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The lack of a individual to blame for this terrible Codex only makes me despise GW as a whole.

Waaaghpower wrote:

 the shrouded lord wrote:

Waaaghpower wrote:
I certainly won't be buying the new codex.
Because I don't play 'Nids.

So why are you here?

To smirk at the poor, misguided Xenos players... And then remember that I play Sisters of Battle, and weep sympathetic tears.

Lol. Oh well, one day GW will hire someone whO knows how a woman's face works, and get rid of cyber Velma.

Also, anyone else notice you can take tyrant guard independent of the tyrant, I'm going to use them as terminator ty up unit in my MC list.

 the shrouded lord wrote:


Also, anyone else notice you can take tyrant guard independent of the tyrant, I'm going to use them as terminator ty up unit in my MC list.

Nothing new there, you could do that last codex also. I used them for a "T6" Prime all the time with my flyrants.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 jifel wrote:
Ok, a Facebook page with 14 likes is essentially non-existent.

No, it quite clearly exists, as do the private messages sent to writers, as do the everyday throwaway comments made by people that are childish, vicious, hostile, admittedly often made by people who would never be so unpleasant face to face, but seemingly under the impression that they won't be read by their target or that their target is some fictional character who doesn't get insulted or pissed off by them.

It's a small community, these comments are seen.

Anyway, mine was just a theory for an alternative reason for the name being removed from the codex, as opposed to Kroot's suggestion that noone wanted to put their name on it out of shame of the contents being forced on them by upper management, in the absence of any official statements from a GW writer or leak, you are free to come to your own conclusions.

thanks for this eminently reasonable post.

Of course it's not unusual - you only need to go to the comment pages of some newspapers to see the vitriol directed at public figures. But these are just guys doing their job.

As to the original question... for club play, I think we might allow the old dex in some fashion. Then again, we often let a weaker dex (Orks or 5th ed Tau before the update) have a 5% or 10% bump. If it starts being too strong, then we pull the bonus points and off we go.

I can't see tournaments allowing the old dex though. But I think it would be hilarious if they did. While I think it's an overreaction now, I can't with a straight face say that I think this is a strong codex in the current meta, and we all know that it could have been much better with more options.

well... the book is what, 48 hours old. Dont get too carried away just yet. Looks like they now have a decent AP ranged option and another legit anti flier opton in the harpie. Its not all doom and gloom. Wait and see what super cool lists the internet makes before jumping the gun

The harpy is in no way shape or form anti-flyer.

Its only two weapon options are template weapons, and so cannot be used against enemy flyers.

The crone is in the same boat, except for its limited use Tentaclids.

We have 0 new real anti-flyer options. We have 0 weapons with skyfire, and only the Hive Tyrant has actual shooting weapons usable against enemy flyers. Same as we had before.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQQGcgJ5PZ0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

I think this about sums up how garbage nids are now with synapse being a huge killer for them

@steamdragon

The crone is decent against flyers, it can resonably kill one per turn but that is if the enemy doesnt throw a rock at it or a stiff breeze doesnt come by when its on the board.

 streamdragon wrote:
The harpy is in no way shape or form anti-flyer.

Its only two weapon options are template weapons, and so cannot be used against enemy flyers.

The crone is in the same boat, except for its limited use Tentaclids.

We have 0 new real anti-flyer options. We have 0 weapons with skyfire, and only the Hive Tyrant has actual shooting weapons usable against enemy flyers. Same as we had before.

Pretty much right - although both can take Stinger Salvos which give it Assault 4 Str 5 wweapons with 18" range not awesome against anything but the lightly armoured flyers.

The Harpys 4 missiles are not bad - Twin linked Str 5 Haywire and it can do Str 8 Vector Stirkes. Its Drool cannon is S6 so might glance some flyers.

There are a number of non skyfire weapons -
the rupture Cannon is 48", Str 10, assault 2 so might get lucky,
Implaer Cannons are 24" S8, Assault 2 and ignore cover/LOS - nice against skimmers .
Bio Plasma Cannons are 24" S7, Ap2 and Assult 6
Devourers with Brianleechs are 18", S6 and assault 6

Template weapons can't hit fliers.

Dish2296 wrote:
Wow. Seriously everybody putting have on the new codex needs to wake up. It's been out for one day and lots of people are writing it off as the worst codex and a "rushed job" if you don't like the rules then don't but the codex or the models, it's simple and you can go play another game like magic the gathering and bitch about how bad their new releases are.

George L. wrote:
well... the book is what, 48 hours old. Dont get too carried away just yet. Looks like they now have a decent AP ranged option and another legit anti flier opton in the harpie. Its not all doom and gloom. Wait and see what super cool lists the internet makes before jumping the gun

Normally this would be me doing these quotes, but seriously - the Codex is awful. Yes, we got a couple decent weapons, but that does not make up for all the stuff that got nerfed into oblivion and the fact that our utter crap units are still utter crap. 95% of the Codex just doesn't work...

Aren't the baby nid rockets fired by the flyer limited to 2 per turn ?

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

The choice to not put a single name on this codex may reflect the decision to stop giving the baying hordes a single target to blame for what they believe is bad background writing, rules, naming choices etc. It must be pretty disheartening to land a great job creating fun stuff for games and playing with toy soldiers all day and then discover you've become an internet meme with (in some cases) really hate-filled stuff, just because you called something a spleen missile or a wolf shield or whatever.

When your job affects (well, decides) the quality of all purchases including past-purchases for an extremely expensive brand of miniatures, perhaps you should view it more as a fun time to get creative with your toy soldiers. I personally feel there needs to be serious thought to balancing put in.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
So all it has is the haywire missile and vector strike. Assuming the haywire missile doesn't pen, that's a maximum of two hull-points per turn.

No, thats a maximum of 5 hull points, and a minimum of 0.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Template weapons can't hit fliers.

None of the weapons I listed above in the codex are template or blast weapons

I personally think maybe look at the Crone in comparison to the Hive Guard. For the same amount of points it has the same amount of range and Strength on its first Vektor Strike as HG doe with their Impalers, except of course movement restrictions make it impossible to hit the same target two turns in a row. That being taken into account, you have 2-4 S8 hits landing where you want, with AP3, and then the chance to fire off a missile or possibly soften up a squad with S6 template. It has the same save and toughness 5 instead of 6, but the trade off for this is immunity to blast weapons and templates, as well as only being hit on snapshots or by sky fire. It's not a perfect comparison since Crone works a bit differently in play given the flyer movement restrictions, but I just don't think it's as bad as some people want to pretend. One on it's own might get blasted out of the sky, and now without drop pods we might have very little options to ensure blowing up a backfield anti-air unit, but 5 flyers could work very nicely, I mean there is only so much that can reliably kill them and thats the stuff you focus. Don't look at the Crones as extra Flyrants look at them as HG with a couple of bonuses/changes, thats what the points costs entails.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Template weapons can't hit fliers.

None of the weapons I listed above in the codex are template or blast weapons

Isn't the Drool cannon a flamer template?

SHUPPET wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:
So all it has is the haywire missile and vector strike. Assuming the haywire missile doesn't pen, that's a maximum of two hull-points per turn.

No, thats a maximum of 5 hull points, and a minimum of 0.

As per the BRB, you can only fire 2 missiles per turn.

Mr Morden wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:
Template weapons can't hit fliers.

None of the weapons I listed above in the codex are template or blast weapons

You said the drool cannon might glance a flyer. The drool cannon is a template weapon.

Ah yes sorry missed that one - just checked.

You know, if Forgeworld makes a mycetic pod resin model and publish it rules in the next IA 4 as 40k approved they would outsell the rest of GW.

 A GumyBear wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQQGcgJ5PZ0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

I think this about sums up how garbage nids are now with synapse being a huge killer for them

@steamdragon

The crone is decent against flyers, it can resonably kill one per turn but that is if the enemy doesnt throw a rock at it or a stiff breeze doesnt come by when its on the board.

How does the crone reasonably kill 1 flyer per turn ?

 SHUPPET wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:
So all it has is the haywire missile and vector strike. Assuming the haywire missile doesn't pen, that's a maximum of two hull-points per turn.

No, thats a maximum of 5 hull points, and a minimum of 0.

I edited like 20 minutes before you made this post.

Am going to be shot for saying that the codex isn't "that bad"
It's got a gak load of problems
THEY KILLED MY fething PARASITE OF MORTREX.
But aside from this, we can now fit nine carnifexes and 30 gaunts and a hive tyrant + 2 tyrant guard into 1500 point list.
Marine player: ok here's my army, a few tac squads, a dev squard, and 2 preds, oh and a storm raven.
'nids player: here's mine.
*places nine carnifexes on the field*

I posted this in another Tyranid whine thread, but it should be repeated:

The book is great! Tyranids got a bunch of deep-dish points reductions on heaps of units. What more do 'Nid players really want? An auto-'I Win' Codex that all the WAAC players can high-five one another over.

I mean they've got the awesome long-ranged Exocrine that can just bombard units to pieces, the Harpy and Crone that really give the Hellturkey a run for its money (the Crone more than the Harpy, if I'm honest), a great set of really useful psychic powers (like Onslaught – what other army can do anything like Onslaught?), the Haruspex can just monster vehicles and infantry alike, the new bio-artefacts give players heaps of really cool options (like the amazingly versatile Ymgarl Factor), and the Venomthrope can shroud most of your army meaning that enemy shooting is toast, giving plenty of time for your Genestealers and Warriors to get into combat. Sure, some units did go up in price – Prime, Tervigons, Hive Guard – but those were crutch units that power-gamers relied on to win games, so now they’re just paying what they’re worth rather than getting ‘el cheapo super-creatures.

Tyranids are awesome now!




NB: Nothing I said above is true. Not a word of it.

Played against a buddy with the new dex today with my mech IG force. In the end it wasn't really even close. 2 12 wound Carnifex squads (I think they were 3 wounds each in 5th but not sure) with close supporting zoanthorpes (and he rolled catalyst so was giving them FnP) . They basically just marched up the board and smashed the crap out of my Chimeras with just their Hammer of Wrath. The amount of high S fire power I brought was just not enough and between the monsterous creatures and ridiculous numbers of gaunts I got overwhelmed and was crushed. Personally I think the new dex has some major holes in it but overall it seems that it also has some things that work rather well together.

 streamdragon wrote:

SHUPPET wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:
So all it has is the haywire missile and vector strike. Assuming the haywire missile doesn't pen, that's a maximum of two hull-points per turn.

No, thats a maximum of 5 hull points, and a minimum of 0.

As per the BRB, you can only fire 2 missiles per turn.

1 missile if you Vektor Strike. Max 4 hull points from the Vektor Strike + max 1 hull point from the missile is a maximum of 5 hull points per turn, minimum of 0. Maximum means the maximum possible not plausible.

 BlaxicanX wrote:

I edited like 20 minutes before you made this post.

Well, it was still like that when I hit the quote button, so that's what I responded to, so I don't know what else to tell you. I had to make breakfasts mid typing of that post so it was probably edited before I noticed

 Watchersinthedark wrote:
Played against a buddy with the new dex today with my mech IG force. In the end it wasn't really even close. 2 12 wound Carnifex squads (I think they were 3 wounds each in 5th but not sure) with close supporting zoanthorpes (and he rolled catalyst so was giving them FnP) . They basically just marched up the board and smashed the crap out of my Chimeras with just their Hammer of Wrath. The amount of high S fire power I brought was just not enough and between the monsterous creatures and ridiculous numbers of gaunts I got overwhelmed and was crushed. Personally I think the new dex has some major holes in it but overall it seems that it also has some things that work rather well together.

Only because you have no clue how to handle it yet. This will be a repetitive story in the next couple weeks. Nid army crushes soandso. Then you will hear about better target priority (Synapse) and more tactics and the Nids will drop back into a far more beatable army.

Codex is fine , old builds won't work the same but it's going to be very competitive , top NID players will kick butt ! Complaining about might brand you as either a bad player or someone stuck in the past and not seeing new combos and tactics . give it tme .....

 mk2 wrote:
Complaining about it brands you as either a bad player or someone stuck in the past and not seeing new combos and tactics .

Or someone with working reading comprehension skills.

Against a space marine captain:
Deathleaper easily makes it into close combat, needs 2+ to hit, 4+ to wound, I does this four times.
Captain strikes back. Needs6+ to hit, 4+ to wound, sounds fun.

 the shrouded lord wrote:
Against a space marine captain:
Deathleaper easily makes it into close combat, needs 2+ to hit, 4+ to wound, I does this four times.
Captain strikes back. Needs6+ to hit, 4+ to wound, sounds fun.

What?

As I see it, Deathleaper needs 3+ to hit, and the Captain hits him back on 4+