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What about the other 2 cards shown on that page?

 Carnage43 wrote:

Zookie wrote:
It looks like the WD has shows some psychic cards (from the looks of the youtube video) can anyone with a copy tell us if those pics of cards tell us anything about the psychic powers?

Warp blast is same stats as today, but has both profiles listed under the power, warp charge 2. I'd assume that's power #6 on the chart.

Also supports the rumor that zoans are warp charge 2, but master level 1. It would allow them to use warp blast without giving them 2 power each if they decide to roll elsewhere.

With only 1 roll the only other table I could think to roll on for zoanthropes would be telepathy to get psychic shriek. However I have a feeling zoeys will be locked into warp blast and not allowed to roll. :-/. 8 more days...

I doubt they will be locked into warp blast. Im more worried about them being given a brotherhood of psykers style setup. Similar to what daemons have. The more zoans you take the stronger your warp blast will be. However if you roll for shriek you would only get one attack not the three we have become accustomed too.

Backlash wrote:
I doubt they will be locked into warp blast. Im more worried about them being given a brotherhood of psykers style setup. Similar to what daemons have. The more zoans you take the stronger your warp blast will be. However if you roll for shriek you would only get one attack not the three we have become accustomed too.

I think there's pretty much zero chance of that happening. On the bright side, if it DID happen, zoans would only be worth about 25 points each then.

Ok a couple things I gleaned from the HD read through of the white dwarf:

1.) pg 26 - bio artifacts and instinctive behavior TABLES. So looks like no longer will being out of synapse cause a ld check then an activity. I bet instead it's an automatic D3 roll on a lurk, feed, or hunt table.
2.) contains rules for "all existing" tyranid models. I predict the return of the RED TERROR as a unique ravener.
3.) pg 143 - the crone missiles are called "tentaclids". They attack aircraft using "bio static energy". I predict they will have the haywire rule to represent this. Basically the crone's primary attack will be the s8 vector strike, with a haywire missile or 2 to finish the job when necessary.

"Bio-artifacts" just sound odd to me. Tyranids makes critters as they need them- where exactly are these artifacts coming from? Old gene-stock they dredged up from the back of the hive ship?

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Ok a couple things I gleaned from the HD read through of the white dwarf:

1.) pg 26 - bio artifacts and instinctive behavior TABLES. So looks like no longer will being out of synapse cause a ld check then an activity. I bet instead it's an automatic D3 roll on a lurk, feed, or hunt table.
2.) contains rules for "all existing" tyranid models. I predict the return of the RED TERROR as a unique ravener.
3.) pg 143 - the crone missiles are called "tentaclids". They attack aircraft using "bio static energy". I predict they will have the haywire rule to represent this. Basically the crone's primary attack will be the s8 vector strike, with a haywire missile or 2 to finish the job when necessary.

I read these as well, and agree with your assessments.
(I posted #1 a page ago....).

On #2, the red terror is also listed as a mini available from GW later in the book.
(along with the zoey, etc.).

On #3, in the design section, it talks about them chewing on cables and electrocuting pilots (fluffy explanation) and I think its referred to as a pulse.
So, I HOPE its haywire, but it could just be an attack....
Which, they also in the battlereport refer to the trygon prime's attack as a "pulse" ....are they related? who knows.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sinful Hero wrote:
"Bio-artifacts" just sound odd to me. Tyranids makes critters as they need them- where exactly are these artifacts coming from? Old gene-stock they dredged up from the back of the hive ship?

I am sure it is just unique upgrades, like the eternal shield for the marines and the puretide chip for the tau - only one per army.

Fluff wise....they could just be unique or sentient biomorphs...like the swarmlord is unique...in that more than one of them can't be grown at a time.

 Sinful Hero wrote:
"Bio-artifacts" just sound odd to me. Tyranids makes critters as they need them- where exactly are these artifacts coming from? Old gene-stock they dredged up from the back of the hive ship?

I googled the actual definition of the word artefact and found: 1. something made or given shape by man, such as a tool or a work of art, esp an object of archaeological interest.

Obviously this isn't man made stuff but I'll bet it's just a word to describe rare chitinous plating, boneswords, symbiotic weapons, and bio morphs. Terminology aside it's standard 6e codex stuff. The warlord traits table is also mentioned. I'm curious as to what those are. I hope someone gets an early copy of the codex soon.

"tentaclids" really... I don't even... this is just sad.

I understand it's pretty standard 6th edition stuff, just I couldn't think of a good fluff explanation for it.

Eldercaveman wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
24" range on the Exocrine... please let this be wrong. So far the only good things that I have heard about this new Codex are the price reductions, but they don't seem like they are going to be enough to help.

24" for artillery, that's not even funny.

But the Hive Guard is fine being 24"?

You can get a brood of 3 Hive Guard for 20 points less than the price of one Exocrine. Not really comparable.

 Sinful Hero wrote:
I understand it's pretty standard 6th edition stuff, just I couldn't think of a good fluff explanation for it.

Ahhh....ok.

Well, I think it would not be hard to make up fluff for unique nid stuff, but I also thought it was easy to nerf ctan and fragment the necrons without the terrible fluff they got too, so who knows what kind of silly fluff nids may have.

 BlaxicanX wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
24" range on the Exocrine... please let this be wrong. So far the only good things that I have heard about this new Codex are the price reductions, but they don't seem like they are going to be enough to help.

24" for artillery, that's not even funny.

But the Hive Guard is fine being 24"?

You can get a brood of 3 Hive Guard for 20 points less than the price of one Exocrine. Not really comparable.

They sort of are, actually. They have very similar toughness and unit footprint, and both have a gun designed for destroying light vehicles. Hive Guard do it from behind cover with slightly higher strength giving them the edge on medium vehicles, Exocrines do it in the open with better AP. The Exocrine gains additional utility by being good against heavy infantry as well due to the higher AP, and larger units of light infantry by being able to pieplate a unit.

Both of them sit in the same field of 'short to mid ranged fire support'. It just depends what you face more of which will bring one of them to the fore for you - light vehicles or heavy infantry. Personally, my Hive Guard are useless after turn 2 when all vehicles are gone. I end up suicide charging them to hold units up. The Exocrine looks like it'll fill the same role for me but have more utility against my normal opponents.

 Sinful Hero wrote:
"Bio-artifacts" just sound odd to me. Tyranids makes critters as they need them- where exactly are these artifacts coming from? Old gene-stock they dredged up from the back of the hive ship?

Well, like the Swarmlord there is only one of, maybe these bio-artifacts are generally something not mass produced.

 -Loki- wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
24" range on the Exocrine... please let this be wrong. So far the only good things that I have heard about this new Codex are the price reductions, but they don't seem like they are going to be enough to help.

24" for artillery, that's not even funny.

But the Hive Guard is fine being 24"?

You can get a brood of 3 Hive Guard for 20 points less than the price of one Exocrine. Not really comparable.

They sort of are, actually. They have very similar toughness and unit footprint, and both have a gun designed for destroying light vehicles. Hive Guard do it from behind cover with slightly higher strength giving them the edge on medium vehicles, Exocrines do it in the open with better AP. The Exocrine gains additional utility by being good against heavy infantry as well due to the higher AP, and larger units of light infantry by being able to pieplate a unit.

Both of them sit in the same field of 'short to mid ranged fire support'. It just depends what you face more of which will bring one of them to the fore for you - light vehicles or heavy infantry. Personally, my Hive Guard are useless after turn 2 when all vehicles are gone. I end up suicide charging them to hold units up. The Exocrine looks like it'll fill the same role for me but have more utility against my normal opponents.

Yeah, with significantly less vehicles, I don' see the impaler cannon being as useful anymore. We'll have to see the stats on the new Shockcannon to find if Hive guard have a place.

I'm actually cooling a lot on this release. Now I'm just planning on grabbing the codex and Exocrine, and seeing where my army falls before I buy more.

 Sasori wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
24" range on the Exocrine... please let this be wrong. So far the only good things that I have heard about this new Codex are the price reductions, but they don't seem like they are going to be enough to help.

24" for artillery, that's not even funny.

But the Hive Guard is fine being 24"?

You can get a brood of 3 Hive Guard for 20 points less than the price of one Exocrine. Not really comparable.

They sort of are, actually. They have very similar toughness and unit footprint, and both have a gun designed for destroying light vehicles. Hive Guard do it from behind cover with slightly higher strength giving them the edge on medium vehicles, Exocrines do it in the open with better AP. The Exocrine gains additional utility by being good against heavy infantry as well due to the higher AP, and larger units of light infantry by being able to pieplate a unit.

Both of them sit in the same field of 'short to mid ranged fire support'. It just depends what you face more of which will bring one of them to the fore for you - light vehicles or heavy infantry. Personally, my Hive Guard are useless after turn 2 when all vehicles are gone. I end up suicide charging them to hold units up. The Exocrine looks like it'll fill the same role for me but have more utility against my normal opponents.

Yeah, with significantly less vehicles, I don' see the impaler cannon being as useful anymore. We'll have to see the stats on the new Shockcannon to find if Hive guard have a place.

Even with few(er) vehicles in many armies, S8 shots that ignore LoS and cover (usually, I'm sure the new hg will simply gave the "ignores cover" rule) is nothing to sneeze at. Especially with so many units now that depend on cover saves (bikes/jetbikes, flying MCs, skimmers)

 Sasori wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
24" range on the Exocrine... please let this be wrong. So far the only good things that I have heard about this new Codex are the price reductions, but they don't seem like they are going to be enough to help.

24" for artillery, that's not even funny.

But the Hive Guard is fine being 24"?

You can get a brood of 3 Hive Guard for 20 points less than the price of one Exocrine. Not really comparable.

They sort of are, actually. They have very similar toughness and unit footprint, and both have a gun designed for destroying light vehicles. Hive Guard do it from behind cover with slightly higher strength giving them the edge on medium vehicles, Exocrines do it in the open with better AP. The Exocrine gains additional utility by being good against heavy infantry as well due to the higher AP, and larger units of light infantry by being able to pieplate a unit.

Both of them sit in the same field of 'short to mid ranged fire support'. It just depends what you face more of which will bring one of them to the fore for you - light vehicles or heavy infantry. Personally, my Hive Guard are useless after turn 2 when all vehicles are gone. I end up suicide charging them to hold units up. The Exocrine looks like it'll fill the same role for me but have more utility against my normal opponents.

Yeah, with significantly less vehicles, I don' see the impaler cannon being as useful anymore. We'll have to see the stats on the new Shockcannon to find if Hive guard have a place.

My guess (and just a guess) is that the the impaler cannon will stay on as our light anti tank gun and the shockcannon (nid taser?) will be our MC gun. Here is my prediction with the stats 24" Assault 2 S 4 AP 4 (Fleshbane)

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
Even with few(er) vehicles in many armies, S8 shots that ignore LoS and cover (usually, I'm sure the new hg will simply gave the "ignores cover" rule) is nothing to sneeze at. Especially with so many units now that depend on cover saves (bikes/jetbikes, flying MCs, skimmers)

The problem is they are S8 AP4. That AP4 really kills their utility against infantry. Anything you want to shoot S8 at will have a 3+ save or better, while anything with a 4+ save or worse is in such numbers that you just don't have enough shots to matter.

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:

 Sasori wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:

 stonehorse wrote:
24" range on the Exocrine... please let this be wrong. So far the only good things that I have heard about this new Codex are the price reductions, but they don't seem like they are going to be enough to help.

24" for artillery, that's not even funny.

But the Hive Guard is fine being 24"?

You can get a brood of 3 Hive Guard for 20 points less than the price of one Exocrine. Not really comparable.

They sort of are, actually. They have very similar toughness and unit footprint, and both have a gun designed for destroying light vehicles. Hive Guard do it from behind cover with slightly higher strength giving them the edge on medium vehicles, Exocrines do it in the open with better AP. The Exocrine gains additional utility by being good against heavy infantry as well due to the higher AP, and larger units of light infantry by being able to pieplate a unit.

Both of them sit in the same field of 'short to mid ranged fire support'. It just depends what you face more of which will bring one of them to the fore for you - light vehicles or heavy infantry. Personally, my Hive Guard are useless after turn 2 when all vehicles are gone. I end up suicide charging them to hold units up. The Exocrine looks like it'll fill the same role for me but have more utility against my normal opponents.

Yeah, with significantly less vehicles, I don' see the impaler cannon being as useful anymore. We'll have to see the stats on the new Shockcannon to find if Hive guard have a place.

Even with few(er) vehicles in many armies, S8 shots that ignore LoS and cover (usually, I'm sure the new hg will simply gave the "ignores cover" rule) is nothing to sneeze at. Especially with so many units now that depend on cover saves (bikes/jetbikes, flying MCs, skimmers)

This is quite true as well. I wouldn't shoot at FMCs though, when we have excellent AA in the form of the Crone.

We'll just have to wait and see the new stats and costs on them.

Overall.. just need the codex, and some serious evaluation time! lol.

 -Loki- wrote:

 Therion wrote:
They could have made the Tyrannofex a more close range assault fire beast and let the Exocrine take over the long range shooting.

The Tyrannofex is a close range assault beast. Using the Rupture Cannon as the basis of your opinion of the Tyrannofex gives a misleading impression on it. Look at the rest of the beast. T6, W6, and the only 2+ save in the army outside of a Hive Tyrant (in 5th). Comes standard with either an assault 5 or large blast S5 weapon and a thorax swarm. Its other 2 primary weapons are a rather nasty template or a 12" range, assault 20 anti light infantry gun. The Tyrannofex was made for close range warfare. The reason people found the Rupture Cannon Tyrannofex overpriced was because they were wasting its other 2 weapons, which are included in the base price, since it never got in range to use them, and wasted its rather tough stats by never taking enough hits to make them worth it. Putting a Rupture Cannon on it is defeating the purpose of the rest of the unit. Not to mention at BS 3 the Rupture Cannon is pretty terrible.

The problems come from the fact that it isn't fast enough to catch much with its rather good short ranged firepower, and doesn't have the assault stats to resist the inevitable return assault. It'll get powerfisted to death after nuking one unit - if it reaches one.

The Rupture Cannon feels almost like the creation of the Vindicator. The Space Marines needed a linebreaker tank and only had Rhino chassis. Not the toughest chassis ever, but managed to toughen it up and strap a Demolisher cannon to it, which got the job done. Similarly, the Rupture Cannon almost feels the same way - the Hive Mind needed the firepower of a Heirpohant but didn't have the biomass to dedicate to one, so they strapped a similarly powerful gun to the biggest creature they had the resources to make, and the 'template' stayed around.

I honestly don't know what you're trying to say. The Hive Mind created the Tyrannofex and/or the Exocrine? I can give you a hint about who created them: It's printed on your codex credits. Let's take your whole presumption the other way around: The Tyrannofex was made for long range warfare but then GW in their infinite wisdom gave it a 'complimentary overcosted defensive short range weapon' and BS3. The way they give points costs to units is completely random anyway. I used to play club games vs Tyranids where we house ruled T Fexes with Rupture Cannons to 200 points and the games were quite balanced. Seems like GW noticed something was wrong too at a five year delay.

So my point stands, if the designers wanted Nids to have a long range monstrous creature, looking at the models, the Exocrine should be it, not the Tyrannofex. As far as tabletop performance goes it's completely irrelevant though as long as atleast one of them is points efficient or better.

Don't forget the poor little biovores.

Plus 3 Fex's with heavy venom cannons and whatever else you give them is nothing to sniff at.

If the AP or stupid -1 to vehicles changes on HVC gets better I can honestly see me running fex's with HVC, talons and bioplasma. That would be a unit not to screw with.

I'm slightly bothered with the additions of the new creatures only because they really do crowd up FOC slots that are already a rather rough choice between. If the Haruspex does go elite that would honesly be terrible since there are already a flood of choices that are or could be viable in the new edition. With the Endocrine the Heavies is also really crowded with the point dropped fexes, trygons, and biovores also in the same spot. I like the idea of the Haruspex but the endocrine isn't really a needed addition especially with its short range shooting. It simply needed a bit more range. 36" would have been fine. Then it can out range most infantry firepower

 dmthomas7 wrote:
I'm slightly bothered with the additions of the new creatures only because they really do crowd up FOC slots that are already a rather rough choice between. If the Haruspex does go elite that would honesly be terrible since there are already a flood of choices that are or could be viable in the new edition. With the Endocrine the Heavies is also really crowded with the point dropped fexes, trygons, and biovores also in the same spot. I like the idea of the Haruspex but the endocrine isn't really a needed addition especially with its short range shooting. It simply needed a bit more range. 36" would have been fine. Then it can out range most infantry firepower

I personally can't wait, to have at least 3+ hard choices for which units to choose from in each slot! The only choices that are looking like they are going to be fairly easy is HQ and Troops. But then that could change depending on what happens with Warriors/Primes, Stealers and Gaunts. If there is something hidden from us that will make these useful, the whole codex becomes a challenge to pick an army from. Which is what I want more than anything.

I would have liked to see the lictors relocate to the FA slot. I do agree that everything is such a tough choice in the new codex. Hopefully the ally rules can help us mitigate a few of our woes when it comes to picking our units.

Well if the Vanguard Infestation dataslate is a formation like the Tau Firebase Support Cadre or the Stormwing for Space Marines, we could presumably field lictors and/or genestealers without taking up ANY force org slots. That's of course assuming it works in the same way as the already-released 40k formations. As to whether or not the rules will be good enough to field the models in this manner is entirely a different matter altogether.

So here we are, about 8-9 days away from codex release. The following are my wishlists for a few things we've not seen from the white dwarf:

1.) Lictors - as mentioned above, i want them to be fieldable. A protection the turn they show up, such as the rumored "Surprise" rule would be excellent.
2.) Speed - the codex as a whole needs to be faster to reach CC. Beast movement, additional distance while running, running followed by assault would all go miles towards correcting our lumbering book as it currently stands.
3.) POISON PROTECTION - i played a game vs dark eldar venomspam on sunday that was an utter joke. 5 venoms outranged and out shot my entire army, and with no protection from their 4+ poison rule my 3+ save monstrous creatures died as quickly as space marines. A biomorph for our big bugs that gives them -1 to poison damage would be amazing and is probably my biggest wishlist of all.
4.) Instant Death avoidance - warriors have always been a great looking unit on the table. I'd like to be able to field 1 or 2 units of them, with the hopes that a single volley of fire from a long fang team wouldn't eliminate the entire unit.... so we'll see.

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Well if the Vanguard Infestation dataslate is a formation like the Tau Firebase Support Cadre or the Stormwing for Space Marines, we could presumably field lictors and/or genestealers without taking up ANY force org slots. That's of course assuming it works in the same way as the already-released 40k formations. As to whether or not the rules will be good enough to field the models in this manner is entirely a different matter altogether.

So here we are, about 8-9 days away from codex release. The following are my wishlists for a few things we've not seen from the white dwarf:

1.) Lictors - as mentioned above, i want them to be fieldable. A protection the turn they show up, such as the rumored "Surprise" rule would be excellent.
2.) Speed - the codex as a whole needs to be faster to reach CC. Beast movement, additional distance while running, running followed by assault would all go miles towards correcting our lumbering book as it currently stands.
3.) POISON PROTECTION - i played a game vs dark eldar venomspam on sunday that was an utter joke. 5 venoms outranged and out shot my entire army, and with no protection from their 4+ poison rule my 3+ save monstrous creatures died as quickly as space marines. A biomorph for our big bugs that gives them -1 to poison damage would be amazing and is probably my biggest wishlist of all.
4.) Instant Death avoidance - warriors have always been a great looking unit on the table. I'd like to be able to field 1 or 2 units of them, with the hopes that a single volley of fire from a long fang team wouldn't eliminate the entire unit.... so we'll see.

Sorry to say but the only one of your wish list that has a chance to happen is Lictors might be playable. The rest we would already know now as all the troop entries have been shown and there are no additional rules listed outside of what was in their entries from last edition (what I mean is something like "Battle Focus" which would allow you to run and assault instead of moving and shooting for example). Hormagaunts aren't beasts, and I would imagine the only beasts in the codex will be Ravaners (still) and maybe the Haruspex as it has so many similarities to the Maulerfiend. The only army that really has poison are the Dark Eldar, so a poison mitigating biomorph is very unlikely as nobody would take it unless they knew they were fighting DE. As for ID avoidance I also can't see that as GW has been going out of their way for a while now to greatly reduce the amount of units that have Eternal Warrior (it was removed from the ENTIRE Demon codex for instance). I am totally with you though as I would love every single one of those and would also wish them to be in the codex, specifically the first two.

From everything we have seen we should be expecting a book that is very similar to the 5th ed codex as was shown with the troops being almost carbon copies out of the 5th ed book, with minor tweaks and points adjustments. That being said this would be my wishlist for the new book (not holding my breath though).

1) Cleaned Up Ranged Weapon Section: Basically resetting the complete mess that Cruddace left us with. Restoring Venom Cannons to their AT role (high strength, multi shot, remove blast) and moving Death Spitters back to being blast weapons are my two biggest hopes for the entire codex. You know it's sad when a book has 32 ranged weapons but has LESS variation then the previous book with 7 entries.
2) Cleaned Up Special Rules: Things like the Trygon Tunnel (worst rule I have ever read), Pyrovores, Onslaught psychic power (seriously...a shooting power you have to target your own troops????), etc. all need to be cleaned up and would go a LONG way to making this book really good.
3) Reduced Points Costs on MCs: This is already in effect, couldn't be happier.
4) Retaining The "Come From All Sides" Deployment Aspect of the 5th Ed Codex: Big hope here as this is my single fave thing from the 5th ed book and it is what made me keep playing it.
5) Adding Real Choice to the Army: This is probably the worst thing about the 5th ed codex. Every time you play against Tyranids right now you know you are fighting 3-5 Tervigons, a Flyrant or two, some Trygons and Hive Guard. That is it. Things look promising on this one as well.

After reading all the rumors I remain very hopeful that all these are in the book as everything we have seen in regards to changes have been very positive and much needed. Can't wait to finally get rid of the 5th ed codex lol.

 -Loki- wrote:


The problem is they are S8 AP4. That AP4 really kills their utility against infantry. Anything you want to shoot S8 at will have a 3+ save or better, while anything with a 4+ save or worse is in such numbers that you just don't have enough shots to matter.

Vector Strikes are ap3.

 Dr. Delorean wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:


The problem is they are S8 AP4. That AP4 really kills their utility against infantry. Anything you want to shoot S8 at will have a 3+ save or better, while anything with a 4+ save or worse is in such numbers that you just don't have enough shots to matter.

Vector Strikes are ap3.

He is on about impalor cannons...

This is what I get for posting at half past one in the morning, sorry y'all.