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When the treatment of NKs populace is compared to the holocaust by the UN its very, very far from resolved.
The UN did nothing to treat the holocaust. Soviet JS IIs, British Tommies (Oi!!!), and American Mustangs did.
You do realize that the UN didn't even exist during WWII, right?
Exactly, hence the original post being nonsensical.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Grey Templar wrote: I always figured the NK army was way overrated, similar to how the Iraq army was overrated.
And on the subject of their nukes, I wouldn't see them as much of a threat to anything beyond the Korean peninsula. Their missile building capability is simply too lacking. Dangerous for sure but mostly because you don't have a clue what is going to happen. Will it even make it off the pad? Will it explode in midflight? Will it simply crash into the sea? Will the bomb fail to detonate? etc...
On the positive, watching NK with missiles is like watching orks trying to build ICBMs.
Not really. We know the Ork weapons can work.
North Korea put a satellite into orbit ahead of South Korea, just saying.
For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back.
When the treatment of NKs populace is compared to the holocaust by the UN its very, very far from resolved.
The UN did nothing to treat the holocaust. Soviet JS IIs, British Tommies (Oi!!!), and American Mustangs did.
You do realize that the UN didn't even exist during WWII, right?
Exactly, hence the original post being nonsensical.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Grey Templar wrote: I always figured the NK army was way overrated, similar to how the Iraq army was overrated.
And on the subject of their nukes, I wouldn't see them as much of a threat to anything beyond the Korean peninsula. Their missile building capability is simply too lacking. Dangerous for sure but mostly because you don't have a clue what is going to happen. Will it even make it off the pad? Will it explode in midflight? Will it simply crash into the sea? Will the bomb fail to detonate? etc...
On the positive, watching NK with missiles is like watching orks trying to build ICBMs.
Not really. We know the Ork weapons can work.
North Korea put a satellite into orbit ahead of South Korea, just saying.
Did the satellite even work? For all we know, it could've been a big Rok.
When the treatment of NKs populace is compared to the holocaust by the UN its very, very far from resolved.
The UN did nothing to treat the holocaust. Soviet JS IIs, British Tommies (Oi!!!), and American Mustangs did.
You do realize that the UN didn't even exist during WWII, right?
Exactly, hence the original post being nonsensical.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Grey Templar wrote: I always figured the NK army was way overrated, similar to how the Iraq army was overrated.
And on the subject of their nukes, I wouldn't see them as much of a threat to anything beyond the Korean peninsula. Their missile building capability is simply too lacking. Dangerous for sure but mostly because you don't have a clue what is going to happen. Will it even make it off the pad? Will it explode in midflight? Will it simply crash into the sea? Will the bomb fail to detonate? etc...
On the positive, watching NK with missiles is like watching orks trying to build ICBMs.
Not really. We know the Ork weapons can work.
North Korea put a satellite into orbit ahead of South Korea, just saying.
South Korea makes tens of thousands of cars and other vehicles a year. Plus they manage to feed their people. NK, not so much.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
According to a talking head on Radio4 yesterday NK has better standard of nutrition than India, not exactly a great accolade but they aren't actually starving, or if they are its probably by design.
RegalPhantom wrote: If your fluff doesn't fit, change your fluff until it does
The prefect example of someone missing the point.
Do not underestimate the Squats. They survived for millenia cut off from the Imperium and assailed on all sides. Their determination and resilience is an example to us all.
-Leman Russ, Meditations on Imperial Command book XVI (AKA the RT era White Dwarf Commpendium).
Its just a shame that they couldn't fight off Andy Chambers.
Warzone Plog
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Easy E wrote: Yeah, but the point of getting a satellite in orbit is to show-off that you can handle ICBM technology too.
IIRC, getting something into orbit is actually easier than designing a missile that both exits and reenters the atmosphere. while also designing a nuclear warhead and its trigger mechanism.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Palindrome wrote: According to a talking head on Radio4 yesterday NK has better standard of nutrition than India, not exactly a great accolade but they aren't actually starving, or if they are its probably by design.
Uh... and who's giving out that sort of information? That's like saying that Cuban's Healthcare is better than the US...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/18 22:20:10
NK is so bad, people in Somalia are going "phew at least we're not in North Korea."
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Meanwhile, the Nigerians are trying to solve overpopulation and world hunger at the same time.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Easy E wrote: Yeah, but the point of getting a satellite in orbit is to show-off that you can handle ICBM technology too.
IIRC, getting something into orbit is actually easier than designing a missile that both exits and reenters the atmosphere. while also designing a nuclear warhead and its trigger mechanism.
Not only that, but giving it a targeting mechanism as well. You definitely don't want to fire a nuke into low orbit, and have it land in your capital.
If I may use an analogy, it's one thing kicking a ball into the air. Kicking the ball into the air and sending it to where you want it, on the other hand, is a different matter.
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
Uh... and who's giving out that sort of information? That's like saying that Cuban's Healthcare is better than the US...
Isn't Cuban healthcare better than the US?
It was aprofessor of something from somewhere. It was the BBC though so it was probably at least a semi reliable source.
RegalPhantom wrote: If your fluff doesn't fit, change your fluff until it does
The prefect example of someone missing the point.
Do not underestimate the Squats. They survived for millenia cut off from the Imperium and assailed on all sides. Their determination and resilience is an example to us all.
-Leman Russ, Meditations on Imperial Command book XVI (AKA the RT era White Dwarf Commpendium).
Its just a shame that they couldn't fight off Andy Chambers.
Warzone Plog
I learned a lot that I did not know from this post.
I didn't know any of that stuff either. Can I ask, are you in the military Harraticus?
Grey Templar wrote: - I always figured the NK army was way overrated, similar to how the Iraq army was overrated.
They have one of the largest artillery components of any army in the world, possibly the largest. Most of it is aimed at Seoul. Even in the most optimistic of scenarios, where pre-emptive simultaneous strikes can take out of percentage of that force, they would still cause an absolutely horrendous amount of damage.
Seoul is a great city. It's first world, the people living there have spent 50 years building it into the metropolis it is today, I'm sure the people living there (or what will be left of them) won't want to start over!
When the treatment of NKs populace is compared to the holocaust by the UN its very, very far from resolved.
The UN did nothing to treat the holocaust. Soviet JS IIs, British Tommies (Oi!!!), and American Mustangs did.
You do realize that the UN didn't even exist during WWII, right?
Exactly, hence the original post being nonsensical.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Grey Templar wrote: I always figured the NK army was way overrated, similar to how the Iraq army was overrated.
And on the subject of their nukes, I wouldn't see them as much of a threat to anything beyond the Korean peninsula. Their missile building capability is simply too lacking. Dangerous for sure but mostly because you don't have a clue what is going to happen. Will it even make it off the pad? Will it explode in midflight? Will it simply crash into the sea? Will the bomb fail to detonate? etc...
On the positive, watching NK with missiles is like watching orks trying to build ICBMs.
Not really. We know the Ork weapons can work.
North Korea put a satellite into orbit ahead of South Korea, just saying.
South Korea makes tens of thousands of cars and other vehicles a year. Plus they manage to feed their people. NK, not so much.
And yet the North got to orbit first. What I'm saying is that I think it's bad to completely write off the technology of North Korea. Sure, a lot of it is rather shoddy, but they were still good enough to beat South Korea, a nation with high-tech as their national stereotype, into orbit.
For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back.
I'm going to play devil's advocate and say that just because NK managed to launch a satellite into orbit does not necessarily mean that they have the capability to reliably launch and guide a missile, complete with payload, to it's target.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
But was South Korea really trying to get into space?
Putting something into space isn't really a big deal anymore, it isn't the 60s.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Palindrome wrote: According to a talking head on Radio4 yesterday NK has better standard of nutrition than India, not exactly a great accolade but they aren't actually starving, or if they are its probably by design.
Uh... and who's giving out that sort of information? That's like saying that Cuban's Healthcare is better than the US...
According to the CIA World Factbook Cuba is ahead of the USA on on infant mortality and almost the same on life expectancy at birth.
Palindrome wrote: According to a talking head on Radio4 yesterday NK has better standard of nutrition than India, not exactly a great accolade but they aren't actually starving, or if they are its probably by design.
Uh... and who's giving out that sort of information? That's like saying that Cuban's Healthcare is better than the US...
According to the CIA World Factbook Cuba is ahead of the USA on on infant mortality and almost the same on life expectancy at birth.
Again... how is that data acquired? This is the sort of question you need to be asking when acquiring data from anywhere.
Just like the UK folks like to point out the differences between how UK count's "violent crimes" vs the US... the World Factbook is based on what the country reports.
Unless, you think there's spooks in every Cuban hospitals.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/19 02:12:10
Well, according Bloomberg, Cuba's quite a bit better than the US in terms of health, but I also imagine the typical American diet doesn't help our numbers much.
RatBot wrote: Well, according Bloomberg, Cuba's quite a bit better than the US in terms of health, but I also imagine the typical American diet doesn't help our numbers much.
EDIT: I also don't know how they arrived at these numbers and I haven't got time right now to do more digging.
I deal with these datasets for a living...
The biggest things to keep in mind is that that of the Cuban government’s heavy-handed enforcement of statistical targets and the lack of transparency... many experts would suggest taking these numbers with a grain (or feth ton) of salt.
And it's not just Cuba... it's Every. fething. Country. On. The. Planet.
There are deviations in the fundamental terminologies, reporting accuracy, data sources, populations, and cultural-medical practices... that making apples-to-apples comparison between these countries extremely problematic.
Besides... NK is still supposedly wracked by famine.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/02/19 03:27:23
My wife is Korean. I speak Korean. I have a fair amount of family there. I spent many years there in the military and still go every few years. I still see videos smuggled out by certain groups that are allowed into North Korea... I saw a lot of stuff when I was in uniform, stuff the South Koreans tried to present to the American government that came out with escaped ROK prisoners. No one in the American governments wanted to listen from what I could tell..
North Korea is the world's largest concentration camp. It is far worse than even most refugees talk about. What makes it worse is it has death camps like Kwan-li-so 16 and 22 for so long that the basic structure of human family does not exist there. Families are sentenced there for life (parents, grandparents, children for the crime of a single person not smiling enough or missing a step in a televised parade). 22 is where the last of the South Korean soldiers from the Korean War were placed when they closed the mines after the last of the Americans died. After the parents die and the kids have kids without any values system instilled it is very scary what humans can do to other "family" members.
Most refugees do not come from the death camps. I know of 2 in the last 12 years that have made it out. Believe me when I tell you they have not, and will not talk about most of what happens there to most folks and never to reporters or the press. They figure out quick no one wants to hear about it, not really. So what you see on the Internet, as bad as it looks, pales to the truth.
Kim Jung-eun killed off all those who might have been a threat to him along with their families in the last year. He lived thru two assassination attempts in late 2012 and early 2013. He is there to stay. He knows if he ever loses power he will die. He is married to Ri Sol-ju and has a daughter by her. He had anyone who she had been with prior to that killed off along with anyone in North Korea who mentioned it for an image of purity to be maintained. There was not a pornographic video tape as had been suggested in the news. No one raised in North Korean would have even considered such a sure fire execution kind of thing.
You can not use conventional ideas of rational thought when thinking about the leaders of North Korea. All the rational ones are dead, with their families. They have been abducting women for over 40 years, not just oriental as most believe. European countries for the most part when not oriental and at least one American male, David Sneddon. Almost all to train spies...really.
If they think sending the army south will buy them a few more years they will do so.
If they think nuking an American city with a bomb smuggled in via a shipping container just to prove to an American President that they can and they will nuke a second or third to keep the the world off them, they will.
All of those thinking the Chinese will deal with them had better think again. The Chinese are terrified of the thought that they will be blamed for what North Korea might do.
One of the assassination attempts was Chinese, the other was not...
What you see going on in Kiev will never happen in North Korea.
You had better believe that the first thing most responsible world leaders gets brief on each morning is North Korea.
My personal estimate... One day the Chinese will get a OK signal that there are no unaccounted for North Korean pig boats and the Chinese will take out all the nuclear sites in North Korea and wipe out the entire line.
For the folks in North Korea I hope that time comes soon....
If I was vain I would list stuff to make me sound good here. I decline. It's just a game after all.
House Rule -A common use of the term is to signify a deviation of game play from the official rules.
Do you allow Forgeworld 40k approved models and armies?
My wife is Korean. I speak Korean. I have a fair amount of family there. I spent many years there in the military and still go every few years. I still see videos smuggled out by certain groups that are allowed into North Korea... I saw a lot of stuff when I was in uniform, stuff the South Koreans tried to present to the American government that came out with escaped ROK prisoners. No one in the American governments wanted to listen from what I could tell..
North Korea is the world's largest concentration camp. It is far worse than even most refugees talk about. What makes it worse is it has death camps like Kwan-li-so 16 and 22 for so long that the basic structure of human family does not exist there. Families are sentenced there for life (parents, grandparents, children for the crime of a single person not smiling enough or missing a step in a televised parade). 22 is where the last of the South Korean soldiers from the Korean War were placed when they closed the mines after the last of the Americans died. After the parents die and the kids have kids without any values system instilled it is very scary what humans can do to other "family" members.
Most refugees do not come from the death camps. I know of 2 in the last 12 years that have made it out. Believe me when I tell you they have not, and will not talk about most of what happens there to most folks and never to reporters or the press. They figure out quick no one wants to hear about it, not really. So what you see on the Internet, as bad as it looks, pales to the truth.
Kim Jung-eun killed off all those who might have been a threat to him along with their families in the last year. He lived thru two assassination attempts in late 2012 and early 2013. He is there to stay. He knows if he ever loses power he will die. He is married to Ri Sol-ju and has a daughter by her. He had anyone who she had been with prior to that killed off along with anyone in North Korea who mentioned it for an image of purity to be maintained. There was not a pornographic video tape as had been suggested in the news. No one raised in North Korean would have even considered such a sure fire execution kind of thing.
You can not use conventional ideas of rational thought when thinking about the leaders of North Korea. All the rational ones are dead, with their families. They have been abducting women for over 40 years, not just oriental as most believe. European countries for the most part when not oriental and at least one American male, David Sneddon. Almost all to train spies...really.
If they think sending the army south will buy them a few more years they will do so.
If they think nuking an American city with a bomb smuggled in via a shipping container just to prove to an American President that they can and they will nuke a second or third to keep the the world off them, they will.
All of those thinking the Chinese will deal with them had better think again. The Chinese are terrified of the thought that they will be blamed for what North Korea might do.
One of the assassination attempts was Chinese, the other was not...
What you see going on in Kiev will never happen in North Korea.
You had better believe that the first thing most responsible world leaders gets brief on each morning is North Korea.
My personal estimate... One day the Chinese will get a OK signal that there are no unaccounted for North Korean pig boats and the Chinese will take out all the nuclear sites in North Korea and wipe out the entire line.
For the folks in North Korea I hope that time comes soon....
Exalted
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/02/19 04:03:44
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
Dreadclaw69 wrote: I'm going to play devil's advocate and say that just because NK managed to launch a satellite into orbit does not necessarily mean that they have the capability to reliably launch and guide a missile, complete with payload, to it's target.
Again, missing my point. All I'm saying is that it's silly to completely dismiss North Korean technology as useless and defective.
For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back.
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Given what we know about NK technology, we can confidently say they won't be launching nukes any farther than South Korea. And maybe Japan if they get really lucky.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Palindrome wrote: According to a talking head on Radio4 yesterday NK has better standard of nutrition than India, not exactly a great accolade but they aren't actually starving, or if they are its probably by design.
Uh... and who's giving out that sort of information? That's like saying that Cuban's Healthcare is better than the US...
According to the CIA World Factbook Cuba is ahead of the USA on on infant mortality and almost the same on life expectancy at birth.
Again... how is that data acquired? This is the sort of question you need to be asking when acquiring data from anywhere.
Just like the UK folks like to point out the differences between how UK count's "violent crimes" vs the US... the World Factbook is based on what the country reports.
Unless, you think there's spooks in every Cuban hospitals.
You are assuming the Cuban data is false. If it is, you can't use dodgy data to support your argument any more than I can. Your proposition about comparing Cuban and US healthcare is incorrect at the outset.
FWIW the USA has somewhat worse public health than a lot of genuinely comparable countries like the UK or Japan.
Grey Templar wrote: Given what we know about NK technology, we can confidently say they won't be launching nukes any farther than South Korea. And maybe Japan if they get really lucky.
Which I am sure is a great comfort to South Korea and Japan.
RegalPhantom wrote: If your fluff doesn't fit, change your fluff until it does
The prefect example of someone missing the point.
Do not underestimate the Squats. They survived for millenia cut off from the Imperium and assailed on all sides. Their determination and resilience is an example to us all.
-Leman Russ, Meditations on Imperial Command book XVI (AKA the RT era White Dwarf Commpendium).
Its just a shame that they couldn't fight off Andy Chambers.
Warzone Plog
If it is, you can't use dodgy data to support your argument any more than I can. Your proposition about comparing Cuban and US healthcare is incorrect at the outset.
False. All I'm saying is that we shouldn't treat these datasets from various countries as gospel.
FWIW the USA has somewhat worse public health than a lot of genuinely comparable countries like the UK or Japan.
There's a huge distinction between the level of healthcare one can receive vs how healthy a certain population is...
Back to OP: I'm challenging that statement that NK's diet is better that India.
~4100
~1660
If I was vain I would list stuff to make me sound good here. I decline. It's just a game after all.
