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 Gloomfang wrote:
I wouldn't have to do this if something other that flyrants or crones had skyfire. I like converting, but I hate feeling like I have to go out of my dex to have a competitve list.

Swarmy should have been able to grant Skyfire...that would have been interesting...go forth Swarmy and skyfiring rupture cannon tyranno or exocrine.

 ductvader wrote:

 Gloomfang wrote:
I wouldn't have to do this if something other that flyrants or crones had skyfire. I like converting, but I hate feeling like I have to go out of my dex to have a competitve list.

Swarmy should have been able to grant Skyfire...that would have been interesting...go forth Swarmy and skyfiring rupture cannon tyranno or exocrine.

^^ that would have made the Hive guard worth their points increase and stat nerf, had there been a synergistic use like this in the codex.

Alas we got a book written by the same author as before - that is why so little of the game mechanics are different in this book.

Hive Guards should have had a skyfire option as was originally rumoured.

What I envision about the Swarmlord is to give him an ability sort of like Fateweaver. He uses the Hive network to sense trouble coming up, thus giving his army 1 re-roll per player turn. That would make him worth taking.

But these are just wish-listing.

 jy2 wrote:
But these are just wish-listing.

Indeed and sadly so.

Hey, we have something to look forward to in a few years now!

So,

More playing about with ideas. My original huge list o' nids has modified itself, with two of the scytal fexes (the 3rd ed. ones) becoming further dakkafexes (for a total of 5 dakkafexes).

I also realised a fantastically simple way to make further sets of twin-devourers - use the twin-deathspitter arms, snip off the Deathspitter barrels and replace with devourer weapon heads. Simples!

Now I just get to eagerly await a friends finances to sort themselves out...

And then I get a bumper order of 'nids as my part of the IOU for all the daemons. (Hive Tyrant, Crone, Exocrine).

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
I also realised a fantastically simple way to make further sets of twin-devourers - use the twin-deathspitter arms, snip off the Deathspitter barrels and replace with devourer weapon heads. Simples!

yep, it's super-easy and doesn't even require any green stuff, looks just fine as the second set of arms with the actual devourers as the first set.

 PrinceRaven wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
I also realised a fantastically simple way to make further sets of twin-devourers - use the twin-deathspitter arms, snip off the Deathspitter barrels and replace with devourer weapon heads. Simples!

yep, it's super-easy and doesn't even require any green stuff, looks just fine as the second set of arms with the actual devourers as the first set.

Am I the only one who just uses four arms?

2 Devourers + 2 Deathspitter conversions = 4 arms.

I'd love to use 4 Devourer arms, but the kit only comes with 2 and I'd rather convert Deathspitters than spend even more money getting the other 2 for each Carnifex.

 PrinceRaven wrote:
2 Devourers + 2 Deathspitter conversions = 4 arms.

I'd love to use 4 Devourer arms, but the kit only comes with 2 and I'd rather convert Deathspitters than spend even more money getting the other 2 for each Carnifex.

Ohhhhhhhh. I acquired like 15 Carnifexes and a literal pile of bits when I got my bugs...didn't realize they only come with two

 ductvader wrote:

 Abandon wrote:
I'll run three with regen, Thorax Swarms and AG glands for testing purposes. Thanks for the input

Don't forget the second template...it's much more necessary than even regen.

Had two battles with them, both vs SM and they were great! This is one of those times I'm happy to be wrong in my initial judgment. This was not a lists I thought would win but it won both games.

1x HT
-Wings
-1x TL Devourer w/ BLW
-Reaper of Obliterax
-Hive Commander
-Thorax Swarm
1x HT
-Wings
-1x TL Devourer w/ BLW
-Toxin Sacs
-WL + BS
-Hive Commander
-Thorax Swarm

22 Temigants
-22 Devourers
-Toxin Sacs
22 Temigants
-22 Devourers
-Toxin Sacs

1x Zoanthrope
1x Zoanthrope
1x Zoanthrope

1x Tyrannofex
-Adrenal Glands
-Regeneration
-Thorax Swarm
1x Tyrannofex
-Adrenal Glands
-Regeneration
-Thorax Swarm
1x Tyrannofex
-Adrenal Glands
-Regeneration
-Thorax Swarm

Ran my Zoanthropes as support trailing behind for synapse and possible buffs, outflanked both Termigant broods and played aggressively with my Flyrants from turn one.

Things I learned

Tyrannofexs
-Make excellent meat-shields
-Benefit greatly from Fleet (Adrenal Glands)
-Regeneration can demoralize your opponent
-Take out vehicles just fine in assault but take forever to kill a Tac Squad and can be tarpitted with only WS3 and 3 attacks
-Add FNP and opponents start conceding

Zoanthropes
-Are best used for support, do not put them on the front line just to take shots on a LR. Dominion, Catalyst and Onslaught are their best use early in the game. Take no other powers.
-As long as they can't get in range to shoot on their next turn and your units do not really require their synapse, your opponent will generally choose to focus down a more immediate threat. (non threatening Zoey in back or Murderous MC right in front of you, hmmm...)

Devilgants
-Though 25% more in price, I've found adding toxin Sacs is generally worth it. They become a double threat and getting them into melee makes synapse less of and issue.
-If they GTG that's still a lot of snapshots. Never underestimate 50+ shots even at BS1.
-Should GTG when possible and outside of or likely to be outside of synapse on your next turn.
-Though it might seem very bad to have these outside of synapse (and it is bad) there is only roughly a 1 out of 3 chance they fall back due to IB.
-Keep them in area terrain as much as possible.

General Tactics
-Run synapse a little behind, trailing your main forces and staying out of range where possible.
-Don't overly rely on synapse. Your main threats should not require it.
-More rolls on the psychic chart mean more Catalyst or Onslaught or both. 3 broods of one or more Zoanthropes each is a solid choice to go along with 2 HTs.

Had yesterday another game with my 2k tyranids list. It has evolve a little since last time I plaayed towards more presure in the first turns and it goes as you see:

2 Flyrant, 60 Termagants, 2 Tervigons, 3 Hive Crones, 3 Venonthorpes in 3 diferent unnits, 3 Biovores in 3 diferent unnits and 2 Vengance Weapon Bateries with the largs F8/Ap3 blast.

En up desolating a tailored list of Mech Dark Angels with lots of asscannons LR and razorbacks and flyers.

Just for your info, using 2 Tervigons is good, let you play VERY agresibly with your gaunts and themselves, using miasma cannon and thorax electroshock G on them improves their utility.
60 Gaunts+ lots more generated mean you dont have to worry about your troops anymore and can use them agresibly running first turn and shooting/chargings 2nd.
3 Venonthorpes gives you a lot of places to get 3+ or even 2+ for your gaunts and flyers all over the game. No1 is gonna shoot them with so many threats on them.
Vengance weapon Batteries gives you a nice ap3 large blast anti meqs as well as a cool place to hide in first turn.
The preasure this nice 2 blocks + the biovores do on turtle armyes like Tau is nice av14 fortifications rules.
During the whole match I was able to get 3+ or even 2+ cover saves for my whole army, venonthorpes included. That made the diference. turn 3 None of my units had been killed.

 Abandon wrote:
Devilgants
-Though 25% more in price, I've found adding toxin Sacs is generally worth it. They become a double threat and getting them into melee makes synapse less of and issue.

Would you agree they are much more effective v Space Marines and not so much v Elder/Tau? I am not 100% sure but the math's seem to tell me that using them in games v Marine's or other T4 models is a no brainer, but againt's T3 it is allot less effective?

I've started to get my Nids working in earnest and a few thoughts:

mixed gants squads are great but take some organisation to keep the devourers off the front but close enough that they can get into 18" range
tervigons never go beyond a second spawning and those gants need synapse babysitting - you need objectives close together
dakka carnifexes die without a venomthrope - missiles, plasma, lascannons just roast them often before they get into 18" range
drop-pod lists cause carnage as they can attack your synapse so easily
deathleaper does die still if in sight - snapshooting lascannons!
FMCs are powerful, but playing 3 or 4 of them is just not a game I want to play

I am scheming to build a Nid style bastion or skyshield now, as they do seem to be a necessary crutch but for aesthetic reasons I won't use an imperial version except as neutral scenery.

bodazoka wrote:

 Abandon wrote:
Devilgants
-Though 25% more in price, I've found adding toxin Sacs is generally worth it. They become a double threat and getting them into melee makes synapse less of and issue.

Would you agree they are much more effective v Space Marines and not so much v Elder/Tau? I am not 100% sure but the math's seem to tell me that using them in games v Marine's or other T4 models is a no brainer, but againt's T3 it is allot less effective?

VS tau/eldar/GEQ, you get to re-roll wounds with poison on the gants. I'd say that makes it more useful in those sorts of matchups, rather than less. I haven't done any mathhammer to prove that though.

 tetrisphreak wrote:

bodazoka wrote:

 Abandon wrote:
Devilgants
-Though 25% more in price, I've found adding toxin Sacs is generally worth it. They become a double threat and getting them into melee makes synapse less of and issue.

Would you agree they are much more effective v Space Marines and not so much v Elder/Tau? I am not 100% sure but the math's seem to tell me that using them in games v Marine's or other T4 models is a no brainer, but againt's T3 it is allot less effective?

VS tau/eldar/GEQ, you get to re-roll wounds with poison on the gants. I'd say that makes it more useful in those sorts of matchups, rather than less. I haven't done any mathhammer to prove that though.

It would be worth it against 10 man Dire Avenger squads, Wraith, Guardian Defender Blobs, or Storm Guardians...but overkill against Fire Warriors, Kroot, 5DA, Rangers or 10 Guardian Defenders.

I've never got significant numbers of termagants into combat for me to consider taking even less bodies for increased close combat ability.

 PrinceRaven wrote:
I've never got significant numbers of termagants into combat for me to consider taking even less bodies for increased close combat ability.

How many termagants do you field?

I generally stay in the 60-90 range.

1 brood of 30 plus whatever I spawn.

 PrinceRaven wrote:
1 brood of 30 plus whatever I spawn.

There you go...

Personally, I don't upgrade my termagants...they're meant to shoot and be a counterassault unit...

Hormagaunts...I never upgrade a unit unless there is an unupgraded unit running in front of them taking the casualties.

 ductvader wrote:

 PrinceRaven wrote:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
I also realised a fantastically simple way to make further sets of twin-devourers - use the twin-deathspitter arms, snip off the Deathspitter barrels and replace with devourer weapon heads. Simples!

yep, it's super-easy and doesn't even require any green stuff, looks just fine as the second set of arms with the actual devourers as the first set.

Am I the only one who just uses four arms?

I have 3 with 4 arms, 2 with 4 conversion arms. I had more twin devourers but when people offered me silly money for them I could not say no.

Even my one flyrant with twin devourers has four - in his case the barrel-head was converted into the wings (FW Flyrant).

 ductvader wrote:


How many termagants do you field?

I generally stay in the 60-90 range.

Question: Have you been having success with using a horde? A lot of the lists on Dakka seem to focus on the TMCs and not the gants. I was hoping that was because of tournament time limits, not effectiveness.

 AdeptSister wrote:

 ductvader wrote:


How many termagants do you field?

I generally stay in the 60-90 range.

Question: Have you been having success with using a horde? A lot of the lists on Dakka seem to focus on the TMCs and not the gants. I was hoping that was because of tournament time limits, not effectiveness.

I win more than I lose?

Tyranids pretty much can't powerbuild...the more you try the worst your list gets.

(The only "powerbuild" I've had success with is 18 Raveners and 9 Shrikes...the game was over Turn 2)



But in general, a horde does what it always does...takes damage and just keep on truckin'...Just be sure you attack you're enemy's MC killers with them...too many people fight fire with fire or fire with with water when they should be fighting it with dirt.

EDIT: A sidenote to those who have not tried him yet: The Swarmlord is godlike for a Swarm...sheer power for your entire army...preferred enemy or monster hunter on any nearby unit is ridiculous...You just can't spearhead with him like we used to. He needs to lead from the center.

But giving out a buff and 3 psychic powers a turn is nothing less than magnanimous...I'm never playing without him again if I can help it.

 AdeptSister wrote:

 ductvader wrote:


How many termagants do you field?

I generally stay in the 60-90 range.

Question: Have you been having success with using a horde? A lot of the lists on Dakka seem to focus on the TMCs and not the gants. I was hoping that was because of tournament time limits, not effectiveness.

It depends on your meta. Hordes do very well against players who don't know 'nids very well. But experienced players will just kill the Synapse, and if they succeed at that, the horde loses. Also Hordes have no answer to Mech. TMC's are far less vulnerable to this. Most of them suffer mainly by doing the thing they would have done anyways at the nearest target (instead of the target of choice). I regularly run 80 or so Gaunts, but run into a good number of lists that deconstruct them very quickly (Deep striking flamers = my bane). So, as the models become available, I'm switching to TMC's.

I'm still wrapping my head around on how to beat Eldau and Taudar. I've had a few games and results have varied drastically. I will be playing on Sunday ...

So how would you deploy? I had reaper cc tyrant, desthleaper, 2 squads lictors, 3 stealer squads (two with broodlord), ten gants in a comms bastion, 2 crones and two mawlocs.

My opponent had buffmander, 3 broadsides (SMS HYM 2 drones, interceptor), riptide, WK, DA in serpents, seer, warp spiders, small outflanking kroot squad, aegis.

The problem here is that the broadside unit can rip my leaper to shreds if he is within 30" easily. If I DS or outflank he has interceptor. Sure horror can help if I can survive within distance but I sure cannot set up the Mawlocs safely for no scatter. I need to hide the flyrant and crones first turn also.

So how would you deploy and advance?

 felixcat wrote:
So how would you deploy and advance?

Deploy your bastion around 18-24" away and infiltrate a broodlord in it...guarunteed horror.

Wraithknight could screw with that though.

You can't use maledictions from inside a transport.

 PrinceRaven wrote:
You can't use maledictions from inside a transport.

That's what I get for never playing transports...

and i want my trmagants in the bastion anyway - i have only ONE synapse source in the whole list.

Flyrant, Scytals, Reaper, Regen
Leaper
2x 2 Lictors
2x7 Stealers, BL Scytals
7 Stealers
10 Gants
2 Crone
2 Mawloc
Bastion, comms

So the unit of broadsides really screws with my optimal deployment

All the local Tyranid players here have kept running hordes and have been losing disastrously, blaming the codex and bringing other armies to the bunker. There's a teenager who last weekend 'quit' his Nids, saying he's
not won a game since the new codex. But I just see him running massive gant and gaunts blobs up the board.

I've been cleaning up on the other hand. The battlereports Ive filmed have been the losses I've had, and the victories have far outnumbered them. I'm running a hordeless Nid army because for me, right now its more fun.

I'm really curious how my Warrior list is going to do. I'm on leave right now and I've just finished painting 6 warriors and a Harpy, so I can field the list I want for the first time. I'll report back whether its a success or massive failure.