of being excited. For all I know that Alpha gameplay trailer is just like that Gearbox A:CM trailer that contained all sorts of nonexistent content.
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
2014/01/11 20:40:02
Subject: Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
HiveFleetPlastic wrote: I actually liked Alien: Resurrection last time I saw it. You just kinda have to be willing to go with it since it's basically a comedy movie rather than ultra serious. If you can get past that it's enjoyable.
A+ review. After A3, it would be kind of weird to try to go serious again. I mean, look at Prometheus where Sir Ridley was convinced you couldn't even use the xenomorph anymore.
HiveFleetPlastic wrote: I actually liked Alien: Resurrection last time I saw it. You just kinda have to be willing to go with it since it's basically a comedy movie rather than ultra serious. If you can get past that it's enjoyable.
A+ review. After A3, it would be kind of weird to try to go serious again. I mean, look at Prometheus where Sir Ridley was convinced you couldn't even use the xenomorph anymore.
Just watch movie defense force about 3 and resurrection and then watch the movies. Put's you in the right state of mind.
2014/01/11 21:47:51
Subject: Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
Manchu wrote: I mean, look at Prometheus where Sir Ridley was convinced you couldn't even use the xenomorph anymore.
On the other hand, look at Prometheus. Hell, look at The Counsellor. If you make a movie where Cameron Diaz grinds herself to orgasm on the windshield of a Ferrari and still can't break a 30% audience rating on Rotten Tomatoes, you suck at your job.
"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up."
-C.S. Lewis
2014/01/11 21:49:19
Subject: Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
Manchu wrote: I mean, look at Prometheus where Sir Ridley was convinced you couldn't even use the xenomorph anymore.
On the other hand, look at Prometheus. Hell, look at The Counsellor. If you make a movie where Cameron Diaz grinds herself to orgasm on the windshield of a Ferrari and still can't break a 30% audience rating on Rotten Tomatoes, you suck at your job.
Cameron Diaz being in the movie means I probably won't watch it regardless. She's got no ass and can't act.
2014/01/11 22:28:22
Subject: Re:Discussion of the Aliens, Predator, AvP et al films
I think that's basically when you see her without make-up.. like so many movie stars actually.
Another quick comment on the Alien game, from the Gamesradar website. Yes I know there is the possibility I'm setting myself up for massive disappointment here, but god-damnit I want to allow myself to get a bit excited!
From the '100 most anticipated games of 2014'
Forget the deflating debacle of Colonial Marines. Gearbox’s game has about as much relevance to Creative Assembly’s Alien: Isolation as Batman: Dark Tomorrow had to Arkham Asylum. Finally adapting the right Alien film (ie. the first one), Alien Isolation promises to be a gruelling, terrifying, survival-horror nightmare of a game, centred around a dynamic, fiercely intelligent, purely AI driven Alien and the total dread of being trapped alone and helpless in the dark.
Made up of years of dedicated work by a development team who really seem to understand the DNA of Ridley Scott’s 1979 sci-fi horror classic, as well as rafts of rare and hitherto undiscovered source material from the production, Alien: Isolation looks as flawlessly authentic as it look relentlessly terrifying. And having been unrepentantly traumatised by a hands-on demo, we can vouch that that’s very terrifying indeed.
