Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:

James811 wrote:
I wonder if we'll be blessed with something like battle focus like the eldar got for hormagaunts? I'd love that!!

I'd sure love my hormagaunts to be able to run and shoot ... I guess you meant running and charging. If only ....

I could see a Run after consolidating too. "OMG, they just ripped apart Bob's squad and then disappeared!"

Noooooo not my squad!

New rumors from Faeit-212:

http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/12/tyranid-rules-apex-biomorphs.html

via an anonymous source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Apex Biomorphs, max one of each per detachment:
1. Synapse range is reduced but grants Eternal Warrior. Can be taken by any
HQ (not Troop Tervigons or HS Trygon Primes).
2.Twin boneswords, AP2, for every wound inflicted on a 5+ the model regains
a wound. For Primes and Tyrants. Regular boneswords are AP3 by the way.
3. Virus spore barrage (Ordnance, Poisoned 3+, unlimited range, one-shot,
the template remains on the board until the end of the game).

A bit hazy but saw a flamer in there that could be taken by Tyrants and
Tervigons only (AP3?) and a 3+ carapace that grants a 2+ and EW if the
model didn't run/glide.

I knew it was gonna happen, but man I am pissed if Boneswords are AP3. Guess that means my warriors will be switching to rending claws...

Yay for having no boneswords other than my Prime!
Boo because I was looking forward to boneswords!

Yeah, not sure why you would be surprised. They've been reducing the AP2, it seems.

rigeld2 wrote:Yay for having no boneswords other than my Prime!
Boo because I was looking forward to boneswords!

pretre wrote:Yeah, not sure why you would be surprised. They've been reducing the AP2, it seems.

Time to convert up some Bone-axes?

http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/12/tyranid-rules-apex-biomorphs.html
]via an anonymous source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Apex Biomorphs, max one of each per detachment:
1. Synapse range is reduced but grants Eternal Warrior. Can be taken by any
HQ (not Troop Tervigons or HS Trygon Primes). Game changer right here, and 100% required for a warrior heavy army.
2.Twin boneswords, AP2, for every wound inflicted on a 5+ the model regains
a wound. For Primes and Tyrants. Regular boneswords are AP3 by the way.Nifty, especially on a prime I suppose...somewhat useless for a tyrant no? Zero surprise about boneswords though
3. Virus spore barrage (Ordnance, Poisoned 3+, unlimited range, one-shot,
the template remains on the board until the end of the game). Meh, might be interesting to drop on an objective or as an area denial tool. Probably excessively expensive though.

A bit hazy but saw a flamer in there that could be taken by Tyrants and
Tervigons only (AP3?) Potentially interesting combo with wings.....nid-drake?
and a 3+ carapace that grants a 2+ and EW if the model didn't run/glide. Walking tyrant/HQ tervigon buff?

Of course, Faeit212, so likely not true.

 pretre wrote:
Yeah, not sure why you would be surprised. They've been reducing the AP2, it seems.

Not surprised, just disappointed. I mean - I knew it was coming which is why I didn't bother making bonesword warriors for my last few games with this codex - didn't want to get "caught" halfway through after spending the time and money converting them.

 Carnage43 wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:Yay for having no boneswords other than my Prime!
Boo because I was looking forward to boneswords!

pretre wrote:Yeah, not sure why you would be surprised. They've been reducing the AP2, it seems.

Time to convert up some Bone-axes?

http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/12/tyranid-rules-apex-biomorphs.html
]via an anonymous source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Apex Biomorphs, max one of each per detachment:
1. Synapse range is reduced but grants Eternal Warrior. Can be taken by any
HQ (not Troop Tervigons or HS Trygon Primes). Game changer right here, and 100% required for a warrior heavy army.
2.Twin boneswords, AP2, for every wound inflicted on a 5+ the model regains
a wound. For Primes and Tyrants. Regular boneswords are AP3 by the way.Nifty, especially on a prime I suppose...somewhat useless for a tyrant no? Zero surprise about boneswords though
3. Virus spore barrage (Ordnance, Poisoned 3+, unlimited range, one-shot,
the template remains on the board until the end of the game). Meh, might be interesting to drop on an objective or as an area denial tool. Probably excessively expensive though.

A bit hazy but saw a flamer in there that could be taken by Tyrants and
Tervigons only (AP3?) Potentially interesting combo with wings.....nid-drake?
and a 3+ carapace that grants a 2+ and EW if the model didn't run/glide. Walking tyrant/HQ tervigon buff?

Of course, Faeit212, so likely not true.

Wow you're right. Holy crap an all warrior army might just have become viable with that EW granting biomorph! The trick will be to give it to either Swarmlord and/or a HT with Armored shell for maximum survivability.

From Faeit212
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/12/tyranid-rules-apex-biomorphs.html

via an anonymous source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Apex Biomorphs, max one of each per detachment:
1. Synapse range is reduced but grants Eternal Warrior. Can be taken by any HQ (not Troop Tervigons or HS Trygon Primes).
2.Twin boneswords, AP2, for every wound inflicted on a 5+ the model regains a wound. For Primes and Tyrants. Regular boneswords are AP3 by the way.
3. Virus spore barrage (Ordnance, Poisoned 3+, unlimited range, one-shot, the template remains on the board until the end of the game).

A bit hazy but saw a flamer in there that could be taken by Tyrants and
Tervigons only (AP3?) and a 3+ carapace that grants a 2+ and EW if the
model didn't run/glide.

Eternal Warrior for any HQ! Summary seems vague if the EW will be personal or within the reduced synapse range. If it's within a range, shoving it on a Prime in a unit will be exceptionally useful.

Additionally, there is another EW carapace. Not that EW is needed on larger Tyranids, anyways.

The rest is disappointing, to a degree. I was hoping that the one-per-army biomorphs would be the substitute for the Doom or Parasite similar to how the Eldar get a spear that can turn your Autarch effectively into a Solitaire. Instead, Tyranids just get super-wargear.

Also, Boneswords are AP3. Severe nerf, but expected.

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
Wow you're right. Holy crap an all warrior army might just have become viable with that EW granting biomorph! The trick will be to give it to either Swarmlord and/or a HT with Armored shell for maximum survivability.

That would just be the tip of the iceberg really.

Prime with it in a warrior brood, so that overcomes the synapse nerf and protects the prime (assume he could even have it)
Flyrant with it escorting some raveners/shrikes up the table...suddenly you are looking at a reasonably tough attack force that might be able to make combat.

Can't see a reasonable use for it with a tervigon though...maybe babysitting biovores, zoans or ranged warriors?

I run my Tervigons down my opponent's throat. They're a significant threat as is - giving them EW would be cool as well.

The potential for a Flying-MC Heldrake lookalike is quite a scary prospect, if it isn't too over the top expensive.

 Absolutionis wrote:
From Faeit212
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/12/tyranid-rules-apex-biomorphs.html

via an anonymous source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Apex Biomorphs, max one of each per detachment:
1. Synapse range is reduced but grants Eternal Warrior. Can be taken by any HQ (not Troop Tervigons or HS Trygon Primes).
2.Twin boneswords, AP2, for every wound inflicted on a 5+ the model regains a wound. For Primes and Tyrants. Regular boneswords are AP3 by the way.
3. Virus spore barrage (Ordnance, Poisoned 3+, unlimited range, one-shot, the template remains on the board until the end of the game).

A bit hazy but saw a flamer in there that could be taken by Tyrants and
Tervigons only (AP3?) and a 3+ carapace that grants a 2+ and EW if the
model didn't run/glide.

Eternal Warrior for any HQ! Summary seems vague if the EW will be personal or within the reduced synapse range. If it's within a range, shoving it on a Prime in a unit will be exceptionally useful.

Additionally, there is another EW carapace. Not that EW is needed on larger Tyranids, anyways.

The rest is disappointing, to a degree. I was hoping that the one-per-army biomorphs would be the substitute for the Doom or Parasite similar to how the Eldar get a spear that can turn your Autarch effectively into a Solitaire. Instead, Tyranids just get super-wargear.

Also, Boneswords are AP3. Severe nerf, but expected.

I read it initially as grants EW within synapse, else what would be the point in reducing the range? Then I thought that it might be gaining EW at the cost of reduced leadership efficiency, but that sounded a bit too much like an attempt at balance!

Seriously though, I think it would be the first one.

When I read it, I thought it would be that the model with the upgrade has reduced Synapse Range, but gains Eternal Warrior. Granting Eternal Warrior to everything within a reduced bubble would be amazing, but I don't think it would happen. I'd love to be wrong, though.

As for the boneswords; expected it ever since I read 6th edition's "power weapons are AP3 unless stated otherwise". How unfortunate. It's not like we can get them on Hormagaunts! If a Warrior (because MCs will get AP2 anyway) gets into close combat with Terminators, I think they deserve to be able to ignore their saves. Ah, well.

Why are people so bent out of shape about the move to AP3 for Boneswords? You didn't cry when Grey Knights went from "no armor save" to AP3. When the same thing happens to your army you flip?

It's not like Tyranid Warriors are going to fight a whole lot that has a 2+ armor save anyway. A brood of 5 Warriors with 'swords is what, sub-200 points? Did you want them wading into a 500 point squad of TH+SS Terminators with an attached character and winning?

Seems a little unreasonable to expect anything more than AP3 for their cost., and seeing as how there are about 2 relevant units in the game walking around with 2+ armor, it's appropriate to 6th edition, not a nerf.

And no, Warriors don't "deserve to ignore" Terminator armor, as someone foolishly claimed. Warriors can wade into the other 99% of infantry out there and slaughter them this way. AP2 wasn't going to be a defining factor. Figure out other ways to kill Terminators; concurrently, figure out other ways to utilize Warriors.

It seems like nobody really wanted Warriors to be viable, they just wanted them to kill Terminators really efficiently, for less points, and with no drawbacks. Shows how close-minded most players are.

Warriors are not Terminator equivalent. They are Aspect Warrior equivalent. Terminators are the high bar for elite shock infantry, and that will never change (nor should it).

Note that I say all this as a Tyranids player first.

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
New rumors from Faeit-212:

http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/12/tyranid-rules-apex-biomorphs.html

via an anonymous source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Apex Biomorphs, max one of each per detachment:
1. Synapse range is reduced but grants Eternal Warrior. Can be taken by any
HQ (not Troop Tervigons or HS Trygon Primes).
2.Twin boneswords, AP2, for every wound inflicted on a 5+ the model regains
a wound. For Primes and Tyrants. Regular boneswords are AP3 by the way.
3. Virus spore barrage (Ordnance, Poisoned 3+, unlimited range, one-shot,
the template remains on the board until the end of the game).

A bit hazy but saw a flamer in there that could be taken by Tyrants and
Tervigons only (AP3?) and a 3+ carapace that grants a 2+ and EW if the
model didn't run/glide.

I knew it was gonna happen, but man I am pissed if Boneswords are AP3. Guess that means my warriors will be switching to rending claws...

Those actually look genuine to me, honestly. Nothing outlandish, and it also confirms stuff we suspected like regular Boneswords being AP3 and regular Synapse not conferring Eternal Warrior. My thoughts;

1) On a totally, completely unrelated note, the Primaris Psychic Power for Tyranids boosts the Synapse range of the psyker by 6" This is very nice as it should allow at least one brood of Raveners/Shrikes/Warriors to benefit from Eternal Warrior. If it does stack with Dominion (and something tells me Dominion will work with it) then running multiples of those units should certainly be viable (except for that one turn you fail your psychic test).
2) I'm curious, does this mean only one model in the army can have "two boneswords", or is this referring to a specific pair of boneswords? In any case, it is obviously suited for a Tyranid Prime with the AP2. Of course, regaining wounds on a 5+ helps any of our HQs.
3) That is awesome. It's the Tyranid equivalent of an Orbital Bombardment. What is not to like?
4) A monster-only (Hive Tyrants and Tervigons are the only monstrous creatures that aren't special characters in the HQ slot) flamer? Hopefully it is AP3 so we can a flying Hive Tyrant Heldrake-wannabe.
5) I'm curious on this one about the "glide", is that supposed to mean actual gliding (a FMC when it isn't "flying") or making a 'run' move as a swooping FMC? Either way, sounds nifty. As long as Armoured Shell is still available otherwise, I don't mind. If it is available to Primes that will be sweet.

These sound nifty, the sticking point of course will be the costs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 brassangel wrote:
Why are people so bent out of shape about the move to AP3 for Boneswords? You didn't cry when Grey Knights went from "no armor save" to AP3. When the same thing happens to your army you flip?

While the rest of your post shows that you are just lazily assigning "the world is ending" tags to people here, I'll only focus on this part.

The difference here is that Grey Knights were an over-powered 5th Edition army, and having almost exclusively AP3 power weapons on their dudes was part of the balancing act of 6th Edition that led to them being a good, but hardly over or under-powered codex. Besides, almost every single Grey Knight has a power weapon.
Tyranid Warriors, instead, are an already very unpopular (competitively) unit that have to actively pay for their boneswords.

Your comparison makes zero sense.

Just say "no" to off-topic arguments about Tyranid Warriors vs. Grey Knights.

My apologies!

The rumour on the Harpy having different 'spore bomb ammunition' really stuck out to me, as it might see the return of the different types of artillery for Biovores. Anyone else intrigued?

 Carnage43 wrote:

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
Wow you're right. Holy crap an all warrior army might just have become viable with that EW granting biomorph! The trick will be to give it to either Swarmlord and/or a HT with Armored shell for maximum survivability.

That would just be the tip of the iceberg really.

Prime with it in a warrior brood, so that overcomes the synapse nerf and protects the prime (assume he could even have it)

I was already putting together a unit with Lashwhip/Bonesword to escort a Prime around, so giving him and his brood Eternal Warrior should make them a fairly tough shock assault unit.

Short question: Which pics in the first post are still dead?
They show all for me because of the cache.

EW bubbles would make Warriors more interesting, but also Venomthropes and especially Warriors supported by Venomthropes. Doubly interesting if VTs grant Shrouding instead of a simple cover save.

 gorgon wrote:
EW bubbles would make Warriors more interesting, but also Venomthropes and especially Warriors supported by Venomthropes. Doubly interesting if VTs grant Shrouding instead of a simple cover save.

EW warriors supported by venomthropes would be almost unstoppable, especially if camping on an objective.

That being said, I'm starting to doubt its true.

I am very doubtful that Synapse will grant Eternal Warrior. I can see a biomorph of some kind granting It will Not Die. That isn't too powerful, as Tyranid Warriors can still be instantly killed by strength 8, which is fair, and at the same time grants Tyranids some protection against small arms fire for Monstrous creatures.

 Janthkin wrote:
Just say "no" to off-topic arguments about Tyranid Warriors vs. Grey Knights.

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:

 gorgon wrote:
EW bubbles would make Warriors more interesting, but also Venomthropes and especially Warriors supported by Venomthropes. Doubly interesting if VTs grant Shrouding instead of a simple cover save.

EW warriors supported by venomthropes would be almost unstoppable, especially if camping on an objective.

That being said, I'm starting to doubt its true.

I think you over estimate how good it would be. They aren't screamer star or seer council level, they aren't a TENTH of that. T4 W3 models with EW and a 4+ save is not exactly intimidating to anyone for 40+ points, just lay the heavy weapons into the big guys and use small arms to take out the warriors.

 Carnage43 wrote:

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:

 gorgon wrote:
EW bubbles would make Warriors more interesting, but also Venomthropes and especially Warriors supported by Venomthropes. Doubly interesting if VTs grant Shrouding instead of a simple cover save.

EW warriors supported by venomthropes would be almost unstoppable, especially if camping on an objective.

That being said, I'm starting to doubt its true.

I think you over estimate how good it would be. They aren't screamer star or seer council level, they aren't a TENTH of that. T4 W3 models with EW and a 4+ save is not exactly intimidating to anyone for 40+ points, just lay the heavy weapons into the big guys and use small arms to take out the warriors.

You're forgetting with a venomthrope and terrain those T4 W3 EW Warriors potentially have a 3+ cover save, maybe even a 2+. Even Tau are going to have trouble taking them out if you manage to take out their marker lights quick enough.

 stonehorse wrote:
I am very doubtful that Synapse will grant Eternal Warrior. I can see a biomorph of some kind granting It will Not Die. That isn't too powerful, as Tyranid Warriors can still be instantly killed by strength 8, which is fair, and at the same time grants Tyranids some protection against small arms fire for Monstrous creatures.

How do you figure Warriors being instantly killed by S8 is 'fair', given their points cost?

They don't need resiance against small arms. a 4+ save and 3 wounds a peice offers that. Their weakness against S8, AP4 or better weapons is what is causing them to be entirely absent from tables. Right now, the humble krak missile removes a ~40pt Warrior from the table. No questions asked, gone. That is where the problem lies.

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:

 Carnage43 wrote:

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:

 gorgon wrote:
EW bubbles would make Warriors more interesting, but also Venomthropes and especially Warriors supported by Venomthropes. Doubly interesting if VTs grant Shrouding instead of a simple cover save.

EW warriors supported by venomthropes would be almost unstoppable, especially if camping on an objective.

That being said, I'm starting to doubt its true.

I think you over estimate how good it would be. They aren't screamer star or seer council level, they aren't a TENTH of that. T4 W3 models with EW and a 4+ save is not exactly intimidating to anyone for 40+ points, just lay the heavy weapons into the big guys and use small arms to take out the warriors.

You're forgetting with a venomthrope and terrain those T4 W3 EW Warriors potentially have a 3+ cover save, maybe even a 2+. Even Tau are going to have trouble taking them out if you manage to take out their marker lights quick enough.

Still not close to screamers or seer council....that's assuming (which has exactly zero rumor support BTW) that venomthropes move to a stealth or shrouded aura and don't still have the crappy 5+ cover save aura. In an era of where T4 creatures have rerollable 2+ invulernable saves, who cares about a 3+ cover saves?

 -Loki- wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
I am very doubtful that Synapse will grant Eternal Warrior. I can see a biomorph of some kind granting It will Not Die. That isn't too powerful, as Tyranid Warriors can still be instantly killed by strength 8, which is fair, and at the same time grants Tyranids some protection against small arms fire for Monstrous creatures.

How do you figure Warriors being instantly killed by S8 is 'fair', given their points cost?

They don't need resiance against small arms. a 4+ save and 3 wounds a peice offers that. Their weakness against S8, AP4 or better weapons is what is causing them to be entirely absent from tables. Right now, the humble krak missile removes a ~40pt Warrior from the table. No questions asked, gone. That is where the problem lies.

A Krak Missile can take out most tanks and vehicles in one shot, can kill most meq and eeq characters with one shot. What makes Warriors so special that they should be immune to being killed by such?

Also I mentioned that It Will Not Die would favour our Monstrous Creatures, not Tyranid Warriors.

For the record I run a predominantly Tyranid Warrior force, so know what it is like to lose them to Krak Missiles, but that is what Krak Missiles do.

 stonehorse wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
I am very doubtful that Synapse will grant Eternal Warrior. I can see a biomorph of some kind granting It will Not Die. That isn't too powerful, as Tyranid Warriors can still be instantly killed by strength 8, which is fair, and at the same time grants Tyranids some protection against small arms fire for Monstrous creatures.

How do you figure Warriors being instantly killed by S8 is 'fair', given their points cost?

They don't need resiance against small arms. a 4+ save and 3 wounds a peice offers that. Their weakness against S8, AP4 or better weapons is what is causing them to be entirely absent from tables. Right now, the humble krak missile removes a ~40pt Warrior from the table. No questions asked, gone. That is where the problem lies.

A Krak Missile can take out most tanks and vehicles in one shot, can kill most meq and eeq characters with one shot. What makes Warriors so special that they should be immune to being killed by such?

Also I mentioned that It Will Not Die would favour our Monstrous Creatures, not Tyranid Warriors.

For the record I run a predominantly Tyranid Warrior force, so know what it is like to lose them to Krak Missiles, but that is what Krak Missiles do.

And for the record, people wanting EW just because you don't like your warriors getting pasted by krak missiles don't realize that the side bonus is that a Daemon Prince with a Balesword or an Archon with a Huskblade or anything with a Force Weapon can't paste them either which throws a lot of things out of whack.

And I love how people just want them for their warriors, forgetting that their MCs and their T6 Tyrant/Hive guard would get the same exact thing for no reason.