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2013/12/31 17:51:02
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
Shadow is 12 Inches -3 LD for psi - Well, that's a nerf. 3d6 is better than a -3, since the average of that third die was 3.5. -4 would have been a buff.
Hive crone is Vector Strike 8 Nice, especially at it's point's cost of ~170
Missiles are rerollable S5 pulse Is this a friggin joke? S5? Did they learn nothing from the Nephalim? Almost enough to spoil the crone altogether.
Exocrine is bs3(4) t6 w5 3+
24 Inches, S7 ap2 6 shots or lagre blast
Bs4 when stationary 24" range.....wut? There better be more than advertised here is all I can say.
Haruspex ist t6 w5 3+
Gains an Attack for Every lost wound
Heals One wound for Every unsaved wound caused <sigh> Well, this sounds interesting at least. The real kicker will be how many base attacks, WS and initiative it has. If it's WS3, S5 and A2....it will never see play. If it's WS5, S6+ and A4+ base it might actually be a solid replacement for a Trygon. Also depends if it's your standard walking speed or 12" movement like I hope it is.
If this is true, the Meta is going to really change.
Shadows pretty much kills Screamerstar and Seer Council, right off the bat at -3 or -4 LD, which ever it is. Shadows is statistically worse than it used to be.....how is this going to break Seer Councils and Screamerstars if it's not already doing that?
Exocrine is... amazing if that is true, for 170 points. I'm going to wait for the rest of the stats....but I'm not impressed with the exocrine so far.
Th Haruspex is interesting. I still think it will be killed too quickly, before it gets into CC. We need to see how expensive it is. My bet is 170 points + upgrades. There's no way it can cost as much as a trygon with it's proposed stats. Not sure how you think this thing is fragile, and the exocrine is amazing with exactly the same survivability.
How are those missles supposed to be Anti-Air? Strength 5???
Looking for Durham Region gamers in Ontario Canada, send me a PM!
See my gallery for Chapterhouse's Tervigon, fully painted.
2013/12/31 17:51:37
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
If it's -3, I think it'll be about slightly better for the person casting the power. Average for 2D6 is 7, so greater than half of all rolls will be good if base Ld is 10. Average for 3D6 is 10 and 11, so you should succeed about half the time. If the penalty is -4, it's a little harder to call without more effort, and I'm too lazy.
The important thing for me is that I've always favored Daemon Psykers are Daemons of Tzeentch, which get +3 to Ld for Psychic checks, so I would clearly rather have the -3 or even -4 penalty than the 3D6.
It Depends which modifier comes first.
Shadows is statistically worse than it used to be.....how is this going to break Seer Councils and Screamerstars if it's not already doing that?
Tyranids, will still make those builds unreliable, if they become an actually used competitive force. When these builds, which already rely on a lot going right, find themselves up against a foe that can cause up to a 50% failure rate, you'll see a drop in the build.
I'm going to wait for the rest of the stats....but I'm not impressed with the exocrine so far.
6 BS 4 Strength 7 Ap2 shots for 170 points is not impressive to you?
My bet is 170 points + upgrades. There's no way it can cost as much as a trygon with it's proposed stats. Not sure how you think this thing is fragile, and the exocrine is amazing with exactly the same survivability.
Simple, because the Exocrine has a ranged attack, compared to the Haruspex, which must footslog it across the field to survive. In a Shooting oriented game, the Exocrine is the clear winner between the two.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 17:57:33
If it's -3, I think it'll be about slightly better for the person casting the power. Average for 2D6 is 7, so greater than half of all rolls will be good if base Ld is 10. Average for 3D6 is 10 and 11, so you should succeed about half the time. If the penalty is -4, it's a little harder to call without more effort, and I'm too lazy.
The important thing for me is that I've always favored Daemon Psykers are Daemons of Tzeentch, which get +3 to Ld for Psychic checks, so I would clearly rather have the -3 or even -4 penalty than the 3D6.
It Depends which modifier comes first.
If it's the same time, doesn't it come down to the players whose turn it is choice?
If it's -3, I think it'll be about slightly better for the person casting the power. Average for 2D6 is 7, so greater than half of all rolls will be good if base Ld is 10. Average for 3D6 is 10 and 11, so you should succeed about half the time. If the penalty is -4, it's a little harder to call without more effort, and I'm too lazy.
The important thing for me is that I've always favored Daemon Psykers are Daemons of Tzeentch, which get +3 to Ld for Psychic checks, so I would clearly rather have the -3 or even -4 penalty than the 3D6.
It Depends which modifier comes first.
If it's the same time, doesn't it come down to the players whose turn it is choice?
Not sure in this instance, it may be a thing for YMDC.
If it's -3, I think it'll be about slightly better for the person casting the power. Average for 2D6 is 7, so greater than half of all rolls will be good if base Ld is 10. Average for 3D6 is 10 and 11, so you should succeed about half the time. If the penalty is -4, it's a little harder to call without more effort, and I'm too lazy.
The important thing for me is that I've always favored Daemon Psykers are Daemons of Tzeentch, which get +3 to Ld for Psychic checks, so I would clearly rather have the -3 or even -4 penalty than the 3D6.
It Depends which modifier comes first.
If it's the same time, doesn't it come down to the players whose turn it is choice?
Not sure in this instance, it may be a thing for YMDC.
Yeah, you're probably right. Best leave that one there before it drags the thread down.
Shadow is 12 Inches -3 LD for psi - Well, that's a nerf. 3d6 is better than a -3, since the average of that third die was 3.5. -4 would have been a buff.
Hive crone is Vector Strike 8 Nice, especially at it's point's cost of ~170
Missiles are rerollable S5 pulse Is this a friggin joke? S5? Did they learn nothing from the Nephalim? Almost enough to spoil the crone altogether.
Exocrine is bs3(4) t6 w5 3+
24 Inches, S7 ap2 6 shots or lagre blast
Bs4 when stationary 24" range.....wut? There better be more than advertised here is all I can say.
Haruspex ist t6 w5 3+
Gains an Attack for Every lost wound
Heals One wound for Every unsaved wound caused <sigh> Well, this sounds interesting at least. The real kicker will be how many base attacks, WS and initiative it has. If it's WS3, S5 and A2....it will never see play. If it's WS5, S6+ and A4+ base it might actually be a solid replacement for a Trygon. Also depends if it's your standard walking speed or 12" movement like I hope it is.
If this is true, the Meta is going to really change.
Shadows pretty much kills Screamerstar and Seer Council, right off the bat at -3 or -4 LD, which ever it is. Shadows is statistically worse than it used to be.....how is this going to break Seer Councils and Screamerstars if it's not already doing that?
Exocrine is... amazing if that is true, for 170 points. I'm going to wait for the rest of the stats....but I'm not impressed with the exocrine so far.
Th Haruspex is interesting. I still think it will be killed too quickly, before it gets into CC. We need to see how expensive it is. My bet is 170 points + upgrades. There's no way it can cost as much as a trygon with it's proposed stats. Not sure how you think this thing is fragile, and the exocrine is amazing with exactly the same survivability.
How are those missles supposed to be Anti-Air? Strength 5???
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 18:32:34
GW: "We do no demographic research, we have no focus groups, we do not ask the market what it wants"
2013/12/31 18:41:00
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
jifel wrote: And according to the scans, the Tyranid force is ~3100 points. And according to the scans, the Tau force is ~1500... Truly, these new Tyranids are terrifying to defeat such desperate odds! (Really though, sounds like the book will at least be better than the last and not "dead on arrival")
Bloodhorror wrote: Whilst i like the point costs so far, i WILL NOT be too pleased if the Exocrines massive gun that is coming from his back is only 24"....
Thats kind of pitiful...
Interest tidbit from the 4chan thread about the exocrine. It was a "S7 AP2 large blast, or 6 shots". They didn't define what strength/AP the 6 shots were. We assumed they were S7 AP2, but it's entirely possible (and extremely likely) they are of lower strength and AP. S6 AP3? S5 AP3? Who knows?
Looking for Durham Region gamers in Ontario Canada, send me a PM!
See my gallery for Chapterhouse's Tervigon, fully painted.
2013/12/31 19:10:03
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
I'm not too keen on a 24' inch range either. Don't care how much plasma it's throwin' around, giving an MC a 24'' threat-range is just asking to be lit up by bladestorm, poison and grav-weapons.
Sigh. GW' really has zero awareness about its own meta. 170-points ain't cheap either. That's too much for a throw-away suicide unit. If it was 120 points, 24'' range would be acceptable.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2013/12/31 19:26:24
2013/12/31 19:21:51
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
Things to know from the BR from the WD. (Not sure if this has already been posted.
-Old One Eye is an HQ -Swarmlord has Tyrant Guard
-Swarmlord is ML3
-Catalyst is FNP to psyker, psykers unit AND one other within 12" per turn (so all 3 benefit each turn)
-Warp blast is S10, doesn't describe separation of it and lance as previously claimed
-Exorcine is 6 S7 AP2 or S7 AP2 large blast
-That's got to be one of the most tailored Tau lists in history... Everything has S7/8 OR S6 AP2. Plus, they have all the objectives on their side and are fighting hammer and anvil.
-2 lists, roughly 1500 each but the nids have 3 free units for killing objectives. Scythed Hierodule is a POS, may as well just throw away points, it's over 2 times the cost of a Wraithknight yet is generally worse than one.
-8 marker drones in the Tau list, not a lot but almost everything is already TL, so essentially a whole army of mass S7/8 AP2. Geez.
-Stranglethorm and Spore Cysts still large blast
-Tervigon still poops out and looks like it's still 3D6 per turn stops on doubles.
-Dakkafexes still fire 12 shots each, and on the grounds the objective is T7 W2 4+, I doubt they've changed from S6 as they kill it in one go with 24 shots "easily" (S5 would actually not kill it on average)
-Tervigon still has stinger salvo, so looks 100% unchanged as of writing barring points
-Venomthrope "vaporised" by one shot - that's S8, so venoms will still be T4 almost certainly.
-The Tau player is slowed, literally charging into MCs. Well, thinking about it, it DOES stop the nids charging the objectives. Seriously though, how are they still alive? They must actively be avoiding them as this is ridiculous.
-Crone instakills with S8 vector strike. Kills 3 crisis suits in one go - good rolling or something else?
-Tau freaking win because the nid player is so slowed he can't kill 3 T7 W2 4+ things. It should have been an utter wipe out, Tau winning on the other player's idiocy and the objective being too far away.
-Old One Eye has FNP -Hive Crone VS confirmed AP3 in after report!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 21:00:02
2013/12/31 21:11:23
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
HiveFleetCollossus wrote: Things to know from the BR from the WD. (Not sure if this has already been posted.
-The Tau player is slowed, literally charging into MCs. Well, thinking about it, it DOES stop the nids charging the objectives. Seriously though, how are they still alive? They must actively be avoiding them as this is ridiculous.
-Tau freaking win because the nid player is so slowed he can't kill 3 T7 W2 4+ things. It should have been an utter wipe out, Tau winning on the other player's idiocy and the objective being too far away.
1. The video above has a very clear "Result: DRAW!", so Tau don't win.
2. That nids have more points in models, AND get additional models during play for destroying shield generators, AND still can't pull out a victory does not really sound all that promising. The scenario being heavily slanted against them (or so I am repeatedly reading) probably plays a large part in that.
Overall, the new info makes me neither more excited nor less excited than previously. I'm still in the "wary; will by codex and Swarm box only at launch" category.
And lol at 24" range for a tyranid "Artillery beast" or whatever the crap GW decided to blow up our collective backsides.
2013/12/31 21:26:24
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
HiveFleetCollossus wrote: Things to know from the BR from the WD. (Not sure if this has already been posted.
-The Tau player is slowed, literally charging into MCs. Well, thinking about it, it DOES stop the nids charging the objectives. Seriously though, how are they still alive? They must actively be avoiding them as this is ridiculous.
-Tau freaking win because the nid player is so slowed he can't kill 3 T7 W2 4+ things. It should have been an utter wipe out, Tau winning on the other player's idiocy and the objective being too far away.
1. The video above has a very clear "Result: DRAW!", so Tau don't win.
2. That nids have more points in models, AND get additional models during play for destroying shield generators, AND still can't pull out a victory does not really sound all that promising. The scenario being heavily slanted against them (or so I am repeatedly reading) probably plays a large part in that.
Overall, the new info makes me neither more excited nor less excited than previously. I'm still in the "wary; will by codex and Swarm box only at launch" category.
And lol at 24" range for a tyranid "Artillery beast" or whatever the crap GW decided to blow up our collective backsides.
I think either Tau or Eldar lost their opening battle report too. It's rarely an accurate indication of what the book can do. Also, did you see these weird lists? 3180 points with 5 HQ's? 6 Riptides? Indestructible objectives? I wouldn't worry too much about it.
If the Exocrine is 24", I'm not worried about it (assuming it can survive). Tyranids are virtually never going to have that super long range artillery, but then no other army is going to be able to field a bunch of monster-tanks that can also fight in close combat. The idea is to move Tyranids forward no matter what's in the army. Furthermore, one would have to be a pretty terrible player to have a tough time getting something within 24". Seeing as that's the starting deployment distance in most scenarios, later than turn 2 = bad Tyranids player.
For how many complaints we see about armies that just sit back in a corner and launch, there are just as many Tyranids players that want to...sit back in a corner and launch. People seem to want Tyranids to do what they always do, plus have the highest toughness monsters (even though they already have the most monsters), plus the durability of MEQ (even though they don't wear armor), plus the ranged firepower of IG (even though they are also great in CC), plus the mobility of Eldar... It's bad/lazy design to make every army do all the same things.
The Crone sounds pretty stellar, by the way.
This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2013/12/31 21:45:33
brassangel wrote: If the Exocrine is 24", I'm not worried about it (assuming it can survive). Tyranids are virtually never going to have that super long range artillery, but then no other army is going to be able to field a bunch of monster-tanks that can also fight in close combat. The idea is to move Tyranids forward no matter what's in the army. Furthermore, one would have to be a pretty terrible player to have a tough time getting something within 24". Seeing as that's the starting deployment distance in most scenarios, later than turn 2 = bad Tyranids player.
For how many complaints we see about armies that just sit back in a corner and launch, there are just as many Tyranids players that want to...sit back in a corner and launch. People seem to want Tyranids to do what they always do, plus have the highest toughness monsters (even though they already have the most monsters), plus the durability of MEQ (even though they don't wear armor), plus the ranged firepower of IG (even though they are also great in CC), plus the mobility of Eldar... It's bad/lazy design to make every army do all the same things.
The Crone sounds pretty stellar, by the way.
No, you don't seem to understand that what people want when they want "close-range" is "assault". Assault units getting close is good. Unless it's melta, a ranged unit should never get close, because close always means death for a ranged unit.
Give the Exocrine 10 S10 AP1 shots at BS4 for all I care. With a 24'' range, It's still not going to do much more than kill a single vehicle or half a unit and then die if thrown against the type of lists we currently see in today's meta. "Assuming it can survive" is the point. It can't. It's a T6 monsterous creature with what is most likely a 2+ or 3+ save. That means bladestorm, plasma, poison and grav is going to rip it a new ass-hole.
The only positive thing you'll he hear about it is the same cop-out crap you hear about mutilators and carnifex. "lulz distraction unit". Not for 170 points and a heavy slot.
This message was edited 8 times. Last update was at 2013/12/31 22:00:17
2013/12/31 22:02:18
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
I will copy paste some of the stuff I wrote in the thread on 4chan, I wrote down all the info on the new unit pages.
Harpy
This multi-part plastic kit creates one
Harpy, an airborne Tyranid monstrosity
with a wingspan that dwarfs other
Warhammer 40,000 flyers such as the
Tau Sun Shark Bomber. A joy to
assemble, it also comes with the option
of swapping out its strangethorn
cannons for heavy venom cannons, plus
three different spore mine to rain
down on the heads of your enemies.
The Harpy comes with three spore mines, which
it creates and drops from its rear-facing spore
cysts. Each sports a subtly different design.
Haruspex
Sculpted by Mark Harrison, the Haruspex
miniature is a gloriously grotesque
centreouece fir any Tyranid collection. Its
key feature is undoubtedly its impossibly
distended jaw, a riot of feeding organs,
teeth and cruel claws dominated by a
talon-tipped grapsing tongue in the midst
of shooting out to ensnare a hapless (and
presumably short-lived) victim. Framing
this ghastly assemblage of mouthparts is a
pair of giant crushing claws, brutal close
combat appendages that can rip apart
Terminator armour and battle tanks alike.
Woe betide any soldier foolish enough to
stand in its way.
Exocrine
An alternative beast made from the
Haruspex kit, the Exocrine is a massive,
squat creature that sits midway between a
Carnifex and a Tyrannofex in size, and
looks daunting indeed as part of a Tyranid
gunline. The Bio-plasmic cannon its carries
is notable not just for its sheer mass, but
also for the six chambers that surround the
main apeture - the monster can fire either
multiple streams of vile plasma or a single
giant explosive blast. Stabilised on a
massive pair of middle limbs, the Exocrine
is hunkered down and ready to fire; no
enemy is safe from its hellish payload.
HiveFleetCollossus wrote: Things to know from the BR from the WD. (Not sure if this has already been posted.
-The Tau player is slowed, literally charging into MCs. Well, thinking about it, it DOES stop the nids charging the objectives. Seriously though, how are they still alive? They must actively be avoiding them as this is ridiculous.
-Tau freaking win because the nid player is so slowed he can't kill 3 T7 W2 4+ things. It should have been an utter wipe out, Tau winning on the other player's idiocy and the objective being too far away.
1. The video above has a very clear "Result: DRAW!", so Tau don't win.
The info was copy/pasted from 4chan. So yeah, I'm not sure whoever posted it saw the video.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 22:03:14
2013/12/31 22:03:43
Subject: Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
Hive Guard
The Hive Guard's typical armament is the
impaler cannon - an organic gun-like
symbiote that fires osseous darts capable
of punching through the toughest armour..
Some Hive Guard have adapted further to
carry shockcannons - hideous weapons
that fire a spine of bone into their targets
before delivering a powerful bio-electric
blast along their trailing tendrils. (Wait? So the nids use stunguns?)
Options for both weapon come in this multi-part
plastic kit and all three Hive Guard can be
equipped with either weapon.
Tyrant Guard
A range of symbiotic bio-weapons are
available to the three Tyrant Guard in this
multi-part plastic kit, from scything talons
and crushing claws to leech-like lashwhips
and razor-edged boneswords, all of which
can be posed in a variety of ways due to
the ball-and-socket joints that are common
to all Tyranid creatures.
Warriors
In a month where Tyranid collectors have
many reasons for celebration, the release
of this multi-part plastic kit is particularly
pleasing. A wholesale reinvention of the
hardly plastic set first released in 2001,
these new frames (much like the new
Space MArine Tactical squad) have been
resculpted and festooned with options,
allowing you to make three Tyranid Warriors.
Full weapon options for each Warrior have been
included for the first time, allowing Swarm
leaders to arm each of their monstrous
troops with ranged bio-weaponry as spinefists,
devourers and eathspittesr, and one
each of the rightly-feared barbed strangler
and venom cannon are included too.
Three sets apiece of scything talons,
boneswords, lash whips and rending claws
(resculpted to more accurately echo those
found on Genestealers and Raveners)
provide close combat options, while flesh
hooks, adrenal grands and toxin scacs offer
further customisability.
It's a brilliant kit that's a joy to build,
further bolstered by three different leg
poses and head creasts; I'm planning on
putting together at least one horde of nine
Warriors with which to slaughter the forces
of the Imperium, And there's one final
surprise included in the box - turn the
page to find out what it is...
Yes, it will likely die in one of those situations. But what about the other big bugs beside/behind it? What if it has a cover save and fnp? If I can flood the board with monsters and lose one or two per turn for the first few turns... That's fine if I can afford to bring 12 to begin with.
I am not worried about close range monstrous creatures, because all Tyranid MC's are just that. Effective in close range situations.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 22:06:59
Warrior Prime The new Tyranid Warrior box set contains enough options to build one Warrior as a Tyranid Prime. The components involved include a Prime-specific chestpiece and extended back carapace, flared shoulder guards and a grander headpiece - all of which go towards making a best significantly more imposing than the already fearsome Tyranid Warriors. The final flourish is a pincer-tipped tail end reminiscent of the one found in the plastic Hive Tyrant kit - a fitting reminder that the Tyranid Prime is one of the Great Devourers most senior, and dangerous, lieutenants.
So there you have the 3rd bullet point on all the new kits, some basic info on the kits.
So Nids now have stunguns... Crushing claws are at least AP2 from the description of them, isn't that the same as before though as they are used on MCs?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 22:06:29
Haruspex
Sculpted by Mark Harrison, the Haruspex
miniature is a gloriously grotesque
centreouece fir any Tyranid collection. Its
key feature is undoubtedly its impossibly
distended jaw, a riot of feeding organs,
teeth and cruel claws dominated by a
talon-tipped grapsing tongue in the midst
of shooting out to ensnare a hapless (and
presumably short-lived) victim. Framing
this ghastly assemblage of mouthparts is a
pair of giant crushing claws, brutal close
combat appendages that can rip apart
Terminator armour and battle tanks alike.
Woe betide any soldier foolish enough to
stand in its way.
I'm still guessing the Claws give Armourbane + Fleshbane. No extra attacks. I'm convinced that Scytals will give +1 attack. So between the two weapon choices you can either go for volume or quality on a MC that has access to both.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 22:08:41
2013/12/31 22:12:09
Subject: Re:Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
Whats funny is it says the crone 'dwarfs the tau sunshark bomber.'
Not that its very hard, as the tau flyer is probably the smallest one in the game.
In any case, 24 inches on the exocrine is going to be very hard to use. Its kind of like a vindicator. Its good area denial. I imagine the monstrous creature is more durable than 13 armor. On the other hand, even fire warrior or bolters can threaten it. Especially if you force it to keep moving. As a tau player, BS 3 sucks.
Yes, it will likely die in one of those situations. But what about the other big bugs beside/behind it? What if it has a cover save and fnp? If I can flood the board with monsters and lose one or two per turn for the first few turns... That's fine if I can afford to bring 12 to begin with.
I am not worried about close range monstrous creatures, because all Tyranid MC's are just that. Effective in close range situations.
What if your enemy doesn't know what they're doing? What if they don't have markerlights? What if, what if, what if.
2013/12/31 22:47:21
Subject: Re:Tyranid Release in January (summary in first post): teaser p64
I just had an idea for a nickname for the Haruspex that I hope will catch on:
The BARFOSPEX
Please use this much easier to remember and much more descriptive alternative moniker on these boards, in your games, and in any other situation that you want to refer to this model that looks quite good except for its awful barf-maw (also, use "barf-maw" to refer to whatever the heck GW has named the mouth-weapon thing!)
-C6
Automatically Appended Next Post: Hopefully no one has already beat me to this (really rather obvious) name...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/31 22:48:07
4000+
6000+ Order. Unity. Obedience.
Thousand Sons 4000+
Dark Eldar 35,000pts
Craftworld Eldar 27,500pts
The fact that there was 6 riptides should've tipped me off that it wasn't 1500! 
